Official Lexus Future Product & Powertrain Megathread

[flipside909]

This has me cracking up. Check out the big brain on Brad.

Glad I can provide some comic relief for your troubles. LOL

 

[Sulu]

1) NX - you've already seen the leaked photos, it's almost here.
2) ES - it's still in the middle of its lifecycle, it just came out in 2019. We will probably see an exterior refresh and possibly a full change 2025-ish?
3) IS - can't wait for the IS 500 F SPORT Performance...i'm glad we're getting it.
4) TX - the US press release hinted at Lexus being built at TMMI. A new three-row SUV. Think about it, they currently build Sequoia, Highlander and Sienna there.
5) LX - You've seen leaked photos of what appears to be a 300 series Land Cruiser. LX is built alongside the LC in Tahara.

We can complain about it over and over, but it's out of our control. Honestly, there are other manufacturers out there that make cars too. If you're not willing to wait, you have other choices.

The problem with Toyota and Lexus is that they don't show or even talk about future models (both facelifts, such as the ES, and new models, such as the NX) until so close to the time they actually show up in the showroom; they keep us in suspense.

The Germans, on the other hand, start leaking and even showing test mules months, even years in advance.

As an example, we know that there is a new Porsche electric Macan coming in 2 or 3 years because we have seen test mules and heard talk about the model. Yet, we have heard so little and seen so little of the 2022 Lexus NX, which should be introduced in a few months.

 

[flipside909]

The problem with Toyota and Lexus is that they don't show or even talk about future models (both facelifts, such as the ES, and new models, such as the NX) until so close to the time they actually show up in the showroom; they keep us in suspense.

The Germans, on the other hand, start leaking and even showing test mules months, even years in advance.

As an example, we know that there is a new Porsche electric Macan coming in 2 or 3 years because we have seen test mules and heard talk about the model. Yet, we have heard so little and seen so little of the 2022 Lexus NX, which should be introduced in a few months.

To me...seeing a car many years beforehand takes away from the element of surprise for me. GR Supra was on that boat...it dragged and dragged....test mules...rumors...then it finally comes out. Not very exciting. Everyone wants answers like yesterday.

 

[Automotive Press]

Thank you @Automotive Press for the insight! It's nice to see someone examine rumors critically before adding fuel to the fire.

You're welcome and thank you for watching my channel. Wishing all of you the best.

 

[internalaudit]

^ I just watched that episode two nights ago on the EV Celica.

 

[internalaudit]

The problem with Toyota and Lexus is that they don't show or even talk about future models (both facelifts, such as the ES, and new models, such as the NX) until so close to the time they actually show up in the showroom; they keep us in suspense.

The Germans, on the other hand, start leaking and even showing test mules months, even years in advance.

As an example, we know that there is a new Porsche electric Macan coming in 2 or 3 years because we have seen test mules and heard talk about the model. Yet, we have heard so little and seen so little of the 2022 Lexus NX, which should be introduced in a few months.

I think the 2023 Macan EV is now official or so says the media:

Official: Porsche is building a fully electric Macan, due in 2023

And it'll 'drive, look and feel like a Porsche'. Here's your first look

www.topgear.com

 

[ssun30]

Specs for LC300 engine. V35A-FTS is tuned for more torque (600N.m -> 650N.m) and less power at lower rpm (310KW@6000RPM -> 305KW@5200RPM). I feel this tune should apply to LS500 too as the loss of power is negligible...

F33 diesel has 15% more power and 8% more torque than 1VD.

GVM is reduced by 120 kg. Assuming no change in payload capacity the new TNGA-F platform makes the LC300 120kg(260lbs) lighter. Towing capacity is unchanged at 3500kg(7700lbs).

Unfortunately ground clearance, approach/departure/breakover angles have not changed from the 200 series. I think Toyota just assumed the aftermarket will lift the vehicle anyway.

 

[Brandon B]

So roughly 410 hp and 480 ft lbs torque. Not bad, I’m guessing the Tundra will mirror this tune as well.

 

[Will1991]

Let's go back a bit, to the H2 powered Corolla.

According to BestCarWeb, it need about 7.34kg of H2 to do 50km at race speed, with a lap time of 2:05.
In the same track, Mirai needs about 4kg to do the same 50km with a lap time of 2:18.

S耐富士24時間レースに水素エンジンを投入！ ミライの水素社会実現の一助となるのか!? - 自動車情報誌「ベストカー」

トヨタが今週末に開催される、S耐富士24時間レースに水素エンジンを投入する！ FCVとは異なるアプローチでのカーボンフリー実現に向けたトヨタの本気度について、国沢光宏氏が熱く語る!!

bestcarweb.jp

This is complete nonsense IMO. Just do it with a FC.

 

[F1 Silver Arrows]

Let's go back a bit, to the H2 powered Corolla.

According to BestCarWeb, it need about 7.34kg of H2 to do 50km at race speed, with a lap time of 2:05.
In the same track, Mirai needs about 4kg to do the same 50km with a lap time of 2:18.

S耐富士24時間レースに水素エンジンを投入！ ミライの水素社会実現の一助となるのか!? - 自動車情報誌「ベストカー」

トヨタが今週末に開催される、S耐富士24時間レースに水素エンジンを投入する！ FCVとは異なるアプローチでのカーボンフリー実現に向けたトヨタの本気度について、国沢光宏氏が熱く語る!!

bestcarweb.jp

This is complete nonsense IMO. Just do it with a FC.

But ICE's are cool tho.

 

[Will1991]

But even the smell is part of the equation 👌

I’m into BEV’s, I want one for the daily commute, but I also want a pure ICE with a manual gearbox sports car!
It’s the perfect combination, you can help the environment with lower emissions, save a ton of cash with fuel bills, and you can also go full bananas with the sports car 😀

We will not save much if we turn all the supercars/sports cars into BEV’s... We might just kill car enthusiasts if we do it because they’re one of the biggest reasons we love cars in the first place, and they don’t do that many miles.
This “turn everything into BEV’s” thing I’m sometimes reading is too much IMO.

 

[F1 Silver Arrows]

But even the smell is part of the equation 👌

I’m into BEV’s, I want one for the daily commute, but I also want a pure ICE with a manual gearbox sports car!
It’s the perfect combination, you can help the environment with lower emissions, save a ton of cash with fuel bills, and you can also go full bananas with the sports car 😀

We will not save much if we turn all the supercars/sports cars into BEV’s... We might just kill car enthusiasts if we do it because they’re one of the biggest reasons we love cars in the first place, and they don’t do that many miles.

I would wager that a good hybrid would still help save the environment too.

This “turn everything into BEV’s” thing I’m sometimes reading is too much IMO.

Exactly.

 

[Will1991]

There’re 2 things keeping me from getting a hybrid:
- I struggle a lot about the UX and the amazing IS300h is gone;
- Montlhy fuel bills are between 200~300€ with my car averaging 7L/100km, a BEV with home charging would be between 40~50€.

 

[Levi]

There’re 2 things keeping me from getting a hybrid:
- I struggle a lot about the UX and the amazing IS300h is gone;
- Montlhy fuel bills are between 200~300€ with my car averaging 7L/100km, a BEV with home charging would be between 40~50€.

RC300h is the best economic and fun and stylish daily car. It just looks to good to not have a V8. In my mind I reserve the later V8 for the LC.

 

[spwolf]

Let's go back a bit, to the H2 powered Corolla.

According to BestCarWeb, it need about 7.34kg of H2 to do 50km at race speed, with a lap time of 2:05.
In the same track, Mirai needs about 4kg to do the same 50km with a lap time of 2:18.

S耐富士24時間レースに水素エンジンを投入！ ミライの水素社会実現の一助となるのか!? - 自動車情報誌「ベストカー」

トヨタが今週末に開催される、S耐富士24時間レースに水素エンジンを投入する！ FCVとは異なるアプローチでのカーボンフリー実現に向けたトヨタの本気度について、国沢光宏氏が熱く語る!!

bestcarweb.jp

This is complete nonsense IMO. Just do it with a FC.

did you actually read the whole article?

It's completely different. MIRAI is 150ps. The lap time is about 2 minutes and 18 seconds. If you make a fuel cell that produces 250ps, it will consume as much hydrogen as a hydrogen engine. Combusting hydrogen well makes it as efficient as a fuel cell. That is why the fuel cell development team was surprised and realized that it was a powerful rival.

 

[spwolf]

and also confirmation that H2 Corolla has 250hp.

 

[Will1991]

RC300h is the best economic and fun and stylish daily car. It just looks to good to not have a V8. In my mind I reserve the later V8 for the LC.

Agree! But it has been axed as well, a second gen or a deeper facelift with the same 2.5 found in the Crown... It would be epic.

and also confirmation that H2 Corolla has 250hp.

To my understanding, it’s the GR Yaris engine that’s rated at 250hp, not that H2 ICE powered Corolla...

If a 1900kg, 184hp road going Mirai is only 13sec slower than a Corolla GR based striped out race car with 250hp... I think it’s better no to be launched...

 

[spwolf]

Agree! But it has been axed as well, a second gen or a deeper facelift with the same 2.5 found in the Crown... It would be epic.




To my understanding, it’s the GR Yaris engine that’s rated at 250hp, not that H2 ICE powered Corolla...

If a 1900kg, 184hp road going Mirai is only 13sec slower than a Corolla GR based striped out race car with 250hp... I think it’s better no to be launched...

no, you are understanding it wrong. He is saying this Corolla H2 has 250hp, while Mirai has 150hp and if Mirai had 250hp, it would spend same amount of hydrogen, and that H2 is real contender compared to FCEV.

Only 13s slower? That is ages in racing.

You misunderstood the article completely, it is completely opposite - he thinks H2 Corolla is awesome.

 

[Will1991]

That’s another issue...

To my knowledge, a ICE and a FC having similar efficiencies is only possible if Toyota found the holly grail for the ICE or if their FC isn’t that good...

Keep in mind, Fuji has 4.5km:
Mirai has 1900kg and a 184ps motor for a (with some time) 180km/h top speed.
That Corolla should be around 1200kg and (supposedly) 250ps using racing tires and suspension.
That's 700kg less and 70ps more for the Corolla... 13sec is nothing... Just from 0-100km/h is 3/4sec difference...

 

[ssun30]

In the article they explained the actual concern is reliability: they want a hydrogen semi-truck to last 2 million km. Fuel cells are far from that goal while ICEs can meet that target quite easily. It seems the H2 ICE program will eventually be commercial use only.

An autonomous truck running 24/7 will do ~1000km a day (~4x the amount a human driver today does). This means it will run 2M km in less than 6 years. A typical diesel truck today already have a lifespan of 1M km over 10 years. For the operator the question then becomes fuel cost vs. maintenance cost. H2 ICE truck uses more fuel but FC truck may need a costly mid-life powertrain replacement.

I hope more people could understand that there is no such thing as a H2 vs. battery debate. Both technologies scale differently: H2 scales up better (commercial) while batteries scale down (passenger) better. I just don't understand why so many people believe it's an either-or situation. BEV semi-trucks won't work just like how H2 passenger cars won't work.