Official Lexus Future Product & Powertrain Megathread

[Tragic Bronson]

I'm surprised though. It's not Lexus that provides the servicing yet warranty work is covered by it, and not the dealerships.

As long as the specific order is on the purchase contract, why would the dealerships be on the hook and if they installed properly as per Lexus specifications? Block heater are offered here in Canada and it's dealership-installed. I didn't know that if it exploded or cause a fire (there was a recall), that the local dealership will be on the hook.

For things such as paint and interior, I think more luxury buyers want it to come from the factory rather than a dealership special edition. But as you say, block heater and other accessories can either be installed by the factory (as a PIO) or the dealer. I'm not that versed, but for little things like that, the factory warranty would cover the part regardless of who installed in, but the assumption is that the dealer installed it at the time of the vehicle purchase (to be covered under the factory warranty).

 

[internalaudit]

For things such as paint and interior, I think more luxury buyers want it to come from the factory rather than a dealership special edition. But as you say, block heater and other accessories can either be installed by the factory (as a PIO) or the dealer. I'm not that versed, but for little things like that, the factory warranty would cover the part regardless of who installed in, but the assumption is that the dealer installed it at the time of the vehicle purchase (to be covered under the factory warranty).

So my proposal will kinda work. Of course not for paintwork but for options that have to be installed.

It's a win-win. Lexus doesn't have to equip any car with it (additional cost) unless there is a an order --> made to order (MTO).

Maybe it just makes sense to find out what German car buyers are ordering that are not being offered in Lexus vehicles and maybe use the MTO approach, someday.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

So my proposal will kinda work. Of course not for paintwork but for options that have to be installed.

It's a win-win. Lexus doesn't have to equip any car with it (additional cost) unless there is a an order --> made to order (MTO).

Maybe it just makes sense to find out what German car buyers are ordering that are not being offered in Lexus vehicles and maybe use the MTO approach, someday.

Sort of. To me, I like factory rather than dealer, because the dealer will charge more, and IMO, sometimes gaudy in execution. I believe the bespoke method started with the high end brands like Lambo, Ferrari etc., and of course, the Germans adopted as well. But to me, you wouldn't start doing to this with a vehicle like an ES or RX to begin with.

 

[internalaudit]

Sort of. To me, I like factory rather than dealer, because the dealer will charge more, and IMO, sometimes gaudy in execution. I believe the bespoke method started with the high end brands like Lambo, Ferrari etc., and of course, the Germans adopted as well. But to me, you wouldn't start doing to this with a vehicle like an ES or RX to begin with.

Definitely. Those are not a car person's car but the ES still drives better than many other same sized FWD cars. Can't offend SSun lol.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

Definitely. Those are not a car person's car but the ES still drives better than many other same sized FWD cars. Can't offend SSun lol.

The only thing that drives like a ES really is an Avalon. The A6 is actually reported more fun to drive, and I don't doubt that. I spend plenty of time in an ES (when I have to drive my dad and mom when I visit them), it might become mine should my dad stop driving. As an enthusiast, its far from what I consider fun, though I would prefer the newer ES because it has Carplay. And yes, I think people here get offended for speaking evil against the Big T.

 

[Sulu]

It would be nice if some small things could be swapped out and replaced, or added at the dealer, such things as a different display screen (e.g. 8" without Embedded Navigation or 12.3" with Embedded Navigation); adaptive front lighting; Triple-Beam LED headlamps; wireless charging; window sunshades; interior ambient lighting; leather or NuLuxe seats; Birds Eye View monitor. (I remember years ago that you could get aftermarket leather upholstery installed at Toyota dealers.)

Some of the items may involve making electrical interfaces the same (different size display screen, different front headlamps) or roughing in the wiring and then merely plugging in the extra components (Birds Eye View monitor), to allow for plug-and-play.

I would not mind paying a few dollars to upgrade some of these items on my next ESh without having to shell out $5000, $10,000 or $15,000 to get the packages. (Correct if I am wrong, but I believe some of these things are available individually in the USA but not available in Canada.)

 

[suxeL]

Dealers to install things is a huge liability....as even minor things like oil changes come back with overfills etc.

I think the only folks I`d trust with swapping anything is the factory or the port delivery processing centers if Lexus employs one on their imported units from Japan.

 

[internalaudit]

I already gave the example of block heater, installed by the dealer, which is sanctioned by Lexus because they offered it during the configuration stage.

I doubt there is huge liabilities with service maintenance items or why would dealerships offer them if the risk/reward isn't there? Isn't it the reason why mechanics get regular training and use checklists?

The cars are warrantied for a certain period. Even if the dealership screws up, Lexus will still foot the bill.

After the warranty period, negligence is still hard to prove? Why go to the dealership if you are going to keep checking under your car's hood anyway?

I've gone for one Toyota service wherein they forgot to fill the coolant level? Did I file a lawsuit? No, I bought a jug and just filled it up.

 

[suxeL]

I already gave the example of block heater, installed by the dealer, which is sanctioned by Lexus because they offered it during the configuration stage.

I doubt there is huge liabilities with service maintenance items or why would dealerships offer them if the risk/reward isn't there? Isn't it the reason why mechanics get regular training and use checklists?

The cars are warrantied for a certain period. Even if the dealership screws up, Lexus will still foot the bill.

After the warranty period, negligence is still hard to prove? Why go to the dealership if you are going to keep checking under your car's hood anyway?

I've gone for one Toyota service wherein they forgot to fill the coolant level? Did I file a lawsuit? No, I bought a jug and just filled it up.

That may work well with a block heater, but it wouldnt be cost effective to retrain workers, input a dedicated paint staff and facilities just for custom order customers who rarely will "buy a jug and fill up the coolant tank" when they custom order exterior paint, interior upholstery.

Think of it this way, Lexus already has a "custom order" team already...all those vehicles on dealer lots are technically custom ordered anyways, dealer procurement specialists and regional teams have to actually select which options will sell and relay that information back to the factorys.

Lexus would not be reinventing channels, simply removing the artificial blockades that dealers rely on to maneuver customers away from custom orders.

 

[internalaudit]

That may work well with a block heater, but it wouldnt be cost effective to retrain workers, input a dedicated paint staff and facilities just for custom order customers who rarely will "buy a jug and fill up the coolant tank" when they custom order exterior paint, interior upholstery.

Think of it this way, Lexus already has a "custom order" team already...all those vehicles on dealer lots are technically custom ordered anyways, dealer procurement specialists and regional teams have to actually select which options will sell and relay that information back to the factorys.

Lexus would not be reinventing channels, simply removing the artificial blockades that dealers rely on to maneveur customers away from custom orders.

Think about your earlier post. The entire service industry will disappear if everyone thought about the huge liability vs. profitability.

Yet the service sector is many times bigger than some manufacturing sectors.


I think you are underestimating how many of the dismantling undertakings are already hardwired to trained mechanics/technicians and that there are service manuals to guide them.

There are no custom orders on Lexus.ca. Just try configuring anything any all are preset with a few add-ons towards the end of your configuration. You wouldn't need a team to custom order anything and those add-ons (3M film, tint, block heater, deflectors) are mostly dealership installed.

There is no reinventing the channel, just figuring out why German cars sell more besides cachet and find out if it can be offered to more discerning customers ala carte and Made to Order. The cost will cover the parts and labor anyway.

 

[suxeL]

Think about your earlier post. The entire service industry will disappear if everyone thought about the huge liability vs. profitability.

Yet the service sector is many times bigger than some manufacturing sector.

And yet vehicles are built in factories not dealerships why?

 

[internalaudit]

And yet vehicles are built in factories not dealerships why?

I am talking about Made To Order installations lol. I am not sure how you cannot follow my simpleton posts.

I think I should put you on ignore now. You are pretending to be so all-knowing yet your posts show ignorance about the service economy and how pervasive it is, even if there are "huge" liabilities in rendering these services.

 

[suxeL]

Tell em

I am talking about Made To Order installations lol. I am not sure how you cannot follow my simpleton posts.

I think I should put you on ignore now. You are pretending to be so all-knowing yet your posts show ignorance about the service economy and how pervasive it is, even if there are "huge" liabilities in rendering these services.

Well I guess to you installing a block heater, 3m door edge guards, and windows tints are equivalent to doing custom interior appointments, one off paint jobs, and other individual options such as but not limited to installing perforated semi-aniline leather interior trim, power open/close trunk with kick sensor, lateral performance dampers and more (which are more then just plug and play options currently in the ES)

If it was feasible economically, I doubt that Toyota, the most efficient automaker and parent to Lexus would hold back. I guess if you want to ignore me, you should probably ignore Lexus and Toyota as well...

 

[Sulu]

Well I guess to you installing a block heater, 3m door edge guards, and windows tints are equivalent to doing custom interior appointments, one off paint jobs, and other individual options such as but not limited to installing perforated semi-aniline leather interior trim, power open/close trunk with kick sensor, lateral performance dampers and more (which are more then just plug and play options currently in the ES)

It would be acceptable to me if only a few electronics options could be added at the dealer; the items I listed should all be easily done at the dealer, since they have to know how to service them (which, when it comes to modern electronics is a simple remove/swap and replace). I would not expect paint colour options to be available at the dealer.

 

[suxeL]

It would be acceptable to me if only a few electronics options could be added at the dealer; the items I listed should all be easily done at the dealer, since they have to know how to service them (which, when it comes to modern electronics is a simple remove/swap and replace). I would not expect paint colour options to be available at the dealer.

It would be nice to add certain modular components, like the navigation unit. There have been rumblings of this type of design for Toyota as early as 2005. However nothing thus far has come of it in regards. Toyota and the industry have been using modularity on the line to simplify design, however there have been varying levels to that. For instance they might leave the connector to the module or fog lamp, but the module is missing to process that data or the switch on the console is missing. DIYers have been able to trace that back and enable certain items to varying degrees of success.

 

[Gecko]

This thread has really gotten off track...

 

[mikeavelli]

kind of yes... first factory is in the same country, so that helps.

BUT, in Japan, popular Lexus models are often on 3-4 month waiting list, so you definitely can not get it the way you want it fast.
When it comes to special ordering, even dealers in the US can do it, and get the car in 120 days.

Totally different market and expectations. There is little to no dealer inventory in Japan. People go and order their cars. They expect to wait.

Lexus was kind enough to give me some dealer tours in Japan and I learned a ton on the differences.

 

[Joaquin Ruhi]

This thread has really gotten off track...

Agreed. Hopefully this Lexus-centric excerpt from Automotive News' interview with new Toyota North America CEO Ted Ogawa will help bring it back on track:

Toyota has had a very conservative product cadence; the Tundra is a prime example, having not been fully redesigned since 2007. Are there plans to shorten that lengthy cadence?
In the case of the Toyota lineup, right now, it's a very good cadence, with one or two new [or refreshed] models per year, and will continue. So dealers are happy, and we are confident, even if the Tundra is too far in its life cycle. We have a new one coming soon, but they are selling currently.

I have no worries about the Toyota lineup, but in the case of Lexus, the cadence is an issue. So for this year, the LC convertible is new. Profitwise, it may be OK, but in this sense, the Lexus dealer body wants to see more product sooner.

How will you change that within Lexus?
We need to change the cadence and the product and the powertrain. Cadence is a planning concept, so that's a No. 1 priority. And then product, next to the powertrain, right now is a second order.

What do you think ails Lexus? Where is the weak point? Is it something that can be fixed with product?
Yes, product and the cadence, and No. 2 is the cost competitiveness. Aggressive incentives from German brands in particular are impacting the market. So we need to change the luxury market, which has been tough for us. Customers rely on the quality of our products, but dealers have issues with cadence. I can improve product and cadence because those are in my hands. But I cannot control the market, so that's very difficult, and I don't have the right answer yet for that.

 

[internalaudit]

Make something the market wants?

What is the point of market research? Let a few corporate newbies read up on forums like these to gather marketing intelligence.

Sounds more like laziness to not be in tune with what the market wants. The sales numbers are out there, even for the competition.

In this day and age, it's not hard to find out why some products sell briskly while others languish.

 

[LexsCTJill]

Make something the market wants?

What is the point of market research? Let a few corporate newbies read up on forums like these to gather marketing intelligence.

Sounds more like laziness to not be in tune with what the market wants. The sales numbers are out there, even for the competition.

In this day and age, it's not hard to find out why some products sell briskly while others languish.

The sales numbers are still very good for North American. Lexus has done really well in world market.s