Official Lexus Future Product & Powertrain Megathread

[LexsCTJill]

Not disagreeing, but the exact car I built on the Lexus configurator was actually on the lot at my local dealer (and it told me so). That was luck, because as we know dealers of any luxury brand these days rarely carry anything that isn't black, white, or grey, and I was insisting on Nightfall Mica this time.

In Japan they have all kinds of options for Lexus, they need to bite the bullet and do that here, at least on the not-so-volume models.

Like what are they missing in the US compared to Japan?

 

[Levi]

The German Premium cook book is not even a secret. It is clear as daylight. Or maybe there is a secret? Yes, but not what you expect. The secret is consistency!

To be profitable from a manufacturing perspective, you either need to lower costs (Toyota way: few options/customization but streamlined prodcution process) or make the customer pay for the extras/complexity (German Premium way: endless list of options, double the starting price).

The sell the first way is evidently a good value buy. The sell the second way you need the added value, and that is what brand perception does.

That is where what the Germans do is evident: brand desirability with continuous halo products, entry level products to appeal to the all (make everyone feel special) and all this has to be supported by marketing, a prime cornerstone. But the secrete is to remain peristent and then consistent. That is where every other luxury car maker failed, Lexus is the last standing alternative.

An example of how this worked is Audi. I don't have to describe what they did, it is self evident (still don't forget marketing). They were not BMW/Mercedes equal.

One difference between Lexus and Audi is the Lexus profit from Toyota's reputation but Audi have their good reputation and make VW profit from it ("cheap Audi" rather than "expensive VW"). But this can vary regionally.

So back to the secret, a Lexus GS, while great for some customers, is not a solution Lexus situation if marketing is not done (which was not as it should) and if consistency is not there. We'll see how persistent and consitent Genesis will be, that is if they first apply marketing tools as must be done.

PS: Rolex does marketing, like no other. It is no Vacheron Constantin. Rolex is the BMW of timeprices. I'd take a Girard Perregaux or even a Maurice Lacroix over a Rolex. (But I'd gladly take a Rolex Oysterquartz, the only true Rolex for me.)

 

[Gecko]

Not disagreeing, but the exact car I built on the Lexus configurator was actually on the lot at my local dealer (and it told me so). That was luck, because as we know dealers of any luxury brand these days rarely carry anything that isn't black, white, or grey, and I was insisting on Nightfall Mica this time.

In Japan they have all kinds of options for Lexus, they need to bite the bullet and do that here, at least on the not-so-volume models.

Don't blame you - your color combo is my absolute favorite 🤤😍

 

[spwolf]

I specced out a comparably equipped S-Class and 7-Series with their online builders before I went with the LS500 and while they still offer more standalone options than Lexus, it's not like it was even 10 years ago. Many of the standalone things require that you have specific packages first, and it's not always obvious why.

Yeah, well it is kind of obvious - TMC is a lot more profitable than the Germans, with their lean production methods, so Germans are now copying TMC.

And it is also not bad, in the end option packages that Lexus has are a lot cheaper if you want everything, as supposed to tacking everything to MB/Audi/BMW. So it also leads to better equipped and cheaper overall packages for them as well.

There’s still a lot of work that needs to be done as Schot went on to mention the ultimate goal is to reduce the product portfolio by as much as 40% or even 45% in a bid to achieve “simplified premium.” Axing some versions of a car or the nameplate altogether isn’t being done uniformly on a global scale since people want different things, so what works in Europe might fail in China or vice versa.

Audi 'Simplified Premium' Approach Has Cut Product Portfolio By 27%

Audi's cost-cutting plan is paying off as the company has reduced model complexity by 27%, but there's still work to be done as it wants to hit 45%.

www.motor1.com

 

[CRSKTN]

From some materials I've translated, it seems like Lexus in Japan is a lot closer to the German treatment globally.

At least with various luxury bits and pieces you can upgrade (e.g. upgraded interior knobs, wood flooring for rear, etc).

 

[Sulu]

Toyota's just-in-time, lean manufacturing, which they are known for, requires absolute coordination between suppliers and the assembly line, to ensure that the right part arrives on the assembly only when it is needed. If the part arrives too early, it requires storage space (and there is no warehouse space along the line) as it waits for its slot on the line; if it arrives too late, it holds up the assembly line.

This requires meticulous, long-term plans. Parts suppliers like this because their production schedule is spelled out long in advance, giving them time to perfect the parts they supply. But it makes it very difficult (if not impossible) to special order a bespoke vehicle.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

This requires meticulous, long-term plans. Parts suppliers like this because their production schedule is spelled out long in advance, giving them time to perfect the parts they supply. But it makes it very difficult (if not impossible) to special order a bespoke vehicle.

I think their system is fine for bespoke. If you are in the Japanese market, you order your car rather than buy what is available on the lot (which is rare for any Japanese dealer), so you get exactly what you want with the options you want too, and none of that "We have to steal allocation of a IS300 with LSD from the Eastern Region because we don't order them that way in the West".

 

[internalaudit]

What features and technologies are available on the German marquees (MB, BMW, Audi) that are not available as options on competing Lexus models below the LC and LS? I know with MB, they will have some really advanced technology like ABC on the S Class.

Maybe we will find out there aren't many deficiencies on the Lexus but that the Germans take the ala carte approach to the Nth level.

 

[Ian Schmidt]

Magic Body Control is the major thing the S-Class does that Lexus needs to copy that I'm aware of.

 

[suxeL]

BMW Individual: The expression of personality

Accentuate your own character with genuine exclusivity: this is precisely what BMW Individual aspires to. Whether you are seeking a special colour or exclusive materials, you can provide a perfect figure for your inspirations. With an automobile that matches your preferences precisely, down to...

www.bmw-m.com

Mercedes-Benz Passenger Cars

A blend of luxury, sportiness and performance. Be it Saloon, Estate, Coupé, Cabriolet, Roadster, SUV and more. Experience the products from Mercedes-Benz.

www.mercedes-benz.co.uk

Pardon the marketing fluff in these links, but this is what I`m referring on the higher end of the "custom order" bit.

But even ordering select packages or color combos from the standard catalog is like pulling shark teeth

 

[internalaudit]

Maybe that is what the larger segment of the luxury car buyer population wants - "bespoke" products.

But for a car (as oppose to clothing), I am good opting for the Ultimate package (if I think the value is there) that has all the bells and whistles as I can always choose to ignore the features I don't care about.

I think Lexus is missing on some key features available in the German cars. That and potentially the performance and cachet (can take years to catch up) gaps.

 

[mikeavelli]

The German Premium cook book is not even a secret. It is clear as daylight. Or maybe there is a secret? Yes, but not what you expect. The secret is consistency!

To be profitable from a manufacturing perspective, you either need to lower costs (Toyota way: few options/customization but streamlined prodcution process) or make the customer pay for the extras/complexity (German Premium way: endless list of options, double the starting price).

The sell the first way is evidently a good value buy. The sell the second way you need the added value, and that is what brand perception does.

That is where what the Germans do is evident: brand desirability with continuous halo products, entry level products to appeal to the all (make everyone feel special) and all this has to be supported by marketing, a prime cornerstone. But the secrete is to remain peristent and then consistent. That is where every other luxury car maker failed, Lexus is the last standing alternative.

An example of how this worked is Audi. I don't have to describe what they did, it is self evident (still don't forget marketing). They were not BMW/Mercedes equal.

One difference between Lexus and Audi is the Lexus profit from Toyota's reputation but Audi have their good reputation and make VW profit from it ("cheap Audi" rather than "expensive VW"). But this can vary regionally.

So back to the secret, a Lexus GS, while great for some customers, is not a solution Lexus situation if marketing is not done (which was not as it should) and if consistency is not there. We'll see how persistent and consitent Genesis will be, that is if they first apply marketing tools as must be done.

PS: Rolex does marketing, like no other. It is no Vacheron Constantin. Rolex is the BMW of timeprices. I'd take a Girard Perregaux or even a Maurice Lacroix over a Rolex. (But I'd gladly take a Rolex Oysterquartz, the only true Rolex for me.)

I know the manager of Audi Bespoke design, it was a new position added about the time the new R8 launched. He’s sent me all sorts of amazing configurations they can do to nearly all models. You just got to pay. It does offer a hefty profit for the customer who wants their own Audi.

In talking with some friends at Porsche recently they really explained their customization is so no two cars are the same. I’ve seen some wild and amazing configurations they offer, many are for owners that don’t share the cars on social media.

I think there is a market for Lexus as I work with dealers who add modifications and they do sell the cars and at a good mark up. You have a happy customer with a one off Lexus compared to the same thing everyone has.

 

[James]

Maybe Lexus should focus and use the Macan or Cayenne (okay, even the X3 M and X5 M or the SQ5) as its SUV benchmark, except keep the better steering feel and don't adopt the BMW numbness. Rather than benchmark Toyota products and make them 30% better?

Also, Lexus doesn't seem to take the Toyota approach to volume-selling. In Canada, it has an infrequent once in a year incentives for one-year old models (say 2019 in September/October 2019) where the lease or finance rates are dropped by 2-2.49% plus a few thousand cash incentives.

It's also very conservative with its lease-end residual values (leading to higher monthly payments) and so many used car dealerships will buy these leased cars cheap and then add in a significant profit.

The only approach that makes sense if I am shopping for a used Lexus is to check the Leasebuster.ca site and check out potential Lexus takeovers (short term remaining) as buying it out would be my goal. Trying to scour used car sites can have that potential diamond in the rough too but dealer margins add 10-15% to the asking price.

Lexus should offer more competitive financing/leasing terms and rates and maybe discount the cars less. That will definitely pull borderline entry luxury car buyers like me into the fold more easily since I do keep cars for a long time but I know anything over 3% interest is going to cost me a pretty penny on interest charges. Even Apple has been offering 12 or 24-month no interest installment on its iPhones for two to three years now in the US. North Americans like to stretch themselves thin financially when shopping for luxury goods. Lexus is a luxury good too.

But yeah product life cycles are so long, it sucks for someone leasing an IS to find out eight years later, the same IS is still being offered. For those who bought in the first or second year, it makes their purchases look astute lol.

Yeah the life cycles has been a huge problem. I mean I know many of us having been talking about it and it's not new news and we know 2020 is just a lost year for everyone right now (is Lexus coming out with anything new this year besides LCC?). Here in Illinois we are at home for another month and there are rumors this could come back in the fall. Does anyone want to show a brand new model with such a weird state of the world when you are probably going to have lower volume of sales with people more worried about their health and job security than a normal year? Hopefully 2021 can be a big remodel year but even that seems to be fishy with Lexus right now. I know they are amazing at keeping secrets but it would sure be nice to have some clue when new models are coming. Come on how many rumors have we seen about the IS? Brand new design, just a refresh, not doing anything, canceling the IS entirely? I can't keep track!

I know the manager of Audi Bespoke design, it was a new position added about the time the new R8 launched. He’s sent me all sorts of amazing configurations they can do to nearly all models. You just got to pay. It does offer a hefty profit for the customer who wants their own Audi.

In talking with some friends at Porsche recently they really explained their customization is so no two cars are the same. I’ve seen some wild and amazing configurations they offer, many are for owners that don’t share the cars on social media.

I think there is a market for Lexus as I work with dealers who add modifications and they do sell the cars and at a good mark up. You have a happy customer with a one off Lexus compared to the same thing everyone has.

Totally agree. When you go to Lexus to build you have a few options but when you go to the Germans my god the stuff you can add or change is actually really cool. I mean we have like 1 color choice for the brakes some have like 10. That alone adds to that customization and uniqueness that even if you get an R8 or M5 you can have one that maybe no one else has.

 

[spwolf]

I think their system is fine for bespoke. If you are in the Japanese market, you order your car rather than buy what is available on the lot (which is rare for any Japanese dealer), so you get exactly what you want with the options you want too, and none of that "We have to steal allocation of a IS300 with LSD from the Eastern Region because we don't order them that way in the West".

kind of yes... first factory is in the same country, so that helps.

BUT, in Japan, popular Lexus models are often on 3-4 month waiting list, so you definitely can not get it the way you want it fast.
When it comes to special ordering, even dealers in the US can do it, and get the car in 120 days.

 

[spwolf]

I know the manager of Audi Bespoke design, it was a new position added about the time the new R8 launched. He’s sent me all sorts of amazing configurations they can do to nearly all models. You just got to pay. It does offer a hefty profit for the customer who wants their own Audi.

In talking with some friends at Porsche recently they really explained their customization is so no two cars are the same. I’ve seen some wild and amazing configurations they offer, many are for owners that don’t share the cars on social media.

I think there is a market for Lexus as I work with dealers who add modifications and they do sell the cars and at a good mark up. You have a happy customer with a one off Lexus compared to the same thing everyone has.

Right... that is the old way, but if you read article few post above, Audi is actually cutting back options by 40%.

 

[suxeL]

kind of yes... first factory is in the same country, so that helps.

BUT, in Japan, popular Lexus models are often on 3-4 month waiting list, so you definitely can not get it the way you want it fast.
When it comes to special ordering, even dealers in the US can do it, and get the car in 120 days.

They can doesnt mean they want to at all, especially if its their most popular fleet models like the ES or RX. The amount of pushback is surprising.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

kind of yes... first factory is in the same country, so that helps.

BUT, in Japan, popular Lexus models are often on 3-4 month waiting list, so you definitely can not get it the way you want it fast.
When it comes to special ordering, even dealers in the US can do it, and get the car in 120 days.

Never said that things come fast, because YMMV as far as time goes. If you are in Japan, the cycle is shorter; for overseas orders, it takes longer obviously because of the time needed to transport. When one purchases a Lexus in Japan or any locally produced vehicle, what I'm saying is that you are placing an order where you must configure the vehicle to what you want, meaning you pick the colors, and the options.

Basically, you get it pretty much the way you want with options you want and none you don't. For US buyers, its more difficult to do so if 1) you aren't special ordering 2) They don't build them that way. I believe Europe has a similar model too. Only in the US and North America, is the dealer model different, where we stock em deep and sell em cheap.

 

[internalaudit]

Lexus/Toyota just has to study/list what exactly German car buyers are opting when configuring their vehicles.

It can then decide on how to accommodate many of these top features (manufacturing and installation-wise) but not equip them until such time a dealership has to install them if a buyer so chooses to opt for them. Problem solved.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

Lexus/Toyota just has to study/list what exactly German car buyers are opting when configuring their vehicles.

It can then decide on how to accommodate many of these top features (manufacturing and installation-wise) but not equip them until such time a dealership has to install them if a buyer so chooses to opt for them. Problem solved.

I believe the personalization that you see is something that requires the factory to do properly, more so than the dealer can do (liability should fall on the manufacturer and not dealer, sorry I work in insurance); obviously, this is why many buyers are willing to pay more.

 

[internalaudit]

I believe the personalization that you see is something that requires the factory to do properly, more so than the dealer can do (liability should fall on the manufacturer and not dealer, sorry I work in insurance); obviously, this is why many buyers are willing to pay more.

I'm surprised though. It's not Lexus that provides the servicing yet warranty work is covered by it, and not the dealerships.

As long as the specific order is on the purchase contract, why would the dealerships be on the hook and if they installed properly as per Lexus specifications? Block heater are offered here in Canada and it's dealership-installed. I didn't know that if it exploded or cause a fire (there was a recall), that the local dealership will be on the hook.