5th Generation (2018+) Lexus LS 500 & LS 500h Megathread

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ssun30

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Gecko said:
ES should get T24A "350", "350h" or maybe "400h" hybrids, and probably a 500h F SPORT Performance flagship. I would also expect 450h+ and an all-electric "e" option... maybe something like ES 400/450e.
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These will happen if the Crown rumors are all true: 350, 350h, 500h, all with standard AWD only. Also Avalon PHV is under development. So all the hardware for your described ES series should already be ready. But Perhaps ES redesign could be delayed a little bit to line up with solid state battery launch in 2025.
 
F1 Silver Arrows

F1 Silver Arrows

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ssun30 said:
These will happen if the Crown rumors are all true: 350, 350h, 500h, all with standard AWD only. Also Avalon PHV is under development. So all the hardware for your described ES series should already be ready. But Perhaps ES redesign could be delayed a little bit to line up with solid state battery launch in 2025.
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I assume for China only?
 
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Ali Manai

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ssun30 said:
These will happen if the Crown rumors are all true: 350, 350h, 500h, all with standard AWD only. Also Avalon PHV is under development. So all the hardware for your described ES series should already be ready. But Perhaps ES redesign could be delayed a little bit to line up with solid state battery launch in 2025.
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Question is what type of awd system will toyota use
The one in yaris gr or
The one in nx
 
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sl0519

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Gecko said:
Agree, but being on the very front of the TNGA rollout, I have to believe the next gen ES and LS will get serious upgrades that will push them past the NX due to advancements made over time, just like how NX has leapfrogged them being 4 years newer.

ES should get T24A "350", "350h" or maybe "400h" hybrids, and probably a 500h F SPORT Performance flagship. I would also expect 450h+ and an all-electric "e" option... maybe something like ES 400/450e.

I believe the 6LS will be all hybrid or - less likely- electric-only for the next gen. The demand for gas powered flagship luxury sedans has shrunk to one: the S Class. Lexus should use the LS as a tech showcase and to cement their position as the hybrid leader with something like a base LS 550h (T24A + batteries), LS 750h (TTV6 + batteries), LS 600h+ (T24A + PHEV), and LS 600e all-electric option. It would be a bold move, but that's really the only course forward for the LS IMO.
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For some, the current TTV6 still lacks refinement and smoothness of previous V8...I just can't imagine going from v6 to l4, at least not in this segment. Ideally, a fine tuned TTv6 should be bare minimum, adding electric motors for hybrid (no cvt this time pls), then one pure electric to showcase their tech advancement and lastly, a V8 for soul and diehard fans lol. (as a matter of fact, BMW still insists on V8 for its next 7 series)
 
yosafbridge

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sl0519 said:
Interesting bits I find on Chinese websites, 2018 LS and 2021 LS both with instrumented tests (acceleration, braking, moose test, fuel economy, noise decibel). The pre-refresh model included its test in the following time stamp (15:45 - 17:23).

https://www.dongchedi.com/video/6833342885442617870
https://www.dongchedi.com/video/7062721888400704039

I want to specifically point out the moose test because this gives us a much clearer picture on how much the suspension tune has changed between pre-refresh and refreshed model.

The 2018 model, has much smoother transition between the cones with only a slight bit of body roll. It has some sporty nature of suspension tunes like the Germans which is plausible except, people from the previous LS complained the ride being too harsh. Perhaps the folks at Lexus panicked so they decided to return to the origin nature of the LS and instead went with the other extreme. The ride definitely soften up a lot on the facelifted model but as you can see, it now sacrifices its dynamic way too much for a much plusher ride. Its struggle of weight transfer between cones can clearly be felt, the rolls have become much bigger and you can even see how there are way too many suspension rebounds and body control fares a lot worse. To me it looks like they haven't quite found the balance where both handling and comfort are maintained as such like segment leader. Hopefully they will get to address many of its problem in the next major redesign.
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I think you put too much stock on visible body roll but missed out the most crucial metric : the speed the car could carry through the moose test.

The 2018 preface-lift LS500h had a carry through speed of 74.2km/h while the 2021 LS500h, even if you "noted" more body roll had a significantly faster speed of 77.5km/h. Hence by objective criteria, the 2021 LS handles better than the 2018 LS even if it rides better and seems to roll more visibly.
 
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Levi

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yosafbridge said:
I think you put too much stock on visible body roll but missed out the most crucial metric : the speed the car could carry through the moose test.

The 2018 preface-lift LS500h had a carry through speed of 74.2km/h while the 2021 LS500h, even if you "noted" more body roll had a significantly faster speed of 77.5km/h. Hence by objective criteria, the 2021 LS handles better than the 2018 LS even if it rides better and seems to roll more visibly.
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Body roll complaint is overrated be car reviewers. Miata drivers know that. There is a difference between body roll and car flipping over.
 
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sl0519

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yosafbridge said:
I think you put too much stock on visible body roll but missed out the most crucial metric : the speed the car could carry through the moose test.

The 2018 preface-lift LS500h had a carry through speed of 74.2km/h while the 2021 LS500h, even if you "noted" more body roll had a significantly faster speed of 77.5km/h. Hence by objective criteria, the 2021 LS handles better than the 2018 LS even if it rides better and seems to roll more visibly.
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The speed does not correlate to how well a car handles, it is rather more of a electronic stability test for extreme manuevering situation. Some sports cars may have bad results because their rear ends tend to slip out a lot eg. BMW performance cars. What's obvious is the fact that facelifted model definitely traded some sportiness for comfort. Don't get me wrong, for the type of car it represents...the outcome is to be expected, however some point out that competitors are just as comfortable and still able to drive even better...which is why I think they have not quite reached the balance they were looking for.
 
yosafbridge

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sl0519 said:
The speed does not correlate to how well a car handles, it is rather more of a electronic stability test for extreme manuevering situation. Some sports cars may have bad results because their rear ends tend to slip out a lot eg. BMW performance cars. What's obvious is the fact that facelifted model definitely traded some sportiness for comfort. Don't get me wrong, for the type of car it represents...the outcome is to be expected, however some point out that competitors are just as comfortable and still able to drive even better...which is why I think they have not quite reached the balance they were looking for.
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At the end of the day, it still comes down to this :

The 2021 LS is able to perform extreme emergency maneuvers better than the 2018 LS and thus better able to keep its driver out of harms way.

So by all real world metrics, it's a better handling car. I won't be surprised either if it pulls better track times than the 2018 version.
 
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Berto3818

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So it’s sad to say the next LS will be full electric. Any guess on when it’s coming and how many motors or will it have a hybrid?
 
mikeavelli

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With no LS F coming it seems a full AWD EV LS makes sense. A faster, more quiet LS with more room? Sounds like a plan.

Note how the LS 500h is now awd only and the only one available with the teammate technology.
 
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Berto3818

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@mikeavelli so team mate will be in the next remodel for sure. I’ve seen that when I checked the website. Fro that pic it looks like 4LS Body. How many electric motors?
 
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