The Future of the IS Thread

[Gecko]

416hp for IS F in 2021?

First gen had 416hp in 2008 and the competition is now at 500hp. SMH.

That render is really nice though.

 

[CRSKTN]

416hp for IS F in 2021?

First gen had 416hp in 2008 and the competition is now at 500hp. SMH.

That render is really nice though.

This is some AMG 43 level watering down of the F branding.

 

[Gecko]

This is some AMG 43 level watering down of the F branding.

Hell - I'm cool with watering down AMG to a more accessible level because it's a flagship product line. If the Lexus F products were half as good as the AMG 43 products, I'd be pleased.

 

[mikeavelli]

I doubt the IS F uses the LS V-6, its just a slug off the line and is not a F type engine. I like that rendering.

 

[CRSKTN]

Hell - I'm cool with watering down AMG to a more accessible level because it's a flagship product line. If the Lexus F products were half as good as the AMG 43 products, I'd be pleased.

What part/aspect of current F offerings do you think are somehow less than half as good as say, the C 43 AMG?

 

[Gecko]

What part/aspect of current F offerings do you think are somehow less than half as good as say, the C 43 AMG?

Basically the fact that it exists and the IS F doesn't? With regard to performance, the E53 is probably a better competitor for the GS F than the E63. I have a lot of respect for how Mercedes has invested in AMG and grown it as a product line, from C to E, CLS, S, etc. More options never hurt!

 

[spwolf]

i think people should take rumors less seriously... ie USA will certainly get new 2.4l turbo as well that replaces V6.
Then it is hard to believe that F engine will be just LS V6.

Then 2.5l hybrid is not the same, it would be next generation 2.5l hybrid.

 

[Netsfan]

A supercharged version of the V8 in the current rcf would be nice

 

[GNS]

No C43/S4/M340i competitor?

 

[James]

I am looking for a new car in 2021 would love to get an ISF please bring it back!

 

[ahmed abou elsaoud]

i think like the exist Gen they will start with IS suff and IS F kit only
after 2 years they will make the IS F performance

the LS500 engine which supplied with tow turbo chargers is very hi performance and in 2021 will be added to the LX as it already in LS

 

[Carmaker1]

😕🧐🤨😠😡🤬2021!!!????? Knowing they're Japanese reports, this definitely points to CY of launch, not model year season! WTH? I am tired. Awful product planning.

This car should not be arriving longer than 15 months, as it is 6 years old now since June 2013 launch!!! The original IS lasted only 6.5 years from early 1999's IS 200 to the IS 300 in September 2005. What gives??

416hp for IS F in 2021?

First gen had 416hp in 2008 and the competition is now at 500hp. SMH.

That render is really nice though.

It is a nice rendering, but what is happening with the LS+ design language?

Is Lexus backtracking on pushing the envelope as of 2017-18 design approvals? (for future models)

Thirdly, I echo disappointment at utilizing the V35A-FTS 3.5L V6...well unchanged that is.

Is that engine at peak performance?

In fact, how has IS-F and RC-F reliability been in comparison to their lesser 350 counterparts or that of the LS 460 and GS 460 UR V8s?

Is it possible to expect that higher stressed Lexus performance vehicles may not last as long as non-performance counterparts, but still eons longer and more durable than the luxury performance competition?

If Lexus chooses to get more out of the V35A-FTS for performance use (LS 500 already is putting out roughly 119 hp per litre!), then hopefully if there is some compromise in durability (lasting as long) it isn't too obvious.

As for the launch date, I am very annoyed, as an 8-year life cycle is a very pathetic and unfortunate joke.

BMW is right on time with redesigning the 3er, with it being last redesigned in February 2012 and February 2019.

Other than to heavily study and benchmark the G20 3er the past few months (to 1 extra year), there is no reason to wait another year on the IS, not even talk of a possible mid-LATE 2021 launch.

Now as for elaborating on my biggest annoyance, a 2022 MY redesign is laughably poor timing and painfully drags on a poorly received late 2016 facelift for an audacious 5 years.

The same way the once GREAT LS 460 went unchanged from September 2012 to its belated retirement in December 2017.

Many LS drivers (XF20, XF30, XF40) jumped ship to Tesla, Audi, BMW, and MB. On this other level of entry, they've needed to build the IS brand, but haven't put in the effort and care more about 2 door offerings (Akio's pets), the NX, and old K/GA-K duo.

I can't bother to know anymore, as I need to focus on my own young future in the present and not fall for studying products, that continually seem delayed or arriving later than stated (supplier database earmarked July 2020 SOP).

Years back (late 00s/early 10s), I took a very heavy interest in the future of MB, because they were making a rumoured serious comeback.

Now they have achieved it (starting with current S-Class) and Dieter Zetsche has retired, thus I don't focus much on what's incoming there as I do with Lexus. Particularly as, although MB is far from perfect, I now fully grasp what they are truly capable of in the 21st century post-DaimlerChrysler/Mckinsey & Co./Jurgen Schrempp eras of the 90s and 2000s that saw serious quality reductions and gross corruption.

I want to know the best Toyota/Lexus is capable of under the leadership and guidance of a Toyoda family member.

(Not in reference to Toyoda) But it seems like I had dangled in front of me, New N and heavy facelift products much of this 2010s decade, while waiting for modular TNGA grandslams.

So far, it is mostly the new Camry, RAV4, and Corolla line that have made a truly lasting impact (and ES to a degree).

Everything else just always seems be coming (IS, GA-F, GA-L CUVs), in dire straits (GS/CT), or being heldback (LS/LC*) from peak execution levels or diversification. I have to take a long break and return focus, when I see some results.

I know that this company is capable of LASTING and IMPACTFUL greatness and very much this (Lexus) brand, but some things clearly don't make sense.

I am not here to aimlessly berate Lexus (constructiveness matters), but to express frustration and hope they do better, against strong competition.

A supercharged version of the V8 in the current rcf would be nice

That might end up being affected by the GGT in the USA.

No C43/S4/M340i competitor?

Exactly...they need a potent 6 cylinder variant. IS 350 is being squeezed out by such competition in 3.0t Q50, C43, S4(?) and 340i/M340i (over time).

Looking at the LS struggle, I can say confidently they don't know what they're doing in targeting the right market.

The LS 500/h is the perfect super GS, but I digress.

IS needs to be designed for its market properly or otherwise, not be redesigned. New 2.4 sounds nice, but why I do feel as the liter size is inaccurate? It is good to replace AWD IS V6 and non-sport V6 IS.

An F-sport orientated turbo V6 is needed as M340i competitor and IS-F at higher levels.

 

[F1 Silver Arrows]

It is a nice rendering, but what is happening the LS+ design language?

Is Lexus backtracking on pushing the envelope as of 2017-18 design approvals? (for future models)

Thirdly, I echo disappointment at utilizing the V35A-FTS 3.5L V6...well unchanged that is.

Is that engine at peak performance?

In fact, how has IS-F and RC-F reliability been in comparison to their lesser 350 counterparts or that of the LS 460 and GS 460 UR V8s?

Is it possible to expect that higher stressed Lexus performance vehicles may not last as long as non-performance counterparts, but still eons longer and more durable than the performance competition?

If Lexus chooses to get more out of the V35A-FTS for performance use (LS 500 already is putting out roughly 119 hp per litre!), then hopefully if there is some compromise in durability (lasting as long) it isn't too obvious.

As for the launch date, I am very annoyed, as an 8-year life cycle is a pathetic joke.

BMW is right on time with redesigning the 3er, with it being last redesigned in February 2012 and February 2019.

Other than to heavily study and benchmark the G20 3er the past few months, there is no reason to wait another year.

Now as for my biggest annoyance, a 2022 MY redesigning is laughably poor timing and painfully drags on a poorly received facelift for an audacious 5 years, the same way the LS 460 went unchanged from September 2012 to its belated retirement in December 2017.

Many LS drivers (XF20, XF30, XF40) jumped ship to Tesla, Audi, BMW, and MB. On this level, they've needed to build the IS brand, but haven't put in the effort and care more about 2 door offerings (Akio's pets) and the NX and old K/GA-K duo.

I can't bother to know anymore, as I need to focus on my own young future in the present and not fall for studying products, that continually seem delayed or arriving later than stated (supplier database earmarked July 2020 SOP).

Years back (late 00s/early 10s), I took a very heavy interest in the future of MB, because they were making a serious comeback.

Now they have achieved it (starting with current S-Class), I don't focus much on what's incoming there as I do with Lexus, because although MB is far from perfect, I now fully grasp what they are truly capable of in the 21st century post-DaimlerChrysler/Mckinsey & Co./Jurgen Schrempp.

I want to know the best Toyota/Lexus capable under the leadership and guidance of a Toyoda family member.

(Not in reference to Toyoda) But it seems like I had dangled in front of me New N and heavy facelift products, while waiting for modular TNGA grandslams. So far, it is mostly the new Camry, RAV4, and Corolla line that have made a truly lasting impact (and ES to a degree).

Everything else just always seems be coming (IS, GA-F, GA-L CUVs), in dire straits (GS/CT), or being heldback (LS/LC*) from peak execution levels or diversification. I have to take a long break and return focus, when I see some results.




That might end up being affected by the GGT in the USA.


Exactly...they need a potent 6 cylinder variant. IS 350 is being squeezed out by such competition in 3.0t Q50, C43, S4(?) and 340i/M340i (over time).

Looking at the LS struggle, I can say confidently they don't know what they're doing in targeting the right market.

The LS 500/h is the perfect GS, but I digress. IS needs to be designed for its market properly or otherwise, not be redesigned.

I'm literally on the verge of giving up. I don't think I will ever have the opportunity to buy a luxury car, ever. It seems that I'm going to have to stick to FWD Toyotas that cut a f*ck load of power because only old farts buy those cars and cannot handle anything more than 2 horsepower, or old dinosaur BOF platforms as cars I can buy. Everything is just so out of reach or just "meh". Nothing excites me anymore. And I don't think I will ever be compelled to buy a Mercedes, BMW, Porsche or Lexus. Nobody is getting their sh*t together.

 

[Carmaker1]

I'm literally on the verge of giving up. I don't think I will ever have the opportunity to buy a luxury car, ever. It seems that I'm going to have to stick to FWD Toyotas that cut a f*ck load of power because only old farts buy those cars and cannot handle anything more than 2 horsepower, or old dinosaur BOF platforms as cars I can buy. Everything is just so out of reach or just "meh". Nothing excites me anymore. And I don't think I will ever be compelled to buy a Mercedes, BMW, Porsche or Lexus. Nobody is getting their sh*t together.

Let's hope not, as one worries at times. I know I rule myself out of luxury market by my traditionalist tastes (sadly only M3 sedan offered what I want), but "wow" I just say in what we encounter as the years progress.

 

[Ch’Pok]

Others here know far more about bringing a design to production than me, but it appears the IS is stuck between “don’t want to kill it” and “don’t want to commit resources to it”. Is it possible the 4IS was paused or greatly slowed at some stage of development? This while management throws resources into (1) finding out how many crossovers it’s possible to build at once and (2) electric. The 4IS is left to hang there with a “we’ll get to it when we get to it” philosophy. Maybe even left to wither on the vine until the day they can save money by offering only the ES and LS? I imagine most dealers would favor concentrating on the RX redesign, LQ or whatever they’re gonna call it, etc.

Genesis G70 here I come...

 

[mediumhot]

Others here know far more about bringing a design to production than me, but it appears the IS is stuck between “don’t want to kill it” and “don’t want to commit resources to it”. Is it possible the 4IS was paused or greatly slowed at some stage of development? This while management throws resources into (1) finding out how many crossovers it’s possible to build at once and (2) electric. The 4IS is left to hang there with a “we’ll get to it when we get to it” philosophy. Maybe even left to wither on the vine until the day they can save money by offering only the ES and LS? I imagine most dealers would favor concentrating on the RX redesign, LQ or whatever they’re gonna call it, etc.

Genesis G70 here I come...

Smells like 4GS scenario all over again. They were probably aware current IS wouldn't be competitive in 2019 and if they had serious plans or priority to keep IS relevant 4IS prototype would have been presented already earlier this year. Waiting for 2 more years to get it into production is LS suicide deja vu. I hope Toyota rebadges give them enough sales to justify exotic LC like car venture in the future.

 

[phoenixss]

Why, already? The current model was released in 1985, why the rush? And where is the electric version? Lexus probably doesn’t know about this company called Tesla that will eat everyone’s lunch once they iron out the current nail bitting challenges. I’m definitely watching.

Certainly hope they don’t use the same designer of the new RAV4, what a shocker in poor interior quality, the ventilation control assy you can shake the $&%# out of it

 

[Gecko]

Others here know far more about bringing a design to production than me, but it appears the IS is stuck between “don’t want to kill it” and “don’t want to commit resources to it”.

I have come to believe this is how Toyoda/ToMoCo views the Lexus brand overall. Look at CT, IS, GS, LS, UX, GX, LX and even ES to an extent. All of it is minimal effort and "is this good enough?" vs the real passion to build great cars that died somewhere around 2012.

The future of Lexus is FWD. No doubt next gen RX and NX are where they're focusing their resources.

 

[Ian Schmidt]

Lexus probably doesn’t know about this company called Tesla that will eat everyone’s lunch once they iron out the current nail bitting challenges.

Nobody's worried about Tesla. Their recent "record sales!!!@!" proclamation hid that the average sale price for the quarter fell by $12,000, meaning the S and X are now deader than disco and the 3s they're selling are mostly base and near-base models. And they aren't making money on those.

 

[phoenixss]

correct, they got some nail bitting challenges ahead, but on the innovation front, they are not looking at tailing anyone.