Official Lexus Future Product & Powertrain Megathread

[NomadDan]

In the presentation they said the 2.0T will be used on trucks as well.

Would that include the Tundra as well? I have a hard time seeing a 2.0T in the Tundra. That would be disastrous for sales. Adding a couple cylinders for a 3.0 inline 6 would be ideal, although I’d prefer a bit more displacement. Ram is now using a 3.0 inline 6 gas engine.

 

[Ali Manai]

I think they arr gonna optimise the 3.5 v6 to last a long time as toyota usually does with their bof vehicles

 

[ssun30]

I think the biggest surprise is Toyota targeting very high specific outputs. 150PS/L for a mainstream engine and 200PS/L potentially 300PS/L for the performance engine. But this is probably the only way forward for any manufacturer to deal with future emissions regulations.

How they can manage the turbo lag would be fascinating.

Also from their presentation future hybrid power will contribute to almost 50% total system power. So the 400PS engine in a hybrid setup could theoretically be scaled up to 800PS total. There's certainly a possibility Toyota introduce something similar to the C63 but I hope not.

*OK so I caught up with the Q&A portion and the presenter said the main reason for smaller displacement engines is actually catalyst cost. The metals used in the catalytic converters have become a very big portion of the production cost of engines. A smaller engine uses less of these materials.

 

[qtb007]

I think the biggest surprise is Toyota targeting very high specific outputs. 150PS/L for a mainstream engine and 200PS/L potentially 300PS/L for the performance engine. But this is probably the only way forward for any manufacturer to deal with future emissions regulations.

How they can manage the turbo lag would be fascinating.

Also from their presentation future hybrid power will contribute to almost 50% total system power. So the 400PS engine in a hybrid setup could theoretically be scaled up to 800PS total. There's certainly a possibility Toyota introduce something similar to the C63 but I hope not.

Is that 600hp the engine alone or system power? A 400hp 2.0T with another 200hp of electric boost seems more likely than a 600hp 2.0T.

 

[Levi]

Also from their presentation future hybrid power will contribute to almost 50% total system power. So the 400PS engine in a hybrid setup could theoretically be scaled up to 800PS total. There's certainly a possibility Toyota introduce something similar to the C63 but I hope not.

I was not against a C63 AMG with 4 cylinders. On the contrary think it is a good idea. Turbo engines just do not sound good, even the very good S58 just is not a NA. At this point why bother with a big heavy (turbo) engine. Having good performance and good fuel economy is great. It just is Mercedes that did a terribly bad job: the car is bloody heavy and not even fuel efficient.

 

[Levi]

One part taken from this website:

トヨタが「新・凄いエンジン」世界初披露！ なぜ“イマ”エンジン開発？ 1.5＆2Lは「エコからスポーツ」まで!? どんな技術なのか

2024年5月28日にカーボンニュートラル実現に向けて、電動化に適合する新たなエンジン開発をトヨタは宣言しました。どのような特徴があるのでしょうか。

kuruma-news.jp

Prior to this technical briefing, I test drove the Toyota Hilux (6-speed manual transmission) and the Lexus IS (paddle shift), both of which are equipped with a 2.0-liter turbo engine.

　The Hilux's engine has a 300 horsepower (red zone: 6200 rpm), while the IS has a 400 horsepower (red zone: 6800 rpm).

　Both cars had light acceleration from a standing start and almost no turbo lag, giving the impression that they were simply "fun to drive."

　Regarding this 2.0-liter turbo, a Toyota engineer said, "Toyota has a globally popular engine called the 2JZ engine. We would like to aim to create an engine that surpasses that," giving us hope for future evolutions.


　The Hilux is a car that is used for business purposes and as transportation for the general public in emerging countries, while the IS is a sports sedan, but the fact that the same engine can cover both areas could truly be called a "dream engine."

Which Hilux I wonder? And which IS? It better get a manual transmission if they panted a Manuel for BEVs. And bring back the Sportcross.

 

[Flagship1]

I was not against a C63 AMG with 4 cylinders. On the contrary think it is a good idea. Turbo engines just do not sound good, even the very good S58 just is not a NA. At this point why bother with a big heavy (turbo) engine. Having good performance and good fuel economy is great. It just is Mercedes that did a terribly bad job: the car is bloody heavy and not even fuel efficient.

True, but i think that segment of car is less about logic, and more about what ifs or as a I like to put it, the German equivalent of Merican muscle; snarling engine growling while roasting the tires. Hopefully they can move remove the heft out as you said but bring the guttural nature of the powertrain back.

 

[ssun30]

Is that 600hp the engine alone or system power? A 400hp 2.0T with another 200hp of electric boost seems more likely than a 600hp 2.0T.

The presenter (CTO of TMC) said they want to build a 600PS by "make enhancements to certain parts". So I think it's the base engine not the overall powertrain.

 

[Ali Manai]

This engine could probably end up in a supra say the regular one gets the 400bhp tune it's an upgrade over the b58 then later a more expensive version powered by the 600bhp cause the way this engine is designed it would be very light weight and shorter meaning a lower hood would be good for dynamics over rhe v35 so fingers crossed for that one.

Also the celicabis rumoured to be powered by the 2.0l but the mr1 and smaller one are said to be powered by a 1.3l so would that be a smaller version of the 1.3l showcased over something completly different.

 

[Falcon]

Will the 2.0T power the GR Hilux instead of the V35A/F33A?

 

[Ali Manai]

Possibly

 

[carguy420]

The 600hp version of the 2.0T is really just meant for their motorsport programs, mainly the Super Formula Championship, because designing and building an engine specifically for a racing series is very costly, so this time around Toyota wanted to make a mass production engine that is a capable enough to be used as the base for their racing engine to keep costs down.

 

[Levi]

Knowing Toyota the final engine will probably have 247 PS in its most powerful production version. Good enough for me in a new IS.

 

[Falcon]

V6s are the only way for future longitudinal products to pass increasingly harsh crash standards without sacrificing interior space

So you think the V35A's successor will also be a V6?

 

[Ali Manai]

新型ハリアーには次世代エンジンを搭載し登場！？ 新型車や業界ニュースなど注目情報満載【ベストカー7月26日号】 - 自動車情報誌「ベストカー」

エンジンはまだまだ終わらない！ そんな新時代の心臓を一番手で収めるのは、なんとハリアーとカローラだった！？　ベストカー7月26日号、注目情報満載でお送りします

bestcarweb.jp

Harrier(venza) anf corolla to be the first to feature new engines

 

[F1 Silver Arrows]

 

[NomadDan]

So I wonder what engine will be in the Corolla? It doesn’t look like there’s a 1:1 replacement for the non-hybrid 2.0. Will the Corolla move to a hybrid only platform and use the NA 1.5? What about Prius and Corolla Cross? The 1.5T hybrid would definitely be a step up in terms of power. It almost seems like there should be a NA 2.0 options as well.

 

[sl0519]

新型ハリアーには次世代エンジンを搭載し登場！？ 新型車や業界ニュースなど注目情報満載【ベストカー7月26日号】 - 自動車情報誌「ベストカー」

エンジンはまだまだ終わらない！ そんな新時代の心臓を一番手で収めるのは、なんとハリアーとカローラだった！？　ベストカー7月26日号、注目情報満載でお送りします

bestcarweb.jp

Harrier(venza) anf corolla to be the first to feature new engines

It's going to be 2027 at the earliest. This is such a long wait.

 

[ssun30]

While the new generation engines are still 3-4 years away (they said the release date will depend on when the newest round of regulations go into effect), Toyota has provided enough data to speculate on what a partial lineup looks like.

1.5L NA I4, ~90kW/120PS. Could come as:
100kW/135hp class MHEV (for developing markets), 135-150kW/180-200PS class HEV, 180kW/240PS class PHEV.

1.5T I4, ~150kW/200PS:
160kW/215PS class MHEV, 200-210kW/270-280PS class HEV, 260-270kW/350-360PS class PHEV.

2.0T "Economy" I4, ~220kW/300PS:
230kW/315PS class MHEV, 280-300kW/380-400PS class HEV, 330-360kW/450-480PS class PHEV.

2.0T "Performance" I4, 300kW/400PS class:
310kW/420PS class MHEV, 375kW/500PS class HEV, 450kW/600PS class PHEV.

They will be very well covered all the way from a Yaris to an IS-F or Supra. I suspect the lower end could add a 1.2L NA I3 (for displacement tax reasons) that covers the 70-100kW range for developing markets. The top end is still very uncertain but a 3.0L V6 will be the most likely and come with a 450PS "comfort" version and 600PS+ "performance" version.

The growth in power is likely necessary to account for future safety regulations making cars heavier (it's not only emissions that drive future designs). All segments will grow by 15-20% in weight (subcompact: 1000->1200 kg, compact: 1400->1600 kg, mid-size: 1700->2000 kg, full-size: 2000->2400 kg).

HEV batteries will grow from 0.8-1.8 kWh to 1.5-3.0 kWh. PHEV batteries will grow from 14-18 kWh to 20-25 kWh. In general the hybrid part will contribute more to the overall system power (from 20-25% currently to 30-35% for HEV, and 1/3 currently to 1/2 for PHEV).

 

[carguy420]

They already have a 1.2L NA inline 3 from Daihatsu called the WA-VE, came out in 2021.