All about the Fourth Generation Prius

[krew]

Automotive News has some information on the two battery choices that Toyota will offer on the Prius (though not in North America, if I've heard correctly):

Toyota Motor Corp. is rolling out its next-generation Prius hybrid with a choice of newer-generation lithium ion or more traditional nickel-metal hydride batteries.

The power packs cost the same to make, deliver basically the same performance and provide almost the same fuel economy. So why bother?

It's because the lithium batteries are 35 pounds lighter, and will be installed in upper-trim cars. That will enable Toyota to pack an additional 35 pounds of goodies into higher-end models and achieve the same performance, says Kouji Toyoshima, chief engineer of the Prius.

"In higher grades, the mass is increased so it's harder to get good fuel economy. So in those we will use lithium ion batteries," Toyoshima said at a Nov. 13 test drive here.

http://www.autonews.com/article/20151123/OEM06/311239986

 

[krew]

The Nikkei Asian Review has an interview with Toyota Chairman Takeshi Uchiyamada, who was the man behind the development of the first-generation Prius:

Initially, Uchiyamada and his team were opposed to adopting hybrid technology. This was because an advanced development unit had already been working on hybrids but the technology was far from being commercially ready. Moreover, it was considered difficult to bring production costs down to the level of ordinary passenger vehicles, meaning their discussions with Wada and other executives were at an impasse.

"They said that they would replace me if I continued to object. We went to great lengths to develop a new car concept and could possibly turn it into reality. It would have been so frustrating if I had left the position at the time. What's more, I learned through additional research that, although hybrid technology was still premature, it would eventually become necessary in the future. Even if we had failed, we would have gotten ahead of our rivals, so our future engineers would be able to utilize our know-how. It might not be of any immediate use, but I decided to develop hybrid technology."

http://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Companies/The-story-behind-the-Prius?n_cid=NARAN012

 

[mikeavelli]

The tech of course seems first rate but in pics I just can't swallow the looks quite yet.

 

[krew]

The tech of course seems first rate but in pics I just can't swallow the looks quite yet.

Sometimes I feel like the only person in the world that likes the new Prius design. Toyota has this wild super-future design right now that's still a bit awkward, but I see a lot of potential. New Prius and Mirai are unlike anything else on the road -- same as the most recent Lexus designs.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

This Prius is actually "Fun to Drive"...the media said so!

 

[mikeavelli]

Sometimes I feel like the only person in the world that likes the new Prius design. Toyota has this wild super-future design right now that's still a bit awkward, but I see a lot of potential. New Prius and Mirai are unlike anything else on the road -- same as the most recent Lexus designs.

I will have to wait to see the Prius modified. As of right now, it leaves me way cold.

 

[mmcartalk]

I know I might take some heat or criticism for this view, but I am honest in my opinions even if others disagree. On the new 4Gen Prius, I hope they do a better job this time with the general solidity of the body and interior than they did last time, on the 3Gen. I give the Prius credit for its excellent MPG capabilities and extremely low emissions (it's a superb commuter car), but I was very disappointed with the last version (3Gen). I thought that, compared to the solidly-built 2Gen, the 3Gen's body was like a tin can, and its interior done with noticeably more flimsy parts (perhaps the most flimsy part was the paper-like pull-cover for the cargo area). And the power-plug and switches for the heated seats were almost all the way down on the floor, at the bottom of a big hole under the center console....IMO a silly place to put them.

In its favor, though, the 3Gen model's lighter weight and more advanced electronics did contribute to better MPG figures than the 2Gen version, and, while it lost some of the 2Gen's soft ride comfort, it noticeably improved on the 2Gen Roly-Poly handling/cornering. And, of course, new Prius C, V, and Extended-Range models were introduced to widen the basic line-up.

 

[Gecko]

I saw it in person at the LA Show... can't quite stomach it.

 

[mikeavelli]

I think thats fair Mike, the interior has never been a stellar point but for the price its somewhat understandable since the money was spent in the hybrid powertrain.

 

[mmcartalk]

I think thats fair Mike, the interior has never been a stellar point but for the price its somewhat understandable since the money was spent in the hybrid powertrain.

On the 2Gen, they managed to provide a well-crafted (if quirky) interior in addition to the expensive hybrid components. Perhaps, though, the cost of upgrading there 3Gen's electronics (which did give it more efficiency), may have come out of the inside.....there, you may have a point.

Except for my previous comment on how I hope it is better inside than the 3Gen was, I won't comment further on the 4Gen model until I see it.....but I'm keeping an open mind.

 

[CIF]

This Prius is actually "Fun to Drive"...the media said so!

Lol, actually it was firstly that Toyota said so. The media is repeating Toyota's claim.

Sometimes I feel like the only person in the world that likes the new Prius design. Toyota has this wild super-future design right now that's still a bit awkward, but I see a lot of potential. New Prius and Mirai are unlike anything else on the road -- same as the most recent Lexus designs.

The 2016 Prius design has quickly grown on me. In real-world pics and the preview videos, I actually find the styling quite nice.

I know I might take some heat or criticism for this view, but I am honest in my opinions even if others disagree. On the new 4Gen Prius, I hope they do a better job this time with the general solidity of the body and interior than they did last time, on the 3Gen. I give the Prius credit for its excellent MPG capabilities and extremely low emissions (it's a superb commuter car), but I was very disappointed with the last version (3Gen). I thought that, compared to the solidly-built 2Gen, the 3Gen's body was like a tin can, and its interior done with noticeably more flimsy parts (perhaps the most flimsy part was the paper-like pull-cover for the cargo area). And the power-plug and switches for the heated seats were almost all the way down on the floor, at the bottom of a big hole under the center console....IMO a silly place to put them.

In its favor, though, the 3Gen model's lighter weight and more advanced electronics did contribute to better MPG figures than the 2Gen version, and, while it lost some of the 2Gen's soft ride comfort, it noticeably improved on the 2Gen Roly-Poly handling/cornering. And, of course, new Prius C, V, and Extended-Range models were introduced to widen the basic line-up.

Some may disagree with you. A friend of mine formerly owned a 2nd gen Prius, and I spent a fair bit of time in it. The interior is not all that special at all. He had to deal with some minor rattling, and road noise often got to annoying levels. The steering rack also had very limited adjustability. These were not one-off issues, as these are well-known problems among many 2nd-gen owners. I haven't actually spent time in the 3rd gen myself, but I've heard mixed things, with some owners saying overall the car is put together better than the 2nd gen, and others saying it's worse.

Then there was also the issue on the 2nd gen Prius of very limited front seat adjustment. On longer rides, the seats could often get uncomfortable. Not sure if it's any different on the 3rd gen.

From the previews and first drives of the 4th gen Prius, it seems that virtually all of the above problems have been solved.

 

[mmcartalk]

Some may disagree with you. A friend of mine formerly owned a 2nd gen Prius, and I spent a fair bit of time in it. The interior is not all that special at all. He had to deal with some minor rattling, and road noise often got to annoying levels. The steering rack also had very limited adjustability. These were not one-off issues, as these are well-known problems among many 2nd-gen owners. I haven't actually spent time in the 3rd gen myself, but I've heard mixed things, with some owners saying overall the car is put together better than the 2nd gen, and others saying it's worse.

Then there was also the issue on the 2nd gen Prius of very limited front seat adjustment. On longer rides, the seats could often get uncomfortable. Not sure if it's any different on the 3rd gen.

No problem. I expected at least some opinions to disagree with mine. Otherwise, I wouldn't be posting about cars, or a forum member.

One thing, though, that adds to Prius road noise is that the powertrain itself is so quiet in the all-electric mode that anything from the tires what gets past the wheel-well and interior insulation will go directly to your ears....there's little else to muffle it.

The biggest problem on the 2Gen model that I could remember was the Roly-Poly handling that produced a lot of body-lean, even with only moderate steering input. This, I think, was the result of the car's relatively tall, narrow stance and soft suspension/tires for riding comfort. That greatly lessened on the 3Gen, but the ride, correspondingly, got stiffer.

From the previews and first drives of the 4th gen Prius, it seems that virtually all of the above problems have been solved.

Have you had an actual chance to drive one? It's on my review list when it gets here to the D.C. area. And are they also going to continue it in the present C, V, and Extended-Range models?

 

[CIF]

Have you had an actual chance to drive one? It's on my review list when it gets here to the D.C. area. And are they also going to continue it in the present C, V, and Extended-Range models?

Nope, I don't think they've reached dealers yet. I believe dealers don't get them until December. That and I just don't have much time for test drives these days.

 

[mmcartalk]

Nope, I don't think they've reached dealers yet. I believe dealers don't get them until December. That and I just don't have much time for test drives these days.

Yes, that's one of the nice things about being retired....you have more time to devote to things like that. I was able to get out when I was 55....I consider myself fortunate in today's economy.

 

[krew]

Why Toyota won't offer the Prius with AWD in North America, from Automotive News:

The fourth-generation Toyota Prius went on sale in Japan last week complete with a new all-wheel-drive version.

Toyota expects to sell as many as 28,800 awd variants a year in its home market, but don't expect them in the U.S. anytime soon.

Despite the increasing popularity of awd passenger cars in the U.S., Toyota is not convinced Americans want an awd Prius.

The world's largest carmaker also hasn't tested the system, dubbed E-Four, in the frigid conditions typical of northern states, let alone Arctic frontiers such as Alaska.

Back home, Toyota's engineers spent six years assessing demand and testing the system in Japan's northern regions, where snowfall can be tremendous but temperatures more mild.

The company is studying a possible U.S. launch, but nothing has been decided, E-Four engineer Yoshihiro Ikushima said at a test drive. Prius sales are typically concentrated in sunshine states such as California where all-wheel traction is a low priority.

The feature tacks on ¥180,000 ($1,462) to the price of a standard Prius.

The system, which includes a second motor, inverter and drive shaft, also adds 154 pounds of extra weight.

 

[mmcartalk]

Despite the increasing popularity of awd passenger cars in the U.S., Toyota is not convinced Americans want an awd Prius.

Back home, Toyota's engineers spent six years assessing demand and testing the system in Japan's northern regions, where snowfall can be tremendous but temperatures more mild.

Prius sales are typically concentrated in sunshine states such as California where all-wheel traction is a low priority.

I don't totally agree with this line of reasoning. It's true that the Japanese Island of Hokkaido, in the north, gets huge snowfalls from cold air from Siberia blowing out over the warm Sea of Japan. But we also have a Snow Belt of states, here in the U.S., running from Wisconsin to northern and western New York State, that suffer regularly during the fall and winter from what is called "Lake-Effect" snow.....localized storms that, similar to Japan's Hokkaido storms, develop when cold air from Canada blows over the warm Great Lakes (particularly before the lakes freeze over and prevent evaporation). Many AWD sales in the U.S. are concentrated in this Snow Belt, in New England, the more northern parts of the Appalachians, and in the Rockies.

I also don't agree that the fact that, while Prius sales are concentrated in California (though we also have a huge number of them here in the D.C. area), that in itself should be a factor limiting the availability of AWD. California can (and does), in the Sierra Nevada and Cascade Mountain regions, get some of the heaviest snow totals in the country....and the California Highway Patrol (their state troopers) sometimes closes off these roads to all but AWD or otherwise-capable winter vehicles.

 

[CIF]

From what I understand the E-Four system is apparently an AWD "lite" sort of system. I can see both sides here, but yes admittedly Prius sales are quite low in northern states, as well as Canada. If there's enough demand, they might offer it, but this E-Four seems to have been primarily designed for the Japanese market.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

Toyota's missing the boat on the AWD Prius...many of the buyers living in the cold regions are friendly to Prius, so it would make sense. With that same thought, I think Toyota isn't doing so because of Subaru, which permeate these areas such as Seattle and Portlandia?

 

[mmcartalk]

Toyota's missing the boat on the AWD Prius...many of the buyers living in the cold regions are friendly to Prius, so it would make sense.


With that same thought, I think Toyota isn't doing so because of Subaru, which permeate these areas such as Seattle and Portlandia?

Subaru doesn't offer as many hybrids, though, as Toyota.....especially in the American market. And the only one that they do offer here (the Crosstrek Hybrid) doesn't get anywhere near the mileage that a Prius does.

 

[mikeavelli]

I have yet to see a new one. How about you all?