5th Generation (2018+) Lexus LS 500 & LS 500h Megathread

[LDeleuran]

Now that's simply stunning! What an interior!

My only problem is that someone has been too eager with Photoshop and removed the seem between the door and dashboard in some of the interior closeups. It looks like there is no seam at all.

 

[Alexander Li]

And I was like "OMG they're going to actually build it"

 

[Carmaker1]

Does anyone notice that the new LS's introduction page on the Lexus International site (unintentionally?) reveals a photo showing the backseat that is SLIGHTLY different from those of the LS500 at NAIAS or other auto show or on the official Lexus website.

Take a look at the bottom right part of the picture, and there is a "stitched something" on the side of the rear passenger seat. I don't know if this is a proof that there will be a 4-seat variant of the LS, but at least it is certain that Lexus will bring the another variant, hopefully more luxurious one.
View attachment 2094

And this picture for a comparison.

I think that's just the left passenger seat sticking out. For all of Rydo's complaints, even though I never previously addressed them and debunked such criticism regarding the lack of genuine 4-seater LS, I knew very well from the beginning that such an arrangement existed and saw photos of it in plain sight from the moment the press release came out. It didn't seem worth the energy to correct, when I knew someone else could easily do that.

I just found this from Lexus' youtube channel. The 5LS won't go on sale until "early 2018"??? C'mon, Lexus...
View attachment 2095

I had pointed this out weeks ago, but heard no response nor did anyone address the "early 2018" disclaimer since early February. Thanks for mentioning that, as I had said--out of frustration--that the only market to get the new LS in 2017 is probably JDM. Not surprising, as they are still running prototypes and not even pilot production units in winter testing.

This was the case with the LC, which spent half of 2016 still in development, although pilot production LCs might have started being built as early as mid-2016. I hope that the new LS doesn't become a solid 2018 1/2 model in spring 2018, as that is pushing it and at that point they cannot keep the outgoing XF40 LS for the 2018 model year (a la Infiniti Q40).

 

[mordecai]

I'm super pissed off that Lexus let their flagship LS stagnate 4-5 years past its expiration date....

*eyes catch LS500h's ruffled, bamboo-inspired door panels*

...what was I talking about again?

 

[Carmaker1]

Some ideation design sketches from 2013 and 2014 by Koichi Suga

So Lexus just Tweeted an info page on the new LS, which is this: http://www.lexus.com/concept/LS/?cid=sf59682137+sf59682137

And that page says "Coming Fall 2017". So now I'm confused about when we'll actually be able to drive the thing, but I certainly hope it's this fall instead of this winter.

Whomever is responsible for displaying "Coming Fall 2017" probably is referring to earlier LS press releases drafted in late 2016 and needs to update that information. With the latest RX, there were simultaneous reports that it would be launched in late 2015 and some said January 2016. Ultimately, it went on sale in late 2015 in Japan and US, then early 2016 in Europe.

We'll see, but considering what happened to the LC (Z100) going from a projected January 2017 launch date to May 2017, I wouldn't put it past them to wait until early next year.

Wow. Great Finds! It clearly is an F Sport embelem if you look close enough. It also can't be the F embelem since you can also see the letters saying SPORT below the F.

I know it is just the camo but I like how the taillights and the have the chrome trim blacked out. Hopefully that is how it will look on the production LS F. Looks very aggressive.

Also, where did you find those photos? Are their any other shots and angles?

It is blacked out per se, because that is mostly vinyl-clad disguising over different parts of the car (especially taillights). In addition to that, as krew stated, there definitely might be gunmetal accents and the vinyl strips are genuinely working well as camouflage.

While I had been very adamant since 2015, that Lexus would move away from horizontal slat grilles starting with the LC and LS, I never discounted them offering a sportier trim level. Since that is very much dependent on decisions of the marketing department (which I am very uninvolved with), it would've been very presumptuous of me to speculate on that, even if my early prediction regarding Spindle grilles was correct.


The LC seemingly ditching F-Sport made me start to think Lexus was moving away from that for the flagship products, but as many people have said here, the LC was probably just the exception.


Although off-topic, I must say that I greatly respect you, in being so young, intelligent, (rivaling many people I worked with in the industry), and extremely involved in such discussion. I never partook in such discussion online when I was your age 12-13 years ago nor did I even fully understand much of what I do now.

I had assumed you were at least university age, but colour me shocked to discover otherwise. If you ever plan to work in the automotive industry, I can tell you that will very far if you are already at the point you are.


Back to the LS, as I wanted to pose this question regarding an F performance version. I think we should be expecting an LS-F trademark filing by the end of 2017. LC-F was filed 1 month ago, so 6-9 months apart seems feasible. LC500 and LC500h were filed in tandem in November 2014, with LS500h in May 2015 and LS500 nearly 3 months later in August 2015.


Looking back, I have to wonder if there was internal conflict at TMC over how to name their new 3.5 litre twin-turbo LS. It was easy to name the LS500h, based off of the LC500h, but unlike the 2UR-GSE powered LC500, sometime in 2015 something had to have change regarding V35A-FTS and 2UR-GSE V8 for the LS.


I only point this out, as there was unusual delay gap between the two LS trademark filings of LS500h and LS500. The decision to not offer the 2UR-GSE in the LS could have been made in 2015 and deliberately not addressed until debut.

This explains why it was testing with BMW 750i(Li) and Audi A8L 4.0t TTV8 in Colorado last year. The problem is, I hope they are certain that real world performance exceeds those two, as on paper the horsepower and torque ratings do not.

I gotta say, the full interior with the glass is beyond my expectations. Just, wow!

The interior is absolutely insane....debuts the "glass" trim..... stunning...

View attachment 2120

The first thing came to mind was a statement that Mark Templin, in which coyly gushed about "doing things we've never done in interiors before". At the level of seniority he was at, he had seen this type of interior and was obscurely referring to it, plus maybe the 24-inch HUD. That was what the augmented reality patent (filed in 2013) was for, something I speculated correctly on.

I know it's unbecoming to make fun of other people's mistakes, but I can't stop myself here -- Autoblog did not read the press release properly:

View attachment 2121

http://www.autoblog.com/2017/03/07/2018-lexus-ls-500h-twin-turbo-10-speed-hybrid/

Autoblog continue to be the disgraceful idiots that they've become, in continuing to deliver obtusely written articles and unsually biased indifference out of brand favouritism. If it wasn't for the fact the current LS is so old, they'd skip out on reporting about it and continue playing dumb as they do with many Japanese and non-German products.

There is an unfair slant in automotive media against certain brands, that one cannot pretend doesn't exist. Autoblog are the same bunch that called the enormously large, RWD test mule for the LS, the redesigned FWD ES. An inexcusable observation, when it was being tested with flagship luxury products in the 7-Series and A8. (LOL Well that is unless the LS was to become a RR Phantom competitor, leaving the ES to battle the FWD-based A8 and sub-V12 Bimmer)


I worked very hard to get out as much info about the fifth gen LS as possible the past few years, as is it was very clear most news sources couldn't give a damn about it and let info about it, slip around under the radar. We can already see that many of them lackadaisically report on any useless tidbits, while salivating over the next story on a new MB CUV 5-door shooting break coupe or fifteenth billion Lamborghini Urus story.


The only thing was worse than their reporting record, is that of their atrocious comment section. Of which is mostly a peanut gallery, save for 5-10% of commentary. The slanted bias against non-European or non-German premium marques is upsetting, when it is clear in not entirely-based out of objectivity. The many times one hears that Lexus somehow needs to hire an Italian or European designer is contemptuous, when the 1989 Giugario-designed GS300 (1993), was a dowdy poor seller compared to the in-house designed second generation and stuck out like a sore thumb in the Lexus lineup.

Oh, heck, you're too politically correct! If someone makes an egregious mistake like that, you politely but clearly call them out on it.

Also, yet further proof of the ongoing, longtime decline of Autoblog.

Considering the source, I wouldn't even bother doing it politely, as they are broadly misinforming a LARGE audience and that I find it disrespectful and extremely careless, when they have the ability to have better quality control. Being in krew's shoes, I would probably be forced to do it politely and not in a snarky manner.

I said it they would present the 4-seater with the LS 500h, and here it is. The case for the SWB/LWB can be closed: only one size available (the longer one), which IMO is a wise decision.





It looks so good in black without chrome.

Thank you, as I had said the same thing, but we have already seen an example of the 4-seater in a lighter colour. I think Rydo's previous comment threw many people off, in assuming Lexus hadn't bothered showing 4-seater variant yet.

Regarding the black prototype, I think that is the same one as White Beach provided. For once, Japanese residents are bothering to report on sightings of prototypes and not feigning indifference to them, as it never made sense to me why one would never see a lick of spy shots from Japan.

Aside from Shibetsu, I am thinking that Toyota primarily test their cars in Aichi. Due to local pride, familial ties, and that of immense honour, most Aichi residents probably went out of their way to not post such things to social media.

thats not the fixed 4 seat option...looks identical to the other one

Yes it is the 4-seat option. There is a major difference in the placement of the bucket seats, compared to the 5-seater. There is no built in headrest at the front of the centre armest. In fact, this is what the LF-FC previewed. The production LS interior, but took it to further heights in an effort to obscure the actual interior design (too early to show it in 2015).

What we haven't seen, is the base bench seat rear. This is a $100k USD+ LS500h and that has been the case with all of the LS prototypes shown so far. In fact, none of them have been $85k USD examples, that will be the basic offering.

 

[Twiz]

That's amazing that the LS500h can cruise up to 87muph without the engine if I read that correctly. when the LS was revealed back in 2007 I'm starting to get that feeling again! Cant wait to see one on the road.

 

[meth.ix]

I personally don't like black leather seats since they often look cheap and blemishes in the leather are more obvious. Other than that, I really like the red and the beautiful glass and also the hand pleated cloth.

Yes, the black on the exterior looks grander and very "dapper" like a limo compared to the colour the LS 500 debuted with. Even though I like most colours in the Lexus lineup, When it comes to the LS and I want to look like a VIP entering the back seat, I would probably want a black like this or maybe white.

 

[CIF]

Yes, yes, YES!! Now THIS is what I'm talking about! That interior, absolutely mind blowing, stunning, and extraordinary! This is WORLD CLASS. Mercedes watch out.

This is the very high level of expectations I had for the new LS interior, and they have met and even slightly exceeded those expectations.

The way the glass trim visually combines with the speaker grille on the rear doors is magnificent. A work of art. I'm not even going to wonder about how reflective those panels are in bright sunlight, as they're just so beautiful. The pleated detail work on the door panels is also brilliant. Anyone know exactly what material the pleated design is made out of? Also in the craftsmanship video, is it implying that this super high-end interior will also be available for the LS500? I really hope this interior is not exclusive only to the LS500h.

Now the other interesting question that arises; given that since the debut of the 5LS, we have been getting a steady and gradual stream of new information about the 5LS (since the initial debut press release was very vague on many details), one has to wonder if this is a deliberate decision to slowly release more and more of the world class details about the 5LS. If this indeed the strategy Lexus is going by, then I expect more world class details to arise leading up to the on-sale date for the 5LS.

 

[ydooby]

Anyone know exactly what material the pleated design is made out of? Also in the craftsmanship video, is it implying that this super high-end interior will also be available for the LS500? I really hope this interior is not exclusive only to the LS500h.

The official video introduction to this glass-decorated interior already states it's for the LS500. It even has a screen shot of the LS500's badge at 1:59. So yeah it's pretty much confirmed that this interior will be available to both models.

 

[Carmaker1]

The official video introduction to this glass-decorated interior already states it's for the LS500. It even has a screen shot of the LS500's badge at 1:59. So yeah it's pretty much confirmed that this interior will be available to both models.

Probably not a real interior, but working model that might be a 1:1 interior mock-up from 2015 for the specialized trim and what was probably based on the general LS interior design mock-up, approved about 3 years ago (2014).

The final product (memory button placement) is what we are now seeing in the final evaluation prototypes being shown everywhere in photos and in presentation. While the body design might be frozen in time 3 years out for such a complex car, small details like metal work and interior pieces can be tinkered with until a slightly later stage.

The final testing stage that precedes pilot production (4-6 months of test assembly at Tahara), is when such minor interior design details are required to be fully finalised before that last stage of prototyping. Usually that is when they are evaluating what has been developed, before granting engineering sign-off and then green lighting pilot production.

This kind of occurrence isn't too unusual, as BMW and MB have also been known to do this in the past. I remember hearing how after BMW approved final styling of the first generation X5 in 1996, sometime in 1998 before the car went on sale in late 1999, Bangle ordered a minor redesign of the headlight cluster to feature a more concave outline between the turn signals and headlights to liven up the design. There are press shots from 1998 and design patents that highlight these differences.

More recently BMW might have been planning to offer a passenger screen on the G11 7-Series, that even a few insiders described it back in 2013-14 (G11 design freeze was circa July 2012), but they backed out last minute before press reveal in June 2015.

When some BMW fans actually saw the passenger side of the dash in the LS, they nearly had a heart attack over the possibility of Lexus of installing a passenger side screen before BMW did.

With MB, the current S-Class (since 2013) interior design during development back in 2009 had air vents more akin to the perpendicular pattern you see in the A-Class and CLA. That same year of 2009, was when W222 designs (ext/int) were fully signed off, originally intended to arrive in late 2012.

By the time they got to building prototypes for public testing in 2010, a new vertical slat pattern mimicking Rolls-Royce and Bentley had emerged for the air vents, which was spotted in S-Class prototypes testing in early 2011.

It is always so interesting to see prototype designs that don't stay the course, seeing as you can later compare them to the final product.

 

[Levi]

Probably not a real interior, but working model that might be a 1:1 interior mock-up from 2015 for the specialized trim and what was probably based on the general LS interior design mock-up, approved about 3 years ago (2014).

The final product (memory button placement) is what we are now seeing in the final evaluation prototypes being shown everywhere in photos and in presentation. While the body design might be frozen in time 3 years out for such a complex car, small details like metal work and interior pieces can be tinkered with until a slightly later stage.

The final testing stage that precedes pilot production (4-6 months of test assembly at Tahara), is when such minor interior design details are required to be fully finalised before that last stage of prototyping. Usually that is when they are evaluating what has been developed, before granting engineering sign-off and then green lighting pilot production.

This kind of occurrence isn't too unusual, as BMW and MB have also been known to do this in the past. I remember hearing how after BMW approved final styling of the first generation X5 in 1996, sometime in 1998 before the car went on sale in late 1999, Bangle ordered a minor redesign of the headlight cluster to feature a more concave outline between the turn signals and headlights to liven up the design. There are press shots from 1998 and design patents that highlight these differences.

More recently BMW might have been planning to offer a passenger screen on the G11 7-Series, that even a few insiders described it back in 2013-14 (G11 design freeze was circa July 2012), but they backed out last minute before press reveal in June 2015.

When some BMW fans actually saw the passenger side of the dash in the LS, they nearly had a heart attack over the possibility of Lexus of installing a passenger side screen before BMW did.

With MB, the current S-Class (since 2013) interior design during development back in 2009 had air vents more akin to the perpendicular pattern you see in the A-Class and CLA. That same year of 2009, was when W222 designs (ext/int) were fully signed off, originally intended to arrive in late 2012.

By the time they got to building prototypes for public testing in 2010, a new vertical slat pattern mimicking Rolls-Royce and Bentley had emerged for the air vents, which was spotted in S-Class prototypes testing in early 2011.

It is always so interesting to see prototype designs that don't stay the course, seeing as you can later compare them to the final product.

Always interesting to have true industry insight from you (unlike some PR marketing guy from the Bavarian car brand).


But IMHO carmakers (not meant at you Carmaker1) are often too meticulous about tiny things (not bad per se) while neglecting the elephant in the room.

 

[Madi]

Finally they uploaded the press release video :


Amazing video and amazing car !

 

[Bryan]

SO how long can the LS500h cruise at 87 mph for? it the hybrid system sustainable?

 

[Carmaker1]

Always interesting to have true industry insight from you (unlike some PR marketing guy from the Bavarian car brand).


But IMHO carmakers (not meant at you Carmaker1) are often too meticulous about tiny things (not bad per se) while neglecting the elephant in the room.

LOL thanks! I know exactly who you're talking about though and I get your point!

 

[mediumhot]

The LC seemingly ditching F-Sport made me start to think Lexus was moving away from that for the flagship products, but as many people have said here, the LC was probably just the exception.

F-Sport was pushed to embrace the spindle as it was intended. It was always more visually striking package but Lexus had to tone down the base trim spindle with illogical horizontal bars and splitter to keep the conservative ground covered. You could tell they were really scared to push the spindle as an idea across the range, for such a progressive, striking defining detail they were very cautions and conservative in the roll out. Spindle on pre facelifted IS looks so shy compared to RC , no need to comment on original 4GS spindle, it was not the spindle, it was like a setup for what is coming

Even though every single Lexus car carries the spindle right now there is a major difference between RC, 5LS, LC and the rest of the line up. These three were designed with final design spindle evolution in mind from the get go. All others got the tack on spindle or were used as transition to the final spindle displayed on the three models mentioned above.

What you see on 5LS is final/intended spindle design and extreme evolution of mesh weave pattern. It took them a while but they got there. Those weaves are extremely hard to pull off, it requires a lot of pattern experience and some surfacing skills as well. You could lay out the flat pattern on your screen, introduce 3D sculpting on it and even have math inside the app fix all the deformations for you so you don't get ugly size deviations due to bending and stretching but that's only half of the story. Team that designed the weave on 5LS did a such a great job and I can vouch you the amount of time they spent on it, refining it probably exceeds the glass and door L leather pattern research and development time combined. That's unless they got lucky and got it right for the very first few times, it can happen, or Toyota has developed some crazy automated pattern process that does it for them.

From now on F-Sports most distinctive feature will not be a mesh weave but something else. F-Sport of the past has accomplished what it was intended to accomplish so now its time to evolve. BTW I could be wrong here, maybe F-Sport introduces even crazier mesh design, some hybrid of Mercedes AMG studded mesh with 5LS weave

 

[Joaquin Ruhi]

From now on F-Sports most distinctive feature will not be a mesh weave but something else. F-Sport of the past has accomplished what it was intended to accomplish so now its time to evolve. BTW I could be wrong here, maybe F-Sport introduces even crazier mesh design, some hybrid of Mercedes AMG studded mesh with 5LS weave

You've definitely piqued my curiosity. I can't wait to see what grille mesh patterns they come up with next.

 

[Madi]

Yes it is the 4-seat option. There is a major difference in the placement of the bucket seats, compared to the 5-seater. There is no built in headrest at the front of the centre armest. In fact, this is what the LF-FC previewed. The production LS interior, but took it to further heights in an effort to obscure the actual interior design (too early to show it in 2015).

What we haven't seen, is the base bench seat rear. This is a $100k USD+ LS500h and that has been the case with all of the LS prototypes shown so far. In fact, none of them have been $85k USD examples, that will be the basic offering.

I really enjoying reading this thread especially your posts so thank you so much.

I have a question, you stated that, this is the 4-seats version, but look to this video at 10:53 :


The middle part is not fixed, he folded it up and became 5-seats, are you were referring to upcoming model other than that ?

 

[meth.ix]

just found this

Apparently the LS 600hL Landaulet was a one-off for a wedding of some royal couple, but it reminded me that an LS 500 Landaulet would be super dope lol.

 

[Joaquin Ruhi]

just found this

Apparently the LS 600hL Landaulet was a one-off for a wedding of some royal couple, but it reminded me that an LS 500 Landaulet would be super dope lol.

Yes, this was used in the wedding of Prince Albert II, current ruler of Monaco, to Charlene Wittstock of South Africa.

Also agreed that a Lexus LS Landauet would be cool, but a real, rear-half convertible Landauet. I think this one was more a bizarre rear transparent, possibly bulletproof canopy.

 

[krew]

krew

A look back at the Geneva debut of the LS 500h.

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