Vehicle shopping for my wife's next project....

[mikeavelli]

I don't think we have ever been more stressed trying to decide on not just a next vehicle but also dealer, possibly brand etc etc....

Currently her 2013 GS 350 F-Sport has been pretty flawless and she loves the vehicle. We now have a 2 year old and while a SUV or larger vehicle isn't a necessity, it would be nice to have for the additional room, higher ride height (making it easier to get him in and out of) and a rear to do some diaper changing instead of struggling inside the vehicle.

I'm being a bit more off hands this time and it looks like SUV's are in the lead and for the first time, the default vehicle is not a Lexus. Competition is just fierce, there are many amazing offerings and many people interested to have us work with them.

Audi Q7
BMW X5
Lexus NX
Lexus RX
Nissan Murano
Mercedes GLC 43 (if it was here already)
Porsche Cayenne
Porsche Macan
Range Rover Sport
Toyota Highlander
Toyota RaV4
Volvo XC90


A long shot is the GS F which would make me happy lol but I want her to be happy...

Obviously for me its quite a bit complicated. Knowing so much about dealerships, I am finding myself detesting many of the practices since I know most of them I still can't believe some of the shadiness being offered, its ridiculous. I find dealing with Corporate to be amazing for the most part, in particular Audi, BMW, Lexus and Nissan. Now I see why so may people like the Tesla model of selling direct.

On the other hand I know quite a few dealerships personally and they are amazing to deal with, which sways purchasing decisions since I want my wife treated like a queen when its time for service etc.

South Florida is quite a bit different than my dealings in Atlanta, where Hennessy Lexus of Gwinnett made my life easy. Also since this might not be a Lexus purchase, it has me all out of whack.

I think this thread is actually going to be a bit of therapy for me .....

 

[Gecko]

Vehicle shopping is always fun... for the most part

Are you guys wanting to buy or lease, or not sure?

A few personal thoughts.

Audi Q7: tech is nice but it's not cheap, the exterior is probably my least favorite of this entire group and the interior has quite a bit of black plastic despite Audi's free pass for having "class leading interiors." I don't love it and I don't hate it.

BMW X5: One of my all-time favorite SUVs, but it's due for a replacement very soon. Would be a good candidate for a two year lease, but I wouldn't buy.

Lexus NX: On the verge of a refresh next year, and it's also pretty small. Personally, I would pass knowing you are a big dude and little Mike isn't far off.

Lexus RX: Not a huge fan of the current RX, but hard to go wrong with this choice. Good tech, comfortable, "right-size," Lexus connections. Like the Q7, I don't love it and I don't hate it.

Nissan Murano: I've read some on and off things about quality with the Murano. I don't have a really strong opinion here... it's nice, good size and has a good bit of technology.

Mercedes GLC 43: Love the GLC and I think it's best-in class, and I'd easily choose it over the NX. Only thing is that in my experience, these SUVs don't offer much more real-world usable space than midsize sedans. I think you're better going a class up and going for a midsize SUV.

Range Rover Sport: Hard to go wrong with this one and I know you have connections with RR. Very tempting.

Toyota Highlander: Top 3 for me. We just bought a Highlander and absolutely love it. I like the Highlander a lot more than RX, and the 2017 will have the 295hp V6, 8AT and Toyota Safety Sense.

Toyota RaV4: Like NX/GLC, too small.

Volvo XC90: I love the next XC90 but have read some disparaging things about Volvo's reliability, especially with this new platform and the new engines. Might be worth looking into further.

I'd probably narrow it down to a tight top 3 between the XC90, RR Sport and Highlander. The Toyota really is that good but I don't know if your timeline to buy allows you another 2-3 months to wait. Leasing an X5 would be another good option.

 

[mikeavelli]

Vehicle shopping is always fun... for the most part

Are you guys wanting to buy or lease, or not sure?

A few personal thoughts.

Audi Q7: tech is nice but it's not cheap, the exterior is probably my least favorite of this entire group and the interior has quite a bit of black plastic despite Audi's free pass for having "class leading interiors." I don't love it and I don't hate it.

BMW X5: One of my all-time favorite SUVs, but it's due for a replacement very soon. Would be a good candidate for a two year lease, but I wouldn't buy.

Lexus NX: On the verge of a refresh next year, and it's also pretty small. Personally, I would pass knowing you are a big dude and little Mike isn't far off.

Lexus RX: Not a huge fan of the current RX, but hard to go wrong with this choice. Good tech, comfortable, "right-size," Lexus connections. Like the Q7, I don't love it and I don't hate it.

Nissan Murano: I've read some on and off things about quality with the Murano. I don't have a really strong opinion here... it's nice, good size and has a good bit of technology.

Mercedes GLC 43: Love the GLC and I think it's best-in class, and I'd easily choose it over the NX. Only thing is that in my experience, these SUVs don't offer much more real-world usable space than midsize sedans. I think you're better going a class up and going for a midsize SUV.

Range Rover Sport: Hard to go wrong with this one and I know you have connections with RR. Very tempting.

Toyota Highlander: Top 3 for me. We just bought a Highlander and absolutely love it. I like the Highlander a lot more than RX, and the 2017 will have the 295hp V6, 8AT and Toyota Safety Sense.

Toyota RaV4: Like NX/GLC, too small.

Volvo XC90: I love the next XC90 but have read some disparaging things about Volvo's reliability, especially with this new platform and the new engines. Might be worth looking into further.

I'd probably narrow it down to a tight top 3 between the XC90, RR Sport and Highlander. The Toyota really is that good but I don't know if your timeline to buy allows you another 2-3 months to wait. Leasing an X5 would be another good option.

Thanks bro..I forgot the Porsches......

This is a good read as well
http://www.caranddriver.com/compari...volvo-xc90-t6-awd-inscription-comparison-test

 

[Tragic Bronson]

Kids, ahem.....

 

[mmcartalk]

I don't think we have ever been more stressed trying to decide on not just a next vehicle but also dealer, possibly brand etc etc....

At least, though, like most of us here on this forum (and similar ones), you have a lot of experience, know the auto market, and what you'd be getting for your money. Just think of all the poor schmucks out there that are little more than cow-fodder for the first unscrupulous salesperson that comes along. Note...I said unscrupulous, for there are indeed honest ones, contrary to much public opinion.

Currently her 2013 GS 350 F-Sport has been pretty flawless and she loves the vehicle. We now have a 2 year old and while a SUV or larger vehicle isn't a necessity, it would be nice to have for the additional room, higher ride height (making it easier to get him in and out of) and a rear to do some diaper changing instead of struggling inside the vehicle.

I'm being a bit more off hands this time and it looks like SUV's are in the lead and for the first time, the default vehicle is not a Lexus. Competition is just fierce, there are many amazing offerings and many people interested to have us work with them.

Audi Q7
BMW X5
Lexus NX
Lexus RX
Nissan Murano
Mercedes GLC 43 (if it was here already)
Porsche Cayenne
Porsche Macan
Range Rover Sport
Toyota Highlander
Toyota RaV4
Volvo XC90

If you and her have got enough spare cash in the bank for it (I won't pry into your personal finances), or can afford the payments, IMO it's hard to go wrong with a Lexus RX, though she might (?) have to get past the new grille and floating roof. If the styling is just too much for her, then check out the Highlander...a lot of the same mechanicals underneath, wrapped in a more conventional skin and interior. Gecko just got a brand new one and (apparently) loves it.

You're probably already aware of the risk, but I'd avoid any Land Rover product. Simply too much chance of getting (by today's standards) an unreliable vehicle. And the supply/demand situation on some of their models precludes getting much, if any, of a discount.

The Murano, unlike some other unreliable Nissan products, has (according to Consumer Reports) good overall reliability. But it's saddled with a CVT, though your wife may not mind the way it operates. Nissan probably does CVTs as well or better than anybody from a roadability standpoint, but I still am not a big fan of them. (It's your wife's decision, though, not mine LOL)

Obviously for me its quite a bit complicated. Knowing so much about dealerships, I am finding myself detesting many of the practices since I know most of them I still can't believe some of the shadiness being offered, its ridiculous. I find dealing with Corporate to be amazing for the most part, in particular Audi, BMW, Lexus and Nissan. Now I see why so may people like the Tesla model of selling direct.

All the more reason, IMO, to check out a Lexus shop first. They are probably not going to try and pull one over you if they know that you are the Administrator of a Lexus forum....and that what they say and do could go viral. If there is one thing that dealerships dislike today, it's bad publicity.

 

[RAL]

Of course I hope you get an RX, but ...
Good hunting!

 

[corgilady2011]

I've looked at many of the products on your list very extensively recently against the RX so maybe I can be of some help. I have a 2015 RX for reference and am already in a situation where I could get out of my situation for little to no hurt and am looking to get into a more long-term vehicle situation if the deal and vehicle is right. In short, bought my RX with not the options I would want to keep for long term.

Top vehicles on my list right now that are also on your list are the new RX are the GX, Q7 and also the Cayenne. I am also looking at the Yukon Denali/Escalade and GX.

Cayenne is due and planned for a redesign for 2018. It is a beautiful vehicle regardless and the interior quality was an obvious step-up from my RX (I would hope so). Need a 2017 for CarPlay and they just are starting to roll to dealers. My personal opinion here is a bit of wait & see to the 2018 Cayenne. Porsche has a Platinum Edition Cayenne this year - a key determinant that there will be major changes in the following model year and they historically have had much worse resale value too. For those of us that want to keep vehicles for a very long time, the Platinum Edition could be perceived as some value but it is generally just including Porsche's Premium Package with some fancy wheels, doesn't outweigh in the least to having the new gen with all of it's bells and whistles even paying full price IMO.

Macan falls in a similar route. I was at the dealer last weekend and saw some of the new base Macan. I would give that a miss. It is basically a Q5 but 20% more expensive because it has a Porsche badge. My dealer subsequently used that as an excuse, the Porsche way, to continue to raise the price of the vehicles on their lot. Prior to the base hitting the lot, they would stock S variants around $60-$65K all day and would fly -- now they are trying to stock their lots with the base at similar prices and the S models on their lot are suddenly into their $70s. Similar to Cayenne, you need 2017 for CarPlay.. and 2016 was a very short model year for them. I anticipate there could be some decent used/CPO deals on these in the next few months given that if you could live without CarPlay..

Q7 has probably the most beautiful interior I've sat in at that price point (Premium Plus). I placed it above the Cayenne I test drove, personally. Tech is cool as well -- but everything with this vehicle just made sense to me. Exterior is not nearly as polarizing as the RX but could be perceived as very safe and maybe even to an extent boring (I am a big fan of understated luxury and a major reason I have my RX). I have a bit of trouble being able to stomach the RX long-term in that regard. Interior was thoughtful, easy for me to navigate. AudiCare seems reasonably priced for the offering and would make a troublefree first few years of ownership. I do not, however, feel Audi has a great dealership presence in my area currently. A very well known, respected dealership group is opening an Audi dealership close to my home next year so maybe that will change, but it makes me put the brakes on for now. On the other hand, there is absolutely no shortage of outstanding Lexus dealers. If it wasn't for that & perceived reliability, I would probably already have a Q7 on order or in my driveway.

GX in particular has a much improved exterior despite the age of the vehicle. I think it would work well for what I need it to do, and probably would still pay the gas premium / tax for the GX over the RX because of that. I'm anxious to see if Lexus will bring out the next gen for the 2018 model year to have alongside the 3-row RX.

I am glad I have the luxury of waiting a few months to make my decision, to give the market a bit more time to have these vehicles out here for a few more months, or in some cases, allow for the next gen to come into the showrooms.

PS - if you are interested in looking at Land Rover products, check out the Jaguar F-Pace. Saw it at the car show earlier this year. Beautiful car but a little small for my needs, but would fit into what you are looking for quite well.

 

[mikeavelli]

Kids, ahem.....

She is completely against a van as her vehicle...I am very close with the Vankulture crew and they have done tons to change that perception that vans are corny...but not hers lol

I've looked at many of the products on your list very extensively recently against the RX so maybe I can be of some help. I have a 2015 RX for reference and am already in a situation where I could get out of my situation for little to no hurt and am looking to get into a more long-term vehicle situation if the deal and vehicle is right. In short, bought my RX with not the options I would want to keep for long term.

Top vehicles on my list right now that are also on your list are the new RX are the GX, Q7 and also the Cayenne. I am also looking at the Yukon Denali/Escalade and GX.

Cayenne is due and planned for a redesign for 2018. It is a beautiful vehicle regardless and the interior quality was an obvious step-up from my RX (I would hope so). Need a 2017 for CarPlay and they just are starting to roll to dealers. My personal opinion here is a bit of wait & see to the 2018 Cayenne. Porsche has a Platinum Edition Cayenne this year - a key determinant that there will be major changes in the following model year and they historically have had much worse resale value too. For those of us that want to keep vehicles for a very long time, the Platinum Edition could be perceived as some value but it is generally just including Porsche's Premium Package with some fancy wheels, doesn't outweigh in the least to having the new gen with all of it's bells and whistles even paying full price IMO.

Macan falls in a similar route. I was at the dealer last weekend and saw some of the new base Macan. I would give that a miss. It is basically a Q5 but 20% more expensive because it has a Porsche badge. My dealer subsequently used that as an excuse, the Porsche way, to continue to raise the price of the vehicles on their lot. Prior to the base hitting the lot, they would stock S variants around $60-$65K all day and would fly -- now they are trying to stock their lots with the base at similar prices and the S models on their lot are suddenly into their $70s. Similar to Cayenne, you need 2017 for CarPlay.. and 2016 was a very short model year for them. I anticipate there could be some decent used/CPO deals on these in the next few months given that if you could live without CarPlay..

Q7 has probably the most beautiful interior I've sat in at that price point (Premium Plus). I placed it above the Cayenne I test drove, personally. Tech is cool as well -- but everything with this vehicle just made sense to me. Exterior is not nearly as polarizing as the RX but could be perceived as very safe and maybe even to an extent boring (I am a big fan of understated luxury and a major reason I have my RX). I have a bit of trouble being able to stomach the RX long-term in that regard. Interior was thoughtful, easy for me to navigate. AudiCare seems reasonably priced for the offering and would make a troublefree first few years of ownership. I do not, however, feel Audi has a great dealership presence in my area currently. A very well known, respected dealership group is opening an Audi dealership close to my home next year so maybe that will change, but it makes me put the brakes on for now. On the other hand, there is absolutely no shortage of outstanding Lexus dealers. If it wasn't for that & perceived reliability, I would probably already have a Q7 on order or in my driveway.

GX in particular has a much improved exterior despite the age of the vehicle. I think it would work well for what I need it to do, and probably would still pay the gas premium / tax for the GX over the RX because of that. I'm anxious to see if Lexus will bring out the next gen for the 2018 model year to have alongside the 3-row RX.

I am glad I have the luxury of waiting a few months to make my decision, to give the market a bit more time to have these vehicles out here for a few more months, or in some cases, allow for the next gen to come into the showrooms.

PS - if you are interested in looking at Land Rover products, check out the Jaguar F-Pace. Saw it at the car show earlier this year. Beautiful car but a little small for my needs, but would fit into what you are looking for quite well.

Thanks! Yes the F-Pace is well done, totally forgot to mention it. Inventory is a bit weird now and the big engine cars are not really here just the base models and to order is months away.

The Q7 as you mentioned is very well done, my preferred dealer is on the other coast of Florida, which poses a bit of a pickle if an issue arises. It also gets pricy with options (saw one with a 90k list!!!).

As for the RX, knowing a 3 row is coming we might just try a short lease.....

The dark horse in all this is the new Nissan Armada, priced at 44k-60k loaded and its basically the Infiniti QX (well they are all a Patrol) but she doesn't want something that big or bulky.

 

[krew]

I am glad I have the luxury of waiting a few months to make my decision, to give the market a bit more time to have these vehicles out here for a few more months, or in some cases, allow for the next gen to come into the showrooms.

Just want to say that your post was fantastic, thank you for sharing your knowledge!

Thanks! Yes the F-Pace is well done, totally forgot to mention it. Inventory is a bit weird now and the big engine cars are not really here just the base models and to order is months away.

The Q7 as you mentioned is very well done, my preferred dealer is on the other coast of Florida, which poses a bit of a pickle if an issue arises. It also gets pricy with options (saw one with a 90k list!!!).

As for the RX, knowing a 3 row is coming we might just try a short lease.....

Purely from a exterior/interior design standpoint, I would be choosing between the F-Pace and the XC90 -- but buying outside of the Lexus/Toyota family makes me nervous to the point of cold sweats, even with a lease. I don't want to do anything but oil changes.

Outside of the front overhang, the RX is wonderful -- interior is excellent, exterior with the F SPORT package is well-done. Would be my first pick. But hey, you only live once, and I think you should try a different brand every once and a while.

What I'm trying to say, buy the Armada.

 

[mmcartalk]

What I'm trying to say, buy the Armada.

The one fly in the ointment, though, with the Armada, is the much-lower-than-average reliability rating that Consumer Reports gives it. It, along with the Titan and QX-80, comes from that Nissan/Infiniti plant in Canton, MS that has had years of quality-control issues.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

The one fly in the ointment, though, with the Armada, is the much-lower-than-average reliability rating that Consumer Reports gives it. It, along with the Titan and QX-80, comes from that Nissan/Infiniti plant in Canton, MS that has had years of quality-control issues.

He is looking at the NEW 2017 Armada, which is built in Japan, not the old one that came from Mississippi. If anything, they probably build them in Japan as well as Toyota does the Land Cruiser.

 

[mmcartalk]

He is looking at the NEW 2017 Armada, which is built in Japan, not the old one that came from Mississippi. If anything, they probably build them in Japan as well as Toyota does the Land Cruiser.

OK...Thanks. I knew that the aging Armada was about ready for a major redesign, but I didn't know that they were shifting production back to Japan. Do you know if the Canton plant will be used for other purposes, or the employees there simply losing their jobs?

I suppose we'll have to wait and see on the Land Cruiser comparison. That's a pretty tall order to fill, even at a Japanese plant. The Land Cruiser has a world-famous reputation for durability and ruggedness (actually, I did a full-review on a new one a few months ago, before my knee-injury and surgery).

 

[mikeavelli]

Yeah it's a bit confusing...
Nissan Armada built in MS.. Current poorly built truck.
Past Infiniti QX56 was a rebadge of it
Nissan Petrol did not exist here

Next generation Nissan Petrol debuts
Infiniti QX56 moves to this platform and rebadges
Nissan Armada continues to be sold
New Nissan Armada will be a Petrol Rebadge..

Honestly for the money I don't think there is anything better when it debuts soon.

As for my wife, I think I'm learning slowly to just STFU and listen ... We go car shopping tomorrow...

 

[Och]

Don't get a Nissan, they are just junk. I'd go with X5M but I'm biased!

 

[mikeavelli]

Well we made a decision today......

 

[mmcartalk]

Well we made a decision today......

And.......................?

 

[IS-SV]

Survey says (just a guess), SUV by L...............

 

[mikeavelli]

Nearly impossible to have a fully loaded RX F-Sport down here....

 

[krew]

Nearly impossible to have a fully loaded RX F-Sport down here....

View attachment 1832

Oh, we're going to need more than just this one photo!

Congrats!

 

[mmcartalk]

Yes, Congratulations. Like I said early in the thread, it's hard to go wrong with an RX.