Next-Generation Lexus LX Megathread

[Carmaker1]

And again we are confirming no new LX this year? I don't know where that's coming from.

New LX in 2021 doesn't = 2021 MY LX, so I don't know how the Toyota USA head said what he did about LC cabrio only and then somehow a new LX, modular basis IS, and NX would arrive this year in spite of his declaration.

Was the idea to show off new cars 1 year before launch? Anything else new and in dealers too never really computed.

 

[Carmaker1]

I think it's funny that dealers just recently are putting up a fuss about an Escalade competitor. I think the exact reason Lexus lost its cache was because of the rise of the Escalade in the early 2000s. Prior to that it was pretty common to see e.g. NFL superstar Randy Moss driving his LS, but almost overnight it was all Escalades. And after that fad blew over (it's still going to an extent, but not like it was then) the celebs all went European. But overall, that was GM's best badge-engineering idea ever, even if the execution on stock models was always suspect.

Very excellent perspective. I think with LS 430, it became a very conservative car and lost its street cred outside of actual enthusiasts (who weren't only about flash).

Even with the Navigator around, LS 400 and LX 450/470 had staying power in late 90s. The minute the MBUSA-official G 500 and 2nd gen Escalade appeared in 2001, it all slowly went to hell. GX was too conservative, although modern inside out to make a dent.

2002 Range Rover even benchmarked the LX 470, because it was so good for its time. Ironically Lexus benchmarked them too for interior luxury with the '95 Range. That right there, did it.

In 1999, LX & Range Rover reigned at the top of luxury utes, followed by Navigator and archaic, yet blingy Escalade.

They really should have beat the Audi Q7 to market with HPX crossover in late 2005. They were just so overwhelmed with new GS, IS, ES, LS in 2005-06.

I can forgive Lexus for not developing an Escalade ESV competitor, as do they really need it? They need a large crossover before tackling a risky market, that could backfire with a downturn.

The dealers are the reason the Sequoia got a new lease on life per @Gecko. Akio Toyoda wanted to kill it 6 years ago. Now the Lexus side wants a big, extended length 8 seater. They need to give it up, as a slightly bigger full size is fine, but a jumbo Lexus is not needed and waste of resources.

 

[Gecko]

I think it's funny that dealers just recently are putting up a fuss about an Escalade competitor. I think the exact reason Lexus lost its cache was because of the rise of the Escalade in the early 2000s. Prior to that it was pretty common to see e.g. NFL superstar Randy Moss driving his LS, but almost overnight it was all Escalades. And after that fad blew over (it's still going to an extent, but not like it was then) the celebs all went European. But overall, that was GM's best badge-engineering idea ever, even if the execution on stock models was always suspect.

I think Lexus dealers' calls for a larger SUV have gotten a little louder now that the LX is at the end of its life, but they've been asking for a Lexus Sequoia since about 2006 or so. When there's a new LX, they quiet down a bit... but it always resurfaces. To @Carmaker1's point, it does take a long time to make those sort of decisions, but... we can't act like 2008-2010 didn't happen either, as that surely would have killed any such plan. However, the economy has been humming along for almost the last decade now, and a Lexus Sequoia would have been a great seller... but I think that last decade is simultaneously when things changed so drastically at ToMoCo.

To your point about GM, with TNGA-F, hopefully it's easy to add another 6" of wheelbase or whatever they'll need to create something truly full size. Seeing the scalability they have elsewhere in the lineup with TNGA, my fingers are crossed!

 

[Ian Schmidt]

Very excellent perspective. I think with LS 430, it became a very conservative car and lost its street cred outside of actual enthusiasts (who weren't only about flash).

Even with the Navigator around, LS 400 and LX 450/470 had staying power in late 90s. The minute the MBUSA-official G 500 and 2nd gen Escalade appeared in 2001, it all slowly went to hell. GX was too conservative, although modern inside out to make a dent.

Flash and bling became the currency, and both Toyota and Lexus rolled out their most safe/boring styling then (I assume in reaction to the bubble era in Japan popping).

 

[mikeavelli]

I'm loving this conversation now. I'll throw in my 15 cents. Range Rover was by far the dominant luxury SUV and for those that follow hip-hop will know the legendary Jay-Z answer to "whats the difference between a 4.0 and a 4.6 (HSE). Overnight in Atlanta it was a rush to get the HSE. This was 1996/1997. Lexus really took a risk and was really forward thinking with the LX 470 which lets be honest, was a rebadge as rebadges get. Overnight it was now in music videos and became the cool hip SUV. Sales wise I do believe it became #1 ahead of Range Rover...

GM came with the Denali...a face-lifted Tahoe and it was an instant hit. What a lot of people don't know is at the time Cadillac was 100% against the idea of SUV. When they saw the sales, it forced their hand and the Escalade was born, a rebadge of a rebadge lol. People didn't care, overnight it became a hit in sales and with celebrities.

Ford came with the Navigator/Expedition which took things to another level. At the time it was huge and really well done. Overnight they became the it SUV.

Lexus came with the LX 470 but as much as we love it, it just never caught on with hip hop and celebrities. It still sold well.

The game changer was the second gen Escalade with its giant "Art and Science" grill. I'll never forget seeing a white one behind me in my GS 400 for the first time. All I saw was grill and thought "what the hell is that". Overnight again, the Escalade was the cool big SUV to have and it hasn't looked back since.

Ford let the Navigator die on a vine until the recent model. And as good as it is, people just love their Escalades.

The LX 570 came but it just had no presence until the SECOND (imagine) refresh. The LX now has moved into a pretty cool realm for people that "know". It is not for everyone, it is a true car persons SUV due to its capabilities. In Atlanta the LX is as rare as a Ferrari whereas you see dozens of Escalades everyday.

Now there's a X7, GLS, etc etc.. As for Range Rover, it still is regarded as the best and coolest SUV line overall IMO. Their product onslaught has been amazing to watch. They designers nail it every time inside and out. We briefly looked at the Range Rover Sport while living in Miami before we picked up the RX F-Sport. I fell in love with the Sport as soon as the second generation debuted.

I understand dealers want a bigger SUV. It makes sense to build a Tundra based luxury Lexus SUV. It does. I hope they keep the LX and move it super luxury for buyers who "know".

 

[mikeavelli]

One last thought. I remember the arguments back in the early 2000s that Lexus was dumb for having 3 SUV's. No other luxury brand did outside Range Rover, which is a SUV only brand. Fast forward to today and Lexus has less than the Germans. What a turn of events in 20 years....

 

[Gecko]

LX L?

Might be the easiest way and they did it with RX and LS, historically. It also makes the most sense to me for cost and "L" flagship names.

• LX 500 (TT V6)
• LX 500L (more "basic" full size luxury SUV like Escalade, GLS, X7)... maybe has slightly more room in 3rd row + ~6" more room in cargo area
  
  
• LX 600 (TT V8)
• LX 600L (two row executive seating option, most exclusive and expensive, special trim options like kiriko glass, etc)

 

[The boy of car dreaming]

LX L?

Might be the easiest way and they did it with RX and LS, historically. It also makes the most sense to me for cost and "L" flagship names.

• LX 500 (TT V6)
• LX 500L (more "basic" full size luxury SUV like Escalade, GLS, X7)... maybe has slightly more room in 3rd row + ~6" more room in cargo area
  
  
• LX 600 (TT V8)
• LX 600L (two row executive seating option, most exclusive and expensive, special trim options like kiriko glass, etc)

Lexus will build some fun and cool fact as before, and their modern car have fact to but In the next 2021 model & future will put together and updates to add more and is great!

 

[Ian Schmidt]

The game changer was the second gen Escalade with its giant "Art and Science" grill. I'll never forget seeing a white one behind me in my GS 400 for the first time. All I saw was grill and thought "what the hell is that". Overnight again, the Escalade was the cool big SUV to have and it hasn't looked back since.

Yes! GM really brought the bling with that one, it was a real statement piece at the time.

 

[meth.ix]

I'm a Gen Z but I believe Biggie was a fan of the LX back then

 

[mikeavelli]

I'm a Gen Z but I believe Biggie was a fan of the LX back then

it was mentioned in his hit “hypnotize”.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

I miss the golden age of hip hop. Great music and videos, and lots of Lexuses in videos.

 

[ssun30]

To your point about GM, with TNGA-F, hopefully it's easy to add another 6" of wheelbase or whatever they'll need to create something truly full size. Seeing the scalability they have elsewhere in the lineup with TNGA, my fingers are crossed!

Body on frame is inherently modular. Varying the wheelbase is super easy.

 

[meth.ix]

I miss the golden age of hip hop. Great music and videos, and lots of Lexuses in videos.

this makes me think, these days I feel like a product placement of an LC 500 Convertible in a major hip-hop music video would probably be more effective than in a blockbuster film.

The reason for this is that the flashy culture that has always been part of hip-hop is more prevalent than ever, and it's the perfect image you want to give to a luxury halo car. When you put a vehicle like the LC in some spy/superhero movie, I feel it does not convey what the LC is meant to be seen as. Sure, performance is a big part of the LC, but showing off its physical attractiveness and bling in a perceived high-class setting would be perfect to re-inject the entire Lexus brand into the average consumer's perception of flashy, cool, luxury cars.

I know from personal experience that this spot is usually filled by the German Trio (at least for younger consumers that weren't alive during the 90s), and manufacturers such as Lexus, Volvo and Infiniti are seen as a lower tier. I know, it sucks that Lexus is even mentioned in the same sentence as Infiniti, but that is probably how the average person who doesn't know much about cars sees things. These people see things in various forms of pop-culture and subconsciously make these brand images in their head.

Overall, this "promotion" in the minds of the average car-buyer of Lexus from a "knock-off luxury brand" to a badge on the same level as BMW could help the Lexus brand significantly. Badges matter, especially to the younger population. I know for a fact that 328i will get double the attention at a high school parking lot than an IS solely based on the fact that its a BMW.

I seriously feel that Lexus could get a real big boost from this lol. If they still want to put their cars into action movies then they should place a new F car in there.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

this makes me think, these days I feel like a product placement of an LC 500 Convertible in a major hip-hop music video would probably be more effective than in a blockbuster film.

The reason for this is that the flashy culture that has always been part of hip-hop is more prevalent than ever, and it's the perfect image you want to give to a luxury halo car. When you put a vehicle like the LC in some spy/superhero movie, I feel it does not convey what the LC is meant to be seen as. Sure, performance is a big part of the LC, but showing off its physical attractiveness and bling in a perceived high-class setting would be perfect to re-inject the entire Lexus brand into the average consumer's perception of flashy, cool, luxury cars.

I know from personal experience that this spot is usually filled by the German Trio (at least for younger consumers that weren't alive during the 90s), and manufacturers such as Lexus, Volvo and Infiniti are seen as a lower tier. I know, it sucks that Lexus is even mentioned in the same sentence as Infiniti, but that is probably how the average person who doesn't know much about cars sees things. These people see things in various forms of pop-culture and subconsciously make these brand images in their head.

Overall, this "promotion" in the minds of the average car-buyer of Lexus from a "knock-off luxury brand" to a badge on the same level as BMW could help the Lexus brand significantly. Badges matter, especially to the younger population. I know for a fact that 328i will get double the attention at a high school parking lot than an IS solely based on the fact that its a BMW.

I seriously feel that Lexus could get a real big boost from this lol. If they still want to put their cars into action movies then they should place a new F car in there.

Besides Lexus, Acura and Infiniti have not done Japan any better. Most of what Acura makes is made in America nowadays. Infiniti is having issues just like its mothership. I think what a lot of young people these days think is that Lexus is mostly RX and ES, which may be the vehicles their own parents drive.

To me, hip hop isn't the same as it was...being older, I don't really listen to today's rap music and don't even know what the videos are like anymore. In those days, Lexus never had to pay for LL or Biggie to rap about the car or drive it in the video. Most of the young people being exposed to cars, are doing the same thing we are, is by watching Youtube.

 

[meth.ix]

Most of the young people being exposed to cars, are doing the same thing we are, is by watching Youtube.

Yup, that's exactly why I feel that a product placement would be a big deal. In many music videos, you see product placements for Beats and e-cigarette brands too. The thing is, with cars it would be much less obvious that they were paid for to be put there since flashy expensive cars are a normal thing to see in many hip-hop videos.

 

[mikeavelli]

this makes me think, these days I feel like a product placement of an LC 500 Convertible in a major hip-hop music video would probably be more effective than in a blockbuster film.

The reason for this is that the flashy culture that has always been part of hip-hop is more prevalent than ever, and it's the perfect image you want to give to a luxury halo car. When you put a vehicle like the LC in some spy/superhero movie, I feel it does not convey what the LC is meant to be seen as. Sure, performance is a big part of the LC, but showing off its physical attractiveness and bling in a perceived high-class setting would be perfect to re-inject the entire Lexus brand into the average consumer's perception of flashy, cool, luxury cars.

I know from personal experience that this spot is usually filled by the German Trio (at least for younger consumers that weren't alive during the 90s), and manufacturers such as Lexus, Volvo and Infiniti are seen as a lower tier. I know, it sucks that Lexus is even mentioned in the same sentence as Infiniti, but that is probably how the average person who doesn't know much about cars sees things. These people see things in various forms of pop-culture and subconsciously make these brand images in their head.

Overall, this "promotion" in the minds of the average car-buyer of Lexus from a "knock-off luxury brand" to a badge on the same level as BMW could help the Lexus brand significantly. Badges matter, especially to the younger population. I know for a fact that 328i will get double the attention at a high school parking lot than an IS solely based on the fact that its a BMW.

I seriously feel that Lexus could get a real big boost from this lol. If they still want to put their cars into action movies then they should place a new F car in there.

Great post.

I think some of it too was it was desired organically. Take Pete Rock and CL Smooth's Straighten it out video. At the end they leave in a SC and LS. Nas "the world is yours" remix, he is sitting inside a SC. Jay-Z etc etc At that time Lexus was seen as the future.... But things change so fast..the last Lexus video i recall a Lexus really prominent was an old Brian McKnight video with a new at the time SC 430... You would even catch an Infiniti or even an Acura in the past. Clearly not even a thought today for those brands in a hip hop song or video.

The LC is shown very very VERY prominently in the movie "SuperFly", a remake of the original right here in Atlanta. There is even a scene of it against a Lamborghini Gallardo that was a good scene. When I was parked with Lexus at the Atlanta Auto Show, the local workers kept referring to it as the Superfly car. I was honestly surprised quite a bit but it was a pleasant surprise they knew what the LC was. Side Note, I talked with them to put wheels on the LC in the movie but we couldn't come to terms thus they painted the wheels black.

Today what is hip to most celebrities/hip-hop is not what Lexus is offering. Even a coupe like the LC is not seen as hip as a 4 door coupe or even more a 4 door coupe SUV. That has been all the rage in hip hop for sometime. In addition where in the past most couldn't drive an exotic as they were all MANUALS, well exotics are driven by everyone since they are AUTOMATICS. So hip hop moved there too. Not to mention we have so many exotics today its mind boggling. In the 1990s it felt like a handful.

I think product placement is great but things have changed and they need something really really dope to be a part ORGANICALLY. I'm involved a bit with these things and now every video they want exotics in the video. I'm sure the LC would fit but they are not asking for it.

But I'm trying to do my part to spread the word still and in particular with the LC. Before the Corona Virus hit I was planning on some cool things. Hopefully when things settle down you see the LC a bit...

 

[Tragic Bronson]

Great post.

I think some of it too was it was desired organically. Take Pete Rock and CL Smooth's Straighten it out video. At the end they leave in a SC and LS. Nas "the world is yours" remix, he is sitting inside a SC. Jay-Z etc etc At that time Lexus was seen as the future.... But things change so fast..the last Lexus video i recall a Lexus really prominent was an old Brian McKnight video with a new at the time SC 430... You would even catch an Infiniti or even an Acura in the past. Clearly not even a thought today for those brands in a hip hop song or video.

The LC is shown very very VERY prominently in the movie "SuperFly", a remake of the original right here in Atlanta. There is even a scene of it against a Lamborghini Gallardo that was a good scene. When I was parked with Lexus at the Atlanta Auto Show, the local workers kept referring to it as the Superfly car. I was honestly surprised quite a bit but it was a pleasant surprise they knew what the LC was. Side Note, I talked with them to put wheels on the LC in the movie but we couldn't come to terms thus they painted the wheels black.

Today what is hip to most celebrities/hip-hop is not what Lexus is offering. Even a coupe like the LC is not seen as hip as a 4 door coupe or even more a 4 door coupe SUV. That has been all the rage in hip hop for sometime. In addition where in the past most couldn't drive an exotic as they were all MANUALS, well exotics are driven by everyone since they are AUTOMATICS. So hip hop moved there too. Not to mention we have so many exotics today its mind boggling. In the 1990s it felt like a handful.

I think product placement is great but things have changed and they need something really really dope to be a part ORGANICALLY. I'm involved a bit with these things and now every video they want exotics in the video. I'm sure the LC would fit but they are not asking for it.

But I'm trying to do my part to spread the word still and in particular with the LC. Before the Corona Virus hit I was planning on some cool things. Hopefully when things settle down you see the LC a bit...

I'm wondering if DUB Magazine and its associated scene changed the tastes of the industry/culture. Besides exotics, the vehicles that I mostly see are big vehicles like trucks, SUVs and cars like the Dodge Charger/Chrysler 300. Ralph Gilles really nailed the styling with the urban market demo. Of course, the Dirty South was very into the box car old school American vehicles. If I really think about it, a lot of these vehicles better fit the artists and of course, athletes, who are bigger in stature than most of us, and wouldn't likely fit in your normal family sedan.

Fun fact: Derek Fisher leased a LS600hL over a decade ago. A friend that worked at a Lexus dealer in the LA area showed me his credit app.

 

[Ian Schmidt]

If I really think about it, a lot of these vehicles better fit the artists and of course, athletes, who are bigger in stature than most of us, and wouldn't likely fit in your normal family sedan.

I think there's something to that. The coupe-shaped-sedan trend has reduced room (especially headroom) even further in sedans, so SUVs are almost the only option for many, including athletes.

 

[mikeavelli]

I'm wondering if DUB Magazine and its associated scene changed the tastes of the industry/culture. Besides exotics, the vehicles that I mostly see are big vehicles like trucks, SUVs and cars like the Dodge Charger/Chrysler 300. Ralph Gilles really nailed the styling with the urban market demo. Of course, the Dirty South was very into the box car old school American vehicles. If I really think about it, a lot of these vehicles better fit the artists and of course, athletes, who are bigger in stature than most of us, and wouldn't likely fit in your normal family sedan.

Fun fact: Derek Fisher leased a LS600hL over a decade ago. A friend that worked at a Lexus dealer in the LA area showed me his credit app.

I believe Ben Afflack had one too. The LS 600h L was cool for people who wanted power and some MPG (relatively speaking) and luxury. The current LS 500 went after more MPG using a V-6 instead of a V-8 for more power and MPG.

I think your point with DUB, etc just shows how saturated it got with cars. I agree that Chrysler/Gilles nailed it initially with the 300C/Magnum etc and even today has a buzz with their SRT/Hellcat etc cars. To be honest, on a personal level, I didn't realize how much Hip-Hop loved American muscle until recently.

Going back to Lexus, I think a bigger LX L or whatever with the usual grille and a hybrid offering would be a welcome addition and maybe bring some attention to the LC and LS. As we all know people love big luxury SUV's.