Hyundai to (Finally) Start an Upmarket/Luxury Division

mmcartalk

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Just as Honda started Acura in 1986, Toyota and Nissan started Lexus and Infiniti in 1990, and Mazda (almost) started the Amati division until their Ford taskmasters cancelled it, Hyundai is going to follow in their footsteps and split off the Genesis, Equus, and an unnamed premium SUV next year into an all-new luxury/premium Genesis Division. it will be sold out of existing Hyundai dealerships at first, but eventually get their own shops.

We'll wait and see, but, IMO this, should help Genesis and Equus sales some, as a lot of buyers avoided them simply because of the Hyundai badge. Might also help the depreciation rate on used ones as well.

I did a review on a new 2Gen Genesis 5.0 RWD sedan last year and found it a superb luxury/sport sedan in almost every way...far better than the 1Gen it replaced. My pastor sprung for a new 3.8 AWD and just loves it. It's a shame we don't get the Genesis 5.0 AWD in the U.S. like they do in other countries.....Hyundai claims that they don't bring it here because of the gas-mileage/CAFE rules....and Hyundai, of course, is no stranger to gas-mileage controversies.

http://www.autonews.com/article/201...-luxury-market-with-stand-alone-genesis-brand

BEIJING -- Hyundai Motor Co. appears set to launch a independent global premium product lineup, to be called Genesis, as it seeks to boost profitability that is being squeezed by a strong won currency.

Hyundai is expected to announce the move in South Korea as early as Wednesday (Tuesday in the U.S.), three people close to the company told Reuters.

The maker of the Sonata midsize sedan and Santa Fe crossover plans to launch Genesis as a separate global brand, though the lineup is likely to be sold through the existing Hyundai-brand distribution channel -- at least for now, said one of the knowledgeable individuals.

Hyundai launched a luxury midsize sedan called the Genesis in 2008, as well as a related coupe model. It later added a remodeled Equus as a flagship sedan to that upscale lineup.

Those cars will form the core of the Genesis lineup, with a midsize SUV to be added by around 2019, the three individuals said. The Equus would likely be renamed.

"A small line of upscale products is going to be sold under the Genesis brand name. It's not a physically separated brand with its own channel," one of the knowledgeable individuals told Reuters, adding Hyundai, for now, thinks that setting up a separate channel of Genesis stores carries too much risk.

The planned move would go some way to fulfilling Hyundai Chairman Chung Mong-koo's long-held ambitions to take the automaker more upmarket.

Hyundai Motor declined to comment.

Premium prospects

Hyundai decided around a decade ago not to set up a stand-alone upscale brand, but instead tested the water with the Genesis models.

At that time, external advisers cautioned Hyundai wasn't ready to move to a standalone luxury brand, and should concentrate first on strengthening the core Hyundai brand.

A well-known Detroit-based product and marketing expert warned the Korean firm then that Japanese rival Toyota Motor Corp. spent around $5 billion to build its Lexus luxury marque from scratch, and took a decade to break even.

Now, though, Hyundai faces a profit squeeze from a strong Korean won that eats away at revenue on cars sold outside Korea -- about 75 percent of the company's sales.

There is also tougher competition in its home market from German luxury brands such as BMW and Audi, said one of the knowledgeable individuals, none of whom wanted to be named as they are not authorized to talk to the media.

Many in the automotive industry believe sales of luxury models will grow faster than the overall market -- and generate bigger profits than the mass market cars Hyundai specializes in.

The high end is a crowded marketplace, however.

Fiat Chrysler's Alfa Romeo brand , Cadillac , Lincoln, Infiniti and Acura are all chasing aspiring luxury car buyers from the United States to China -- markets where German brands are already strong. And there's Tesla Motors now, too.

Ko Tae-bong, industry analyst at HI Investment & Securities, said Hyundai had caught up with the global industry with its "value for money" cars, and it was now time "to jump to the next level."

"It's about the profitability. Hyundai is well known for value for money, and customers will buy cars based on that. Selling expensive luxury cars can boost its sluggish profits growth," Ko said.

According to two of the knowledgeable individuals, however, some of Hyundai's U.S.-based sales executives are concerned the company may be rushing into launching a stand-alone premium brand. They think headquarters may not have "thoroughly thought through the move," said one of the individuals. "Some are not very happy."

"Creating a new brand from the ground up ... you'd have to be very thoughtful and measured. All those questions have not been fully answered," he said.
 

Gecko

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I'm all for it, though I am not really sold on the "Genesis" name. It just seems to lack the sophistication of competitors like Mercedes-Benz, Cadillac, Lexus and others. However, it's the cars that matter, so if Hyundai can deliver on the product, the name will become synonymous with something great.

Quite frankly, Hyundai has done so well the last few years that seeing them apply a similarly bullish strategy to the luxury market will be interesting. Acura and Infiniti are particularly lost in the dark right now. Buick is on an upswing, I think Lincoln has a very bright future, and so does Cadillac. It will take Genesis a while to get there, but they could solidly make their way to tier 2/3 within 15 years, I think.

Hyundai has the resources and technology to pump into the brand to make good cars, and that's point #1.
 

mmcartalk

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I'm all for it, though I am not really sold on the "Genesis" name. It just seems to lack the sophistication of competitors like Mercedes-Benz, Cadillac, Lexus and others. However, it's the cars that matter, so if Hyundai can deliver on the product, the name will become synonymous with something great.

Quite frankly, Hyundai has done so well the last few years that seeing them apply a similarly bullish strategy to the luxury market will be interesting. Acura and Infiniti are particularly lost in the dark right now. Buick is on an upswing, I think Lincoln has a very bright future, and so does Cadillac. It will take Genesis a while to get there, but they could solidly make their way to tier 2/3 within 15 years, I think.

Hyundai has the resources and technology to pump into the brand to make good cars, and that's point #1.


Have you driven a new 2Gen Genesis? Try one out (especially the 5.0L) version) and I think you will be even more impressed. :) ;) I reviewed the old one several years ago, and the difference between the old and new one is nothing short of stunning.

I agree with you, BTW, with both Buick and Lincoln on the upswing, but Buick seems to more or less have their act together on reliability. Lincoln and Cadillac don't.
 

mmcartalk

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Here's an article on the new proposed naming system....based on "G" and numbers. It will essentially be like the old system that Infiniti doesn't use any more.

http://jalopnik.com/hyundai-makes-the-genesis-brand-official-cars-will-get-1740446762


The reports were true: Hyundai is officially launching its own global luxury brand named Genesis. The automaker made the announcement tonight with a few details on what they have in store. Some good, some not so good.

For starters, Genesis will have six new models by 2020 that Hyundai says “will compete with the world’s most renowned luxury car brands.” Here’s some PR speak to whet your appetite:

The Genesis brand seeks to create a new definition of luxury, one that will provide a new platform for future mobility centered on people. By anticipating human needs at every touch point, Genesis models will embody four key aspects: Human-focused innovation, refined and balanced performance, athletic elegance in design and hassle-free customer experience.

Neat. In addition the cars will use a new wing emblem not unlike the current Genesis logo, but “even more luxurious” in appearance. Their words, not mine.


And then we get to the names. If the Hyundai Genesis is already a thing, will it become the Genesis Genesis? No, that would be stupid. And what of the Hyundai Equus?

Hyundai says it will institute a naming system for the new cars that starts with “G” and ends in a number. Like this:

The Genesis brand will also adopt a new alphanumeric naming structure. Future models will be named by combining the letter ‘G’ for Genesis with a number, 90, 80 or 70 etc., representing the segment.

Good. Great. Swell. Another set of alphanumerics for us all to learn. I guess now that Infiniti is done with the G, Hyundai decided to scoop it up. You know how the G37 became the new Q50 and Q60, right? Or as we call it around the office, “Which one is that again?”

Anyway, luxury buyers love alphanumerics instead of real names, apparently, so they have to go that route to be competitive.

But there’s good news: Luc Donckerwolke, the design chief formerly of Bentley, Audi, Lamborghini and others and whom Hyundai scooped up recently, will lead design at Genesis. His work will be overseen by Peter Schreyer, who has led Hyundai’s recent design renaissance. The point is this: the Genesis G-Whatevers should look really good.

I for one am looking forward to seeing what Hyundai is capable of in the luxury space. They’ve made tremendous strides in the past 15 years, and this move seems like a natural progression for them, not to mention a potentially very profitable one.

One of the biggest pitfalls, however, is that the luxury game is more crowded than ever. In addition to the usuals from Germany and Lexus, Genesis will be up against a renewed Cadillac, Infiniti, Alfa Romeo, Maserati and Jaguar, all of whom are working to get their **** together in different ways. Hyundai had better do the same.
 

CIF

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I'm not sure this is going to work out. Does Hyundai think they can succeed, where Infiniti and Acura have failed?

They're not even planning to go all the way; no dedicated luxury stores, simply areas within existing Hyundai dealerships. Acura and Infiniti have faced a variety of struggles, and they have separate stand-alone dealerships from their mother brands.

The value aspect is simply not that strong anymore with Hyundai's vehicles as it once was. This also combined with the fact that the luxury market today is extremely competitive. The new Genesis sedan, with seemingly good reviews and lots of praise, has not even made a dent in the sales of Tier 1 luxury brands. Maybe it's made a dent in Acura or Infiniti sales a bit, but BMW, Lexus, and Mercedes sales are as strong as ever. In any case, before Hyundai can even think of competing with BMW, Lexus, Mercedes, they need to worry about very strong efforts coming from Buick, and Volvo. Volvo will soon be bringing an extremely strong product onslaught, which has only begun with the new XC90.

Also as Gecko alluded to, the 'Genesis' name/brand I also feel will be a problem. This is already a name associated with not only their current sedan, but their entry-level coupe, which is not luxurious at all, and a far more downmarket product than the sedan.

So for me, this move poses too many questions, and Hyundai's plan doesn't provide enough answers IMO.
 

mmcartalk

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Also as Gecko alluded to, the 'Genesis' name/brand I also feel will be a problem. This is already a name associated with not only their current sedan, but their entry-level coupe, which is not luxurious at all, and a far more downmarket product than the sedan.

So for me, this move poses too many questions, and Hyundai's plan doesn't provide enough answers IMO.

Well, I think at least one of your questions here has already been addressed by Hyundai's plans. The Genesis coupe is indeed a different, and much less upmarket, vehicle than the sedan. But, when the sedan gets renamed with the new "G" number system (probably to G70, but we'll see), that will clearly separate it, by name, from the coupe. Also, there's no evidence (yet) that the coupe itself will be part of the new division (nor should it be, IMO). Hyundai's current plans for the new division include only the renamed Genesis sedan, Equus sedan, and a yet-to-be named luxury SUV in a few years.....probably something along the lines of the now-discontinued upmarket Veracruz.
 

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Will the car/brand be better or still a value proposition?

Toyota didn't make Lexus to just join the party, the intent was to beat the best in the world. Until their cars are considered world beaters I don't see the point. I think elevating the Hyundai brand is perfectly fine and it appeals to people who don't want the badge.

What will be truly interesting is how this shakes up the 2nd/3rd tier brands. If the "Genesis" brand has a full V-8 flagship in the Equus and the current Geneiss is good, that makes Lincoln, Acura, infinit , Volvo and even Cadillac look worse.
 

mmcartalk

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Will the car/brand be better or still a value proposition?

Toyota didn't make Lexus to just join the party, the intent was to beat the best in the world. Until their cars are considered world beaters I don't see the point. I think elevating the Hyundai brand is perfectly fine and it appeals to people who don't want the badge.

What will be truly interesting is how this shakes up the 2nd/3rd tier brands. If the "Genesis" brand has a full V-8 flagship in the Equus and the current Geneiss is good, that makes Lincoln, Acura, infinit , Volvo and even Cadillac look worse.

The 5.0L V8 Genesis, in most ways, drives better than the more expensive Equus. Sample one, and I think you will agree. (fortunately, both will be in the new division).

As for the lack of V8 engines, you've got somewhat of a point with Lincoln and Cadillac, though a V8, of course, is standard in the Cadillac CTS-V, and Infiniti has a 5.6L V8 in the Q70 sedan flagship. The Lincoln Navigator and Cadillac Escalade offer big V8s, but they are not sedans.
 

CIF

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Well, I think at least one of your questions here has already been addressed by Hyundai's plans. The Genesis coupe is indeed a different, and much less upmarket, vehicle than the sedan. But, when the sedan gets renamed with the new "G" number system (probably to G70, but we'll see), that will clearly separate it, by name, from the coupe. Also, there's no evidence (yet) that the coupe itself will be part of the new division (nor should it be, IMO). Hyundai's current plans for the new division include only the renamed Genesis sedan, Equus sedan, and a yet-to-be named luxury SUV in a few years.....probably something along the lines of the now-discontinued upmarket Veracruz.

If they separate the coupe from the Genesis name, then that will be a long-overdue move. We'll see what happens.

Will the car/brand be better or still a value proposition?

Toyota didn't make Lexus to just join the party, the intent was to beat the best in the world. Until their cars are considered world beaters I don't see the point. I think elevating the Hyundai brand is perfectly fine and it appeals to people who don't want the badge.

What will be truly interesting is how this shakes up the 2nd/3rd tier brands. If the "Genesis" brand has a full V-8 flagship in the Equus and the current Geneiss is good, that makes Lincoln, Acura, infinit , Volvo and even Cadillac look worse.

Excellent points!

Just from all the details known so far, these vehicles certainly aren't going to be world beaters. IMHO, they are going to most likely compete with Tier 2/Tier 3 'near luxury' brands, nothing more.
 

mmcartalk

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http://www.autonews.com/article/201...nesis-g90-flagship?cciid=email-autonews-daily

Rendering is the usual mix of various brands but to their credit it always seems to work out. This flaghship is a big middle finger to the tier 2/3 brands and will further plummet their image. Egads this is crazy when you think about it.

hyundai-genesis-g90.jpg


A gorgeous design....especially with the obvious Bentley touch in the rear. But I hope they aren't serious with those wheels...a car is meant to ride on tires, not wheel-rims.
 

mikeavelli

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Here it is...

dealers are very concerned this is all rushed and it won't launch properly or with the right care. Hyundai has been down 7 consecutive quarters in regards to financials so they are looking for some good news.

80-genesis_g90_spy_photo_a8502100982c9be1d167635da35dbae8ae99ad06.jpg
 
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krew

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Yawn. Seems like an updated VW Phaeton....

Also dealers are very concerned this is all rushed and it won't launch properly or with the right care. Hyundai has been down 7 consecutive quarters in regards to financials so they are looking for some good news.

80-genesis_g90_spy_photo_a8502100982c9be1d167635da35dbae8ae99ad06.jpg

It's derivative, but I like it well enough. I'm not too down on Hyundai for attempting to build a luxury brand, I actually think it's a smart move.

Even so, Genesis is a poor choice of name -- it either sounds religious or like a famous prog-rock band, depending on your affiliations. Would have made more sense to pick something with no meaning whatsoever.
 

mmcartalk

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It's derivative, but I like it well enough. I'm not too down on Hyundai for attempting to build a luxury brand, I actually think it's a smart move.

Even so, Genesis is a poor choice of name -- it either sounds religious or like a famous prog-rock band, depending on your affiliations. Would have made more sense to pick something with no meaning whatsoever.

If you have not already done so, Krew, try test-driving a new 2Gen Genesis sedan (especially the 5.0L version). Once you have sampled this car, I think you will be pleased enough with it that the name will be of relatively little concern. ;)

When I did a full-review, I was stunned that Hyundai could make a car with this kind of comfort, quality, and road manners.

or like a famous prog-rock band,

Genesis's Peter Gabriel wasn't exactly my favorite singer, but I've heard lots worse. :D
 
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CIF

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Yawn. Seems like an updated VW Phaeton....

Also dealers are very concerned this is all rushed and it won't launch properly or with the right care. Hyundai has been down 7 consecutive quarters in regards to financials so they are looking for some good news.

80-genesis_g90_spy_photo_a8502100982c9be1d167635da35dbae8ae99ad06.jpg

Seems like an updated Equus from the rear. Agreed that it looks very derivative.

80-genesis_g90_spy_photo_a8502100982c9be1d167635da35dbae8ae99ad06.jpg



Westland%20Hyundai%20Equus%20Main.jpg

Wow fascinating news that dealers are concerned. Can't say I'm surprised, given this whole Genesis brand is a half-hearted effort so far, with no new branding (using existing Genesis logo/branding and merely expanding it out) and no stand-alone Genesis dealerships.
 

mmcartalk

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Seems like an updated Equus from the rear. Agreed that it looks very derivative.

80-genesis_g90_spy_photo_a8502100982c9be1d167635da35dbae8ae99ad06.jpg


Well, yes, I'll have to agree with that part of it. The Jaguar connection is obvious, but I hadn't considered the Equus part until you mentioned it.
 
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mmcartalk

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Even so, Genesis is a poor choice of name -- it either sounds religious or like a famous prog-rock band, depending on your affiliations. Would have made more sense to pick something with no meaning whatsoever.

What would you have named it, then, if it were up to you?

As far as the "religious" description goes, the Mercury, Merkur, and Saturn divisions of Ford and GM were all named after not only planets but pagan deities. Buick, at one time, produced a rebadged Chevy Nova called the Apollo.....another pagan diety. The Dodge Aries sedan/coupe was an astrological name. The Ford Taurus, an enormously popular sedan for years, was another astrological name. Of course, all of these except the Taurus have been discontinued.
 
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CIF

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Well, yes, I'll have to agree with that part of it. The Jaguar connection is obvious, but I hadn't considered the Equus part until you mentioned it.

Really? I thought the Equus connection would be pretty obvious for many.