Dear Lexus:

[CIF]

Dear Lexus,

Many people are well-aware of the huge push at Lexus over the last several years to focus much more on styling and performance. To a smaller extent, some people are also aware that at Lexus, model cycles have lengthened to improve quality. While many Lexus fans appreciate this, other fans feel left out. Lexus has publicly admitted that it's fine with losing some fans due to more polarizing styling. However, there are some serious concerns certain fans have regarding more core issues. With the big focus lately at Lexus on styling and performance, some fans and owners feel that core attributes like luxury and comfort are being neglected. This is especially and painfully evident with the very old current LS model, and no official news or indication yet of the next-gen LS.

There are enough sport-oriented Lexus models now in the lineup, that some fans and owners feel that the more extreme styling and performance isn't needed on all models. As one of those fans, I ask you Lexus to please re-focus on comfort, elegance, luxury, and refinement on models such as the ES, LS, GS, and GX. The new LX and RX are great steps in that direction, as they have interiors very much focused on comfort, luxury, and refinement. Please leave the heavy focus on extreme styling and performance to models like the IS, RC, and F models. Also Lexus has an almost legendary reputation for focusing on what I would call "practical luxury". Things like quality, reliability, craftsmanship, comfort, refinement, ergonomics, clever use of interior space and luxury features that are genuinely useful in every day situations. The new RX, while having a great luxury interior and comfort, is really right on the line in terms of aggressive versus elegant styling. Also the new RX interior arguably has lost a couple of practical interior features/capabilities that makes the interior a bit less flexible. Please remain disciplined and refrain from straying into gimmicks like some competitors.

Polarizing styling is one thing, but losing focus from some of your key fundamental brand attributes is something else entirely. Many Lexus fans and owners are fine with this focus on styling and performance, but don't forget your roots made the brand what it is today.

Sincerely,

A Lexus enthusiast.

 

[GSCT]

I can't agree with your proposition that a re-focus on comfort is needed and, IMO Lexus hasn't lost elegance, luxury and refinement but has added, excitement, dynamic handling and confidence. Buyers now have a choice of regular or F Sport in most models, so they can choose more aggressive styling and handling if they want. Sales are up, a younger demographic is buying and Lexus can't be accused of just making boring cars for old folks anymore, so I do 't see any reason why they would or should change the strategy. And based on the ES loaner I had this week, there are still some old style Lexuses available for those who want them.

 

[CIF]

I can't agree with your proposition that a re-focus on comfort is needed and, IMO Lexus hasn't lost elegance, luxury and refinement but has added, excitement, dynamic handling and confidence. Buyers now have a choice of regular or F Sport in most models, so they can choose more aggressive styling and handling if they want. Sales are up, a younger demographic is buying and Lexus can't be accused of just making boring cars for old folks anymore, so I do 't see any reason why they would or should change the strategy. And based on the ES loaner I had this week, there are still some old style Lexuses available for those who want them.

Respectfully, I think you misunderstood the aim of my post.

My main point was asking that Lexus please refocus on comfort and pure luxury only on certain models such as the ES, LS, GX, and to a lesser extent GS. Models in the Lexus lineup that are more comfort-oriented. So in other words, I am asking Lexus to please not lose the comfort focus on those models (the GS being a sport/comfort balance). The ES for example, while good, could definitely be better. Especially compared to the new RX interior, the ES interior could be much better. No need to bring up the LS again, we all know it's very old and outdated. The base GS should keep its sport/comfort balance. For those that want more sport or more aggression, there is the F-Sport variant, or also the GS F.

I have no problem with the focus on aggressive styling and performance for most models. There is no need to bring a heavy focus on aggressive styling and performance on comfort-oriented models. F Sport variants are fine with me, the focus on aggressive styling and performance on other models is fine with me. Just leave some regular non-F-Sport variants of comfort-oriented Lexus models focused on comfort and luxury.

Also to add, my other point was for Lexus to remain focused on "practical luxury". Gimmicks like gesture control most buyers won't use on a daily basis. Things like better audio systems, better refinement, better ride and handling on rough roads and potholes, better stability when under extreme external forces like very high crosswinds or heavy rain, better seats, etc....these are things that most buyers will notice every day, and appreciate more than gimmicky features. Budgets are finite, so I hope Lexus keeps their priorities logical.

Also one last thought about the LS. Imagine if Lexus made a "super LS", a sort of super-luxury version of the LS. To me that would be very wise, and also an incredible move. That would make Lexus an extremely formidable competitor, because then they would have very sporty high end models, as well as super luxury high end models. That would make it extremely difficult for competitors.

 

[meth.ix]

I don't know how you think there are enough performance models, especially when your profile picture is an LFA . RC F, GS F, and LC. That's definitely not enough compared to the number of ///M or ///AMG models. Also, I think personally that the best way to boost a luxury brand's image is to have more performance models. People know that BMW or Mercedes aren't as reliable as a Lexus is, but the Motorsports history of both brands really influences them. I have to agree on the styling. Some styling should not be on base models that are oriented for families. Like the Altezza lights on the GS. Are they really needed on the base model? The Altezza taillights make it look like a performance model instead of a family executive sedan. They should have kept them on the GS F but kept the old taillights on the base model. And the Infotainment System? Android Auto/Apple CarPlay are becoming mandatory these days as companies like Honda and Mazda have it standard. Also, has anyone compared the looks of a Lexus to its Mercedes competitor?

Here's the E-Class

And here's the GS:

Look at the difference! The GS could be any family sedan while the E-Class is obviously a luxury car at first glance. I mean, it looks like a luxury car. The GS is a luxury car as well, I know. But there is not a single indication that makes it different from a regular sedan and tells you it's a luxury sedan. But the E-Class is a grand looking vehicle. Look at that MB badge on the hood the chrome line running down the bottom. The chrome grille. These are all symbols that tell you it's not just another ordinary family car. And the interior is crazy too!

There's ambient lighting, crazy luxurious seats, beautiful infotainment layout. Honestly, I think the new E-Class interior can easily beat the LS interior (not size-wise). Interior has been an issue for Lexus and now it is a critical one as Mercedes is setting the new standard for interiors. The C-Class compared to the IS is just as mind-blowing:

The bumper vents are too agressive even in the non-F Sport and there should be a separator in the grille of the non-F Sport because the grille will probably look too big for older buyers who just want a regular looking Lexus. Look at the C-Class though. Those chrome accents are just right. Not too much.

I honestly think that just the slightest touch of chrome in the exterior and keeping in mind that these are luxury cars that are meant to look more grand than sporty, with the exception of the F and F Sport models. So I also want the spindle grille to be toned down a little bit in base models. And I think the main problem with Lexus interiors is not always the fact that it isn’t good, but it doesn’t look as good. Like the seats of the E-Class and GS probably don’t have much of a difference in terms of comfort, but the E-Class sure looks much more comfortable with that quilt style pattern and light colored leather, relaxing ambient lighting and smooth looking dashboard. Honestly, which car would make people think you’re richer, an E-Class or the GS? The C-Class or the IS? The correct answer is the Mercedes competitors. The brands prestigious history also plays a role, but it’s mostly on its I-have-my-own-personal-chauffeur (grand) look. The LS concept looks great, but if the production LS looks anything like it, it’ll only be an S-Class competitor by interior and size.

The exterior looks too sporty and again, CHROME! I know chrome will one day get outdated, but currently, the best way for a car to look like a luxury car is with chrome. Also, did anyone notice that most of the photos released of any Lexus these days have black interiors? The black color really takes away from the luxurious feel IMO. A light colored beige or tan with a wood trim is the ideal luxury interior for me. The Mercedes S-Class photos are mostly in its whitish interior which makes it look ABSOLUTELY STUNNING!!!

 

[GSCT]

Respectfully, I think you misunderstood the aim of my post.

My main point was asking that Lexus please refocus on comfort and pure luxury only on certain models such as the ES, LS, GX, and to a lesser extent GS. Models in the Lexus lineup that are more comfort-oriented. So in other words, I am asking Lexus to please not lose the comfort focus on those models (the GS being a sport/comfort balance). The ES for example, while good, could definitely be better. Especially compared to the new RX interior, the ES interior could be much better. No need to bring up the LS again, we all know it's very old and outdated. The base GS should keep its sport/comfort balance. For those that want more sport or more aggression, there is the F-Sport variant, or also the GS F.

I have no problem with the focus on aggressive styling and performance for most models. There is no need to bring a heavy focus on aggressive styling and performance on comfort-oriented models. F Sport variants are fine with me, the focus on aggressive styling and performance on other models is fine with me. Just leave some regular non-F-Sport variants of comfort-oriented Lexus models focused on comfort and luxury.

Also to add, my other point was for Lexus to remain focused on "practical luxury". Gimmicks like gesture control most buyers won't use on a daily basis. Things like better audio systems, better refinement, better ride and handling on rough roads and potholes, better stability when under extreme external forces like very high crosswinds or heavy rain, better seats, etc....these are things that most buyers will notice every day, and appreciate more than gimmicky features. Budgets are finite, so I hope Lexus keeps their priorities logical.

For me, the real question is: "what does Lexus want to stand for?" IMO it used to be reliable luxury and it was known as appropriate for those older folks with enough money that they didn't have to buy a Buick. But they were also boring. So, even the ES and LX are somewhat bolder than before with the spindle grill and they look like apart of the Lexus family. I'm OK with the ES, RX and LS being more of a luxury focus and less sporting, but overall I like the direction Lexus is headed.

The "perfect" Lexus for me is the new LC. It's a wonderful blend of luxury, aggressive styling and performance dynamics and is anything but boring. I submit it makes Mercedes and BMW look sedated in comparison. I really hope its' "DNA" is implemented throughout the rest of the line.

Finally I totally agree with a priority for handling refinement compared to electronic gimmicks, but as I stated in another thread, Lexus navigation and electronic interfaces are lacking compared to other companies.

 

[CIF]

I don't know how you think there are enough performance models, especially when your profile picture is an LFA . RC F, GS F, and LC. That's definitely not enough compared to the number of ///M or ///AMG models. Also, I think personally that the best way to boost a luxury brand's image is to have more performance models. People know that BMW or Mercedes aren't as reliable as a Lexus is, but the Motorsports history of both brands really influences them. I have to agree on the styling. Some styling should not be on base models that are oriented for families. Like the Altezza lights on the GS. Are they really needed on the base model? The Altezza taillights make it look like a performance model instead of a family executive sedan. They should have kept them on the GS F but kept the old taillights on the base model. And the Infotainment System? Android Auto/Apple CarPlay are becoming mandatory these days as companies like Honda and Mazda have it standard. Also, has anyone compared the looks of a Lexus to its Mercedes competitor?

RC F, GS F, (likely) coming LC F, (likely) coming LS F, not to mention countless F Sport variants now. Also, the base models of the IS, RC, LC, CT, and even the NX to an extent are a bit more sport-oriented than pure comfort or luxury-oriented.

Lexus does not have a huge lineup, and never will. So to me yes, in my humble opinion, that's enough sporty and performance models currently and in the near future. There's always a possibility of the IS F returning to the lineup as well.

Lexus can never match the number of German models, nor should they.

As for the other specific details your post mentioned, I'd prefer not to get into that in this thread.

For me, the real question is: "what does Lexus want to stand for?" IMO it used to be reliable luxury and it was known as appropriate for those older folks with enough money that they didn't have to buy a Buick. But they were also boring. So, even the ES and LX are somewhat bolder than before with the spindle grill and they look like apart of the Lexus family. I'm OK with the ES, RX and LS being more of a luxury focus and less sporting, but overall I like the direction Lexus is headed.

The "perfect" Lexus for me is the new LC. It's a wonderful blend of luxury, aggressive styling and performance dynamics and is anything but boring. I submit it makes Mercedes and BMW look sedated in comparison. I really hope its' "DNA" is implemented throughout the rest of the line.

Finally I totally agree with a priority for handling refinement compared to electronic gimmicks, but as I stated in another thread, Lexus navigation and electronic interfaces are lacking compared to other companies.

Only Lexus truly knows what they stand for. We can only guess, or go by official statements. If I had to bet, based on publicly what Lexus has done and stated over the last few years, they want to be known as a prestige brand, in my opinion. That of course means fielding a very strong lineup, with both performance luxury and comfort/pure luxury models.

 

[meth.ix]

I also think that F Sport needs a change. I'm not saying it should die, but an engine upgrade is needed. It should have around 30hp more than the regular car, and the F Sport package should be available on the fastest engine available for the car. For example, the IS 350 should be the only car offered with F Sport. It should have a 330hp engine which is a little bump from the regular 306hp in the IS 350. This strategy is similar to the Mercedes-Benz AMG Sport models. The C450 AMG Sport (Now named the Mercedes-Benz C43) is basically what I'm talking about. An IS 350 F Sport would be a good competitor to the C43, S4 and Q50S Red Sport. It won't be high-performance enough to be an M3 and C63 competitor, that will be the IS F's job. F Sport will be perfect for people who can't afford a full performance luxury car, but still want a decent-performance car.

 

[mikeavelli]

Quite a few past Lexus owners feel the same way. I really am hoping more than anything for new class leading powertrains like in the past. I had a LS 460 loaner the other day and GX and they are really good traditional Lexus models but I don't know if that is what people want in the future.

I was thinking recently how kids today will see Lexus very different than how we saw it and how they will see other brands differently than how we saw it.

 

[GSCT]

I was thinking recently how kids today will see Lexus very different than how we saw it and how they will see other brands differently than how we saw it.

It's changing. When I got my first Lexus in 2008, my older son went on in the vein of "well, now you're older and retired and it's time for your old man car". Seven years later, he's buying a CT 200h F Sport! I know it's anecdotal, but the Gen 2 and 3 IS, the F Sports, the RC and above all the LFA have made Lexus appealing to a wider audience without loosing any of it's luxury/quality image.

 

[James]

It's changing. When I got my first Lexus in 2008, my older son went on in the vein of "well, now you're older and retired and it's time for your old man car". Seven years later, he's buying a CT 200h F Sport! I know it's anecdotal, but the Gen 2 and 3 IS, the F Sports, the RC and above all the LFA have made Lexus appealing to a wider audience without loosing any of it's luxury/quality image.

I totally agree. I have loved Lexus for a decade now and being young it was hard to be like look how good it looks and now they look great. Maybe a little over the top now at times but I love the changes. I wish a little more power to the engines tho...especially AWD versions.

 

[Ian Schmidt]

The original SC showed flashes of what Lexus could actually be, and I think they're finally getting a lot closer: you *can* have luxury and comfort without the "God's waiting room" styling of the S-Class (if I may recycle a joke I heard all the time in Florida, usually when stuck behind a mid-90s Buick going 25 MPH in a 45).

 

[CIF]

Quite a few past Lexus owners feel the same way. I really am hoping more than anything for new class leading powertrains like in the past. I had a LS 460 loaner the other day and GX and they are really good traditional Lexus models but I don't know if that is what people want in the future.

I was thinking recently how kids today will see Lexus very different than how we saw it and how they will see other brands differently than how we saw it.

Interesting point about how people see Lexus now/in the future. I'm such an exception in this discussion lol. A fairly young person, who's been a Toyota/Lexus fan for a long time, and I always saw Lexus as a decently sporty brand, in their own unique Japanese way. The only difference being in recent times Lexus focusing on the sport more than ever before.

 

[mikeavelli]

Interesting point about how people see Lexus now/in the future. I'm such an exception in this discussion lol. A fairly young person, who's been a Toyota/Lexus fan for a long time, and I always saw Lexus as a decently sporty brand, in their own unique Japanese way. The only difference being in recent times Lexus focusing on the sport more than ever before.

Weird right...we grew up for example on fun Hondas and Acuras of the 80s/90s.. Kids today will remember them as a SUV company. Lexus today is known a bit more for fun whereas we saw it more as luxury then fun. Audi was non existent just ten years ago, today kids adore them...etc etc...

 

[Ruksac]

I can appreciate the sentiment that started this thread, and I'm sure there are differing opinions depending on various ages, regions of the country, driving styles, etc. And yes, the aging LS is way overdue for the massive overhaul which, from the rumors, will be exactly what we've been craving. But models such as the GS should not be toned down in terms of the sporty styling and performance personality. I think the lineup is pretty clearly defined. The LS has its baby brother the ES. The GS has its baby brother in the IS. The LX is the off road version of an LS, and the RX is the SUV equivalent of the ES. The GX is pretty standalone but the NX has similarities to both the RC and IS. If anything, Lexus needs to compete with more distinct styling to overtake the Germans once and for all.

To revert to the days of yore and dull down the GS would be catastrophic. We don't want to go the way of Oldsmobile.

 

[CIF]

I can appreciate the sentiment that started this thread, and I'm sure there are differing opinions depending on various ages, regions of the country, driving styles, etc. And yes, the aging LS is way overdue for the massive overhaul which, from the rumors, will be exactly what we've been craving. But models such as the GS should not be toned down in terms of the sporty styling and performance personality. I think the lineup is pretty clearly defined. The LS has its baby brother the ES. The GS has its baby brother in the IS. The LX is the off road version of an LS, and the RX is the SUV equivalent of the ES. The GX is pretty standalone but the NX has similarities to both the RC and IS. If anything, Lexus needs to compete with more distinct styling to overtake the Germans once and for all.

To revert to the days of yore and dull down the GS would be catastrophic. We don't want to go the way of Oldsmobile.

I think you misinterpreted my statements.

To clarify, I think that the current sport/luxury balance of the GS should be left as is in terms of overall balance. Should the GS get a bit more upmarket and luxurious? Sure, but they can continue to maintain the same level of sport-luxury balance in the GS. The current 4GS is almost unanimously praised for great handling, yet also having a good ride and a great, luxurious interior. Lexus achieved a great sport-luxury balance on the 4GS. What I was saying was that I hope Lexus never gets any silly ideas to make the base GS more sporty, which would throw off the sport-luxury balance. I never said the GS should get less sporty, or more dull. Not sure where you got that interpretation. Equally I believe the (base) GS should not get more sporty, unless the luxury aspect is equally increased with the sport.

The original philosophy of the GS model was to be a nice balance of sport and luxury, and I simply meant that Lexus should never stray from that balance.

Those who want more sport in their GS, there are the F-Sport and GS F models.

I agree that the Lexus lineup is pretty clearly defined right now. The aim of this thread are my personal thoughts that Lexus does not get any silly or goofy ideas which would muddy or complicate the lineup. Silly ideas like "more sport" in models that don't need that, like the ES.

 

[Ruksac]

I totally get you. And yes, the ES is not, nor ever will be deserving of a sportier package or personality. As far as the current GS, I too think Lexus has it balanced. Whether you want to step up from an IS into an entry level GS 200t or 350 you will see a lot of bang for the buck differences. Then Lexus has the upper level GS sedans well balanced as well with either choosing a 56k or 60k level F-sport or opting for the much more refined luxury package priced around 58k.

 

[Ian Schmidt]

Am I the only one who didn't see the IS/GS and ES/LS parings before? It makes *total* sense once its pointed out, of course.

Now we just need an AWD ES to complete the lineup.

 

[IS-SV]

My opinion is that Lexus IS not properly addressing the mid-level sport/performance market with its current lineup, the lack of new engines contributes to that problem on F-Sport models.