5th Generation (2018+) Lexus LS 500 & LS 500h Megathread

[Levi]

hows that better?

Maybe OCD? I prefer the way it was done on 4LS, and as all competitors still do it.

 

[Gecko]

MOD NOTE: OK, let's all focus on the 5.1LS and respect each other while we do it.

CRSKTN - stop baiting and instigating other members. I deleted your post.


Why are ya'll so worked up over this LS? You guys care more about how other people feel about the car than Lexus did when designing it!

 

[internalaudit]

Touch screen, finally!

Surprised this refreshed LS didn't look anything like the improved 3.3IS, at least for the front.

 

[supra93]

The headlights look sooooo much better!!! Why are there openings on the fender?

 

[Joaquin Ruhi]

Why are there openings on the fender?

The LS facelift Lexus Global Newsroom doesn't explicitly explain why, but, from what many on this forum deduce, only LS models with the Lexus Teammate option have the fender openings. Although Lexus says nothing about them, we figure they hold side LIDAR sensors to allow for Level 2 autonomous driving.

 

[spwolf]

Why are ya'll so worked up over this LS? You guys care more about how other people feel about the car than Lexus did when designing it!

how do you figure that out? Interior, exterior, tech, powertrain, suspension updates and introduction of Lexus Teamate, AI driven upgradable first LIDAR system in production? (beating Volvo by 2 years).

 

[F1 Silver Arrows]

@Gecko is right but I do need to clear something up though.

The LC F project is in fact cancelled indefinitely and this is NOT a rumor. Why you may ask? Blame the pandemic.

 

[James]

@Gecko is right but I do need to clear something up though.

The LC F project is in fact cancelled indefinitely and this is NOT a rumor. Why you may ask? Blame the pandemic.

Wait it truly is...Lexus you’re killing me...

 

[Gecko]

@Gecko is right but I do need to clear something up though.

The LC F project is in fact cancelled indefinitely and this is NOT a rumor. Why you may ask? Blame the pandemic.

Yes - and poor planning. The car was taking way too long and should have been here before coronavirus even showed up in the first place.

If it had been delivered for 2019 or 2020, or even 2021MY, it would have been too late to kill.

 

[Gecko]

Also, while we are on the topic: there was never a formal LS F program. Not even a trademark. Many assumed the development of such a vehicle would coincide with the LC F - it did not. So it is really only the LC F that is stillborn.

LC F was always the priority as Lexus' most impressive, range-topping flagship performance vehicle but they tried to overengineer the car into something nobody asked for (two seats, rear mounted transaxle, ultra light weight), it took way too long and the project became unviable.

I think if the LC F had a more logical life (came 12-18 months after launch, LC with TTV8, better suspension and a cool aero kit), they could have quickly applied the same formula to the LS (F) but it did not happen that way. LC F sucked all of the resources and then died.

 

[wyvern]

One thing which I haven't seen mentioned yet is that there appears to be a new larger digital instrument panel available (if you look through the gallery on the press release). Given that it also appears that the previous smaller instrument panel will still be available, I imagine the larger one is only for Lexus teammate equipped car.

It's a small change, but a nice one that jives with the 'continuous improvement' philosophy. The tech of the LS was criticised when it came out as being only adequate, so I'm glad to see Lexus making lots of small incremental improvements to the LS to keep pace with other manufacturers.

 

[spwolf]

One thing which I haven't seen mentioned yet is that there appears to be a new larger digital instrument panel available (if you look through the gallery on the press release). Given that it also appears that the previous smaller instrument panel will still be available, I imagine the larger one is only for Lexus teammate equipped car.

It's a small change, but a nice one that jives with the 'continuous improvement' philosophy. The tech of the LS was criticised when it came out as being only adequate, so I'm glad to see Lexus making lots of small incremental improvements to the LS to keep pace with other manufacturers.

yep... and overall whole LS has many small changes everywhere.

 

[spwolf]

Also, while we are on the topic: there was never an LS F program. Many assumed it would coincide with the LC F - it did not. So it is really only LC F that is stillborn.

LC F was always the priority, Lexus decided to try to engineer the car into something nobody asked for (two seats, rear mounted transaxle, ultra light weight), it took way too long and the project became unviable.

I think if LC F had a more logical life (came 12-18 months after launch, LC with TTV8, better suspension and a cool aero kit), they could have quickly applied the same formula to the LS (F) but it did not happen that way. LC F sucked all of the resources and then died.

it was actually logical for it to be introduced at facelift time. Well, V8tt anyway, be that in LC600 or LC-F.

In general, things are moving quickly, i wonder how much logic is there with V8tt anyway in 2021/2022, working on Prime versions that add 100hp to existing hybrid system sounds much more interesting and it is sellable in other countries than USA.

In >2021, "nobody" is going to be buying v8tt engines with 670hp. But I bet a lot of people would buy low taxed 450hp+ LS 600h "Prime".

 

[James]

So no LCF or LSF is the new V8 dead? I mean what the hell else would they put it in?

 

[Gecko]

it was actually logical for it to be introduced at facelift time. Well, V8tt anyway, be that in LC600 or LC-F.

In general, things are moving quickly, i wonder how much logic is there with V8tt anyway in 2021/2022, working on Prime versions that add 100hp to existing hybrid system sounds much more interesting and it is sellable in other countries than USA.

In >2021, "nobody" is going to be buying v8tt engines with 670hp. But I bet a lot of people would buy low taxed 450hp+ LS 600h "Prime".

I think you have some good points and I agree. Knowing that Toyota over-engineers their engines for reliability and durability, it's logical to assume the "~635hp F V8" would have been a tune of whatever core TT V8 they plan to deliver for the LC and LX. So... all is not lost. It's not like there will be no V8 - there just might be a ~525hp version instead of ~625hp "F" version. With it seeming like the F brand is on the way out, it makes sense to just release that new core turbo V8 for LC 600, LX 600, and maybe for next gen, LS 600.

We criticize Lexus for being 1-2 steps behind the Germans sometimes, but it seems like right as they are about to phase out V8s, Lexus is set to deliver a brand new one. To me, that is pretty sweet and it seems like their tardiness has worked to our advantage.

Losing LC F is still disappointing - don't get me wrong - but I am not too bothered because it's not like the entire V8 project is dead. However, whether there is displacement tax, MPG penalty or not, there is a subset of wealthy enthusiasts who just want what they want and Lexus simply will not be delivering any product for that niche. The rest of us still have a new turbo V8 coming sometime soon.

 

[spwolf]

I think you have some good points and I agree. Knowing that Toyota over-engineers their engines for reliability and durability, it's logical to assume the "~635hp F V8" would have been a tune of whatever core TT V8 they plan to deliver for the LC and LX. So... all is not lost. It's not like there will be no V8 - there just might be a ~525hp version instead of ~625hp "F" version. With it seeming like the F brand is on the way out, it makes sense to just release that new core turbo V8 for LC 600, LX 600, and maybe for next gen, LS 600.

We criticize Lexus for being 1-2 steps behind the Germans sometimes, but it seems like right as they are about to phase out V8s, Lexus is set to deliver a brand new one. To me, that is pretty sweet and it seems like their tardiness has worked to our advantage.

Losing LC F is still disappointing - don't get me wrong - but I am not too bothered because it's not like the entire V8 project is dead. However, whether there is displacement tax, MPG penalty or not, there is a subset of wealthy enthusiasts who just want what they want and Lexus simply will not be delivering any product for that niche. The rest of us still have a new turbo V8 coming sometime soon.

Sure, but that is USA only and maybe Russia. V8 will not sell in Europe, Japan or Asia, simply crazy these days.

I don't think F brand is on the way out though, i think they will end up doing more and more, just like they are doing with their Gazoo stuff.
However I think they should focus more on plugins in the future since their own Rav4 Prime shows how well they can be done.

 

[F1 Silver Arrows]

So no LCF or LSF is the new V8 dead? I mean what the hell else would they put it in?

Now I did say that it is cancelled indefinitely. It may come back. The LS F may happen. We may get this engine in more Lexus vehicles than you think but for now there aren't any plans.

So to answer your question, this is where Toyota creeps into the picture. Think BOF products. ;^)

 

[Gecko]

Middle East is also a very big market for V8s, and as we know, next gen LX is around the corner with "LX 600" trademark. There is plenty of interest in V8s even if none in Europe, Asia and Japan. Those are great markets for plugins and hybrids, just as you note. V8s are still big business in some markets and potentially the highest volume use case will be the LF-1, if it happens.

 

[spwolf]

Now I did say that it is cancelled indefinitely. It may come back. The LS F may happen. We may get this engine in more Lexus vehicles than you think but for now there aren't any plans.

So to answer your question, this is where Toyota creeps into the picture. Think BOF products. ;^)

V8 will be especially nice in LX and hopefully LC, LS and LF-1.

I am sure Tundra, LC300 will get it as well.

Believe it or not, main markets will be GCC countries and Russia, and it will easily outsell german V8's worldwide overall simply because markets that buy V8's in 2022 are the ones that TMC is better positioned. That is why we are getting it too.

 

[spwolf]

potentially the highest volume use case will be the LF-1, if it happens.

i would say LX600, since it will be default engine... LF-1 with v8 will be upgrade and sell in lower volume, especially in middle east.
LX sells crazy amounts.