2021+ 3rd Generation Lexus IS (300, 350, 500) Megathread

[ssun30]

I'm actually thinking a detuned 5L v8...ive read/heard that the 3.5L TTV6 is a massive engine and barely fits the LS along with its 10speed auto. At least with the v8 we know that the platform can already take it along with the 8 speed auto. But I dunno. Either way is good. So long there is a model sitting about the 350!

It is the opposite. The V35A is a very compact engine for its output. This allows the LS500 to be FMR. The whole assembly is smaller than the multistage hybrid system which itself is smaller than the 2UR+10AT. It's the 2UR that's too big for the original 3IS since 90 degree V8s are very wide. There is no DOHC V8 that's smaller than V6.

 

[bogglo]

Whatever it comes with at least now we have some concrete idea that it's a possibility now. Also lexus tweaked the original ISF to fit that V8. Also the LC500 uses an F engine but it's not a full F car. However I think it's going to use the the V6TT in the LS because I think the LS will go back to a V8 and if they keep the V6 in the LS it will become entry level LS.

We might be looking at another case of Gs460 and LS460.

 

[meth.ix]

Whatever it comes with at least now we have some concrete idea that it's a possibility now. Also lexus tweaked the original ISF to fit that V8. Also the LC500 uses an F engine but it's not a full F car. However I think it's going to use the the V6TT in the LS because I think the LS will go back to a V8 and if they keep the V6 in the LS it will become entry level LS.

We might be looking at another case of Gs460 and LS460.

Oh yeah, completely forgot about the fact that the LC 500 had a 5.0L V8. But I feel like its an exception since its a premium luxury coupe, not a mid-tier sports sedan.

 

[Sulu]

Lexus saw all that backlash from the reveal and did some last minute changes I see lol

I hope the lexus community really is that influential...

With the reveal of an IS 500 coming a short 2 weeks after the introduction of the new IS, I very highly doubt that it is due to Lexus giving in to pressure from enthusiasts. The short duration between the two announcements tells me that the IS 500 was planned all along.

If a larger, more-powerful engine was not initially planned for this new IS, it would have taken a year or more (likely more) to prepare and engineer the model for the larger engine.

 

[James]

But why wait to reveal it? Now they’ve gotten all this bad publicity about their new car instead of positive where they have this higher engine? And is the IS 500 even enough? I guess when we thought we weren’t getting anything having the 500 will be enough but if their plan was to have this why not just come out with it when you revealed the “new” IS.

 

[Sulu]

I'm actually thinking a detuned 5L v8...ive read/heard that the 3.5L TTV6 is a massive engine and barely fits the LS along with its 10speed auto. At least with the v8 we know that the platform can already take it along with the 8 speed auto. But I dunno. Either way is good. So long there is a model sitting about the 350!

I don't know the exact length, height, width dimensions of the 2UR-GSE V8 or the V35A-FTS TTV6, but basic knowledge of Toyota's V8 and V6 engines tells me that the V8 is very likely longer and wider than the V6.

A V8 engine is a bit longer than a 4-cylinder engine (2 banks of 4 cylinders, staggered, not side-by-side). A V6 engine is one cylinder shorter (2 banks of 3 cylinders, staggered, as opposed to 2 banks of 4 cylinders). The V8 engine is about 1 cylinder longer (33% longer) than the V6.

Toyota's 2UR V8 engines are engineered with a 90deg "V" between the 2 banks of cylinders. Toyota's V35A V6 engines are engineered with a 60deg "V" between the 2 banks of cylinders. The V6 engine is narrower than the V8

The complete engine and transmission combination does not all fit under the hood of the car; much of the length of the transmission is, in fact, sitting in between the driver and front passenger footwells, so even if the 10-speed transmission behind the smaller V35A-FTS V6 engine is longer than the 8-speed transmission behind the 2UR-GSE, it is not under the hood of the IS, it is sitting between the front footwells.

 

[LexusSteve]

Honestly Lexus needs to reassess their Executives/Board Members etc. I am convinced one, or maybe even more, are just plain out of touch. I'm all kinds of confused. Who is this low volume selling IS 500 aimed at exactly? The most hardcore Lexus Enthusiast? Whelp if that's the case, I am pretty sure most of the diehards here want F cars from top to bottom that aren't compromises that you have to make some sort of "yeah, but it's more reliable" excuse for it being slower. No one is asking for a higher horsepower motor in some soon to be 10 y/o model (I'm exaggerating, but still.) Sorry guys, I'm not going settle and be excited for the IS 500, it's more a slap in the face. There are $60,000 starting MSRP MIDENGINE Corvettes now, it's a totally different car market now. Ultimately, Lexus' product development time is too long, the rigorous testing for reliability has shown to have a buzzkill effect in terms of excitement and anticipation of the product. The LC came out before the 8-series and BMW made sure they had an M8 ready to go like what? A year later? Here we are still waiting for an LC F. Now we're suppose to get excited about an IS 500? Yeah, I'll pass on this snoozefest of a car.

 

[Joaquin Ruhi]

With the reveal of an IS 500 coming a short 2 weeks after the introduction of the new IS, I very highly doubt that it is due to Lexus giving in to pressure from enthusiasts. The short duration between the two announcements tells me that the IS 500 was planned all along.

But why wait to reveal it? Now they’ve gotten all this bad publicity about their new car instead of positive where they have this higher engine?

Keep in mind that what is 2 weeks apart is the unveiling of the 2021 IS 300 / 350 vehicle and the discovery of a trademark for IS 500. And I'll repeat what I've said a time or 2 on these forums: the reveal of the 2021 IS with carryover engines was probably originally scheduled for April at the now-cancelled New York Auto Show. The IS 500 trademark filing would've followed by almost 3 months, not 2 weeks as it's turned out. I don't see ineptitude on Lexus' part as much as one more plan disrupted by the Covid-19 pandemic. Keep in mind that in the Lexus IS's competitive segment, it's typical and normal for larger-engine, higher-performance variants to be revealed later and separately from the regular, bread-and-butter volume versions.

 

[yosafbridge]

The complete engine and transmission combination does not all fit under the hood of the car; much of the length of the transmission is, in fact, sitting in between the driver and front passenger footwells, so even if the 10-speed transmission behind the smaller V35A-FTS V6 engine is longer than the 8-speed transmission behind the 2UR-GSE, it is not under the hood of the IS, it is sitting between the front footwells.

I thought I read somewhere that the new 10 speed is shorter and has less rotating mass then the current 8 speed.

So with the V35A being more compact and the new 10 speed being shorter than the current 8 speed, and Lexus reserving V8s for flagships and halo supercoupes/sedans, it looks like the IS500 F-Sport will be a TTV6.

 

[thtupid]

It is the opposite. The V35A is a very compact engine for its output. This allows the LS500 to be FMR. The whole assembly is smaller than the multistage hybrid system which itself is smaller than the 2UR+10AT. It's the 2UR that's too big for the original 3IS since 90 degree V8s are very wide. There is no DOHC V8 that's smaller than V6.

I hope you are correct! Either way I really don't care...especially since I wont be able to afford one anyway. So long there is a flagship above the 350 to give the entire IS some credibility then I am happy.

 

[Will1991]

Further confirmation IS isn't getting a replacement for Europe, Lexus Norway only shows this on their lineup:

Curious to see what's going to happen the next couple of months, since I believe current CT won't live past 2020, leaving just ES/LS combo:

 

[joepac]

I don't know the exact length, height, width dimensions of the 2UR-GSE V8 or the V35A-FTS TTV6, but basic knowledge of Toyota's V8 and V6 engines tells me that the V8 is very likely longer and wider than the V6.

A V8 engine is a bit longer than a 4-cylinder engine (2 banks of 4 cylinders, staggered, not side-by-side). A V6 engine is one cylinder shorter (2 banks of 3 cylinders, staggered, as opposed to 2 banks of 4 cylinders). The V8 engine is about 1 cylinder longer (33% longer) than the V6.

Toyota's 2UR V8 engines are engineered with a 90deg "V" between the 2 banks of cylinders. Toyota's V35A V6 engines are engineered with a 60deg "V" between the 2 banks of cylinders. The V6 engine is narrower than the V8

The complete engine and transmission combination does not all fit under the hood of the car; much of the length of the transmission is, in fact, sitting in between the driver and front passenger footwells, so even if the 10-speed transmission behind the smaller V35A-FTS V6 engine is longer than the 8-speed transmission behind the 2UR-GSE, it is not under the hood of the IS, it is sitting between the front footwells.

We do engine/tranny swaps in the old school Toyota scene all the time. Mine has a more "traditional" swap in my 74 Celica but a bunch of people do all the time including the Beams 3SGE (IS200/Altezza), 2JZ and even the UZ V8s with having to modify the tranny tunnel... All this done at home or at a shop. Ryan Millen did a full ISF swap engine/trans, hell even the interior in this 1st Gen corolla! https://www.thedrive.com/news/31484...la-is-actually-a-410-hp-lexus-is-f-underneath

So I think lexus can easily figure out how to fit the tranny in the IS, if the 10spd is shorter all they would probably need is a longer prop shaft. If they can't figure it out, I know some guys they need to talk to and I bet they can figure it out 😂

 

[Levi]

IS got 3 years life extention, what happens after is unknown. What about RC? Also life extention or stops as GS? Unlikely next gen, at least now with what happened to IS.

 

[Sulu]

I thought I read somewhere that the new 10 speed is shorter and has less rotating mass then the current 8 speed.

I seem to remember reading this also.

 

[LexusSteve]

Can anyone confirm that Lexus has a Single Turbo V6 on the way? (I haven't read up on upcoming engines) Some guy says that Lexus may be re-designating their models using the following:

IS 300 = 2.0L Turbo I4
IS 350 = 2.4L Turbo I4
IS 500 = 3.2L Turbo V6 or Mazda I6

and when naming nomenclature changes, the LS500 TTV6 will be known as the LS600.

Source: Twitter, but tweet has since been deleted. But has anyone heard of this or can confirm?

 

[Sulu]

Can anyone confirm that Lexus has a Single Turbo V6 on the way? (I haven't read up on upcoming engines) Some guy says that Lexus may be re-designating their models using the following:

IS 300 = 2.0L Turbo I4
IS 350 = 2.4L Turbo I4
IS 500 = 3.2L Turbo V6 or Mazda I6

and when naming nomenclature changes, the LS500 TTV6 will be known as the LS600.

Source: Twitter, but tweet has since been deleted. But has anyone heard of this or can confirm?

Why do that? TTV6 places a smaller turbocharger on each bank of cylinders; single-turbo V6 would be a larger turbocharger that would take longer to spool up, meaning more turbo lag.

 

[super51fan]

Why do that? TTV6 places a smaller turbocharger on each bank of cylinders; single-turbo V6 would be a larger turbocharger that would take longer to spool up, meaning more turbo lag.

Hot-V potentially?

 

[F1 Silver Arrows]

Why do that? TTV6 places a smaller turbocharger on each bank of cylinders; single-turbo V6 would be a larger turbocharger that would take longer to spool up, meaning more turbo lag.

BMW's B58 almost has zero lag though. Granted they have this sort of mini-antilag system (don't worry it's not like the 2-step system that you see crazy tuners do to their A80 Supra and destroy their turbochargers in 2 seconds) to help the car off launch and be responsive in higher RPM and when you kick down a gear or a few. But other than that system it's still ridiculously quick to respond on its own and the ZF 8-speed helps it even more.

For Lexus, this is their very first attempt at making a serious turbocharged (V6) engine, and while it's not a bad first attempt, it's far from good. The 10-speed NEEDS to be quick and be geared for performance so it can keep the car happy in the upper rev range or else it will feel sluggish.

Hot-V potentially?

I'm a little surprised as to why Lexus never thought of doing that for the V35A-FTS in the first place.

 

[super51fan]

BMW's B58 almost has zero lag though. Granted they have this sort of mini-antilag system (don't worry it's not like the 2-step system that you see crazy tuners do to their A80 Supra and destroy their turbochargers in 2 seconds) to help the car off launch and be responsive in higher RPM and when you kick down a gear or a few. But other than that system it's still ridiculously quick to respond on its own and the ZF 8-speed helps it even more.

For Lexus, this is their very first attempt at making a serious turbocharged (V6) engine, and while it's not a bad first attempt, it's far from good. The 10-speed NEEDS to be quick and be geared for performance so it can keep the car happy in the upper rev range or else it will feel sluggish.


I'm a little surprised as to why Lexus never thought of doing that for the V35A-FTS in the first place.

The V35a has very little lag as well with both hitting peak torque at 1600 rpms. B58 cars launch so well because of launch control.

I think the LC's TT V8 is rumored to be a hot-v.

 

[ssun30]

Hot-V potentially?

I'm a little surprised as to why Lexus never thought of doing that for the V35A-FTS in the first place.

They cannot do Hot-V on a 60 degree V6 and they will not do a 90 degree V6. The extra width will limit steering angle when it's in a FMR layout. The core design goal of V35A-FTS is to be as compact as possible (required for a very long stroke). A 90 degree angle will make the engine too wide.
Manufacturers make design decisions based on compromises. They would only make 90 degree V6 if it was derived from a 90 degree V8. In every other way possible 60 degree is the correct choice.

BMW's B58 almost has zero lag though. Granted they have this sort of mini-antilag system (don't worry it's not like the 2-step system that you see crazy tuners do to their A80 Supra and destroy their turbochargers in 2 seconds) to help the car off launch and be responsive in higher RPM and when you kick down a gear or a few. But other than that system it's still ridiculously quick to respond on its own and the ZF 8-speed helps it even more.

Well with Inline-6 they could use a single integrated exhaust manifold and twin-scroll turbocharger to solve those problems. On a V6 it's impossible to do with a single-turbo setup because one side always has to wrap around the block with very long piping, increasing heat loss and lag. The only feasible setup for a turbocharged 60 degree V6 in modern days is twin.

All things considered all car makers should be making Inline-6s but it's surprising how just one criteria (length) is a such deal breaker that most of them just ignore it. IMO a company as obsessed with cost as Toyota should have considered the clear superiority of I6. It's not like they will ever use this engine in cars where engine length could be a problem: that's unless they seriously considered putting this thing in a transverse platform like the RX or ES (that was the justification by Ford when they made the EcoBoost 3.5).