MM Annual Holiday Full-Review: 2016 Lexus RX

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MM Annual Holiday Full-Review: 2016 Lexus RX
Merry Christmas/Happy Holidays....a Full-Review, by request, of the all-new 2016 Lexus RX

http://www.lexus.com/models/RX

http://www.lexus.com/models/RX-hybrid

IN A NUTSHELL: The world's most ubiquitous luxury crossover SUV gets a major styling transformation.

CLOSEST AMERICAN-MARKET COMPETITORS: Acura MDX, Infiniti QX60, BMW X5, Audi Q5, Cadillac SRX/XT5, Lincoln MKX, Volvo XC90, Mercedes GLE (?), Land Rover LR-4


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(RX450 Hybrid)


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(RX350)


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(F-Sport interior)


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OVERVIEW:

For this year's Annual Holiday Review, I couldn't think of a better candidate than the new Lexus RX, and, of course, had multiple requests for it. This major redesign has generated great interest and debate for months (and, of course, many others, particularly in the auto press, have already written their own reviews of it). Numerous comments have arisen, not only on its looks and body-styling, but on the question of whether it would include (for the first time) a 3rd-row seat. For now, the answer to that question is no, but Lexus officials are either mum or evasive on what we might see in the future, as potential customer interest in a 3-row car-based SUV from Lexus remains quite high. Currently, Lexus offers the 3rd-row seating only in the truck-based GX and LX models, both of which are truck-based inn design and more expensive than the RX.

Although Jeep had introduced the upmarket Wagoneer somewhat earlier in 1963, the British Range Rover, first introduced in 1970, was probably the first real attempt by the auto industry to produce what could be called a "Luxury" SUV.....combining all-weather security, off-road-prowness, ease of operation, and interior plushness/comfort for its occupants. In this, it succeeded, although its price tag put it out of the range of many prospective buyers, American-market dealership outlets for it were relatively sparse at the time, and, like many other British-designed vehicles of the era, it and its Lucas electrical systems became notorious for being about as reliable as a submarine with screen doors. (Ironically, according to Consumer Reports, the Range Rover, 45 years later, still ranks low in reliability, and its price tag still puts it up in country-club territory).

Roughly twenty-five years later, in the mid-late 1990s, the Subaru Outback/Forester, Toyota RAV-4, and Honda CR-V pioneered the (now) tremendously popular concept of a crossover, car-based, unibody SUV (or, better know as "CUV"....for Cute Utility Vehicle). These were reliable, relatively inexpensive and affordable (I owned an Outback myself for six years), versatile and useful in many different conditions (which earned them a place not only in suburbia but other locals as well), relatively easy to drive/steer/handle, and rode reasonably comfortably.....Subarus especially so. These vehicles, predictably and not surprisingly, were more of a hit than free beer at Clancy's bar....just like minivans had been 10-15 years before, in the mid-late 1980s. But CUVs and the first wave of crossover SUVs could hardly be considered true luxury vehicles where comfort and interior trim was paramount.

Enter the first Lexus RX in 1998. The RX was arguably the first true car-based, crossover, unibody SUV that could be truly considered a luxury vehicle, designed with not only the usual all-weather security and mild off-road capability, but also with passenger-comfort and plush trim in mind. Being a Lexus product, it was, of course, reliable, as with most vehicles of that nameplate. Its generous wood trim, plush soft seating leather, many comfort/convenience features, and copious amounts of sound-insulation made it essentially a bad-weather Jaguar (minus Jaguar's British unreliability). Best of all, its price tag, while not inexpensive by any means, did not require one to re-finance their house to buy or lease one. Not surprisingly, RX sales immediately took off....and, again not surprisingly, many competitors appeared over the years. However, to this day, the RX remains wildly popular in the American market (especially in suburban areas), and, despite competition (sometimes serious competition) from many European, American, Japanese, and Korean vehicles of this type, it still is at or near the top of sales in its class every year. Some doubt is taking place, among not only auto reviewers, but in the blogosphere as well, if RX sales can or will keep up as a result of this major restyling. As I see it, this vehicle is so popular, and has been for so many years, that I would not bet one thin dime against it continuing to appeal to the masses....though some potential buyers might still be disappointed at the lack of a 3rd-row seat option.

For 2016, the all-new 4th-Generation RX comes in four basic trim-lines......RX350, RX350 F-Sport, RX450h (Hybrid), and RX450h F-Sport. RX350 F-Sport models come standard AWD; the Hybrid 450h F-Sport with FWD.......the others all have a choice of FWD or AWD. RX350 and F-Sport models come with a 3.5L V6 of 295 HP and 268 ft.-lbs. of torque and an 8-speed close-ratio Sport-Shift automatic transmission (sorry, folks, the F-Sport package is mostly trim and underpinnings, not more engine power). RX450h Hybrid models come with the same V6 engine and traction-electric motor with a total system 308 HP and a CVT (Continuously-Variable-Transmission).....Lexus does not list individual power/torque/RPM ratings on its web site for the hybrid components. Again, there is no difference in power for the Hybrid F-Sport version over the standard Hybrid....it is chiefly trim and underpinnings. Starting prices range from $41,900 on base FWD models to $55,645 for the RX450h Hybrid F-Sport.

For the review, I looked at, and sat in, several different new RX interiors, including a nice black-on-black F-Sport model which listed for some 56K...no cheapie (and one blue standard, non-F AWD model there listed for over 59K). In one sense, it was a good day to try out several interiors and their different seats, as my lower back is still a little sore from what I think is a muscle-pull in it a few nights ago (should heal up in a few more days). The new RX's relative ease-of-entry/exit height also helped....more on that later.

Whether it was just the novelty of an all-new or major-redesigned vehicle (which often draws crowds), the fact that it was the Veterans' Day Holiday sale (thanks to all of you who have served and sacrificed), or whether this is just an indication of what is to come in the RX market, customer and test-drive traffic for the new version, at the Lexus shop I was at today, was like a zoo. (Jill, you might have a point on that mega-home-run comment, at least for now LOL). Some of the reps and staff there already knew me (or still remembered me) from when I had bought my yellow IS300 there some years ago. There were maybe six or seven new RX models in stock there (including a black-on-black F-Sport at 56K). After checking out the F-Sport interior, I was going to consider doing a test-drive, as F-Sport models seem to generate a lot of interest in this forum. No Dice....wasn't to be. Just like that, that quickly, a sales-rep came out with a prospective customer, took off with that customer for a test-drive......and, Bingo, it was sold. (like other Lexus dealers, this one has the option of a huge gift-bow around it this time of year if it is a Holiday present for someone else). Other, generally less-expensive models on the lot (though one listed for more than 59K) were also being looked at, and test-driven, by prospective customers. I actually had to wait for the one I eventually test-drove (a gray AWD lightly-optioned model listing at some 46K) while a very nice young Asian saleslady * went out in it with a couple. When they brought it back, it was still for sale and had not been sold, so I was able to take it out myself. I told her I'd probably have it out somewhat longer, for an adequate road review, than she and the couple did, and she didn't mind....just don't put too many miles on it. So, off I went. Sure enough....when I got back, someone else was waiting for it....so I just handed them the key-fob and left the test-drive plate on. Ah, such is the lure, sometimes, of an all-new model.

And....for the results? Read on.


*On the subject of salesladies, I'd like to take this review to remember the late AsianGirl007, a member of this forum for years, who once sold new and used Lexus vehicles at Longo Lexus of El Monte, CA, one of the largest, most advanced, and most sophisticated Lexus dealerships in the country....a well-respected operation. All of their new-vehicle inventory, for example, is kept indoors, out of the weather and other deteriorating effects. She contributed a lot to this forum, especially to those prospective with new-vehicle-buying or financing questions. Unfortunately a premature illness took her from us several years ago...she, of course, is sorely missed, but undoubtedly is still with us in spirit. RIP, Asian Girl.

(for those of you here in the LexusEnthusiast forum, Liz, a.k.a. AsianGirl007, was a lady I knew in another forum. She passed away before this forum was created......MM)

MODEL REVIEWED: 2016 Lexus RX350 AWD

BASE PRICE: $43,300


OPTIONS:

Touch-Free Rear Hatch Opener: $200

Heated Front Seats: $440 (IMO, this should be standard in a vehicle of this class, and heated/cooled front seats are an additional charge)

All-Weather Floor/Cargo Mats: $190


DESTINATION/FREIGHT: $940 (a little steep for a vehicle this size, but not unreasonable)

LIST PRICE AS REVIEWED: $45,070


DRIVETRAIN: AWD, Transversely-mounted 3.5L V6, 295 HP @ **** RPM (Lexus doesn't provide the peak HP RPM on its site), Torque, 268 Ft-lbs. @ 4700 RPM, 8-speed close-ratio Sport-Shift automatic transmission.


EPA MILEAGE RATING: 19 City, 26 Highway, 22 Combined


EXTERIOR COLOR: Nebula Gray Pearl

INTERIOR: (Two-Tone) Stratus Gray/Gray Sapelle Leather.




PLUSSES:

Lexus reliability.

Smooth, refined V6 and 8-speed automatic.

Effective drive-mode calibrations.

Good ride comfort on base wheels/tires. (didn't sample the others)

Good wind noise isolation.

Quite good handling/steering response by SUV standards.

Lower-body cladding protects paint from road debris.

Good exterior hardware and fit/finish.

Typical superb Lexus paint job.

Solid, hefty doors.

Relative ease of entry/exit.

Easy-to-read gauges.

Generally easy to use buttons/controls (on non-NAV versions)

Solid, high-quality interior hardware.

High-quality interior trim materials and fit/finish.

Choice of several interior trim patterns/colors.

Standard First-Aid Kit.

Relatively roomy, well-finished, and space-efficient cargo area.



MINUSES:

Lack of a 3rd-row seat (for those many prospective buyers who wanted one).

Crowded underhood layout.

Some audible road noise on base-level tires, but not bad.

Wide center console impacts driver/front-passenger knee-room.

F-Sport front seat-back cushions a little narrow for some wide torsos.

No body-side moldings for parking lot protection.

Somewhat tacky-looking (IMO) center-dash video/NAV panel.

Limited rear visibility out the back.



EXTERIOR:

Those who have not (yet) physically seen the new 2016 RX, and are accustomed only to what was done in the styling department for the last three RX generations, will be in for quite a surprise this year.....although, in several ways, it is just a more-or-less big-brother version of the NX's all-new styling last year. Up front, we'll start with the most obvious (and immediately noticeable) change from the 2015 RX....the big spindle-grille that, along with some very sharply-creased hollows/recessions, completely dominates the front end. The color and trim-pattern of the spindle grille differs among the several trim-versions, but all of them pretty much make a bold statement. Styling, of course, is subjective, and no two opinions may be exactly alike on the same vehicle. I myself was not a fan of the new RX's radically different front-end when I first saw it in pictures. But, on the lot, actually looking at it in person, I found it more amicable and less offensive than what I first saw in the pictures and Internet images. Still not my favorite styling by any means, and it wouldn't be my first choice, but I could live with it if I had to.

Another noticeable (and significant) change, in back, is the "Floating Roof" effect on the D-pillars. This is actually a smoked/blacked-out glass and sheet metal effect on the outside, a small clear-glass outward-visibility window on the inside, together with a dip in the rear roofline, creating an effect where the rear sheet metal on the roof "floats" a couple of inches, with a dark gap, above the bottom of the D-pillars. The overall shape of this rear end is more or less similar to the latest Nissan Murano, though the Murano lacks the float roofline effect. Again, I'm not a terribly big fan of this effect (and it doesn't do a whole lot for visibility out the back), but it is interesting, and I know that subjective opinions will differ. The vehicle's height-stance off the ground, especially with the power-seat-controls set for a person of my size (in other words, with the bottom cushion down low), made for very easy entry/exit for a person my size....with my rump right at seat level. Nice, of course, because that also made it easier on my still-somewhat-sore lower back.

The body sheet metal, at first, to me, felt a little thin...but, comparing it to last year's 2015 RX parked right next to it, I couldn't feel any appreciable difference in how easy the metal buckles. Up above are very nice chromed roof-rack rails that are solidly attached and with excellent fit/finish. The side-mirror housings have nice turn-signal indicators in them. The doors themselves, despite thinnish sheet metal on the surface, have a very hefty, solid feel to them....perhaps too heavy for some frail people or arthritic arms/hands/shoulders. Outside, the "thunk" upon closing, while reasonable, is not that substantial, but inside, they shut with a definite thunk....and their heavy construction gives you a secure feeling that you will generally be well-protected in a side-impact. Down below, running around the entire lower-end of the vehicle, including both ends, is a nice strip of black body-cladding that protects the paint from road debris.....though the bean-counters, as usual nowadays, omitted the side door-mouldings to protect from parking-lot dings.

And, if at all possible, mouldings or not, you certainly don't want to ding up this paint job, as it is done with the (usual) Lexus excellence in application and a surface that is almost mirror-smooth. Some day, just out of curiosity, I wouldn't mind seeing how the metal-finishing stages and paint-robots in the Lexus plants operate. Some of the exterior colors, IMO, are on the dull side, but the Matador Red is stunning, and I also liked the White Pearl, the Brownish Autumn Shimmer, and the dark-blue starlight-effect of the Nightfall Mica....that mica-effet is very nice.

So, again, for those who have not seen the exterior of new RX, and remember only previous models......you're probably in for a surprise.



UNDERHOOD:

The hood felt light, but somewhat stronger and stiffer than some of the other body panels (perhaps from aircraft-grade aluminum like on the new Ford F-150?....couldn't quite tell). Open it, and a pair of nice gas struts holds it up for you. On the underside of the hood is a nice insulation pad. Despite the fairly large engine compartment, the sideways (transversely) mounted 3.5L V6 engine fits in on the tight side, with little room to reach components down the sides of the engine. The big plastic engine cover (a hallmark of most Lexus products and many others in the upmarket-vehicle class) blocks virtually all of the engine's top-access. Other underhood components are pretty close to the engine, with much access-room. The battery, on the right, is at least partly exposed, and the dipsticks/filler-caps/fluid-reservois are easily reached. But, in general, Technicians and Do-it-Yourselfers probably won't enjoy working on this vehicle.




INTERIOR:

Many positive comments have been written, in other reviews, about the quality and execution of the new RX's interior, and IMO, based on my own review, most of them are deserved. The overall visual-theme and basic design of the new interior more or less mimics that of other new or recent Lexus products. With the new RX, it is obvious, from the moment one slips into the comfortable leather seats and shuts the thunk-solid doors, that Lexus spent the time, money, and resources to address a common complaint in some other recent vehicles that they have introduced....lighter-grade interior materials with a cheaper feel. Almost nowhere in the RX's new interior did I get that impression at all. Virtually everything, with the possible exception of the F-Sport's plastic paddle-shifters, felt substantial, solidly-attached, of high quality, and designed to last the life of the vehicle. I only have two minor complaints. First, that the edges of the wide center-console somewhat restrict the driver and front-passenger's knee-room, so that your leg or knee is sometimes resting uncomfortably on the edge. Second, the tacky-looking rectangular video screen that sticks up out of the center-dash look like a hastily-installed afterthought. (some versions also had an awkward-feeling mouse-controller on the console). But everything else inside feels like it was hand-crafted in Santa's Elf factory....fitting, of course, for this Holiday Season review LOL. Overhead, the felt-fabric-lined sunroof housing is designed in a way that allows scalloped-out sections in it for added front/rear headroom. The same nice felt-fabric coats both sun-visors, which gives them a silky feel. The F-Sport interior, with its mild-sport-orientation, has metallic-drilled pedals for the gas and brake, different trim patters/colors from the others, and front seats designed for more lateral support. The lower-cushions of the power-seats were quite comfortable for me in all versions (including the F-Sport), but, for for a person with my tall and wide torso, the upper seat-bolsters on the F-Sport models were just slightly (borderline)too narrow...but not enough for me to list as a complaint. The wider upper-seat cushions in the other versions, of course, were no problem for my torso at all. Most persons, of course, being physically smaller than me, probably won't have any issues with any of the seats....and these seats felt comfortable enough to take a long trip in without any problem. The grade of leather used on them, in all versions, also felt quite nice. Base-trim models use the NuLuxe seat covering, which I have always liked since I first saw it in the CT200h. IMO, it is one of the best imitation-leather coverings in the industry (and I'm sure a lot of cows agree LOL).

The buttons/controls are all generally clearly marked and easy to use, though, of course, the NAV versions have more complex controls and menus to navigate through than the base ones. The analog-style electronic gauges are blank when the ignition is switched off, but then come to life with the engine, and are clear and easy to read. The trim pieces are slick and as solidly-attached as a rock. The steering wheel has a nice thick leather-covered rim that is comfortable to hold, and is well-designed for the relatively large number of controls/buttons on it. The glove-box door and latch, push-button-activated, are solid enough to avoid the thin/flimsy feel of those on some other recent Toyota/Lexus products. The stereo sound quality, while not in the Mark Levinson class like on the Lexus LS, is good enough to be music to one's ears (Pun intended, LOL). In the center of the dash is a chrome jewel of an analog clock.....much like what we saw from Infiniti years ago. Best of all, the new interiors are available, depending on the model/exterior color/series, in a number of monotone, two-tone, and different wood-trim or other trim-pattern designs.

In general, well-done inside, Lexus.



CARGO COMPARTMENT/TRUNK:

My test-vehicle lacked a lot of options, but did include the ($200) Touch-Free Rear-Hatch opener.......a first on production Lexus vehicles, which works by placing your hand near a sensor buried in the Lexus symbol on the hatch. It's a nice feature, I'll admit, but, IMO, the hatch-opening system that Ford and Mercedes uses by sweeping one foot under the rear-bumper is actually more convenient if both of your hands are full of bags or packages. Once the power-operated hatch is up, it reveals a relatively roomy cargo area, though probably not quite as roomy as if the rear end had been squared-off a little more. Once again, as with the interior, there just isn't enough room in the cargo area to fit in a third-row seat that would hold anything more than small children or items. To do that, the engineers would have to lengthen the structure some, though there is some talk of maybe doing that in the future.

The cargo area itself, as befits a Lexus product, is very well-finished and has some nice materials in it. A nice grade of carpet adorns the floor, and a VERY solid pull-shade cargo cover (as compared to the weak roll-spring and paper-thin cover in the Toyota Prius) hides the cargo and packages from prying eyes. My test-vehicle also had the optional ($190) all-weather interior rubber floor-mats and Subaru-style molded-vinyl cargo-floor tray to protect the carpet from weather and spills. In each corner of the cargo floor was a nice pull-up cargo tie-down loop (four in all) which looked and felt like real chromed metal...not cheap plastic. On the right wall was the standard First-Aid Kit, a Lexus tradition, and often found in this upmarket class of vehicle. Under the cargo floor is (you guessed it)......a temporary spare tire instead of a real spare. I used to list temporaries and donuts as a complaint, but it's like talking to a wall, as the auto companies seem determined to keep real spare tires out of almost everything but off-road vehicles....and then sometimes as an option, not standard. The Chevy SS is the last sedan I saw with a real spare-tire option, but it is a low-volume, Australian (Holden)-built sedan that is going out of production soon. And even a temporary spare is better than what some vehicles now give you...a Fix-a-Flat compressed-air bottle, which is about as useful as a submarine with screen doors.




ON THE ROAD:

Start up the ubiquitous Toyota/Lexus 3.5L V6 with a key-fob and engine START/STOP button, and the engine comes to life in the same manner that it has always done....smooth, quiet, and refined. It's not quite as silky as the butter-smooth Lexus V8s, but certainly beats not only most four-cylinders, but even some other V6s as well. Lexus has been criticized, in the auto press, and among some reviewers, for using so-called "outdated" V6 powerplants needing updated designs.....but in general, I disagree. I don't see any need for the engineers to spend time, money and resources redoing this engine, except maybe to get a few more MPGs out of it for the upcoming Government CAFE fuel-mileage rules. Because of those CAFE rules, a number of former V6 engines are being replaced by four-cylinder turbos, even in mid-sized vehicles. (Oh, and, yes, they could maybe fit it in underhood a little better LOL).

Anyhow, unlike the smaller 2.5L V6 used in the Lexus IS250, this 3.5L, in the RX state of tune, doesn't lack for power at all, and has an adequate and reasonable amount of grunt for most normal driving. (And, of course, people don't buy the IS250 for power, but for small-V6 refinement, which it delivers). The 3.5L's noise level is generally low, even under significant acceleration, though you will hear some exhaust and wind-up noise as it approaches 4000 RPM (as usual, I didn't take it much over 4000, as brand-new engine should not be until after break-in). The big drive-mode knob on the center console (ECO / NORMAL / SPORT) was generally effective, with noticeable differences in throttle-response and transmission-shift characteristics in the three positions. In some vehicles, the effect is so unnoticeable that the knob might as well not be there at all.

The 8-speed Sport-Shift automatic transmission almost seemed like overkill, with probably no need for the upper pair of gears at most legal American highway speeds, though triple-digit speeds on the German Autobahns might be a different matter. The shift lever, on the console, has the zig-zag fore-aft motion that I usually dislike (I generally like a straight back-and-forth motion). But, in this case, the lever is so silky-smooth and easy to move in its operation that I did not find the zig-zag motion very objectionable. Even in the SPORT and/or manual modes, the transmission was always smooth-shifting and refined....typical of most Lexus products. F-Sport models have plastic shift-paddles on the steering column (they feel better than they look, with a cheap finish on them). With base versions like the one I drove, you simply bump the lever up or down a notch in the manual-shift gate.

The new chassis was also surprisingly well-designed, with good road manners in most areas. Ride comfort over bumps, with the tall-profile 65-series 18" all-season tires, was quite good by SUV standards....better, IMO, than the last-generation base-model RX. (larger tire/wheel packages and/or the F-Sport option could be expected to be a little stiffer). Steering response was surprisingly good (again, by SUV standards), considering the non-sporting tires/wheels....though with the electric power-steering pump, there wasn't a whole lot of road-feel in the steering itself. Body roll was reasonably well-controlled, though vehicles of this stance off the ground can be expected to have at least some roll. Again, the F-Sport suspension could be expected to stiffen things up a little, but I found the standard underpinnings and tires just fine. Wind noise was very well-controlled, though a fairly small but noticeable amount of road noise from the all-season tires did penetrate the cabin....it was somewhat more audible at low speeds than at higher ones. The new RX is a little unusual in the brake department...base versions have larger 13.3 inch solid-disc rotors in back, as opposed to smaller 12.9 inch ventilated discs/rotors up front. usually larger brakes are used in the front of vehicles with the engines up front, because of forward-weight transfer on heavy braking. Surprisingly, at least from what I could find in the specs, the F-Sport models have the same brakes as the other models. The brakes, though, are generally effective, and I didn't find any problems with them...including my big circus-clown size-15 shoes having any hang-up problems on the edge of the brake pedal when lifting off the gas, like what happens in some vehicles.



THE VERDICT:

There's little question that Lexus has come up with a controversially-styled but nice-driving replacement for past RX models, though the long-term question of whether there will ever be a 3rd-row seat, to satisfy increasing public demand, still seems to be unanswered with the new design. Lexus still points 3rd-row customers to the truck-based, body-on-frame GX and LX SUVs....but an increasing number want a 3rd-row crossover SUV, like with the competing Infiniti QX60. Still, 3rd-row seat or not, a lot of new RX models can be expected to go out the door......indeed, based on what I saw this morning, a lot of salespeople and dealerships will make a lot of money selling them (so should Lexus itself, of course).

Perhaps it's to be expected, since the RX is a higher-grade vehicle than the NX, with generally higher prices, but I want to note that Lexus, IMO, seemed to put significantly more effort into the design and materials, and especially into road manners and drivetrain, than on the NX with its more-basic materials and higher levels of wind noise. That's not to say that the NX is a bad vehicle by any means, but driving it is a noticeably less-refined experience than in the new RX. After reviewing both of them, if it were my money, I'd pay a little more and get the RX....especially a lower-line model like this one that ran in the mid-40s on the price. But, that doesn't mean that NX buyers should feel short-changed.....the NX is less expensive, more maneuverable, has a shorter turning radius, gets better gas mileage, and is easier to park than the larger RX.

The new RX also competes well against the newly-released Lincoln MKX, though I generally prefer the MKX's styling inside and out. Both use nice materials inside (the hardware on the new RX feels a little more solid), but the MKX has the quirky push-button transmission controls that are becoming standard on all new Lincolns. The MKX does not offer a mildly sport-oriented version like the new RX F-Sport does. Neither does the MKX offer a hybrid like the RX, though the MKX does offer a much more powerful turbo 2.7L V6, which significantly out-powers all versions of the RX.

Besides the MKX, the new RX also seems to compete well against other mid-sized luxury crossover SUVs....though, as mentioned earlier, it lacks the Infiniti QX60's 3rd-row seat. But the QX60 is stuck with a CVT transmission that, while flexible and economical, has questionable durability compared to the RX's conventional automatics. I've tested most of the RX's other competitors (the LR-4 is an exception), but not always the latest versions of some of them.....and, of course, we're still waiting for Cadillac's new XT5 entry in this field, due next year. I plan to review that, and see how that one compares.

In the meantime, the RX has been satisfying a lot of customers for the better part of 20 years, and, like the Toyota Camry and Honda Accord, will probably still be satisfying more customers 20 years from now. But, if you want a new RX, unless you need a new vehicle immediately I'd recommend waiting a little while until the initial new-model hype wears off a little, and then go see if you can find one (or order one, if possible) to your liking. That way, you can go to a Lexus shop and not have to deal with a zoo or bazaar-type atmosphere....and you might also get more off of list price.

And, with this review, to everyone in the forum and my review mailing-list........Merry Christmas/Happy Holidays.

And, as always......Happy car-shopping. :)

MM
 

Trexus

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Thanks Mike for the review of the 2016 RX. I'm sure this new RX will do very well. I look forward to seeing them on the streets of southern California...
 

mmcartalk

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Thanks Mike for the review of the 2016 RX. I'm sure this new RX will do very well. I look forward to seeing them on the streets of southern California...

Glad you enjoyed it. :) Yeah...a lot of interest in this new model. The RX and ES, of course, have been the bread-and-butter vehicles for Lexus over the years....a significant part of the company's profits come from it. I'm not a terribly big fan of this new styling (though it looks somewhat better in person than in pictures), but they certainly did a nice job on the interior materials, platform / chassis / drivetrain engineering, and noise insulation, except for a small amount of road noise.
 
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IS-SV

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Thanks Mike for the review of the 2016 RX. I'm sure this new RX will do very well. I look forward to seeing them on the streets of southern California...

Yes, I expect this new RX to be a strong seller and expect to see many on streets in northern CA/Bay Area. The interior is outstanding, I look forward to driving one soon.
 

mmcartalk

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Yes, I expect this new RX to be a strong seller and expect to see many on streets in northern CA/Bay Area. The interior is outstanding, I look forward to driving one soon.


You don't have to write up something as long as I did. but when you do sample one, give us your impressions. It's selling quite briskly right now, though, so you may have to search a little or wait for an unsold one. I was going to test-drive a classic black-on-black F-Sport model, but they sold it (at 56K) while I was still taking notes on the interior LOL.
 

CIF

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Thanks for the review.

I have two questions though:

1.) Who's Jill?

2.) Was this review done for another forum? It sort of reads like it, to be honest.
 

mmcartalk

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Thanks for the review.

I have two questions though:

1.) Who's Jill?

2.) Was this review done for another forum? It sort of reads like it, to be honest.


Yes...I'm a member of more than one forum. The review, though, was done for all of them....not really one over another. Jill is a member of another forum.
 

CIF

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Yes...I'm a member of more than one forum. The review, though, was done for all of them....not really one over another. Jill is a member of another forum.

Well that explains it, since it somewhat reads like a "template" review made for more than one forum, rather than specifically written for TLE.
 

mmcartalk

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Well that explains it, since it somewhat reads like a "template" review made for more than one forum, rather than specifically written for TLE.


That's basically the standard format/layout I do for all of my full-reviews. Condensed-reviews, partial-reviews, and static-reviews can vary according to the need, request, and circumstances.

While no review is perfect (and mine sure are no exception), I've gotten enough favorable comments on this format, from enough readers, over the years, to stick with it at least for now.
 

abraxas

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But, if you want a new RX, unless you need a new vehicle immediately I'd recommend waiting a little while until the initial new-model hype wears off a little, and then go see if you can find one (or order one, if possible) to your liking. That way, you can go to a Lexus shop and not have to deal with a zoo or bazaar-type atmosphere....and you might also get more off of list price.

Thanks!

As a 66 year old "seasoned" car buyer that is still learning, I'd love to order one and cut out what I don't want (the packs) and hopefully still be able to negotiate beginning with working from the invoice up and/or vice versa, working from the MSRP down. Is that possible by going thru a fleet manager or does it depend on the dealership?

IOW, say I put together something that has a MSRP price of $50,000. Would it still be possible to knock off 8% or so to get where I want to go?
 

abraxas

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Here's a good review and something I pondered too after a quick cursory sit in and look at the showroom, no test drive. Did they really remove the console's storage space? We noticed that but didn't pay it much attention at the time. If so, that's really a step in the wrong direction as is removing the left cup holder. 2 steps back, one step forward?

2016 Lexus RX 350 - Consumer Review
I own a 2012 RX350 and have anxiously waited for the newly designed 2016 to arrive. After spending time at the dealer comparing the 2016 to the 2012 we own, my wife and I will not be purchasing a 2016. We were already aware of the ugly front grill, but hoped other improvements would be worth ignoring the grill. But about the only thing we found improved was the navigation system. Here are the things we do not like about the 2016, compared to the 2012. 1. My 5'6" wife complains the step up to enter the car is higher in the 2016, an uncomfortable 1.5" to 2" higher. 2. The handy cup holder to the left of the steering wheel is gone. 3. The storage area under the console, between the driver and passenger is no longer open. Replaced with a very small pocket. 4. The seats are now two-toned. So grey seats are no longer all grey. They are part grey and part black.

 

mmcartalk

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Glad you enjoyed it. :)

As a 66 year old "seasoned" car buyer that is still learning,

Like you, I'm no spring chicken myself....been doing this for decades. But, as you yourself know (and congratulations on 66 successful years).........with age usually comes wisdom. ;)

I'd love to order one and cut out what I don't want (the packs) and hopefully still be able to negotiate beginning with working from the invoice up and/or vice versa, working from the MSRP down. Is that possible by going thru a fleet manager or does it depend on the dealership?

IOW, say I put together something that has a MSRP price of $50,000. Would it still be possible to knock off 8% or so to get where I want to go?

To a large extent, it depends on the dealership, but there are also a number of other factors involved. Sometimes it is possible to special-order vehicles from specific plants, but, in the U.S. that's usually easier (but not always) when the plants are located here. Dealerships, though, are usually more interested in moving what stock they currently have in the showroom and on the lot (and the new RX, needless to say, is selling quite briskly) than in placing a special-order and in waiting weeks or months for it to arrive. So, even if you can (and do) special-order, any dealer or factory incentives could be lost in some cases. The dealership might not be willing to discount it, either (or discount it as much) as with something bought off the lot. They sometimes ask for a fairly high deposit, too, on a special-order.

Sometimes, a specific vehicle, color/trim/equipment wise (or something reasonably close to it) can be found at other surrounding Lexus dealerships in the area or dealer-zone. The other dealership, on contacting with your own, might be willing to send it on down to the dealership you are actually buying the vehicle at (though it might affect the price slightly, and, of course, risks some ding/pebble-damage on the road driving down). But, that way, you don't have to pay a deposit and wait. Lexus dealerships (by company policy) never used to display their new-car inventory on their public web-sites, but now they do....and have live-chat requests. I also use a handy web site called everycarlisted.com to help find and locate vehicles for people...you can try it yourself here.

http://www.everycarlisted.com,

Last, we also have a Lexus representative thread right here on this forum for customer-service questions:

https://lexusenthusiast.com/forums/forums/lexus-usa-customer-service/

They can probably answer some of your questions in more and better detail than I could, as this question of special-ordering has sometimes come up before.

Good Luck. :)
 

mmcartalk

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Here's a good review and something I pondered too after a quick cursory sit in and look at the showroom, no test drive. Did they really remove the console's storage space? We noticed that but didn't pay it much attention at the time. If so, that's really a step in the wrong direction as is removing the left cup holder. 2 steps back, one step forward?

2016 Lexus RX 350 - Consumer Review
I own a 2012 RX350 and have anxiously waited for the newly designed 2016 to arrive. After spending time at the dealer comparing the 2016 to the 2012 we own, my wife and I will not be purchasing a 2016. We were already aware of the ugly front grill, but hoped other improvements would be worth ignoring the grill. But about the only thing we found improved was the navigation system. Here are the things we do not like about the 2016, compared to the 2012. 1. My 5'6" wife complains the step up to enter the car is higher in the 2016, an uncomfortable 1.5" to 2" higher. 2. The handy cup holder to the left of the steering wheel is gone. 3. The storage area under the console, between the driver and passenger is no longer open. Replaced with a very small pocket. 4. The seats are now two-toned. So grey seats are no longer all grey. They are part grey and part black.


You (and your wife, if applicable) would have to actually sit in the vehicle (which you apparently have done) and determine if the interior dimensions and the design of the console (including the amount of available storage space) was to your liking. Not just with the new LX, but with a number of vehicles today (and I've also noticed this at GM), the tendency is to place the shift-lever on the left-side of the console to bring it closer to the driver's arm and hand. That means that the console-mounted cupholders are displaced a little to the right, closer to the front-passenger. Adding to that tendency is the increasing use of small electronic parking-brake tabs today, replacing the former bulky pull-up levers.....that, of course, frees up more room on the console for both the shift lever AND cup-holders. As you note, sometimes cup-holders to the left of the wheel are being removed...that could (?) be for any number of reasons, including cost-cutting.

One thing I didn't like about the RX's new console is its overly-wide design (ironically, which the new electronic parking-brake tabs are supposed to help eliminate LOL). That big, high, wide border on the center console tends to impact the driver's knee-room in the front seat, especially on a big guy my size with heavy legs.......something I noted in the review. If that really is a serious issue for you, the new Lincoln MKC and MKV SUVs use an interesting console design that removes all of the transmission controls from the console itself and places them on the dash with electronic push-buttons....that thins out the console-width some. Might want to give it a look. :)

2016-lincoln-mkx-interior.jpg
 

abraxas

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Thanks for the comprehensive well articulated response....it is appreciated. Bottom line? If we can live with the new RX I'll just have to make an offer and see what happens. It's my money, and that's my power. I'll check out that link. Wide console without the storage space. FAIL My Tundra has more storage space than my closet. Amazing how they transformed every nook and cranny into storage. Suggests that the new Lexus RX cut corners on that detail.

Regarding the front grill, folks are gonna either hate it or think it's "kewl man". I think it's ugly. Sure will make a great filter for bugs. :) Can you imagine cleaning that thing during the summer's insect migration and breeding?

Wouldn't mind a Lincoln but the reliability history is poor. To me Mercedes-Benz, Lincoln, or say.....Cadillac no longer represent quality. They represent a product for sucker bets who have more money than sense. Have a friend with a M-B Suv and he opined about his aggravation with the reliability - "you'd think they would have gotten it right by now." At our age, I have the time but not the patience for the aggravation of taking a car back to the shop for a problem in or out of warranty plus I'm 60 miles from the nearest dealer which is located in San Antonio.

Therein lies Toyota's and Lexus' strength - tight, well built, reliable transportation.

Regards,
Mark
 

mmcartalk

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Thanks for the comprehensive well articulated response....it is appreciated. Bottom line? If we can live with the new RX I'll just have to make an offer and see what happens. It's my money, and that's my power. I'll check out that link. Wide console without the storage space. FAIL My Tundra has more storage space than my closet. Amazing how they transformed every nook and cranny into storage. Suggests that the new Lexus RX cut corners on that detail.

The new RX may not have an ideally-shaped console (and some of the styling touches are controversial)...but otherwise, don't sell it short. It has good refinement, a nice powertrain, and good road manners.


Wouldn't mind a Lincoln but the reliability history is poor. To me Mercedes-Benz, Lincoln, or say.....Cadillac no longer represent quality. They represent a product for sucker bets who have more money than sense. Have a friend with a M-B Suv and he opined about his aggravation with the reliability - "you'd think they would have gotten it right by now." At our age, I have the time but not the patience for the aggravation of taking a car back to the shop for a problem in or out of warranty plus I'm 60 miles from the nearest dealer which is located in San Antonio.

Therein lies Toyota's and Lexus' strength - tight, well built, reliable transportation.

Any vehicle, of course, to some extent, is a roll of the dice on reliability. But, in general, most of today's vehicles are at least reasonably well-built...especially compared to 20 or 30 years ago. True lemons as new cars, while they still exist, are becoming less-common each year. Consumer Reports and J.D. Power (I generally prefer CR's system, for several reasons), track the average number of defects and repairs per vehicle and brand, and, in general, it drops gradually each year. That said, though, one can still lessen the chances of getting a lemon by avoiding more trouble-prone brands like Land Rover, Jaguar, Jeep, etc..... and sticking to Japanese or Korean brands. However, some mixed patterns also develop, like what we currently see at GM, where some of their vehicles, by today's standards, are quite reliable, and others have been quite troublesome.

Good luck on your decision. :)
 

abraxas

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I rely on CR's auto reports. Their graphical reliability representation of vehicles is based on owner surveys. I fill them out too so I know what questions are asked and how comprehensive the surveys are. Some of the staff comments are ill founded IMO. That's a statement about one's personal tastes and like reviews, everyone reviewer has his/her bias'.
 

Trexus

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Wouldn't mind a Lincoln but the reliability history is poor. To me Mercedes-Benz, Lincoln, or say.....Cadillac no longer represent quality. They represent a product for sucker bets who have more money than sense. Have a friend with a M-B Suv and he opined about his aggravation with the reliability - "you'd think they would have gotten it right by now." At our age, I have the time but not the patience for the aggravation of taking a car back to the shop for a problem in or out of warranty plus I'm 60 miles from the nearest dealer which is located in San Antonio.

Therein lies Toyota's and Lexus' strength - tight, well built, reliable transportation.

Regards,
Mark

I appears some people just don't learn and keep buying the unreliable vehicles or that these people don't mind that the reliability isn't there and they actually like going back and forth to the dealership for warranty repairs or paid repairs...as for myself I just don't have the time for unreliability. I need a vehicle that will start on time, every time, all the time, forever...
 

GSCT

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I had a look at the new RX in the showroom but haven't driven it yet. Quickie impressions are: expressive styling (personally I prefer it to the soap bar styling of the previous RX), great interior, but for me it is HUGE- almost alarmingly big! According to the sales person I talked with, interest was high, so clearly I am not in the target group (again).
 

mmcartalk

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I appears some people just don't learn and keep buying the unreliable vehicles or that these people don't mind that the reliability isn't there and they actually like going back and forth to the dealership for warranty repairs or paid repairs...as for myself I just don't have the time for unreliability. I need a vehicle that will start on time, every time, all the time, forever...

I think most of us would agree with you on the reliability front. Nobody likes the hassles involved with vehicle repairs....except maybe shop-owners and those who profit from non-warranty repairs LOL. IMO, however, it bears noting that, most vehicles today, regardless of brand, are built to a high enough standard that what is considered "unreliable" today is nothing like what we put up with in the past. Many of the "unreliable" vehicles of today would have been considered first-rate in the 1990s. In fact, many common problems with vehicles aren't really the car's fault at all, but simple bad luck or human error....a tire, for example, picks up a nail or other puncture, and a slow, almost unnoticeable leak that is difficult for the PSI sensors to immediately pick up turns into a flat tire the next morning. Or owners sometimes forget to turn off things that can drain batteries overnight....things like manually-operated dome lights, reading lights in the back seat, etc.... (I've seen that happen a number of times). Or, owners continually use cheap, crap-grade gasoline that, even if it has the required octane for ping/knock-resistance, doesn't have enough detergent additives in it to keep small fuel-system passages clean and free of carbon child-up (among others, Shell and Chevron are known to have good detergent packages). Or, for people who do their own oil changes, if they don't use the correct grade/viscosity of oil or the correct filter (just because the filter fits doesn't necessarily mean it's the correct one), and it leads to premature engine wear. Or, if the bozos in the repair shops don't do THEIR jobs correctly and the car suffers damage or unreliability as a result. This does not, of course, excuse or exonerate poor quality control, or a bad or otherwise unreliable design from the factory, but some reliability problems aren't necessarily the car's fault. Others, of course, are.

That was one thing, BTW, that used to sting a lot of VW owners....the ignition switches were wired separately from the radio/sound system, by-passing the regular "ACC" position on the switch. That drained a lot of batteries when owners had the radios on at low volume or muted, turned the ignition off, and walked off without separately turning off the sound system. Today, off course, on most vehicles, almost everything goes off with the ignition switch or with things like door/hood/glovebox closure except for some manual-control dome lights, unless there is a short or bad switch somewhere.
 
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