The Lexus RZ Megathread (550e, 500e 350e)

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internalaudit

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ssun30 said:
You have no idea how easy it is to get a good riding and handling Chinese EV for a low price. Adaptive and semi-active suspensions are standard equipment on many cars sold between ¥200k and ¥400k. And you can get fully active suspensions that ride no worse than Mercedes AirMatic on cars 1/5 the price of a Maybach. Noise reduction wheels and tires, dual pane windows, zero gravity seats are also standard equipment on even non-luxury cars. And "poor handling" Chinese EVs are setting one lap record after another and even Porsche now has to take them seriously.

And let's not forget how quickly GWM is stealing market share from Toyota trucks in Australia. And GWM mostly makes ICEVs.

If you want to dismiss Chinese cars at least use the right argument. These cars are over equipped and will have parts fail right after warranty expires and becomes a money sink after 100000km. But you can say the same for many German cars.
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Can you name a few of these vehicles that won kudos or accolades and cite your sources?

The only thing you mentioned that seems performance-related is is air suspension, everything else is just more luxury.
 
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sl0519 said:
I usually don’t like to advocate Chinese stuff, but I think a lot of people are still living in their own bubble, and this video essentially proves that. If these kinds of vehicles were to enter the U.S. market, it would likely trigger a major industry shake-up, and I don’t think traditional automakers would fare too well in the face of such disruption.
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Chinese brands need to raise prices of their international models a lot to make up for the domestic price war. But even then they will have a big price advantage.

We've already seen this before with 90s Japanese cars. Consumers can only benefit from competition. If Chinese cars are not effectively banned in US it won't take Lexus USA 3 years to make dual pane windows standard on the RX. The "premium" package from vast majority of legacy brands these days is just to fleece customers.
 
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Ok, back to TMC.

These are the updates that bring RZ and BZ4X to be competitive in 2021-2023.

- It seems that charging is now faster, at 30m 10%-80% vs 45m before.
- RZ gets 77kwh gross capacity battery, which is better but not really luxury vehicle standard.
- All new motors add power and efficiency, they are supposed to be 20% more efficient overall than before, when TMC falsely claimed to be most efficient on the market.
- Infotainment upgrade - 14" screen and drive display now separate from wheel and moved up top.
- 11-22kw charging for AC!
- Destination planning plus manual/auto preheating of battery added


These are good updates and if all are true, you can now buy these vehicles without making a big mistake.

Now, the cool car is just announced CHR+. It gets all those technologies and 77kwh battery, at price point 10k (hopefully) cheaper than BZ4X. If thats the case, thats then competitive because at $40k you dont expect larger batteries or 800v charging.

It also looks good!
 
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ssun30

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spwolf said:
Ok, back to TMC.

These are the updates that bring RZ and BZ4X to be competitive in 2021-2023.

- It seems that charging is now faster, at 30m 10%-80% vs 45m before.
- RZ gets 77kwh gross capacity battery, which is better but not really luxury vehicle standard.
- All new motors add power and efficiency, they are supposed to be 20% more efficient overall than before, when TMC falsely claimed to be most efficient on the market.
- Infotainment upgrade - 14" screen and drive display now separate from wheel and moved up top.
- 11-22kw charging for AC!
- Destination planning plus manual/auto preheating of battery added


These are good updates and if all are true, you can now buy these vehicles without making a big mistake.

Now, the cool car is just announced CHR+. It gets all those technologies and 77kwh battery, at price point 10k (hopefully) cheaper than BZ4X. If thats the case, thats then competitive because at $40k you dont expect larger batteries or 800v charging.

It also looks good!
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I agree, the C-HR+ is a much, much more compelling product (strange it also gets a bigger battery than the bZ4X). Now what's really strange is Lexus is not releasing a new UX EV based on the now bigger and more spacious C-HR+. The UX EV might be their most important product in Europe but it's not getting an update.

They added a lot of features that make them up to date with products from around 2022. But then again the industry is at a bottleneck after all the low-hanging fruits are picked and we likely won't see a lot of major innovations for the next 3 years. In terms of packaging they still look like how someone would build an EV in 2017.
 
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ssun30 said:
I agree, the C-HR+ is a much, much more compelling product (strange it also gets a bigger battery than the bZ4X). Now what's really strange is Lexus is not releasing a new UX EV based on the now bigger and more spacious C-HR+. The UX EV might be their most important product in Europe but it's not getting an update.

They added a lot of features that make them up to date with products from around 2022. But then again the industry is at a bottleneck after all the low-hanging fruits are picked and we likely won't see a lot of major innovations for the next 3 years. In terms of packaging they still look like how someone would build an EV in 2017.
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I am sure Lexus will release new UX EV soon after.

Problem comes with everyone going to 800v and big batteries in 2026 - CLA and iX3, etc. However, in smaller/almost city categories, 30m 10%-80% and 77kwh battery is going to be fine. Especially since not so many charging stations support this in 2025.

now for RZ, at those prices and above, it is also not going to be great. But Lexus and Toyota dealers will take anything as better than what they have today.
 
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Levi

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spwolf said:
Problem comes with everyone going to 800v and big batteries in 2026 - CLA and iX3, etc.
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You know how much that tiny thing weighs? If that is the price to pay for 800V and big batteries for range, it is worthless…
 
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Levi said:
You know how much that tiny thing weighs? If that is the price to pay for 800V and big batteries for range, it is worthless…
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That's about 700 lbs. heavier than the heaviest Model 3. I didn't see any mention of an AMG model on March 13 but here's to hoping it has 4MATIC+ and rear wheel steering lol. Then that weight won't matter as much. I kinda like the exterior of the 2026 CLA too bad BEVs are likely more short-lived and less repairable down the road than regular ICEVs or even Toyota/Honda HEVs.

The (takes deep breath) 2026 Mercedes-Benz CLA 350 4Matic with EQ Technology weighs 2,135 kilograms in European guise. That's 4,706 pounds

AI:
The Tesla Model 3 has a curb weight ranging from 3,862 to 4,065 pounds, depending on the specific model and trim level.
 
CRSKTN

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Component miniaturization will come.

We're comparing the absolute latest in ICE packaging & componentry vs a lot of these companies barely being 5 to 10 years into the effort.

The CLA weighing more than an S class is funny, though.

Improved chemistry and new materials innovations will help with weight too.
 
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CRSKTN said:
Component miniaturization will come.

We're comparing the absolute latest in ICE packaging & componentry vs a lot of these companies barely being 5 to 10 years into the effort.

The CLA weighing more than an S class is funny, though.

Improved chemistry and new materials innovations will help with weight too.
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well CLA will have a gas engine too. It is a mid step.

Most people care about highway range way more than city, so aero and high speed power usage is important
 
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spwolf said:
well CLA will have a gas engine too. It is a mid step.

Most people care about highway range way more than city, so aero and high speed power usage is important
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Do you still have your Model 3 Performance? Or have you since switched to an i4?
 
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Just took a look at RZ used market. This thing is holding its value quite well despite being severely gimped compared to competition. I love the new update. Just wish they did more with the headlight design.
 
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mediumhot said:
Just took a look at RZ used market. This thing is holding its value quite well despite being severely gimped compared to competition. I love the new update. Just wish they did more with the headlight design.
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Could it be due to it merely being a Lexus or are there other merits to it?
 
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ssun30

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As I've said many times, RZ is a good car but a bad EV. It's probably one of the best new cars on sale from Lexus today.

Now it's becoming a decent EV, there are now legitimate reasons to actually buy one.
 
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