Scion xB Calling It Quits

[Tragic Bronson]

http://wardsauto.com/sales-marketing/scion-xb-calling-it-quits

SANTA MONICA, CA – Folks wanting a boxy car soon will have fewer choices.

“The xB will be leaving the lineup at the end of the year,” Scion Vice President Doug Murtha tells WardsAuto here at a ’16 iA and iM media preview.

Murtha’s predecessor Jack Hollis told WardsAuto in April 2012 the xB would not see a third generation, but the Toyota youth brand kept the xB around for three more years, despite declining volume.

The first-generation xB is near-iconic and became the face of the Scion brand in its early years.

The square-edged car was a virtual copy of the Japan-market Toyota bB and immediately found fans in the U.S., some of whom saw it as a hipper and less-expensive alternative to a minivan.

Sales of the xB reached their pinnacle with that first generation, hitting 61,306 units in 2006.

But the second-generation xB, launched in 2007 as an ’08, didn’t measure up to its predecessor’s success.

Even Toyota CEO Jim Lentz thought the bigger and more American successor lost the first-gen’s unique character.

“(If we could) do things over again, we would (add) a little bit of fun-to-drive (spirit) back to that vehicle,” Lentz said at a 2009 industry conference.

After increasing in 2012 from 2011, sales of the second-generation xB fell in 2013 and 2014, with just 16,583 sold last year. In comparison, the competing Kia Soul delivered 145,316 units in 2014.

Ironically in its final year the xB has been trending up. Some 7,376 xBs were sold through May, a 5.4% increase from the same period year-ago.

The xB joins other discontinued boxes the Honda Element and Nissan Cube on the scrap heap of automotive history, leaving the Soul as the last model standing in the U.S.

Murtha sees the 5-passenger Scion iM compact hatchback as somewhat filling the xB’s void, but he doesn’t see it as a direct replacement of the model.

The iM goes on sale Sept.1 in the U.S.

The once iconic xB is discontinued...shame it was not given more updates to better compete with the Soul. Also, the second xB didn't have that quirkiness of the first model.

 

[mmcartalk]

http://wardsauto.com/sales-marketing/scion-xb-calling-it-quits

The once iconic xB is discontinued...shame it was not given more updates to better compete with the Soul. Also, the second xB didn't have that quirkiness of the first model.

The Kia Soul has been so successful that it has pretty much shoved aside both the Nissan Cube and the 2Gen Scion xB. At one local Kia dealership in my area, (roughly) half of all the vehicles they sell are Souls. Another factor that impacted on Xb sales is that the 2Gen model was larger, heavier, had a much larger engine (2.4L in-line four instead of 1.5L), and, as a result, did not get the same gas economy. The fuel economy of the first-generation models was one of the things that attracted it to buyers.

 

[CIF]

No surprise, this is what happens when you neglect a model like this. Then again, I never did understand, and still don't understand the usefulness of the Scion brand. I feel there's not enough investment in the brand.

 

[mmcartalk]

No surprise, this is what happens when you neglect a model like this.

I'm not sure if you could say that it was out-and-out neglect, or simply designing the 2Gen version in a way that was not as appealing to its core group of buyers as the 1Gen version was.

Then again, I never did understand, and still don't understand the usefulness of the Scion brand. I feel there's not enough investment in the brand.

I think the best feature of the Scion brand was (and still is) what Saturn perfected in the 1990s....the simple, no-haggle, no-stress list-price deals. While it prevents discounts for the customer, it also prevents higher-than-list dealer price-gouging on high-demand, hard to get models, though dealers can still add accessories to high-demand models to increase profits.

 

[IS-SV]

No surprise, this is what happens when you neglect a model like this. Then again, I never did understand, and still don't understand the usefulness of the Scion brand. I feel there's not enough investment in the brand.

Good points, because in Japan the Xb was successful as a Toyota. And in recent years people got discounts on Scions just like Toyotas in U.S. In Scion's short history, nothing in product line comes close to sales success of gen1 Xb. 1st gen Xb's in good condition still have above average resale value.

2nd gen XB is close 2nd in Scion sales (nearly the top selling model), so does this mean end of Scion brand maybe?

 

[Och]

Good riddance, it was a fugly miserable car anyway.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

Good points, because in Japan the Xb was successful as a Toyota. And in recent years people got discounts on Scions just like Toyotas in U.S. In Scion's short history, nothing in product line comes close to sales success of gen1 Xb. 1st gen Xb's in good condition still have above average resale value.

2nd gen XB is close 2nd in Scion sales (nearly the top selling model), so does this mean end of Scion brand maybe?

I think the first gen xB is already a cult classic, so values on them will hold and perhaps rise? I think they might be worth MORE than the 2nd gen xB because of their desirability. That could be said for even some 4Runners as well.

IDK, I think the tC might be selling better at this point. The xB began the road for Scion and the tC was the second round of attack. But the tC was also neglected for quite some time too and its second iteration was also "meh" to many, even though it is the current best seller for the brand (beating the FR-S!).

 

[IS-SV]

Tc sales slightly ahead of Xb, yes weak sales across the board for Scion.

 

[mmcartalk]

I think the first gen xB is already a cult classic, so values on them will hold and perhaps rise? I think they might be worth MORE than the 2nd gen xB because of their desirability. That could be said for even some 4Runners as well.

IDK, I think the tC might be selling better at this point. The xB began the road for Scion and the tC was the second round of attack. But the tC was also neglected for quite some time too and its second iteration was also "meh" to many, even though it is the current best seller for the brand (beating the FR-S!).

One probable reason the FR-S doesn't do better than it does is that it shares its basic design and engine with the Subaru BR-Z, which means it is dependent on Subaru for a steady supply of the flat-four engines. Production numbers on both of these cars also seems to have been limited, despite the demand for them. Right now, I think the best prospect for Scion is the iM, which very nicely fulfills the role of a Corolla 5-door hatchback/wagon that Toyota won't sell here in the U.S. under its own nameplate. I would not be surprised to see the iM do well...even if some other Scion models don't.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

One probable reason the FR-S doesn't do better than it does is that it shares its basic design and engine with the Subaru BR-Z, which means it is dependent on Subaru for a steady supply of the flat-four engines. Production numbers on both of these cars also seems to have been limited, despite the demand for them. Right now, I think the best prospect for Scion is the iM, which very nicely fulfills the role of a Corolla 5-door hatchback/wagon that Toyota won't sell here in the U.S. under its own nameplate. I would not be surprised to see the iM do well...even if some other Scion models don't.

The FR-S is still a better seller than the BRZ, though of course, they pail compared to Camaros and Mustangs...honestly, everyone who wanted a Toyobaru got one. So the car has hit its peak appeal for the most part. Meanwhile, the WRX is doing better sales as of late than the twins.

 

[CIF]

I'm not sure if you could say that it was out-and-out neglect, or simply designing the 2Gen version in a way that was not as appealing to its core group of buyers as the 1Gen version was.

I think the best feature of the Scion brand was (and still is) what Saturn perfected in the 1990s....the simple, no-haggle, no-stress list-price deals. While it prevents discounts for the customer, it also prevents higher-than-list dealer price-gouging on high-demand, hard to get models, though dealers can still add accessories to high-demand models to increase profits.

Actually, what I meant was that the 2nd gen xB has been on the market for about 8 years now, and they did almost nothing to refresh or update it. The most significant thing that Toyota has done during the 2nd-gen xB's life cycle has been to recently cancel it. For a Toyota vehicle that is a sad fate.

Otherwise your points are correct. They made several mistakes with the 2nd-gen xB model, but IMHO the biggest mistake was letting the model languish all these years, and not even coming up with a proper replacement. Soon after debuting, they knew that the model did not have the same appeal as the 1st gen xB.

As for the pricing feature of the Scion brand, from what I have heard, that is not such a big selling point as it used to be.

 

[mmcartalk]

As for the pricing feature of the Scion brand, from what I have heard, that is not such a big selling point as it used to be.

Probably, at least partly, because dealerships handling other non-Scion brands have come up with some new ways of doing business themselves. One feature I especially like is the no-haggle Internet discount (sometimes also done in person at the dealership, not just on-line) where, except maybe for extremely high-demand/short-supply vehicles, the dealership offers a reasonable discount and dispenses with the usual Middle-East bazaar haggling. The car-buyer can take that offer, or, for a little more, if applicable, get a package which includes more free service and customer-perks. The dealership gets a reasonable profit, the customer gets a reasonable price, and both are happy. I've shopped with several car-buyers using that system and almost everyone I've been with liked it.

 

[CIF]

Probably, at least partly, because dealerships handling other non-Scion brands have come up with some new ways of doing business themselves. One feature I especially like is the no-haggle Internet discount (sometimes also done in person at the dealership, not just on-line) where, except maybe for extremely high-demand/short-supply vehicles, the dealership offers a reasonable discount and dispenses with the usual Middle-East bazaar haggling. The car-buyer can take that offer, or, for a little more, if applicable, get a package which includes more free service and customer-perks. The dealership gets a reasonable profit, the customer gets a reasonable price, and both are happy. I've shopped with several car-buyers using that system and almost everyone I've been with liked it.

Yes, a lot of interesting new things have been adopted by US dealers over the last 5-10 years. Sadly most dealers in Canada haven't quite kept up. Many genuinely appealing customer perks that US dealerships have started offering over the last few years sadly are unavailable in Canada.

 

[mmcartalk]

Yes, a lot of interesting new things have been adopted by US dealers over the last 5-10 years. Sadly most dealers in Canada haven't quite kept up. Many genuinely appealing customer perks that US dealerships have started offering over the last few years sadly are unavailable in Canada.

Don't Canadian buisness-laws, though, regulate dealerships up there more closely than in the U.S? Or are dealerships there still free to pretty much conduct business as they see fit...within certain guidelines? Even here, in the U.S., though, dealerships still have to abide by Truth-in-Lending, Credit-security, cash-reporting, and other American laws.

 

[CIF]

I would not be surprised to see the iM do well...even if some other Scion models don't.

I forgot to reply to this,

I agree with you on this one. I think the iM could actually do well, if only because it is a spiritual successor to the Toyota Matrix that's no longer available. The iM is reasonably priced, and comes with Toyota's 1.8L Valvematic engine standard. The same engine that I recently talked about in another thread that should be standard on all Corolla models.

 

[CIF]

Don't Canadian buisness-laws, though, regulate dealerships up there more closely than in the U.S? Or are dealerships there still free to pretty much conduct business as they see fit...within certain guidelines? Even here, in the U.S., though, dealerships still have to abide by Truth-in-Lending, Credit-security, cash-reporting, and other American laws.

I know there are certain differences, but given the wide range of "tactics" and bazaar-style sales "strategies" I've encountered at dealers here in Canada, from personal experience I can't really say that they're more tightly regulated. Not from real-world observations anyways. Also as far as I know, those extra customer perks US customers get at dealerships I don't think would violate regulations in Canada. I could be wrong though.

 

[mmcartalk]

I forgot to reply to this,

No problem...... you do an excellent job of keeping up as it is. It's sometimes difficult to see and catch every post, especially when one is busy with other things.

I agree with you on this one. I think the iM could actually do well, if only because it is a spiritual successor to the Toyota Matrix that's no longer available. The iM is reasonably priced, and comes with Toyota's 1.8L Valvematic engine standard. The same engine that I recently talked about in another thread that should be standard on all Corolla models.

The only thing the iM may (?) be lacking, as a spiritual successor to the Matrix/Vibe, is an AWD option.....something that, since we're also on the subject of the Scion xB, was an option that the xB never got, either. Even so, the AWD Matrix /Vibe, at least in my area, was never that big a seller...most of them went out the door of local dealerships as FWDs. Those who wanted a small Toyota AWD product usually ended up looking at the RAV-4.....and even some of THEM were sold with FWD.

 

[mmcartalk]

I know there are certain differences, but given the wide range of "tactics" and bazaar-style sales "strategies" I've encountered at dealers here in Canada, from personal experience I can't really say that they're more tightly regulated. Not from real-world observations anyways. Also as far as I know, those extra customer perks US customers get at dealerships I don't think would violate regulations in Canada. I could be wrong though.

I don't know this for a fact, but my strong guess is that sales-taxes on new-car purchases are higher there. In my home state of Virginia, it is only 3 or 4% on a new car.

On the xB, one interesting experience I had was that a former Scion/Toyota-shopper I went car-hunting with (an ex-co-worker of mine) was so impressed with the xB's roominess and space-efficiency that he came very close to buying one, choosing a new Matrix instead (which was also fairly space-efficient inside) at the last minute. The xB, unfortunately, short-cut on the gauges, placing them in a (for him) annoying center stack....the Matrix gauges, except for deep circular tunnels, were more conventional.

(I also found the xB's center-stack gauges annoying, as did a number of xB reviewers in the auto press, but given the sales numbers of the 1Gen version, a lot of buyers either did not share that view or did not consider it a deal-breaker)

The official line from manufacturers that do that design is that it gets the gauges out from where the steering wheel or column can block them from the driver's view (which may be partly true). But I strongly suspect that the main reason is cost-cutting on the assembly line, as center-stack gauges make it easier and cheaper to do both left-hand and right-hand drive versions for different countries and markets.

 

[CIF]

No problem...... you do an excellent job of keeping up as it is. It's sometimes difficult to see and catch every post, especially when one is busy with other things.

The only thing the iM may (?) be lacking, as a spiritual successor to the Matrix/Vibe, is an AWD option.....something that, since we're also on the subject of the Scion xB, was an option that the xB never got, either. Even so, the AWD Matrix /Vibe, at least in my area, was never that big a seller...most of them went out the door of local dealerships as FWDs. Those who wanted a small Toyota AWD product usually ended up looking at the RAV-4.....and even some of THEM were sold with FWD.

Thanks, yeah you're right .

Good point, but as you mention, I believe that role has been taken now by the Rav4, although it's a fair bit pricier than an AWD Matrix was.

I don't know this for a fact, but my strong guess is that sales-taxes on new-car purchases are higher there. In my home state of Virginia, it is only 3 or 4% on a new car.

On the xB, one interesting experience I had was that a former Scion/Toyota-shopper I went car-hunting with (an ex-co-worker of mine) was so impressed with the xB's roominess and space-efficiency that he came very close to buying one, choosing a new Matrix instead (which was also fairly space-efficient inside) at the last minute. The xB, unfortunately, short-cut on the gauges, placing them in a (for him) annoying center stack....the Matrix gauges, except for deep circular tunnels, were more conventional.

(I also found the xB's center-stack gauges annoying, as did a number of xB reviewers in the auto press, but given the sales numbers of the 1Gen version, a lot of buyers either did not share that view or did not consider it a deal-breaker)

The official line from manufacturers that do that design is that it gets the gauges out from where the steering wheel or column can block them from the driver's view (which may be partly true). But I strongly suspect that the main reason is cost-cutting on the assembly line, as center-stack gauges make it easier and cheaper to do both left-hand and right-hand drive versions for different countries and markets.

Yes, taxes overall in Canada are typically higher. Aside from that, I can't really say if there are actual tighter regulations for dealers themselves, based on my earlier posted observations .

I agree with you wholeheartedly on the center-stack gauges. Despite the reasoning from automakers, I too feel it's mainly a cost-cutting move that allows for very easy left and right-hand drive model assembly. There are a few exceptions though, like the Prius models, which have angled, very wide center stack "gauges" with driver-oriented dashboards, although they're in actuality very wide digital displays. I don't mind such a design on the Prius, since they are somewhat angled, and from the layout one can tell it's not really a cost-cutting move, since the dashboards are not symmetrical at all.

 

[mikeavelli]

Its rare that a car comes after the originator and just kills it but that Kia Soul did just that....They nailed the car and the marketing.....I can't remember the last time I've seen any advertising for the xB.....