RC-F love it or hate it?

[Och]

I am split on it - on one hand Lexus finally made a proper coupe (with a range of engines, not just the RC-F). It is definitely a head turner, but according to reviews it doesn't drive as good as the competition. I wish Lexus would try harder - hopefully they will improve it with refreshes through it's life cycle.

 

[krew]

I am split on it - on one hand Lexus finally made a proper coupe (with a range of engines, not just the RC-F). It is definitely a head turner, but according to reviews it doesn't drive as good as the competition. I wish Lexus would try harder - hopefully they will improve it with refreshes through it's life cycle.

Interesting point -- reminds me of a Motoring Australia interview with RC F chief engineer Yaguchi. Here's a quote:

“We are already thinking about some changes to make for next year,” he confirmed via an interpreter.

“The objective is to make the car more fun to drive. If you make the car go too fast then the human being won’t be able to catch up with it.

Intriguingly, he did concede there was more power to be eked from the engine, without resorting to forced induction.

“We think we can get a little more out of it,” he said.

“It’s really about increasing the rpm to be able to gain more horsepower, so if we were to increase the rpm then we would have to look at using what components to be able to meet the rpm increase… so at that time we would also have to review the cost etcetera. So right now it is set.”

http://lexusenthusiast.com/2014/09/02/lexus-rc-f-receive-yearly-performance-improvements/

 

[Mohammed Taha]

I am split on it - on one hand Lexus finally made a proper coupe (with a range of engines, not just the RC-F). It is definitely a head turner, but according to reviews it doesn't drive as good as the competition. I wish Lexus would try harder - hopefully they will improve it with refreshes through it's life cycle.

That's the thing ... it's a head turner (good or bad) but that's where it ends.

If customers are after something that looks different, there are plenty of those in the market. If they're after power, this is not the car for them.

Customers will take a look at the pros and cons of the car and make a decision. Some may think the power of the RC/RC-F is good enough for them, the cost is just right and buy the car but at the end of the day Lexus must realize that they're the new kid on the block and they're out to play ball unfortunately their first shot was weak. Fans will cheer and say "give them another chance" but skeptics and neutral parties will raise their eyebrows and start questioning them.

Lexus needs to stop trying to make cheaper cars and start making industry changing ones. If they can produce a car at $30,000 and Mercedes sells a similar car for $35,000 then what can Lexus add that will distinguish it from a Mercedes/BMW at that same price?

 

[phm14]

That's the thing ... it's a head turner (good or bad) but that's where it ends.

If customers are after something that looks different, there are plenty of those in the market. If they're after power, this is not the car for them.

Customers will take a look at the pros and cons of the car and make a decision. Some may think the power of the RC/RC-F is good enough for them, the cost is just right and buy the car but at the end of the day Lexus must realize that they're the new kid on the block and they're out to play ball unfortunately their first shot was weak. Fans will cheer and say "give them another chance" but skeptics and neutral parties will raise their eyebrows and start questioning them.

Lexus needs to stop trying to make cheaper cars and start making industry changing ones. If they can produce a car at $30,000 and Mercedes sells a similar car for $35,000 then what can Lexus add that will distinguish it from a Mercedes/BMW at that same price?

Reliability? A vehicle that distinguishes itself, rather than melting into an appearance that most won't differentiate from every other BMW/MB on the block? A naturally aspirated V8 in the upper model range? Better resale? It's easy to let the auto media do our thinking for us, but it's important to distinguish between fact and opinion. The direct competitive segment for the RCF is small, and I believe Lexus did an exceptional job creating something different. I plan to take my ISF out to an open track day soon, and I won't be feeling under equipt compared to any stock M cars out there, although is is very common for me to be out-skilled

 

[Carolyna]

I have driven all types of RC's and i absolutely love the lexus came out with such an elegant AND sporty vehicle. However, I do have to be honest, I love the outside design on the RC, but i hate to think that when i get in the vehicle, its like getting into an IS... the RC should have the GS screen and a little more updated buttons rather than IS like buttons...

 

[krew]

I have driven all types of RC's and i absolutely love the lexus came out with such an elegant AND sporty vehicle. However, I do have to be honest, I love the outside design on the RC, but i hate to think that when i get in the vehicle, its like getting into an IS... the RC should have the GS screen and a little more updated buttons rather than IS like buttons...

The GS has the best interior of the entire lineup, and you're right -- the RC F should have been a combination of the GS & IS interiors. I find the RC/IS interior cold in its design.

 

[RastaRacer]

Absolutely love my RC-F. I have no complaints about the whatsoever.

 

[mikeavelli]

Reliability? A vehicle that distinguishes itself, rather than melting into an appearance that most won't differentiate from every other BMW/MB on the block? A naturally aspirated V8 in the upper model range? Better resale? It's easy to let the auto media do our thinking for us, but it's important to distinguish between fact and opinion. The direct competitive segment for the RCF is small, and I believe Lexus did an exceptional job creating something different. I plan to take my ISF out to an open track day soon, and I won't be feeling under equipt compared to any stock M cars out there, although is is very common for me to be out-skilled

Great post. The goal posts move for Lexus again. Note the GS/IS are considered the best handling in class and there is barely a peep about it. The RC F has the most peak horsepower and that isn't brought up. Now the entire conversation is weight over and over. When the M5 weighs 4500lbs based on a 7 series. That is rarely if ever mentioned.

I'm sure Lexus is used to it by now.

 

[Mohammed Taha]

Reliability? A vehicle that distinguishes itself, rather than melting into an appearance that most won't differentiate from every other BMW/MB on the block? A naturally aspirated V8 in the upper model range? Better resale? It's easy to let the auto media do our thinking for us, but it's important to distinguish between fact and opinion. The direct competitive segment for the RCF is small, and I believe Lexus did an exceptional job creating something different. I plan to take my ISF out to an open track day soon, and I won't be feeling under equipt compared to any stock M cars out there, although is is very common for me to be out-skilled

Reliability and resale value is a factor only a few consider. Those that buy Lexus/Toyota will always justify their purchase by mentioning reliability and resale value but what else does Lexus have going for it?

Don't worry, I'm not biased or anything, I bought a 2009 Lexus IS full sport package in Feb 2009 and loved the reliability; it was a great car. But you want to know what I really wanted to buy? A brand new 2009 335i. I just couldn't justify the price at the time so I went for the IS.

So, if you or Lexus/Toyota think that we all buy their cars for the reliability/resale value, think again. The younger crowd would rather buy something else but Lexus was cheaper and the sales agent convinced them that this car is everything they need and you know ... resale value and reliability.

I'm not trolling or anything, I just want Lexus to finally roll up their sleeves and say "we don't care anymore, we want to be absolutely great". We want everyone to drool when they see our cars. We want to be the definition of Luxury. We want to be leaders in everything automotive. Yet unfortunately, what they're working on is reducing cost to improve their profit margin. From a financial point of view, sure. From my point of view, seriously? That's your current financial strategy?

Anyways, done rambling.

 

[krew]

I'm not trolling or anything, I just want Lexus to finally roll up their sleeves and say "we don't care anymore, we want to be absolutely great". We want everyone to drool when they see our cars. We want to be the definition of Luxury. We want to be leaders in everything automotive. Yet unfortunately, what they're working on is reducing cost to improve their profit margin. From a financial point of view, sure. From my point of view, seriously? That's your current financial strategy?

Before there's a huge backlash on this, I just want to say that your criticism is valid -- however, I also think we could easily apply this statement to any of the other luxury automotive brands. Lexus is not alone in reducing costs and making compromises.

Working off your point, it's time for Lexus to shift away from branding and design and refocus on vehicle technology and luxury. In fact, I'm hoping the next-generation LS is a return to the original LS, where the whole point of the vehicle is to upend the flagship luxury market.

Really though, how do you jump leaps and bounds over the current S-Class? That thing feels like it's 5 years ahead of everyone already.

 

[Mohammed Taha]

Before there's a huge backlash on this, I just want to say that your criticism is valid -- however, I also think we could easily apply this statement to any of the other luxury automotive brands. Lexus is not alone in reducing costs and making compromises.
...

Thanks for your constructive argument. I don't dispute the fact that there are other Luxury Automotive companies out there working on reducing costs but their R&D departments are miles ahead of the rest.

Mercedes is investing heavily in Formula 1 and at the same time releasing a car as outstanding as the S class. Audi is leading the world in LED lights and now Laser headlights. Jaguar Land Rover was bought by Tata yet they released their best Range Rover and I think the best Luxury SUV for 2014/2015. Jaguar also released the XJ F type; a thing of beauty. Need I go on?

You also hit the nail on the head, Lexus needs to refocus their investment on R&D instead of Marketing. The world knows Lexus. Lexus does not need to use young models and hip hop artists for the world to realize they're cool. It's like my dad throwing on a jersey, flipping his hat backwards , sporting baggy jeans and then trying to fit in with my friends. It just doesn't work. What works is my dad challenging me to a game of basketball or whatever and schooling me up and down the court/field. Lexus needs to be that guy because you know what, a few years down the road, they're going to look back at that ad and say ... what the hell were we thinking.

Now ... as for the S Class and I think we have gone so far off topic Mercedes hit a home run so hard the game was shutdown from the first inning. Every other car that copies any of Mercedes's features will be listed as a follower. I mean they can have most of the same features or all, but they need to introduce more. The question now is, how much more can you add without the car's price falling into Maybach territory?

 

[mikeavelli]

Reliability and resale value is a factor only a few consider. Those that buy Lexus/Toyota will always justify their purchase by mentioning reliability and resale value but what else does Lexus have going for it?

Don't worry, I'm not biased or anything, I bought a 2009 Lexus IS full sport package in Feb 2009 and loved the reliability; it was a great car. But you want to know what I really wanted to buy? A brand new 2009 335i. I just couldn't justify the price at the time so I went for the IS.

So, if you or Lexus/Toyota think that we all buy their cars for the reliability/resale value, think again. The younger crowd would rather buy something else but Lexus was cheaper and the sales agent convinced them that this car is everything they need and you know ... resale value and reliability.

I'm not trolling or anything, I just want Lexus to finally roll up their sleeves and say "we don't care anymore, we want to be absolutely great". We want everyone to drool when they see our cars. We want to be the definition of Luxury. We want to be leaders in everything automotive. Yet unfortunately, what they're working on is reducing cost to improve their profit margin. From a financial point of view, sure. From my point of view, seriously? That's your current financial strategy?

Anyways, done rambling.

I never bought a Lexus solely because of value or it was cheaper. That was an additional benefit. I truly believe they build some of the best cars on the planet and they fit my needs well, even if they lack in some areas. While I bought a 2014 LS F-Sport I did review the M5, Tesla, Panamera and a few other vehicles, most quite tasty. At a near 90k MSRP "value" becomes less of an importance and it becomes more about what a person wants and desires.

So far Lexus continues to move up as we have moved up in life so its been a great marriage. Since I am lucky enough to drive various other brands and cars on a near daily basis I am very much in tune with offerings from other brands and many are tantalizing, some are a let down.

With that said I am searching for a new vehicle to add possibly and Lexus is not involved since they don't make an offering in what I am looking for. I do wish they did.

 

[krew]

You also hit the nail on the head, Lexus needs to refocus their investment on R&D instead of Marketing. The world knows Lexus. Lexus does not need to use young models and hip hop artists for the world to realize they're cool. It's like my dad throwing on a jersey, flipping his hat backwards , sporting baggy jeans and then trying to fit in with my friends. It just doesn't work. What works is my dad challenging me to a game of basketball or whatever and schooling me up and down the court/field. Lexus needs to be that guy because you know what, a few years down the road, they're going to look back at that ad and say ... what the hell were we thinking.

No offense, but I don't know that Lexus should be compared to anyone's dad. In fact, I think of the current marketing in a completely opposite way -- right now Lexus is growing up and trying new things, but have yet to find the subtlety required at this level of sophistication. Like anyone in their twenties, there's a tendency to overcompensate.

I also don't fault the brashness of their current designs -- it's bold and will grow into something unexpected. Even so, and I find it strange to say, Lexus needs to apply the lessons learned from the LFA. It was never going to be the best supercar on paper, but it had a purity of vision that was immediately obvious to anyone that drove it. That's what Lexus needs now. The vehicles need to have a clear purpose, something that can not be argued.

I think the NX has it -- here's a SUV built with something specific in mind, which Lexus referred to as Premium Urban Sports Gear. A very Japanese turn of phrase, but it's impossible to argue that the designers & engineers hit their mark. I want that from every Lexus vehicle.

 

[krew]

With that said I am searching for a new vehicle to add possibly and Lexus is not involved since they don't make an offering in what I am looking for. I do wish they did.

NX F SPORT with the Black Bison Kit --- dooooooo iiiiiittttttt.

 

[corradoMR2]

I have driven all types of RC's and i absolutely love the lexus came out with such an elegant AND sporty vehicle. However, I do have to be honest, I love the outside design on the RC, but i hate to think that when i get in the vehicle, its like getting into an IS... the RC should have the GS screen and a little more updated buttons rather than IS like buttons...

The GS has the best interior of the entire lineup, and you're right -- the RC F should have been a combination of the GS & IS interiors. I find the RC/IS interior cold in its design.

Agree with both of you. As an owner of the IS, all-black interior is somewhat cold and stark looking, but for a 40k car it's OK, not for a 50k+ car. When I test drove the RC 350 AWD today, I was left disappointed since I expected a different feel. Not only did it drive and feel like my IS, it looked like it from the inside. I so wanted to like it and after the test drive, I find it harder to like the RC. The other thing that bugged me is the high wheel gap at front. I was able to fit my fist in there as to how big it is. Lowering springs may have to be the option here...

But RC aside, RC F is a different beast. Love the muscular bulge of the hood and taller/narrower spindle grille as well as the lowered stance. I could live with the IS interior but with the nicer F seats, alcantara dash and door panel appointments, and that melodiously deep-sounding V8, I love this car.

 

[Lasse J. Nordvik]

Welcome,RAL!

 

[krew]

I so wanted to like it and after the test drive, I find it harder to like the RC. The other thing that bugged me is the high wheel gap at front. I was able to fit my fist in there as to how big it is. Lowering springs may have to be the option here...

The AWD wheel gap on the RC is a tragedy -- it makes no sense to me at all. Of all the things about the RC, that is the #1 thing that HAS to be fixed.

 

[CIF]

Front end appears larger because of the wider fenders taller hood and larger front fascia. They're more or less the same size overall. The 2UR-GSE can easily fit in the normal RC engine bay. They're identical in size from the firewall to the core support:

Yeah, you're right, it's mainly the taller hood that seems to throw off the proportions. Wait, but the 2UR-GSE wouldn't find the normal RC hood though right? That would have made for a far sleeker-looking RC F.

Reliability and resale value is a factor only a few consider. Those that buy Lexus/Toyota will always justify their purchase by mentioning reliability and resale value but what else does Lexus have going for it?

Don't worry, I'm not biased or anything, I bought a 2009 Lexus IS full sport package in Feb 2009 and loved the reliability; it was a great car. But you want to know what I really wanted to buy? A brand new 2009 335i. I just couldn't justify the price at the time so I went for the IS.

So, if you or Lexus/Toyota think that we all buy their cars for the reliability/resale value, think again. The younger crowd would rather buy something else but Lexus was cheaper and the sales agent convinced them that this car is everything they need and you know ... resale value and reliability.

I'm not trolling or anything, I just want Lexus to finally roll up their sleeves and say "we don't care anymore, we want to be absolutely great". We want everyone to drool when they see our cars. We want to be the definition of Luxury. We want to be leaders in everything automotive. Yet unfortunately, what they're working on is reducing cost to improve their profit margin. From a financial point of view, sure. From my point of view, seriously? That's your current financial strategy?

Anyways, done rambling.

Except...you're only speaking for yourself.

Resale value doesn't factor as much into luxury cars for many others including myself you're right. It is a nice bonus to have though.

Reliability and durability, for me those absolutely do play a BIG part in my purchasing decisions, including luxury cars. This is the type of person I am. It's not even just about the money. It's about the mental hassle and the big waste of time a BMW and a Benz become in terms of the repairs, TSBs, electrical gremlins, and on and on.

Oh and just to add, I would be considered part of the "younger crowd". Based on luxury car demographics, I'm part of the very highly sought-after "young" demographic.

So in conclusion, I have absolutely no interest in owning a BMW or Benz. I don't lease cars, so that would be out of the question as well.

In fact, I'm hoping the next-generation LS is a return to the original LS, where the whole point of the vehicle is to upend the flagship luxury market.

Really though, how do you jump leaps and bounds over the current S-Class? That thing feels like it's 5 years ahead of everyone already.

I can only hope so as well. I feel it is overdue for the LS, especially given how excellent of a car the 4th gen GS is.

My opinion is not part of the current hype, and goes against the grain a bit, but I sincerely believe the current S Class is overhyped. No I'm not being contrarian for the sake of it. I logically view most of the "groundbreaking" features on the new/current S Class as nothing but small improvements over similar systems from competitors (the semi-autonomous driving technologies, lane systems, etc.), or complete gimmicks (the air fragrance system). To me, the current S Class did not significantly raise the bar in terms of pure luxury. Reliability and durability also remain to be seen. The craftsmanship and quality is of course there, even though I'm not a fan of the interior styling-wise. The exterior I do like; it's one of the only modern Benz models which I like the exterior on.

 

[Tinhinnh]

They need to Nissan GTR-fied the RCF. The nissan is quite porky also but it has Awd and a lot of torque.