Next-Generation Lexus CT Coming to Europe in 2020?

[spwolf]

True, I know of this fact. But my question was what, do you think, is the reason behind the C-HR not actually cannibalizing Auris sales?

People seem them as different category of vehicles, and different price also helps.

 

[spwolf]

Lexus should have kept the 2018 CT for North America. Lexus lost some potential sales with the refreshed 2018 CT.

Sure, but they are probably losing money on it in NA so they dont mind.

 

[Will1991]

Is there any update regarding 2-gen CT?

 

[Joaquin Ruhi]

Is there any update regarding 2-gen CT?

Nothing that I'm aware of.

 

[spwolf]

Nothing that I'm aware of.

we had EU Lexus heads saying that they are not going to discontinue it, but at the same time, Japanese mags dont have any rumors for it.

It certainly has good base in new Corolla though.

 

[maiaramdan]

Honestly I am thinking Corolla is just enough if they add a premium package with real leather stitchings, and one or more powerful engine than what they currently offer everything will be all set

 

[Trexus]

Sure, but they are probably losing money on it in NA so they dont mind.

Doubt Lexus was losing money on the CT selling in U.S.(Lexus did lose money selling the LFA). One third of all worldwide sales came from U.S. Drivetrain in the CT is basically the Prius so Toyota is very smart by not creating a new drivetrain for the CT and Toyota runs it's manufacturing process most very efficiently.

I believe dealers were very lazy selling the CT and most Americans aren't really into hatchbacks, selling a luxury hatchback did have an uphill battle. The CT only came in hybrid form, maybe if Lexus had a gasoline version (CT 200) they could have sold more as the price point would've been lower. Lexus could have also catered to the enthusiasts by adding a more powerful variant (CT 300h) as well. Lexus could have done a lot with the CT but we can only dream...

 

[spwolf]

Doubt Lexus was losing money on the CT selling in U.S.(Lexus did lose money selling the LFA). One third of all worldwide sales came from U.S. Drivetrain in the CT is basically the Prius so Toyota is very smart by not creating a new drivetrain for the CT and Toyota runs it's manufacturing process most very efficiently.

I believe dealers were very lazy selling the CT and most Americans aren't really into hatchbacks, selling a luxury hatchback did have an uphill battle. The CT only came in hybrid form, maybe if Lexus had a gasoline version (CT 200) they could have sold more as the price point would've been lower. Lexus could have also catered to the enthusiasts by adding a more powerful variant (CT 300h) as well. Lexus could have done a lot with the CT but we can only dream...

CT sold reasonably well in the USA, it was outselling A3 hatch for instance... So them selling it had to be losing money, just like something like Yaris is losing them money and not bringing anything to the table in the NA, otherwise they would not forgo efficiencies of building another 10k-15k per year.

 

[maiaramdan]

CT is died at birth, even Prius didn't hold a candle infront of the Corolla and nor CT

Corolla was and still and will always be the king in this category for Toyota and I dare to say for the overall industry, the logical thing is to spend more on making it much more better package than divide the R&D costs on 2 or 3 models

For me Prius and CT are already died, with the new Corolla got 2 different hybrid variants and in same time have much more better handling than ever

 

[spwolf]

CT is died at birth, even Prius didn't hold a candle infront of the Corolla and nor CT

Corolla was and still and will always be the king in this category for Toyota and I dare to say for the overall industry, the logical thing is to spend more on making it much more better package than divide the R&D costs on 2 or 3 models

For me Prius and CT are already died, with the new Corolla got 2 different hybrid variants and in same time have much more better handling than ever

If car industry worked like that, Toyota would have 50% less sales .

There will be plenty of other cars on TNGA-C platform.

 

[maiaramdan]

What I mean Toyota always have more than variant in every category except for small family, always Corolla
full lux Majesta, Celsior/ LS
mid lux Crown (Athlete/Royal), Aristo/GS
small lux progres, Brevis, Verossa, Origin, Altezza/ IS
full family Avalon, Aurion
mid family Camry, Windom/ES, Cressida/Mark/Caresta/Chaser
Small family only Corolla and every variant came under the corolla umbrella

 

[spwolf]

What I mean Toyota always have more than variant in every category except for small family, always Corolla
full lux Majesta, Celsior/ LS
mid lux Crown (Athlete/Royal), Aristo/GS
small lux progres, Brevis, Verossa, Origin, Altezza/ IS
full family Avalon, Aurion
mid family Camry, Windom/ES, Cressida/Mark/Caresta/Chaser
Small family only Corolla and every variant came under the corolla umbrella

There were other sedans in Japan based on Corolla if you mean that... and also there was hatch and wagon under Auris name, as well as Verso. I dont think the name matters though?

There will certainly be CT and Prius in the future, those cars are not going away even if they are taking name of Auris and merging it into Corolla.

Problem with Auris was that it ended up being cheap, fleet car, and first gen was pretty issue prone so that is why they are moving back to Corolla brand.
And new Corolla in Europe will still end up being a fleet car, maybe a bit better than before in that sense (little bit more private buyers), but if they want to sell it at some higher prices, they still need other cars on same platform like CT or UX.

When you sell base Corolla for $18k, you cant expect people to buy same looking car for $35k because it has more equipment, it just does not have that cachet.

Otherwise, in Japan, they are also doing huge renovation of dealer network, 50% of the Toyota cars will disappear, like it happened with new Crown, and they will consolidate under single brand name (right now Toyota has 4 different dealer networks in Japan that sell different cars... more here:
https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Companies/Toyota-to-break-down-walls-of-dealerships-in-Japan

 

[Will1991]

It's really an important model for Europe, even with current SUV trend the hatchback segment is huge!

Even inside VAG group with VW Golf (with interior materials quite a lot superior facing the almost-out-of-production Auris) they have a lot of market for Audi A3.

It's a different target audience in my view.

 

[spwolf]

It's really an important model for Europe, even with current SUV trend the hatchback segment is huge!

Even inside VAG group with VW Golf (with interior materials quite a lot superior facing the almost-out-of-production Auris) they have a lot of market for Audi A3.

It's a different target audience in my view.

Not to mention that A3 interior is worse than Golfs

 

[flexus]

It's really an important model for Europe, even with current SUV trend the hatchback segment is huge!

Even inside VAG group with VW Golf (with interior materials quite a lot superior facing the almost-out-of-production Auris) they have a lot of market for Audi A3.

It's a different target audience in my view.

Thats correct. Hatchbacks will always sell well in Europe and Japan. CT, Mazda 3, 1 series, A-Class aren't popular because they are cheapest offering of luxury brand but their size is important. Even in Finland where there is now oldtowns I would buy IS or CT because of their size.

 

[flexus]

Also hatchbacks are considered sporty in Japan that's why Corollas main model is sedan and Japanese consider that new Corolla arrives this year as sedan. Corolla hatchback is in fact callet Corolla Sport.
My dream is that next gen CT has front grille of ES, headlights of NX or Corolla Sport, body of Mazda 3, C pilar of RX. Powertrains should be 1.2 turbo, 2.0 NA, 2.0 Hybrid, Plug in and EV.

 

[Sadman]

Thats correct. Hatchbacks will always sell well in Europe and Japan. CT, Mazda 3, 1 series, A-Class aren't popular because they are cheapest offering of luxury brand but their size is important. Even in Finland where there is now oldtowns I would buy IS or CT because of their size.

Most of the German premium hatchbacks are often bought because of the badge they carry on the front, really.

Speaking at least for my own country, you can see tons of A Class, A3 and some 1 Series (though it has always been kind of a niche car because RWD) each and every one of them being mostly entry level engines (the infamous Renault 1.6 diesel for the A Class and the gutless 1.6 TDI for the A3/Golf/etc..) pumped with every kind of obnoxious AMG packet or S-Line pack with 18" rims to look sporty. Inside it's the same, barebone stock and entry level with 1 or 2 optionals...one day I saw near my house a fully loaded M sport 1 Series 114d (3 cylinder diesel engine) with every kind of gadged and such.

I mean, the new A Class has a rear torsion beam axle suspension instead of the multilink it used to have in the old model and the same goes for the A3 which has the same torsion beam for engines under 150 hp if I recall correctly.

Meanwhile cars like the Alfa Romeo Giulietta - which I admit as of today is old and need a replacement - and the Mazda 3 are ignored in place of these German entry level alternative which are for some reason praised for their driving dynamics and interior quality which nobody can experience if they keep buying entry/mid level trims, diesel especially.

It's a lost cause, when the media here praises German cars (oh and you all know the reason behind this...) and people sh*t on cars like the CT which single handedly has the best interior of the class (speaking about quality and fit and finish - also notice how the new Audi and Mercedes at the same time have lowered their quality inside) and offers the innovative hybrid technology - which they always forgot it's here since 1997 - all of this while going as fast as their entry level diesel engines but in a way more refined way.

What about another alternative like, uh, a Volvo V40? People here probably ignore its existence.

I'm really curious to see what is going to happen now that diesel is experiencing a well deserved crisis (a cospicuos number of people who buy diesels drive the car mostly in the city which is crazy), Toyota is going to sell the new Corolla hybrid with the new 179 hp power step and an intriguing 0-62 mph time rated at 7,9 seconds.

Will they stop bashing the hybrids now saying that they're slow and boring cars? Really looking forward to know the answer.

 

[F1 Silver Arrows]

The replacement for the Giulietta is coming. But RWD. >

 

[Sadman]

The replacement for the Giulietta is coming. But RWD. >

The "new" Giulietta will be an MCA model, so it'll basically be a heavy renovation of the current model inside out and it's absolutely possible that it's going to still be FWD.

Something like VW Golf V --> Golf VI or Opel Corsa D --> Corsa E

 

[F1 Silver Arrows]

The "new" Giulietta will be an MCA model, so it'll basically be a heavy renovation of the current model inside out and it's absolutely possible that it's going to still be FWD.

Something like VW Golf V --> Golf VI or Opel Corsa D --> Corsa E

Car and Driver reported from Alfa Romeo that the next Giulietta is RWD. So there's that.