Lexus IS 200t Coming to Canada, New IS 300 AWD Also Announced

[IS-SV]

My point is, it makes absolutely no sense to be offering two different versions of the 3.5L V6 on the same model, yet using different tunes and different numerical designations.

Sounds kind of like BMW 328 vs 320 w/detuned version of 2.0L turbo4.

 

[Gecko]

I thought about this a bit over the weekend... while it seems like a bizarre move, looking at the specs:

3.5L V6
255 hp
236 lb-ft
AWD
0-60 in 6.1
(not sure on MPG yet)
(it might take regular gas, if it's derived from the Camry/ES V6)

... this is actually a somewhat compelling car and might be fun to drive, if you compare it to an A4 2.0T or 328i XDrive.

2.0T is all "ooooh" and "ahhhh" because it's new, but if you want an AWD entry level sedan, IS has a leg-up with the standard V6 (IMO).

 

[CIF]

Sounds kind of like BMW 328 vs 320 w/detuned version of 2.0L turbo4.

I hope that's not the case, but it unfortunately could be. Lexus to date has had a great, clear model designation system.

I thought about this a bit over the weekend... while it seems like a bizarre move, looking at the specs:

3.5L V6
255 hp
236 lb-ft
AWD
0-60 in 6.1
(not sure on MPG yet)
(it might take regular gas, if it's derived from the Camry/ES V6)

... this is actually a somewhat compelling car and might be fun to drive, if you compare it to an A4 2.0T or 328i XDrive.

2.0T is all "ooooh" and "ahhhh" because it's new, but if you want an AWD entry level sedan, IS has a leg-up with the standard V6 (IMO).

So then what happens with the IS350? Surely the rumor of Canada losing the IS350 can't be true. Will this IS300 be extended to other markets? Is there an IS350 replacement coming then? So many questions, very little answers from the Lexus PR.

Sure in a vacuum, this car sounds great. But since there's also going to be an IS200t, at least on paper, specs are really close to the IS200t.

 

[Andyl]

I hope that's not the case, but it unfortunately could be. Lexus to date has had a great, clear model designation system.



So then what happens with the IS350? Surely the rumor of Canada losing the IS350 can't be true. Will this IS300 be extended to other markets? Is there an IS350 replacement coming then? So many questions, very little answers from the Lexus PR.

Sure in a vacuum, this car sounds great. But since there's also going to be an IS200t, at least on paper, specs are really close to the IS200t.

From the Canadian press release for the 16' IS, it shows IS350 AWD is still available. Details of the packages were in the press.

However, IS350 RWD is not mentioned at all. So it is highly likely that it will be chopped in Canadian market for 16'.

 

[IS-SV]

I hope that's not the case, but it unfortunately could be. Lexus to date has had a great, clear model designation system.
.

Regarding BMW 320/328 2.0Lturbo4 variations, I've seen Awd version of the lower horsepower 320 version too.

 

[Gecko]

Most disappointing of all to me - Lexus did not announced an upgraded top end V6 for the IS 350, GS 350, RC 350, etc.

This engine is now a decade old, the competition has caught up, and even Lexus' new entry level engines are nipping on it's heels. The right thing to do would have been to introduce all new engines, 2.0T, 3.5L for AWD and an upgraded 3.5L with some ~330hp.

Quite frankly, if it was me shopping right now, I'd have a hard time dishing out the extra cash for an IS 350 when the 2.0T should be so torquey in real world driving with better MPG.

 

[CIF]

From the Canadian press release for the 16' IS, it shows IS350 AWD is still available. Details of the packages were in the press.

However, IS350 RWD is not mentioned at all. So it is highly likely that it will be chopped in Canadian market for 16'.

More questions unfortunately.

Regarding BMW 320/328 2.0Lturbo4 variations, I've seen Awd version of the lower horsepower 320 version too.

Indeed. I can't imagine how underpowered a 320 AWD must feel.

Most disappointing of all to me - Lexus did not announced an upgraded top end V6 for the IS 350, GS 350, RC 350, etc.

This engine is now a decade old, the competition has caught up, and even Lexus' new entry level engines are nipping on it's heels. The right thing to do would have been to introduce all new engines, 2.0T, 3.5L for AWD and an upgraded 3.5L with some ~330hp.

Quite frankly, if it was me shopping right now, I'd have a hard time dishing out the extra cash for an IS 350 when the 2.0T should be so torquey in real world driving with better MPG.

I agree 100% with not hearing about a replacement for the 3.5L V6. Then again, they are rumored to be working on one.

As for the 2.0T vs the 3.5L V6, the main difference is that the 2.0T won't feel as smooth as that 2GR V6. For some that still matters a lot. I personally prefer to get the smoothest engine whenever possible.

 

[krew]

Good question. There's even speculation it may actually be derived from the new 3.5L D-4S but the higher torque of this engine doesn't seem to line up with the much lower torque figure of the 3.5 in the IS 300.

I've been told it's a detuned 3.5 L 2GR-FSE V6 from the IS 350, but that's unconfirmed.

 

[IS-SV]

Most disappointing of all to me - Lexus did not announced an upgraded top end V6 for the IS 350, GS 350, RC 350, etc.

This engine is now a decade old, the competition has caught up, and even Lexus' new entry level engines are nipping on it's heels. The right thing to do would have been to introduce all new engines, 2.0T, 3.5L for AWD and an upgraded 3.5L with some ~330hp.

Quite frankly, if it was me shopping right now, I'd have a hard time dishing out the extra cash for an IS 350 when the 2.0T should be so torquey in real world driving with better MPG.

I have same concern. I'm interested in possibly owning RC coupe but since it weighs 350+pounds over my current IS350, it really needs some additional hp.

Note: today I'm driving a 2013 IS250 loaner for contrast.

 

[IS-SV]

More questions unfortunately.

As for the 2.0T vs the 3.5L V6, the main difference is that the 2.0T won't feel as smooth as that 2GR V6. For some that still matters a lot. I personally prefer to get the smoothest engine whenever possible.

I'm not convinced of that, but I still need to drive IS w/2.0T.

I am driving a IS250 loaner today and driving it back to back with my Mercedes Turbo4. The Mercedes turbo4 is as smooth and quiet as the small V6 all the way to redline with slightly better power and significantly better torque (it's faster). If smoothness is the main criteria (as compared to the 2 Lexus V6's, 2.5 and 3.5), then Mercedes has it dialed with its 1.8 and 2.0 turbo 4's. I've driven all extensively for hundreds to thousands of miles and I am very picky about NVH especially in top of rev range. My opinion is engine in premium car should sound like a premium engine, without the 4 banger thrashing so common in mainstream Toyota, Honda, GM, Chrysler cars.

If Mercedes can do it (small displacement sub 2.0 L close to square turbo4 w/balance shaft required to accomplish btw), I would hope Lexus could too. Like you, I demand smoothest engines too.

 

[corradoMR2]

I'm not convinced of that, but I still need to drive IS w/2.0T.

I am driving a IS250 loaner today and driving it back to back with my Mercedes Turbo4. The Mercedes turbo4 is as smooth and quiet as the small V6 all the way to redline with slightly better power and significantly better torque (it's faster). If smoothness is the main criteria (as compared to the 2 Lexus V6's, 2.5 and 3.5), then Mercedes has it dialed with its 1.8 and 2.0 turbo 4's. I've driven all extensively for hundreds to thousands of miles and I am very picky about NVH especially in top of rev range. My opinion is engine in premium car should sound like a premium engine, without the 4 banger thrashing so common in mainstream Toyota, Honda, GM, Chrysler cars.

If Mercedes can do it (small displacement sub 2.0 L close to square turbo4 w/balance shaft required to accomplish btw), I would hope Lexus could too. Like you, I demand smoothest engines too.

NX's 2L Turbo is exceptionally smooth and I'd go as far as saying more quiet (better NVH) than the 250's V6 in the higher revs. But sound... V6 much better.

 

[IS-SV]

NX's 2L Turbo is exceptionally smooth and I'd go as far as saying more quiet (better NVH) than the 250's V6 in the higher revs. But sound... V6 much better.

'13 IS250 loaner on 17's ^

Good points about quietness and what I would expect from top tier premium car company, because typical 4 banger soundtrack would not be acceptable so it's better off silenced. The turbocharger contributes to the silencing too. The Mercedes C250 turbo4 is also quieter all the way to redline and sounds quite sweet getting there, no unacceptable cheap 4 banger thrashing sound at all. I don't find it to be any less desirable soundtrack than the 2 stock V6's. Mercedes dialed it in (the soundtrack) and not by accident. Lexus needs to be careful about tuning the "sound quality" when they put that thing in a sport sedan, it's a different audience/buyer.

Although the sound of stock Lexus V6 is nice, no comparison to a stock Porsche flat six from a soundtrack standpoint.

Of course the semi-exotic soundtrack of a FSport exhaust on Lexus V6 is something else... (and something I prefer over any 4 banger)

 

[spwolf]

My point is, it makes absolutely no sense to be offering two different versions of the 3.5L V6 on the same model, yet using different tunes and different numerical designations.

why not? BMW dooes that with all of their engines... some of them have 5 different designations for same engine/displacement.

 

[spwolf]

Looking at Lexus UK specs for 2.0t, they show it being around 120lbs lighter than 250... and also between 400lbs and 600lbs lighter than NX 2.0t AWD (depending on equipment)... so it should be quite faster than NX and IS, despite the official numbers of 0-62 in 7.0s (NX is 7.3s in UK). NX 2.0t has already shown to have good in-gear acceleration according to comparos, and IS200t should be even nicer... I would say considerably so if it is 500lbs lighter on average. Exact numbers are tricky to find since due to equipment, each EU country is showing slightly different weights.

 

[Joaquin Ruhi]

Looking at Lexus UK specs for 2.0t, they show it being around 120lbs lighter than 250... and also between 400lbs and 600lbs lighter than NX 2.0t AWD (depending on equipment)... so it should be quite faster than NX and IS, despite the official numbers of 0-62 in 7.0s (NX is 7.3s in UK). NX 2.0t has already shown to have good in-gear acceleration according to comparos, and IS200t should be even nicer... I would say considerably so if it is 500lbs lighter on average. Exact numbers are tricky to find since due to equipment, each EU country is showing slightly different weights.

I'm curious...where exactly did you read that "Lexus UK specs for 2.0t, they show it being around 120lbs lighter than 250"? Do you have a link? What I've read in the Lexus UK and Europe newsrooms indicates a curb weight range that shows the IS 200t to be 35 kg (77 lbs) heavier than the IS 250.

 

[spwolf]

I'm curious...where exactly did you read that "Lexus UK specs for 2.0t, they show it being around 120lbs lighter than 250"? Do you have a link? What I've read in the Lexus UK and Europe newsrooms indicates a curb weight range that shows the IS 200t to be 35 kg (77 lbs) heavier than the IS 250.

I went to Lexus Europe website, which is aggregate EU site... They are the ones that do PR's.
http://www.lexus.eu/car-models/is/is-250/#BuildYourIS

There is also PDF broschure from Lexus.de that shows 40kg difference.
http://kontakt.lexus.de/lexus/v10/e...rd&bhash=E6EFA039-3F5C-4F9B-8008-C28CB0C1B824

Unfortunately every online lexus site has different numbers Our Toyota Europe brochures are much more detailed, they show weight for each equipment/engine combo, not just minimum weight like what many others do.

 

[CIF]

why not? BMW dooes that with all of their engines... some of them have 5 different designations for same engine/displacement.

So if BMW does it, then Lexus has to as well?

I don't really understand your logic here.

I'm genuinely curious to hear a valid reason or reasons as to why Lexus should all of a sudden start changing around the logical numerical nomenclature of its lineup. Saying "because BMW does it" is not a valid reason.

 

[mmcartalk]

I wish Lexus had done an AWD version of the RWD 1Gen IS300, with the 3.0L straight-six, that I owned for almost 5 years.......I would have bought one in a heartbeat. I liked that IS, especially its chronograph gauges, chrome-ball shifter, and bright yellow paint......but it was a complete dog on really slippery roads, even with all season tires, snow-mode for the transmission, and traction control (but didn't have VSC).

 

[Joaquin Ruhi]

I'm curious...where exactly did you read that "Lexus UK specs for 2.0t, they show it being around 120lbs lighter than 250"? Do you have a link? What I've read in the Lexus UK and Europe newsrooms indicates a curb weight range that shows the IS 200t to be 35 kg (77 lbs) heavier than the IS 250.

I went to Lexus Europe website, which is aggregate EU site... They are the ones that do PR's.
http://www.lexus.eu/car-models/is/is-250/#BuildYourIS

There is also PDF broschure from Lexus.de that shows 40kg difference.
http://kontakt.lexus.de/lexus/v10/e...rd&bhash=E6EFA039-3F5C-4F9B-8008-C28CB0C1B824

Unfortunately every online lexus site has different numbers Our Toyota Europe brochures are much more detailed, they show weight for each equipment/engine combo, not just minimum weight like what many others do.

Wow! I was surprised to see such different numbers in that German Lexus brochure which, if accurate, suggest the IS 200t might be lighter than the IS 250 after all.

Given that new bit of information, I revised the curb weight section of the 2016 IS 200t commentary article I wrote for my.IS:

http://my.is/forums/f41/2016-lexus-sedans-europe-updated-551945/#post7906225

Having said that, I want to be wrong but feel pessimistic and think that the IS 200t will be heavier than the IS 250. Let's see what the North American numbers are like...

 

[spwolf]

Wow! I was surprised to see such different numbers in that German Lexus brochure which, if accurate, suggest the IS 200t might be lighter than the IS 250 after all.

Given that new bit of information, I revised the curb weight section of the 2016 IS 200t commentary article I wrote for my.IS:
http://my.is/forums/f41/2016-lexus-sedans-europe-updated-551945/#post7906225

Having said that, I want to be wrong but feel pessimistic and think that the IS 200t will be heavier than the IS 250. Let's see what the North American numbers are like...

UK numbers feel very suspect to me... same goes for NX numbers, it says it is lighter than what it actually is - what we know from comparos... for instance figure I found on Lexus.AT brochure was almost 200kg heavier than UK and much closer to reality.

Keep in mind that official lexus.eu page said 1645kg for IS250, which is where my original comment came from:
http://www.lexus.eu/car-models/is/is-250/#BuildYourIS