Lexus Future BEV Thread

ssun30

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Is this our first glimpse of the next-gen LS BEV ("LZ")?
1.png

Also, 200km+ EV range PHEV planned in the future. (I think this is the most interesting part of the briefing)

Officially moved away from FCEV on passenger cars and focus on commercial vehicles instead.
 

internalaudit

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Going to watched the hour-long presentation lol now that I am up.

Anything on battery technology? :)
 

internalaudit

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Sounds like 10 BEV models by 2026? Hopefully, there will be enough supply to go around. Wait times for HEVs, PHEVs and BEVs are crazy long in Canada. It's almost like JIT or even build after the customer order haha.

Toyota is taking the shot gun approach on propulsion systems, which is good.

New BEV unit, all in one team!

BEV production is limited by battery supply!
 
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Ali Manai

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Is this our first glimpse of the next-gen LS BEV ("LZ")?
View attachment 6890

Also, 200km+ EV range PHEV planned in the future. (I think this is the most interesting part of the briefing)

Officially moved away from FCEV on passenger cars and focus on commercial vehicles instead.
Yeah their were rumours circulating that mirai might get a hybrid powertrain and with them switching fcev to commercial it does make sense
 

mikeavelli

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3 row EV crossover made in NC
Evolution of currant plants. Possible EV only plants
Lexus to lead EV charge
Complete rethink of EV engineering. evolution of E-TNGa
Will still offer a mix of offerings not EV only. Hoping for carbon neutrality
Hybrids now more profitable than ICE only vehicles
PHEV with 120 miles of range ūüė≥
There is more that stuck out to me…..

Oh and that image is supposedly a Lexus fastback from what the press is saying
 
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Ali Manai

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1.5 million global sales is doable for toyota since large part of it will come from china
 

Sulu

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Here is a summary of the new electrification strategy:
  • Greater emphasis on the development of battery electric vehicles (BEVs) compared to the previous management
  • Launch 10 new battery electric vehicles (BEVs) by 2026
  • New estimate of selling 1.5 million BEVs per year by 2026
  • New 3-row SUV to be produced in the US, with batteries from the North Carolina plant
  • Ready for production (some already previewed as concepts, including Tacoma EV, Crown EVs, bZ Compact SUV):
    • 2 new EVs for China for launch in 2024 (joining the bZ4X SUV and the bZ3 sedan China)
    • Small EV and fully electric pickup trucks for Asia and other emerging markets to enter production by the end of 2023
  • Next-generation battery electric vehicles (BEVs) to arrive after 2026, combining greater efficiency with even more exciting driving characteristics, offering ‚Äúdouble the range by using batteries with far greater efficiency‚ÄĚ
  • Hiroki Nakajima, Executive Vice President of Toyota announces formation of new, specialized unit at Toyota, led by a ‚Äúsingle leader with full authority‚ÄĚ, responsible for all aspects of the development, production, and business operations related to electric vehicles, an ‚Äúall-in-one team‚ÄĚ to handle every function related to EVs
  • Continue to make its hybrid vehicles more efficient and affordable and offering plug-in hybrids with an extended EV-only range of over 200 km (124 miles)
  • Continue pursuing development of hydrogen and other alternative fuels
  • Regional priorities:
    • Large SUVs and pickups for America
    • Driver-orientated cars for Europe
    • Compact vehicles and minivans for Japan
    • Electrification for China
    • Focus on quality, reliability, and affordability for global South
 
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Continue to make its hybrid vehicles more efficient and affordable and offering plug-in hybrids with an extended EV-only range of over 200 km (124 miles)
Like do we really even need EVs at this point if they're going to offer PHEVs that have over 200km range?

If anything this tells me we're going to have our vroom vrooms for practically the foreseeable future and that makes me happy.

Continue pursuing development of hydrogen and other alternative fuels
This makes me happy too. :)
 

LS500-18

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Continue to make its hybrid vehicles more efficient and affordable and offering plug-in hybrids with an extended EV-only range of over 200 km (124 miles)
Why would anyone buy an EV if this existed? WOW! I love PHEVs, have had plugin Prius and RAV4 Prime (and 2 Teslas). PHEV makes a lot of sense but most have so little EV range they just aren't desirable.

It's unfortunate that government regulations, government (taxpayer) buying incentives and Tesla "cool" factor has resulted in so many people becoming so closed minded on future technologies.
 

LateToLexus

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I'm not really battery literate. Will this purported doubling in battery range/efficiency also mean a dramatic decrease in charging times?

While we've entertained an electric vehicle, the time difference between charging an electric vehicle and gassing up an ICE is a big deterrent for us.
 

mikeavelli

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I'm not really battery literate. Will this purported doubling in battery range/efficiency also mean a dramatic decrease in charging times?

While we've entertained an electric vehicle, the time difference between charging an electric vehicle and gassing up an ICE is a big deterrent for us.

Yes. As the tech improves battery charging will improve. The biggest increase will be for fast charging to get to 80% in hopefully around 20 minutes.
 

Sulu

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Why would anyone buy an EV if this existed? WOW! I love PHEVs, have had plugin Prius and RAV4 Prime (and 2 Teslas). PHEV makes a lot of sense but most have so little EV range they just aren't desirable.
That was my first thought also. But it got me thinking what trade-offs were (or will be) necessary in order to combine a battery big enough to provide 200km of range AND an internal combustion engine.

Is this only possible with the perfect high-capacity solid-state battery? When will that battery come? And if it is that good, do we need an ICE range extender?

What about that range extender? Is it only a small, weak serial-hybrid range extender that will never drive the wheels, and not the more-powerful engine in the serial-parallel hybrid that enthusiasts have come to rely upon when we need more power?
 

ssun30

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What about that range extender? Is it only a small, weak serial-hybrid range extender that will never drive the wheels, and not the more-powerful engine in the serial-parallel hybrid that enthusiasts have come to rely upon when we need more power?
Range extenders are extremely inefficient unless it's a dedicated generator design like Toyota's free-piston linear generator. I wonder what happened to that project. It has a tank-to-battery efficiency of 40% and produces 15kW/cylinder. So for continuous driving 2 cylinders are needed for a compact car and 4 cylinders for a 3-row SUV.

Mazda MX-30 PHEV has a 830cc rotary making only 20kW and has a fuel efficiency of 27 MPG when the battery is depleted. That is embarrassingly inefficient. Not even the most dedicated rotary fan would want to buy a 27hp 27MPG car with a rotary engine.

A full 50L tank and 17.8kWh battery gives the MX-30 600km range in WLTP cycle. The Prius Prime gets 940km EPA cycle range with a full 40L tank and 13.6kWh battery AND has 60 more horsepower.

I'm imagining a Prius Prime with a 350V solid-state battery with ~80Ah capacity for a total of 28kWh and 112kW@4C. Using a energy density of 400Wh/kg the battery cells would weigh only 70kg and the entire pack at 117kg assuming 60% packing efficiency. That's 13kg lighter than current Prius Prime's 130kg battery. The ICE side doesn't need to be changed at all. It could be a drop-in upgrade together with a faster level 2 charger (mayba 240V@48A).
 
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ssun30

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I'm not really battery literate. Will this purported doubling in battery range/efficiency also mean a dramatic decrease in charging times?

While we've entertained an electric vehicle, the time difference between charging an electric vehicle and gassing up an ICE is a big deterrent for us.
The 2026 new architecture will be 800V and supports up to 350kW charging with CCS 2.0 but realistically the time savings is ~40% vs. a 150kW charger (charging curves for batteries are not linear). So it would still take ~18-25min to charge 10-80% depending on battery size.

ChaDeMo 3.0/Chaoji supports up to 900kW charging @1.5kV so theoretically a car can be charged in 5 min but I doubt that number would be achievable this decade. It's way too high C-rate and maybe only designed for charging semi-trucks. Plus the charging cable would require cryogenic cooling to handle the heat. I haven't seen any car company planning to introduce 1kV+ architecture for BEVs because of safety concerns.