Official: Toyota’s GR GT3 Concept will become the GR GT production car

[bogglo]

Some of us actually have insider knowledge of stuff. I've shown Gecko stuff that will never see the light of day. People here have shared the same with me.

Toyoda is actively de-centering it.

It's never been a focus or something they're serious about other than low hanging luxury margin fruit, and a test bed for offerings they didn't want to risk having under the Toyota brand.

Kirk is literally just a public figure promoting vehicles and creating entertaining videos. Nobody is giving dudes like that actual insider anything. That's not an insult, it's just reality, the real intent is hidden and held back for a core group of people who operate below the line. Everyone else needs air to breath, and are above it.

He's an extension of their public relations and marketing team. Their entire value proposition is being yes-men for corporates in exchange for access. Just the way it works. Larry Chen, others are no different.

And yes, Akio is stupid. He was born into a position he isn't qualified for and he's propped up by harder working people than himself. If that company had actual visionary leadership do you know what they could actually deliver given their economies of scale?

Akio Toyoda is stupid and people who deify guys like him aren't on the ball either 🤷.

If Koji was allowed to play is position what will your view of Lexus future be based on what you and others know?

 

[Ian Schmidt]

I'm not an insider and don't play one on TV, but from what I've seen Koji is a non-entity. Now is when we should be seeing announcements about products he was interested in and instead everything's been indistinguishable from when Akio had the CEO title.

 

[F1 Silver Arrows]

Read the comments section to see how the general enthusiast public thinks about this.

Also, as an aside, I saw on a YouTube Short that the GR GT has the new Lexus chime when the car fires up. As if stealing the car from Lexus wasn't enough insult to injury.

 

[LCLFV]

They seem indifferent? Of course with the way this car will be priced it's not meant "for us" so it remains to be seen what exactly Toyota wants to do with this new brand and who its target audience is. So far it's following Polestar's footsteps with an "exotic" car to introduce the brand and make some noise (though to what degree of success is too early to say) followed by a more mainstream, accessible vehicle which from reports appears to be a new MR2/Celica. That vehicle will be far more important in determining the longevity of the brand than the GR GT.

The other question is, if the the GR GT is sold at Lexus dealerships, then what about future GR-branded vehicles? Still sold at Toyota?

 

[DarkSpace6383]

They seem indifferent? Of course with the way this car will be priced it's not meant "for us" so it remains to be seen what exactly Toyota wants to do with this new brand and who its target audience is. So far it's following Polestar's footsteps with an "exotic" car to introduce the brand and make some noise (though to what degree of success is too early to say) followed by a more mainstream, accessible vehicle which from reports appears to be a new MR2/Celica. That vehicle will be far more important in determining the longevity of the brand than the GR GT.

The other question is, if the the GR GT is sold at Lexus dealerships, then what about future GR-branded vehicles? Still sold at Toyota?

Based on what I have read up, GR as a brand will be sold at Lexus dealers, and they will be completely separate from Toyota vehicles. They are expected to be more performance oriented and premium than your average Corolla or Camry. However, similar to Volvo/Polestar, Toyota will be getting GR SPORT variants of some of their models, similar to the polestar engineered trims that Volvo has. I would imagine certain dealerships would become "Lexus and GR of xyz."

I don't personally think it will fall into the same trap as Viper, because GR is pretty well respected amongst people, especially the younger audience (as a highschooler the amount of people in my school who want a Supra, 86, or GR Corolla is absolutely crazy). GRGT will absolutely be the top dog, and its not a volume seller, so I think for brand success where we really need to look at is what the current reputation is amongst people for Supra, GR86, etc. Currently this reputation is rather positive, and Toyota is cultivating a whole generation of people who love these products, and are growing up seeing a GR car as the attainable dream car. I think Dodge just had really bad execution.

Now furthermore, on a personal level this is something that I like to see. "GR" being spun off commands a level of presence that a Toyota simply cannot offer, especially now that they are releasing a whole model-line of cars. Toyota is seen by many as fairly economical, and with them wanting to release more and more high-end versions of cars like the MR2 and Supra (GRMN variants), it just doesnt make sense. Ultimately, at least in my opinion, the GRGT, while better than this LFA EV nonsense, is a car that does not fit within the Lexus brand, as despite it having some Lexus qualities through things like fit and finish, the overall design just does not feel like an elegant Lexus car. GR becoming something bigger and having more independence is a step in the right direction, but that's just my opinion. NOW, this does not mean Toyota is doing everything right.

My main grievances over TMC's decisions has been with them sacrificing Lexus as a result of this, when in reality I firmly believe this is something they could do without it costing Lexus. What they SHOULD be doing with the introduction of GR is having Lexus variants be higher-end, more beautiful and refined versions of their GR counterparts (I am fully aware this is not happening, but its what I believe SHOULD happen). For example, with the LFA, it should ideally have a more powerful version of the GRGT V8 that is able to use a solid-state hybrid system (so it is small and light) coupled with the GRGT's TTV8 to generate more HP (idk probably closer to 900). It sacrifices a little bit of rawness for refined power but can still maintain a degree of driver engagement. I am ok with a fully BEV version existing in ADDITION to a hybrid. Oh yeah also a racing version. Lexus F Racing needs to be back and better than ever. I am talking GT3 Racing, Formula E (they seem to be the electric pioneer after all) and also maybe also having their version of the Toyota LMDH (Audi and Porsche were doing this idea, and developed the cars, until Audi got in bed with F1). They should also release something that would in theory be an RC/LC replacement, that is a through and through F car, (lower-end car, costs maybe cost around 80k) and is based on the Supra, has a 6-cylinder engine that's based on the GRGT V8 Architecture, and can go head-on with BMW's M4. Maybe when I have the time or if I feel like it I outline my pr

I concede that this is one hell of a rant, as I am just typing whatever comes to mind. So the TLDR is this: I believe GR can exist as its own brand and do pretty well since I think it will outgrow the Toyota umbrella. Most of my TMC issues are with Lexus, as there is a way to co-exist, and actually build/thrive off each other.

 

[Levi]

So the Lexus GSof ISF could come back as a GR Sedan?

 

[ssun30]

Something very few people talk about is it's huge size. With an overall length of 4820mm it's bigger than almost every grand tourer on the market. The 1st gen AMG GT and LFA are both ~4600mm long and even the full size 2+2 8 series is just 4840mm long.

BestCar had predicted its length to be 4600mm, and I think the first GR GT concept was 4700mm long. I now suspect Mag X's rumor was also correct: at some point they wanted to redesign it into a 2+2, because gen 2 AMG GT did that, but then cancelled that plan because of more delays.

The more we look at this vehicle's history, the more it exposes how poor Toyota's project planning and management is when they step slightly out of their comfort zone. We already saw similar things with the entire GA-L lineup. They can design and engineer their familiar GA-K cookie cutter products very quickly. But the moment they have to do something hard, they seem to lose focus and discipline. Specs keep changing and the product gets increasingly compromised as the project gets one delay after another.

 

[DarkSpace6383]

So the Lexus GSof ISF could come back as a GR Sedan?

I am saying they should base the next-gen IS/F on the Supra platform. I think the ES/GS should just be combined into a single model for it's next generation. This current one (2026) is atrocious, and I think they should just leave it for China where it will actually sell. Maybe here make the ES an actual competitor to the 5er.

 

[F1 Silver Arrows]

They seem indifferent? Of course with the way this car will be priced it's not meant "for us" so it remains to be seen what exactly Toyota wants to do with this new brand and who its target audience is. So far it's following Polestar's footsteps with an "exotic" car to introduce the brand and make some noise (though to what degree of success is too early to say) followed by a more mainstream, accessible vehicle which from reports appears to be a new MR2/Celica. That vehicle will be far more important in determining the longevity of the brand than the GR GT.

The other question is, if the the GR GT is sold at Lexus dealerships, then what about future GR-branded vehicles? Still sold at Toyota?

They don't seem indifferent IMHO. If you read the comments most of them are in defence of Toyota spinning off GR to be their own brand and are disagreeing with the premise of the article. They don't realize that F was being cannibalized for GR.

I think there's space for both performance divisions, but alas... it is what it is.

 

[NomadDan]

The part I don’t understand with the whole GR brand is what happens to cars like the GR Yaris, GR Corolla, GR Supra, or hypothetical GR Celica? Will those cars now be sold at Lexus dealers, or can they still be purchased at Toyota dealers? It seems dumb to have Corollas and Supras at Lexus dealers.

Toyota GR and Lexus F just makes so much more sense from a marketing and brand ID perspective. I don’t get it. Toyota/Lexus marketing and decision making seems so disconnected from reality.

 

[F1 Silver Arrows]

The part I don’t understand with the whole GR brand is what happens to cars like the GR Yaris, GR Corolla, GR Supra, or hypothetical GR Celica? Will those cars now be sold at Lexus dealers, or can they still be purchased at Toyota dealers? It seems dumb to have Corollas and Supras at Lexus dealers.

Toyota GR and Lexus F just makes so much more sense from a marketing and brand ID perspective. I don’t get it. Toyota/Lexus marketing and decision making seems so disconnected from reality.

This.

I'm one of the few people that loves Akio Toyoda for what he has done for Toyota and still do, but the spinning off of GR is insanely asinine and shortsighted IMHO. It seems like a vanity project at this point, rather than bringing up Toyota and Lexus' stature in the global automotive space.

 

[DarkSpace6383]

The part I don’t understand with the whole GR brand is what happens to cars like the GR Yaris, GR Corolla, GR Supra, or hypothetical GR Celica? Will those cars now be sold at Lexus dealers, or can they still be purchased at Toyota dealers? It seems dumb to have Corollas and Supras at Lexus dealers.

Toyota GR and Lexus F just makes so much more sense from a marketing and brand ID perspective. I don’t get it. Toyota/Lexus marketing and decision making seems so disconnected from reality.

From what I have read, Yaris and Corolla GR will be a one-and-done thing. The Celica will be expected to succeed it in rallying with GR4 technology.

 

[Levi]

From what I have read, Yaris and Corolla GR will be a one-and-done thing. The Celica will be expected to succeed it in rallying with GR4 technology.

But Toyota will still have the GR Sport trim.

 

[DarkSpace6383]

But Toyota will still have the GR Sport trim.

GR Sport will be sold at Toyota dealers. The full on GR variants will be sold at Lexus dealers. They will be completely different models. It wont be like Toyota Corolla and GR Corolla. No GR model will have a regular Toyota variant and vice versa.

 

[LCLFV]

GR Sport will be sold at Toyota dealers. The full on GR variants will be sold at Lexus dealers. They will be completely different models. It wont be like Toyota Corolla and GR Corolla. No GR model will have a regular Toyota variant and vice versa.

That won't make any sense. Lexus won't use the GR moniker, even the RX will be "RR" not GR.

I think the GR GT will be the exception to the norm and sold at Lexus dealerships, whereas other GR vehicles will be sold at Toyota dealerships like the Crown lineup. Only question is if Akio's ego can tolerate such a thing and he'll eventually demand GR have standalone showrooms.

 

[DarkSpace6383]

That won't make any sense. Lexus won't use the GR moniker, even the RX will be "RR" not GR.

I think the GR GT will be the exception to the norm and sold at Lexus dealerships, whereas other GR vehicles will be sold at Toyota dealerships like the Crown lineup. Only question is if Akio's ego can tolerate such a thing and he'll eventually demand GR have standalone showrooms.

I never said that Lexus will use GR on their models, just that ALL GR cars will be sold at Lexus dealers. I am just saying GR will be positioned as a premium performance brand, above Toyota. Lexus will have it's own performance branding (whatever that may be, but it seems to be F given the F-mode button on the electric LFA). The idea is they have GR cars, Lexus cars (including potential F models) sold at a GR LEXUS dealership or something.

 

[LCLFV]

Grifters gonna grift...

 

[mediumhot]

They don't seem indifferent IMHO. If you read the comments most of them are in defence of Toyota spinning off GR to be their own brand and are disagreeing with the premise of the article. They don't realize that F was being cannibalized for GR.

I think there's space for both performance divisions, but alas... it is what it is.

Toyota GR is the unification of racing divisions. There will be no Lexus in any sort of racing no more, except maybe some upcoming GT-EV racing series or Formula E. From now on sports racing is exclusive to Toyota Gazoo Racing.

 

[mediumhot]

View attachment 10860
Grifters gonna grift...

Well I guess they were right when they said Toyota couldn't. This thing is already outmatched by current Porsche 911 Turbo by a whole lot but the pricing will be the key. If it's priced like or under AMG GT 63 it would all kind of make sense; 100K less than 911 Turbo and beats AMG GT performance wise (probably) but I'm still skeptic about it beating 911 Carrera GTS for the same money. I'm just baffled why they settled for AMG GT as a target. They probably know something we don't but AMG GT3 Evo has struggled in racing so far, Lexus RC-F did so much better than it. We can only hope there will be "Turbo" variant on the horizon as Toyotas ultimate GT car cause so far this is really far off from Nissan GT-R debut close to two decades ago.

Anyway, I'm more interested in Lexus BEV LFA than this. You can tell this car is half arsed as a road car but probably nailed down as a GT3 race car. LFA on the other hand still has a chance to be on par with 992.2 Turbo S for less money.

 

[CRSKTN]

View attachment 10860
Grifters gonna grift...

I hope he gets ready to get humiliated again with his $300k, 600hp hack job that would've barely been competitive 5 years ago.

This is what happens when you're a copier and a thief and you have no vision of your own beyond what pertains to ego driven fantasies.