February 2016 Luxury Car Sales Thread

[Gecko]

To be fair, though, Cadillac has, in addition to the mid-size XT5 (SRX replacement), both an larger XT7 SUV and a compact CUV (probably the XT3) on the way.

Allegedly, the XT7 idea was canned and that prototype was the Chevy Traverse. Bad plan for Cadillac. They need something between the XT5 and Escalade very badly.

 

[Born2Drive]

I just don't see any success of Buick at all. Its flagship sedan is less than Avalon, and its flagship 3 row crossover doesn't actually cost more than a similarly equipped highlander. Is Toyota a luxury brand? I don't think so. And, those Toyota vehicles being sold way more. I don't get how Buick gets in the upper class?

Cadillac in bad situations has little to do with Buick. It is the management that messed up the American luxury brand. It tries to chase a game owned by the German, and almost totally lost its core values. The only true Cadillac today is Escalade. Its whole car line is laughable. Why should people buy those copycats? When originals are there only asking little more, and even many of those originals are facing a tough time to sell so well as before.

I don't think that FWD /RWD platforms make a big difference either. Not too long ago, American President was still riding in FWD based Cadilla(Cadillac was in a better position than today's).
Audi's sedan line and crossovers never has been RWD based. However, Audi is the most successful (in growth) luxury brand in the past 5-8 years, at least in my eyes.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

I just don't see any success of Buick at all. Its flagship sedan is less than Avalon, and its flagship 3 row crossover doesn't actually cost more than a similarly equipped highlander. Is Toyota a luxury brand? I don't think so. And, those Toyota vehicles being sold way more. I don't get how Buick gets in the upper class?

Having Buick & Caddy isn't the optimal thing for GM to do, but when Buick has a better image in China than it does here, they deemed it worthwhile not to kill the brand when they were downsizing during bankruptcy. Honestly, the line up is better but has to really tread lightly because of the potential overlap with Caddy. They would be better off it didn't have Buick and vice versa, because Ford doesn't even have Mercury around to cannibalize Lincoln.

Cadillac in bad situations has little to do with Buick. It is the management that messed up the American luxury brand. It tries to chase a game owned by the German, and almost totally lost its core values. The only true Cadillac today is Escalade. Its whole car line is laughable. Why should people buy those copycats? When originals are there only asking little more, and even many of those originals are facing a tough time to sell so well as before.

Lexus is doing the same thing chasing Germans, but differently, and Lexus has had the best success of any non-German luxury make. After all, every luxury maker has their sights on 'ze Germans'. The problem IMO, isn't the car line up, it is much better than it ever was, but again, its image besides the Escalade works against it for many luxo buyers (much of the same reasoning applies to Lexus too). I think the ATS-V and CTS-V are pretty badass in their own right, but of course, the casual luxury buyer may not notice the V Series models, and honestly, the price tag on certain ones are almost comparable with some of the German competition, and for many buyers, why get the Caddy when the BMW/Mercedes is more prestigious.

I don't think that FWD /RWD platforms make a big difference either. Not too long ago, American President was still riding in FWD based Cadilla(Cadillac was in a better position than today's).
Audi's sedan line and crossovers never has been RWD based. However, Audi is the most successful (in growth) luxury brand in the past 5-8 years, at least in my eyes.

Definitely Audi has done well considering it hit rock bottom in the early 90s.

 

[Gecko]

I just don't see any success of Buick at all. Its flagship sedan is less than Avalon, and its flagship 3 row crossover doesn't actually cost more than a similarly equipped highlander. Is Toyota a luxury brand? I don't think so. And, those Toyota vehicles being sold way more. I don't get how Buick gets in the upper class?

I do agree with you here, and think the only thing that makes Buick a "near luxury" brand is the name. In many cases, XLE/Limited trims of the Camry, Avalon and Highlander are probably a little nicer than the LaCrosse or Enclave. Toyota is a traditional mainstream automaker, Buick seems to be clinging onto it's glory days of making higher end cars, but the reality is different.

GM, in general, is really guilty of photoshopping press interior pictures so badly that they almost look cartoonish. It also sets you up for disappointment once you're there in person. I saw and looked into the new LaCrosse interior in LA - same overly high gloss wood, flat door panels, cheap corporate steering wheel, etc. However, that works for some people, and to have a "Buick" is hoity-toity-er than a Toyota.

 

[mikeavelli]

The Buick Enclave is really well done and priced in the 40-50k range. Let's also not forget the Regal GXP which is a pretty badass Buick but simply overlooked by everyone. Obviously the LaCrosse is another homerun. The Verano destroys the ILX in sales and the Encore has also done very well for them.

They also now have a convertible. If you sit inside a Buick and an Acura, they are pretty similar in build and feel. Obviously the NSX is an anomaly and Buick has nothing to compete with it.

To my eyes when they not only improved their lineup but it was well recieved it belonged as a brand in the sales list and if anything is at least informational. We could also add some non luxury brand cars (Taurus, 300C, Cadenza, Avalon, etc) due to pricing and features but that complicates things and takes more time.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

The Buick Enclave is really well done and priced in the 40-50k range. Let's also not forget the Regal GXP which is a pretty badass Buick but simply overlooked by everyone. Obviously the LaCrosse is another homerun. The Verano destroys the ILX in sales and the Encore has also done very well for them.

Its actually Regal GS, but yeah, it was one of the few sedans that you can still buy in stick. Unfortunately, I see a lot of them on Carmax though as many buyers turn them in early. Yes, the Verano is doing pretty good against the luxo Civic. I think the Encore and Enclave got the formula right to do well in their respective segment.

They also now have a convertible. If you sit inside a Buick and an Acura, they are pretty similar in build and feel. Obviously the NSX is an anomaly and Buick has nothing to compete with it.

If they could build a new GNX...

To my eyes when they not only improved their lineup but it was well received it belonged as a brand in the sales list and if anything is at least informational. We could also add some non luxury brand cars (Taurus, 300C, Cadenza, Avalon, etc) due to pricing and features but that complicates things and takes more time.

+1

 

[mmcartalk]

They also now have a convertible.

Yeah...I test-drove one a couple of weeks ago. A lot of fun once you get past the long doors in tight spaces, well-built (another German Opel product) and surprisingly free of cowl-shake. Rides somewhat better than expected with the 20" wheels. But borderline underpowered, even with the 1.6L turbo engine. After a test-drive, I'm even more convinced it will appeal to the former Chrysler Lebaron/Sebring convertible buyer-base, though the back seat is noticeably smaller....... the roomy (by convertible standards) back seat was a strong selling point of the Chrysler ragtops.

 

[mikeavelli]

Regal GS, thanks for correcting me! On the website now lol......

 

[Born2Drive]

I do agree with you here, and think the only thing that makes Buick a "near luxury" brand is the name. In many cases, XLE/Limited trims of the Camry, Avalon and Highlander are probably a little nicer than the LaCrosse or Enclave. Toyota is a traditional mainstream automaker, Buick seems to be clinging onto it's glory days of making higher end cars, but the reality is different.

GM, in general, is really guilty of photoshopping press interior pictures so badly that they almost look cartoonish. It also sets you up for disappointment once you're there in person. I saw and looked into the new LaCrosse interior in LA - same overly high gloss wood, flat door panels, cheap corporate steering wheel, etc. However, that works for some people, and to have a "Buick" is hoity-toity-er than a Toyota.

You get me also. Buick has too much tacky cheap weird stuff in and out, plus its senior owner image. I know that some middle age people want to buy new vehicles at its price range, but try to avoid Buick brand at all cost. That is bad for GM. If GM didn't have Buick now, and put its vehicles into Chevy and Cadillac, things could be better.

 

[mmcartalk]

We haven't really talked about it much in this thread (concentrating mostly on Buick and Cadillac)...but, with Consumer Reports rating Audi, as a brand, so highly in the last couple of years, it will be interesting to see what that does to at least non-diesel sales. I've already got some requests to review the new upcoming 2017 A4.

 

[Born2Drive]

Just saw this on the web, for those don't have time, just read the 3rd line below graph regarding the class of Buick.

 

[mmcartalk]

Just saw this on the web, for those don't have time, just read the 3rd line below graph regarding the class of Buick.

Exactly. The debate about Buick being a luxury or non-luxury brand has been going on for years. We're certainly not going to solve it here. That's because, today, in the auto industry, the terms "Luxury", "Premium", "Upmarket", and other similar terms have all become intertwined, and, depending on who uses the term and under what conditions, may or may not be different versions of the same adjective.

 

[Ian Schmidt]

Buick would benefit from better advertising, too. Recent Chevy ads manage to deliver a positive"you didn't know how good we were" message, and the GMC ads project an Acura-like "precision engineering" vibe, albeit over a song about 80s cocaine parties. Whereas Buick ads go straight for "Buick: It sucks less than you thought", which plays like a warmed-over copy of the "Not Your Father's Oldsmobile" ads that buried that brand in the 90s.

 

[mmcartalk]

Buick would benefit from better advertising, too. Recent Chevy ads manage to deliver a positive"you didn't know how good we were" message, and the GMC ads project an Acura-like "precision engineering" vibe, albeit over a song about 80s cocaine parties. Whereas Buick ads go straight for "Buick: It sucks less than you thought", which plays like a warmed-over copy of the "Not Your Father's Oldsmobile" ads that buried that brand in the 90s.

There are a few exceptions, but, in general, auto-manufacturer ads today are an insult to human intelligence...almost as much so as the dealer-ads LOL.

 

[CIF]

That's a big drop for GS sales, hope they rebound.

 

[Alex77789]

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