Lexus August 2018 Sales Report

Welcome new member TheNerdyPotato

Welcome new member TheNerdyPotato

TheNerdyPotato

If you've followed me this far, then you may be able to figure out why the entire automotive enthusiast community would be excited by an engine with a M30A-GTS designation ;)

Good call on the A designation for inline-4s.

But why would they give the BMW B58 a Dynamic Force name? From the A90 designation on the Supra I'm more leaning towards 3JZ for the engine. They did the same on the 86 with the 4U, a series that wasn't used for half a century.

Welcome to the forum!

TheNerdyPotato

If you've followed me this far, then you may be able to figure out why the entire automotive enthusiast community would be excited by an engine with a M30A-GTS designation ;)

Good call on the A designation for inline-4s.

But why would they give the BMW B58 a Dynamic Force name? From the A90 designation on the Supra I'm more leaning towards 3JZ for the engine. They did the same on the 86 with the 4U, a series that wasn't used for half a century.

Welcome to the forum!

TheNerdyPotato

If you've followed me this far, then you may be able to figure out why the entire automotive enthusiast community would be excited by an engine with a M30A-GTS designation ;)

Good call on the A designation for inline-4s.

But why would they give the BMW B58 a Dynamic Force name? From the A90 designation on the Supra I'm more leaning towards 3JZ for the engine. They did the same on the 86 with the 4U, a series that wasn't used for half a century.

Welcome to the forum!

Because a man can dream that Toyota would design their own engines. If it's really a BMW engine and no manual option, I can't see myself getting one of the new Supras.

Because a man can dream that Toyota would design their own engines. If it's really a BMW engine and no manual option, I can't see myself getting one of the new Supras.

Because a man can dream that Toyota would design their own engines. If it's really a BMW engine and no manual option, I can't see myself getting one of the new Supras.

TheNerdyPotato

Because a man can dream that Toyota would design their own engines. If it's really a BMW engine and no manual option, I can't see myself getting one of the new Supras.

Are you saying the M30A is a boxer type? Wow. That’s a thrill! But what does the M actually mean?

TheNerdyPotato

Because a man can dream that Toyota would design their own engines. If it's really a BMW engine and no manual option, I can't see myself getting one of the new Supras.

Are you saying the M30A is a boxer type? Wow. That’s a thrill! But what does the M actually mean?

TheNerdyPotato

Because a man can dream that Toyota would design their own engines. If it's really a BMW engine and no manual option, I can't see myself getting one of the new Supras.

Are you saying the M30A is a boxer type? Wow. That’s a thrill! But what does the M actually mean?

ssun30

One thing that plays in their favor is China cancelling road tax deduction for sub-1.6L engines and producing engines locally lets them completely bypass the displacement sales tax. The nation is moving towards a emission-based system so Japan will be the last place where displacement tax is a concern.
Still the GR replacement cannot be a V35A-FKS, because the GR series is designed for as high specific output as possible (80hp/L BoL and 90+hp/L EoL). Dynamic Force slightly sacrifices specific output for efficiency, so a V35A-FKS will be less powerful (~280hp) than the 2GR(301-318hp). Obviously nobody wants the IS/ES/RX to have even less power than right now.
Also this engine will find itself on a BoF truck, which could use way more torque low-down than what the naturally aspirated 3.5L offers.

That's definitely something that plays in their favor for sure.

Well this is all hypothetical at this point, and it may very well be a different variant of a V35A-FKS, not that exact variant. Or it could be a totally different V block engine. We shall see when Toyota finally unveils more of their TNGA engine lineup.

With this many unknowns, I don't feel it wise at all to be jumping into too much conjecture or speculation.

F1 Silver Arrows

I don't know if this could be possible. But looking at the diagram with the powertrain models, it seems that there are only 3 engines that will have a V configuration. The rest being inline engines. Other than that, I believe the only engines above the V35A-FTS being the two purported V8's. I don't think we're having a 3.0L engine or a naturally aspirated version of the V35A-FTS. I think the 6 cylinder and the 8 cylinder cars are going all on out turbo.

This isn't bad. Since the 6 and 8 cylinder cars can really go take the competition to their competitors. The turbo/naturally aspirated 4 cylinders with hybrid motors in conjunction make sense. The global market and workhorse Toyota and smaller Lexus models would be having a share in this. I just don't think the naturally aspirated 6 cylinder and 8 cylinder cars will be able to push the envelope reliably, smoothly, sportively and still have that signature creaminess that these engines were known for.

In the case of the 6 cylinders, I highly doubt that they will be able to push further than the 340-350 horsepower barrier in a naturally aspirated form in the 3.5L unit. Same story for the 8 cylinder cars. I don't think they would be able to go higher than give or take 510 hp for the same reasons I mentioned above by simply staying at 5.7L/4.6L/5.0L. These things MUST go along with turbocharging. They will honestly be able to wipe their whole competition like this. Knowing Toyota, when an event like this occurs...... like the 90's or the mid 2000's. Going with what happened then, I seriously believe that competition will be crushed under Toyota/Lexus for a solid 5-6 years until other manufacturers are able to react.

I believe the diagrams are generic placeholders and not indicative of engine type or layout.

Levi

One thing you are missing is the a powerful diesel engine (V6 or V8). No way Toyota will sell any new Land Cruiser without diesel in the rest of the world, unless they have a Land Cruiser Hybrid.

A heavy-duty hybrid system for Toyota vehicles has been in development for quite a few years now. Who knows when (if ever) we will see it. Toyota's Hino division has had a heavy duty hybrid system available on their commercial trucks for quite a number of years now.

ssun30

A new diesel engine is the least of their concern. I don't think TMC is going to develop a diesel engine from scratch, ever. They are investing an enormous amount of resources on engineering TNGA 1.0 and R&D on TNGA 2.0 and EV. Plus all these rumors about diesel bans. The chance of an entirely new diesel is infinitesimal.
Not updating its current diesel engines means better serviceability and part availability which is the prime concern in those regions that use diesel utility vehicles extensively. They do not need more power, there is plenty already. They want the engine to operate into eternity and nothing else.
Oh, and this lineup is for TMC's 'major' markets only, i.e. NA, Japan, EU, and China. They will keep a separate plan for the developing world.

Gecko

What I am telling you is that it was the case - they had diesel options for Tundra, Tacoma/4Runner as well as passenger cars with running prototypes in North America. Just not sure if that whole program was scrapped when the VW scandal broke (+ major push for electrification) because I haven't heard anything about it in 8 months or so.

I assume that no diesels in EU makes sense, and if they're going that route, they may have pulled the program for diesels here as well.

I recently read that Toyota announced they will not be developing any brand-new diesel engines for passenger cars, and will be phasing them out in Europe.

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2...sel-cars-europe-phasing-vehicles-2018-onward/

Now the wording here is very important, as Toyota did not mention trucks or SUVs. So I would expect Toyota to continue offering diesel engines in certain markets for models like the Hilux, Prado, and Land Cruiser at least for the foreseeable future.

ssun30

One thing that plays in their favor is China cancelling road tax deduction for sub-1.6L engines and producing engines locally lets them completely bypass the displacement sales tax. The nation is moving towards a emission-based system so Japan will be the last place where displacement tax is a concern.
Still the GR replacement cannot be a V35A-FKS, because the GR series is designed for as high specific output as possible (80hp/L BoL and 90+hp/L EoL). Dynamic Force slightly sacrifices specific output for efficiency, so a V35A-FKS will be less powerful (~280hp) than the 2GR(301-318hp). Obviously nobody wants the IS/ES/RX to have even less power than right now.
Also this engine will find itself on a BoF truck, which could use way more torque low-down than what the naturally aspirated 3.5L offers.

That's definitely something that plays in their favor for sure.

Well this is all hypothetical at this point, and it may very well be a different variant of a V35A-FKS, not that exact variant. Or it could be a totally different V block engine. We shall see when Toyota finally unveils more of their TNGA engine lineup.

With this many unknowns, I don't feel it wise at all to be jumping into too much conjecture or speculation.

F1 Silver Arrows

I don't know if this could be possible. But looking at the diagram with the powertrain models, it seems that there are only 3 engines that will have a V configuration. The rest being inline engines. Other than that, I believe the only engines above the V35A-FTS being the two purported V8's. I don't think we're having a 3.0L engine or a naturally aspirated version of the V35A-FTS. I think the 6 cylinder and the 8 cylinder cars are going all on out turbo.

This isn't bad. Since the 6 and 8 cylinder cars can really go take the competition to their competitors. The turbo/naturally aspirated 4 cylinders with hybrid motors in conjunction make sense. The global market and workhorse Toyota and smaller Lexus models would be having a share in this. I just don't think the naturally aspirated 6 cylinder and 8 cylinder cars will be able to push the envelope reliably, smoothly, sportively and still have that signature creaminess that these engines were known for.

In the case of the 6 cylinders, I highly doubt that they will be able to push further than the 340-350 horsepower barrier in a naturally aspirated form in the 3.5L unit. Same story for the 8 cylinder cars. I don't think they would be able to go higher than give or take 510 hp for the same reasons I mentioned above by simply staying at 5.7L/4.6L/5.0L. These things MUST go along with turbocharging. They will honestly be able to wipe their whole competition like this. Knowing Toyota, when an event like this occurs...... like the 90's or the mid 2000's. Going with what happened then, I seriously believe that competition will be crushed under Toyota/Lexus for a solid 5-6 years until other manufacturers are able to react.

I believe the diagrams are generic placeholders and not indicative of engine type or layout.

Levi

One thing you are missing is the a powerful diesel engine (V6 or V8). No way Toyota will sell any new Land Cruiser without diesel in the rest of the world, unless they have a Land Cruiser Hybrid.

A heavy-duty hybrid system for Toyota vehicles has been in development for quite a few years now. Who knows when (if ever) we will see it. Toyota's Hino division has had a heavy duty hybrid system available on their commercial trucks for quite a number of years now.

ssun30

A new diesel engine is the least of their concern. I don't think TMC is going to develop a diesel engine from scratch, ever. They are investing an enormous amount of resources on engineering TNGA 1.0 and R&D on TNGA 2.0 and EV. Plus all these rumors about diesel bans. The chance of an entirely new diesel is infinitesimal.
Not updating its current diesel engines means better serviceability and part availability which is the prime concern in those regions that use diesel utility vehicles extensively. They do not need more power, there is plenty already. They want the engine to operate into eternity and nothing else.
Oh, and this lineup is for TMC's 'major' markets only, i.e. NA, Japan, EU, and China. They will keep a separate plan for the developing world.

Gecko

What I am telling you is that it was the case - they had diesel options for Tundra, Tacoma/4Runner as well as passenger cars with running prototypes in North America. Just not sure if that whole program was scrapped when the VW scandal broke (+ major push for electrification) because I haven't heard anything about it in 8 months or so.

I assume that no diesels in EU makes sense, and if they're going that route, they may have pulled the program for diesels here as well.

I recently read that Toyota announced they will not be developing any brand-new diesel engines for passenger cars, and will be phasing them out in Europe.

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2...sel-cars-europe-phasing-vehicles-2018-onward/

Now the wording here is very important, as Toyota did not mention trucks or SUVs. So I would expect Toyota to continue offering diesel engines in certain markets for models like the Hilux, Prado, and Land Cruiser at least for the foreseeable future.

ssun30

One thing that plays in their favor is China cancelling road tax deduction for sub-1.6L engines and producing engines locally lets them completely bypass the displacement sales tax. The nation is moving towards a emission-based system so Japan will be the last place where displacement tax is a concern.
Still the GR replacement cannot be a V35A-FKS, because the GR series is designed for as high specific output as possible (80hp/L BoL and 90+hp/L EoL). Dynamic Force slightly sacrifices specific output for efficiency, so a V35A-FKS will be less powerful (~280hp) than the 2GR(301-318hp). Obviously nobody wants the IS/ES/RX to have even less power than right now.
Also this engine will find itself on a BoF truck, which could use way more torque low-down than what the naturally aspirated 3.5L offers.

That's definitely something that plays in their favor for sure.

Well this is all hypothetical at this point, and it may very well be a different variant of a V35A-FKS, not that exact variant. Or it could be a totally different V block engine. We shall see when Toyota finally unveils more of their TNGA engine lineup.

With this many unknowns, I don't feel it wise at all to be jumping into too much conjecture or speculation.

F1 Silver Arrows

I don't know if this could be possible. But looking at the diagram with the powertrain models, it seems that there are only 3 engines that will have a V configuration. The rest being inline engines. Other than that, I believe the only engines above the V35A-FTS being the two purported V8's. I don't think we're having a 3.0L engine or a naturally aspirated version of the V35A-FTS. I think the 6 cylinder and the 8 cylinder cars are going all on out turbo.

This isn't bad. Since the 6 and 8 cylinder cars can really go take the competition to their competitors. The turbo/naturally aspirated 4 cylinders with hybrid motors in conjunction make sense. The global market and workhorse Toyota and smaller Lexus models would be having a share in this. I just don't think the naturally aspirated 6 cylinder and 8 cylinder cars will be able to push the envelope reliably, smoothly, sportively and still have that signature creaminess that these engines were known for.

In the case of the 6 cylinders, I highly doubt that they will be able to push further than the 340-350 horsepower barrier in a naturally aspirated form in the 3.5L unit. Same story for the 8 cylinder cars. I don't think they would be able to go higher than give or take 510 hp for the same reasons I mentioned above by simply staying at 5.7L/4.6L/5.0L. These things MUST go along with turbocharging. They will honestly be able to wipe their whole competition like this. Knowing Toyota, when an event like this occurs...... like the 90's or the mid 2000's. Going with what happened then, I seriously believe that competition will be crushed under Toyota/Lexus for a solid 5-6 years until other manufacturers are able to react.

I believe the diagrams are generic placeholders and not indicative of engine type or layout.

Levi

One thing you are missing is the a powerful diesel engine (V6 or V8). No way Toyota will sell any new Land Cruiser without diesel in the rest of the world, unless they have a Land Cruiser Hybrid.

A heavy-duty hybrid system for Toyota vehicles has been in development for quite a few years now. Who knows when (if ever) we will see it. Toyota's Hino division has had a heavy duty hybrid system available on their commercial trucks for quite a number of years now.

ssun30

A new diesel engine is the least of their concern. I don't think TMC is going to develop a diesel engine from scratch, ever. They are investing an enormous amount of resources on engineering TNGA 1.0 and R&D on TNGA 2.0 and EV. Plus all these rumors about diesel bans. The chance of an entirely new diesel is infinitesimal.
Not updating its current diesel engines means better serviceability and part availability which is the prime concern in those regions that use diesel utility vehicles extensively. They do not need more power, there is plenty already. They want the engine to operate into eternity and nothing else.
Oh, and this lineup is for TMC's 'major' markets only, i.e. NA, Japan, EU, and China. They will keep a separate plan for the developing world.

Gecko

What I am telling you is that it was the case - they had diesel options for Tundra, Tacoma/4Runner as well as passenger cars with running prototypes in North America. Just not sure if that whole program was scrapped when the VW scandal broke (+ major push for electrification) because I haven't heard anything about it in 8 months or so.

I assume that no diesels in EU makes sense, and if they're going that route, they may have pulled the program for diesels here as well.

I recently read that Toyota announced they will not be developing any brand-new diesel engines for passenger cars, and will be phasing them out in Europe.

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2...sel-cars-europe-phasing-vehicles-2018-onward/

Now the wording here is very important, as Toyota did not mention trucks or SUVs. So I would expect Toyota to continue offering diesel engines in certain markets for models like the Hilux, Prado, and Land Cruiser at least for the foreseeable future.

amoschen7

Are you saying the M30A is a boxer type? Wow. That’s a thrill! But what does the M actually mean?

M is the old designation for straight 6s before the JZ series. The MK3 Supra and Cressida came with 7M series engines, for example. IIRC, the 60s 2000GT also had an M engine.

The engine above the A25A could be a new Tacoma/Hilux 4cyl. It may receive an R or T designation.

amoschen7

Are you saying the M30A is a boxer type? Wow. That’s a thrill! But what does the M actually mean?

M is the old designation for straight 6s before the JZ series. The MK3 Supra and Cressida came with 7M series engines, for example. IIRC, the 60s 2000GT also had an M engine.

The engine above the A25A could be a new Tacoma/Hilux 4cyl. It may receive an R or T designation.

amoschen7

Are you saying the M30A is a boxer type? Wow. That’s a thrill! But what does the M actually mean?

M is the old designation for straight 6s before the JZ series. The MK3 Supra and Cressida came with 7M series engines, for example. IIRC, the 60s 2000GT also had an M engine.

The engine above the A25A could be a new Tacoma/Hilux 4cyl. It may receive an R or T designation.

TheNerdyPotato

M is the old designation for straight 6s before the JZ series. The MK3 Supra and Cressida came with 7M series engines, for example. IIRC, the 60s 2000GT also had an M engine.

The engine above the A25A could be a new Tacoma/Hilux 4cyl. It may receive an R or T designation.

I see... not so familiar with the Toyota legacy.
But I thought a boxer type will probably catch more eyeballs? I’m kinda skeptical about inline 6 because the 2GR replacement should also find its place in ES. A FWD inline 6 may be quite hard to engineer.

TheNerdyPotato

M is the old designation for straight 6s before the JZ series. The MK3 Supra and Cressida came with 7M series engines, for example. IIRC, the 60s 2000GT also had an M engine.

The engine above the A25A could be a new Tacoma/Hilux 4cyl. It may receive an R or T designation.

I see... not so familiar with the Toyota legacy.
But I thought a boxer type will probably catch more eyeballs? I’m kinda skeptical about inline 6 because the 2GR replacement should also find its place in ES. A FWD inline 6 may be quite hard to engineer.

TheNerdyPotato

M is the old designation for straight 6s before the JZ series. The MK3 Supra and Cressida came with 7M series engines, for example. IIRC, the 60s 2000GT also had an M engine.

The engine above the A25A could be a new Tacoma/Hilux 4cyl. It may receive an R or T designation.

I see... not so familiar with the Toyota legacy.
But I thought a boxer type will probably catch more eyeballs? I’m kinda skeptical about inline 6 because the 2GR replacement should also find its place in ES. A FWD inline 6 may be quite hard to engineer.

amoschen7

I see... not so familiar with the Toyota legacy.
But I thought a boxer type will probably catch more eyeballs? I’m kinda skeptical about inline 6 because the 2GR replacement should also find its place in ES. A FWD inline 6 may be quite hard to engineer.

Inline 6s are, with rare exception, made for FR platforms only. I never implied that it would be used in a FWD vehicle. I was actually referring to the new Supra, which would logically have an engine to succeed the nigh-legendary 2JZ. But, that's apparently not meant to be because it's a BMW.

amoschen7

I see... not so familiar with the Toyota legacy.
But I thought a boxer type will probably catch more eyeballs? I’m kinda skeptical about inline 6 because the 2GR replacement should also find its place in ES. A FWD inline 6 may be quite hard to engineer.

Inline 6s are, with rare exception, made for FR platforms only. I never implied that it would be used in a FWD vehicle. I was actually referring to the new Supra, which would logically have an engine to succeed the nigh-legendary 2JZ. But, that's apparently not meant to be because it's a BMW.

amoschen7

I see... not so familiar with the Toyota legacy.
But I thought a boxer type will probably catch more eyeballs? I’m kinda skeptical about inline 6 because the 2GR replacement should also find its place in ES. A FWD inline 6 may be quite hard to engineer.

Inline 6s are, with rare exception, made for FR platforms only. I never implied that it would be used in a FWD vehicle. I was actually referring to the new Supra, which would logically have an engine to succeed the nigh-legendary 2JZ. But, that's apparently not meant to be because it's a BMW.

TheNerdyPotato

Inline 6s are, with rare exception, made for FR platforms only. I never implied that it would be used in a FWD vehicle. I was actually referring to the new Supra, which would logically have an engine to succeed the nigh-legendary 2JZ. But, that's apparently not meant to be because it's a BMW.

Yea, I got you. I was expecting that powerful engine could get to more models in Lexus lineup,lol. Maybe I’m too greedy

TheNerdyPotato

Inline 6s are, with rare exception, made for FR platforms only. I never implied that it would be used in a FWD vehicle. I was actually referring to the new Supra, which would logically have an engine to succeed the nigh-legendary 2JZ. But, that's apparently not meant to be because it's a BMW.

Yea, I got you. I was expecting that powerful engine could get to more models in Lexus lineup,lol. Maybe I’m too greedy

TheNerdyPotato

Inline 6s are, with rare exception, made for FR platforms only. I never implied that it would be used in a FWD vehicle. I was actually referring to the new Supra, which would logically have an engine to succeed the nigh-legendary 2JZ. But, that's apparently not meant to be because it's a BMW.

Yea, I got you. I was expecting that powerful engine could get to more models in Lexus lineup,lol. Maybe I’m too greedy

http://toyotanews.pressroom.toyota....+toyota+corolla+hatchback+wows+2018+nyias.htm

Apparently I was wrong about the M designation. Toyota is using the M20A-FKS designation for the new 2.0l 4cyl in the 2019 Corolla. I assume that this is a different engine than the A20A in the UX

http://toyotanews.pressroom.toyota....+toyota+corolla+hatchback+wows+2018+nyias.htm

Apparently I was wrong about the M designation. Toyota is using the M20A-FKS designation for the new 2.0l 4cyl in the 2019 Corolla. I assume that this is a different engine than the A20A in the UX

http://toyotanews.pressroom.toyota....+toyota+corolla+hatchback+wows+2018+nyias.htm

Apparently I was wrong about the M designation. Toyota is using the M20A-FKS designation for the new 2.0l 4cyl in the 2019 Corolla. I assume that this is a different engine than the A20A in the UX

TheNerdyPotato

http://toyotanews.pressroom.toyota....+toyota+corolla+hatchback+wows+2018+nyias.htm

Apparently I was wrong about the M designation. Toyota is using the M20A-FKS designation for the new 2.0l 4cyl in the 2019 Corolla. I assume that this is a different engine than the A20A in the UX

They are the same engine. In the UX press release the 2.0 was not given a code. 'A20A' was what we assumed.