Lexus August 2018 Sales Report

Posted by Kevin on September 4th, 2018

USA

Lexus USA has reported 28,622 total sales for August 2018, a 7.1% decrease over last year — here’s the model-by-model breakdown:

MONTH Year to Date (*DSR)
2018 2017 % CHG* 2018 2017 % CHG*
CT 0 204 -100 4 4,572 -99.9
IS 2,231 2,445 -8.8 15,595 17,216 -9.9
RC 327 665 -50.8 2,335 4,286 -45.8
ES 4,686 6,404 -26.8 29,138 34,845 -16.8
GS 549 689 -20.3 4,707 4,894 -4.3
LS 923 413 123.5 6,004 2,670 123.8
LC 210 291 -28 1,392 1449 -4
LFA 0 0 0 2 1 99
Total Cars 8,926 11,111 -19.7 59,177 69,933 -15.8
NX 5,644 5,517 2.3 38,969 36,946 5.0
RX 10,875 10,391 4.7 70,706 66,760 5.4
GX 2,773 3336 -16.9 16,817 16,308 2.6
LX 404 446 -9.4 3,356 3,516 -5.0
Total Trucks 19,696 19,690 0.0 129,848 123,530 4.6
Total Sales 28,622 30,801 -7.1 189,025 193,463 -2.8

Please note, all percentages are calculated by the Daily Sales Rate (DSR), which takes into account the number of days in the month that dealerships could sell cars. August 2018 had 27 selling days, August 2017 had 27 selling days.

Sales ReportsUSA
Popular Stories

Sorry. No data so far.

Comments
Ian Schmidt
spwolf
You have to consider that MT is #1 transmission in many countries, like in Europe, so of course they are constantly developing new ones.
True, I just didn't expect a 6-speed to be used with smaller engines.
Ian Schmidt
spwolf
You have to consider that MT is #1 transmission in many countries, like in Europe, so of course they are constantly developing new ones.
True, I just didn't expect a 6-speed to be used with smaller engines.
S
Ian Schmidt
True, I just didn't expect a 6-speed to be used with smaller engines.
heh, i think since past 10 years or so, only Toyota in Europe with 5 speed is Aygo's 1.0 68hp 3cly engine.

Everything else got 6mt... from 1.33 99hp, to 1.2t 112hp and 1.5l 111hp.
S
Ian Schmidt
True, I just didn't expect a 6-speed to be used with smaller engines.
heh, i think since past 10 years or so, only Toyota in Europe with 5 speed is Aygo's 1.0 68hp 3cly engine.

Everything else got 6mt... from 1.33 99hp, to 1.2t 112hp and 1.5l 111hp.
S
Gecko
What is the difference between the engine code starting with an "A" or a "V"? It seems to me that naturally aspirated engines start with A and turbocharged ones start with V, but we haven't seen enough models to know for sure. What do you think?
I'm leaning towards A for inline engine and V for V-engine. Type of aspiration is encoded in the suffix F'T'S.

spwolf
Toyota already updated 1.0l KR in upcoming Aygo facelift, and they also did another ESTEC engine in 1.5l NA category last year with Yaris so those two are not on these lists for this years changes. It seems they want only all new engines to show there for this year. They also have new 1.0l KR turbo in small cars in Japan since last year or two.
I completely missed that part. The KR and NR updates are indeed somewhat new. But this could also mean their Dynamic Force update could come very late (2020-2021).
A senior engineer at TMEC said that they were not very happy with the 8NR-FTS design since it does not deliver the power density and fuel efficiency desired. It was just an interim solution for turbo-loving markets like EU and China. The problem is its very small displacement, or rather displacement per cylinder. 300cc is very little space to work with so they couldn't extract a lot of efficiency out of it. The general rule is you want as high displacement per cylinder as possible until you start losing reliability due to stroke length and vibrations. Each engine layout has a different 'sweet spot'. For I4 this is between 350 and 600 cc/cylinder. I3 rules in the sub-1.5L segment. At 330-430 cc/cylinder (1.0-1.3L), the efficiency is unbeatable by I4 but at 1.5L (the 500cc/cylinder 'magic number'), containing vibration becomes more challenging and some engineers may choose I4 for better NVH and scalability.
So I think TMC wants to try following the winning recipe and replace the 8NR-FTS with a 1.2 or 1.3T Inline-3. GM is using its new 1.3T unit to replace a lot of I4 (turbocharged included) engines.

spwolf
As to the hybrid, it is certainly 1.5l, but it wont be more powerful than Prius hybrid of course...
The Aqua/Yaris Hybrid already makes 75kW, so 90kW is not a significant bump considering the drivetrain could also be used on slightly bigger vehicles like Auris and Corolla.

spwolf
Also look at how they have shown new 3.5l hybrid in LC/LS - as transmission not engine.
It is labeled as a hybrid system, not a transmission, so it counts towards the 6 hybrids.

CIF
Overall I am happy to see more new TNGA engines debuting that are naturally aspirated.
One thing that plays in their favor is China cancelling road tax deduction for sub-1.6L engines and producing engines locally lets them completely bypass the displacement sales tax. The nation is moving towards a emission-based system so Japan will be the last place where displacement tax is a concern.
Still the GR replacement cannot be a V35A-FKS, because the GR series is designed for as high specific output as possible (80hp/L BoL and 90+hp/L EoL). Dynamic Force slightly sacrifices specific output for efficiency, so a V35A-FKS will be less powerful (~280hp) than the 2GR(301-318hp). Obviously nobody wants the IS/ES/RX to have even less power than right now.
Also this engine will find itself on a BoF truck, which could use way more torque low-down than what the naturally aspirated 3.5L offers.
S
Gecko
What is the difference between the engine code starting with an "A" or a "V"? It seems to me that naturally aspirated engines start with A and turbocharged ones start with V, but we haven't seen enough models to know for sure. What do you think?
I'm leaning towards A for inline engine and V for V-engine. Type of aspiration is encoded in the suffix F'T'S.

spwolf
Toyota already updated 1.0l KR in upcoming Aygo facelift, and they also did another ESTEC engine in 1.5l NA category last year with Yaris so those two are not on these lists for this years changes. It seems they want only all new engines to show there for this year. They also have new 1.0l KR turbo in small cars in Japan since last year or two.
I completely missed that part. The KR and NR updates are indeed somewhat new. But this could also mean their Dynamic Force update could come very late (2020-2021).
A senior engineer at TMEC said that they were not very happy with the 8NR-FTS design since it does not deliver the power density and fuel efficiency desired. It was just an interim solution for turbo-loving markets like EU and China. The problem is its very small displacement, or rather displacement per cylinder. 300cc is very little space to work with so they couldn't extract a lot of efficiency out of it. The general rule is you want as high displacement per cylinder as possible until you start losing reliability due to stroke length and vibrations. Each engine layout has a different 'sweet spot'. For I4 this is between 350 and 600 cc/cylinder. I3 rules in the sub-1.5L segment. At 330-430 cc/cylinder (1.0-1.3L), the efficiency is unbeatable by I4 but at 1.5L (the 500cc/cylinder 'magic number'), containing vibration becomes more challenging and some engineers may choose I4 for better NVH and scalability.
So I think TMC wants to try following the winning recipe and replace the 8NR-FTS with a 1.2 or 1.3T Inline-3. GM is using its new 1.3T unit to replace a lot of I4 (turbocharged included) engines.

spwolf
As to the hybrid, it is certainly 1.5l, but it wont be more powerful than Prius hybrid of course...
The Aqua/Yaris Hybrid already makes 75kW, so 90kW is not a significant bump considering the drivetrain could also be used on slightly bigger vehicles like Auris and Corolla.

spwolf
Also look at how they have shown new 3.5l hybrid in LC/LS - as transmission not engine.
It is labeled as a hybrid system, not a transmission, so it counts towards the 6 hybrids.

CIF
Overall I am happy to see more new TNGA engines debuting that are naturally aspirated.
One thing that plays in their favor is China cancelling road tax deduction for sub-1.6L engines and producing engines locally lets them completely bypass the displacement sales tax. The nation is moving towards a emission-based system so Japan will be the last place where displacement tax is a concern.
Still the GR replacement cannot be a V35A-FKS, because the GR series is designed for as high specific output as possible (80hp/L BoL and 90+hp/L EoL). Dynamic Force slightly sacrifices specific output for efficiency, so a V35A-FKS will be less powerful (~280hp) than the 2GR(301-318hp). Obviously nobody wants the IS/ES/RX to have even less power than right now.
Also this engine will find itself on a BoF truck, which could use way more torque low-down than what the naturally aspirated 3.5L offers.
F1 Silver Arrows
I don't know if this could be possible. But looking at the diagram with the powertrain models, it seems that there are only 3 engines that will have a V configuration. The rest being inline engines. Other than that, I believe the only engines above the V35A-FTS being the two purported V8's. I don't think we're having a 3.0L engine or a naturally aspirated version of the V35A-FTS. I think the 6 cylinder and the 8 cylinder cars are going all on out turbo.

This isn't bad. Since the 6 and 8 cylinder cars can really go take the competition to their competitors. The turbo/naturally aspirated 4 cylinders with hybrid motors in conjunction make sense. The global market and workhorse Toyota and smaller Lexus models would be having a share in this. I just don't think the naturally aspirated 6 cylinder and 8 cylinder cars will be able to push the envelope reliably, smoothly, sportively and still have that signature creaminess that these engines were known for.

In the case of the 6 cylinders, I highly doubt that they will be able to push further than the 340-350 horsepower barrier in a naturally aspirated form in the 3.5L unit. Same story for the 8 cylinder cars. I don't think they would be able to go higher than give or take 510 hp for the same reasons I mentioned above by simply staying at 5.7L/4.6L/5.0L. These things MUST go along with turbocharging. They will honestly be able to wipe their whole competition like this. Knowing Toyota, when an event like this occurs...... like the 90's or the mid 2000's. Going with what happened then, I seriously believe that competition will be crushed under Toyota/Lexus for a solid 5-6 years until other manufacturers are able to react.
F1 Silver Arrows
I don't know if this could be possible. But looking at the diagram with the powertrain models, it seems that there are only 3 engines that will have a V configuration. The rest being inline engines. Other than that, I believe the only engines above the V35A-FTS being the two purported V8's. I don't think we're having a 3.0L engine or a naturally aspirated version of the V35A-FTS. I think the 6 cylinder and the 8 cylinder cars are going all on out turbo.

This isn't bad. Since the 6 and 8 cylinder cars can really go take the competition to their competitors. The turbo/naturally aspirated 4 cylinders with hybrid motors in conjunction make sense. The global market and workhorse Toyota and smaller Lexus models would be having a share in this. I just don't think the naturally aspirated 6 cylinder and 8 cylinder cars will be able to push the envelope reliably, smoothly, sportively and still have that signature creaminess that these engines were known for.

In the case of the 6 cylinders, I highly doubt that they will be able to push further than the 340-350 horsepower barrier in a naturally aspirated form in the 3.5L unit. Same story for the 8 cylinder cars. I don't think they would be able to go higher than give or take 510 hp for the same reasons I mentioned above by simply staying at 5.7L/4.6L/5.0L. These things MUST go along with turbocharging. They will honestly be able to wipe their whole competition like this. Knowing Toyota, when an event like this occurs...... like the 90's or the mid 2000's. Going with what happened then, I seriously believe that competition will be crushed under Toyota/Lexus for a solid 5-6 years until other manufacturers are able to react.
S
F1 Silver Arrows
I don't know if this could be possible. But looking at the diagram with the powertrain models, it seems that there are only 3 engines that will have a V configuration. The rest being inline engines. Other than that, I believe the only engines above the V35A-FTS being the two purported V8's. I don't think we're having a 3.0L engine or a naturally aspirated version of the V35A-FTS. I think the 6 cylinder and the 8 cylinder cars are going all on out turbo.
Good call. The engine between the V35A-FTS and A25A-FKS looks like an inline engine (consistent with the smaller models). So A25A-FTS it is then.

Bad news: no mainstream V6 for the IS/ES/NX/RX.

Good news: the V6 ES F-Sport will be a damn powerful beast with V35A-FTS. 416hp+AWD=easily outruns GS-F on drag strips. Corners maybe not so much.

This is pretty much in line (no pun intended) with their strategy of charging premium for cylinders. Oh you want a smoother engine than the inline-4? How about 100 more horsepower and a torque vectoring AWD? And please take those fancy 20-inch wheels and a carbon fibre wing as well. Plus, you get all that V6 smoothness.

This is how everyone sell cars these days right?

F1 Silver Arrows
Going with what happened then, I seriously believe that competition will be crushed under Toyota/Lexus for a solid 5-6 years until other manufacturers are able to react.
This sounds hilarious, but the possibility of Lexus restarting a horsepower war is non-zero. They are the ones who started it since the original GS400. The horsepower war is only getting worse with electrification. In China we get 542hp hybrid family SUVs starting from $40,000 before incentives. And of course everyone gets the bull/stallion-slaying Model S.
S
F1 Silver Arrows
I don't know if this could be possible. But looking at the diagram with the powertrain models, it seems that there are only 3 engines that will have a V configuration. The rest being inline engines. Other than that, I believe the only engines above the V35A-FTS being the two purported V8's. I don't think we're having a 3.0L engine or a naturally aspirated version of the V35A-FTS. I think the 6 cylinder and the 8 cylinder cars are going all on out turbo.
Good call. The engine between the V35A-FTS and A25A-FKS looks like an inline engine (consistent with the smaller models). So A25A-FTS it is then.

Bad news: no mainstream V6 for the IS/ES/NX/RX.

Good news: the V6 ES F-Sport will be a damn powerful beast with V35A-FTS. 416hp+AWD=easily outruns GS-F on drag strips. Corners maybe not so much.

This is pretty much in line (no pun intended) with their strategy of charging premium for cylinders. Oh you want a smoother engine than the inline-4? How about 100 more horsepower and a torque vectoring AWD? And please take those fancy 20-inch wheels and a carbon fibre wing as well. Plus, you get all that V6 smoothness.

This is how everyone sell cars these days right?

F1 Silver Arrows
Going with what happened then, I seriously believe that competition will be crushed under Toyota/Lexus for a solid 5-6 years until other manufacturers are able to react.
This sounds hilarious, but the possibility of Lexus restarting a horsepower war is non-zero. They are the ones who started it since the original GS400. The horsepower war is only getting worse with electrification. In China we get 542hp hybrid family SUVs starting from $40,000 before incentives. And of course everyone gets the bull/stallion-slaying Model S.
S
F1 Silver Arrows
I don't know if this could be possible. But looking at the diagram with the powertrain models, it seems that there are only 3 engines that will have a V configuration. The rest being inline engines. Other than that, I believe the only engines above the V35A-FTS being the two purported V8's. I don't think we're having a 3.0L engine or a naturally aspirated version of the V35A-FTS. I think the 6 cylinder and the 8 cylinder cars are going all on out turbo.
Good call. The engine between the V35A-FTS and A25A-FKS looks like an inline engine (consistent with the smaller models). So A25A-FTS it is then.

Bad news: no mainstream V6 for the IS/ES/NX/RX.

Good news: the V6 ES F-Sport will be a damn powerful beast with V35A-FTS. 416hp+AWD=easily outruns GS-F on drag strips. Corners maybe not so much.

This is pretty much in line (no pun intended) with their strategy of charging premium for cylinders. Oh you want a smoother engine than the inline-4? How about 100 more horsepower and a torque vectoring AWD? And please take those fancy 20-inch wheels and a carbon fibre wing as well. Plus, you get all that V6 smoothness.

This is how everyone sell cars these days right?

F1 Silver Arrows
Going with what happened then, I seriously believe that competition will be crushed under Toyota/Lexus for a solid 5-6 years until other manufacturers are able to react.
This sounds hilarious, but the possibility of Lexus restarting a horsepower war is non-zero. They are the ones who started it since the original GS400. The horsepower war is only getting worse with electrification. In China we get 542hp hybrid family SUVs starting from $40,000 before incentives. And of course everyone gets the bull/stallion-slaying Model S.
F1 Silver Arrows
ssun30
Good call. The engine between the V35A-FTS and A25A-FKS looks like an inline engine (consistent with the smaller models). So A25A-FTS it is then.

Bad news: no 3.0 V6TT for the ES/NX/RX.

Good news: the AWD ES/RX will be a damn powerful beast with V35A-FTS.
Yeah! I share the same views as you. But I knew deep down that the 3.0L would never happen (at least not this time). So now that we have most of the engines confirmed. Assuming we know that there will be a turbo V8, I assume it would look like this. I will be leaving some blanks for us to make speculations. Some of these are what I wish to happen, but I still have issues with their lineup. I will explain after.

UX:
UX200 - Brand new 2.0L 4-cylinder engine
UX250 - 2.5L NA?
UX250h - 2.5L hybrid

IS:
IS300 - 2.0L turbo
IS350/400 - 3.5L TTV6
IS F - 4.0L TTV8

RC:
RC300 - 2.0L turbo
RC350/400 - 3.5L TTV6
RC F - 4.0L TTV8

NX:
NX300 - 2.0L turbo
NX300h - 2.5L hybrid
NX350/400 - 3.5L TTV6

ES:
ES300 - 2.0L turbo
ES300h - 2.5L hybrid
ES350/400 - 3.5L TTV6

RX:
RX350h -3.5L TTV6 hybrid
RX350/400 - 3.5L TTV6
RX F - 4.0 L TTV8

GX:
GX500 - 3.5L TTV6
GX550 - 4.0L TTV8
GX F - 4.0L TTV8

GS:
GS300 - 2.0L turbo
GS350/400 - 3.5L TTV6
GS350h - 3.5L TTV6 hybrid
GS F - 4.0L TTV8

This is what I think will end up for the LC......

LC:
LC500 - 3.5L TTV6
LC550 - 4.0L TTV8
LC500h - 3.5L TTV6 hybrid
LC F - 4.0 L TTV8

LS:
LS500 - 3.5L TTV6
LS550 - 4.0L TTV8
LS500h - 3.5L TTV6 hybrid
LS F - 4.0L TTV8

LX:
LX500 - 3.5L TTV6
LX550 - 4.0L TTV8
LX F - 4.0L TTV8

LF-1:
??? 500 -3.5L TTV6
??? 550 -4.0L TTV8
??? h - 3.5L TTV6 hybrid
??? F - 4.0L TTV8

Phew! Now that's done, I still have one major issue that pops out to me.

Why isn't the NX on the IS platform? This confuses me to no end. It shows that the bottom lineup has no lineage. My problem with Lexus is that they need to have a linear lineup. A SUV, sedan and a coupe for each tier. I will exclude UX because UX is a special global model to push for fuel efficient vehicles. I was so tempted to put an F model on the NX but it simply won't work because it will ruin the balance of the car. My problem is that it isn't RWD.

I am not sure here but I strongly believe that Lexus needs to take notes from Mercedes-Benz's playbook. They have a SUV, sedan and a coupe for each tier. The NX and IS do not share anything with any other car and serve as independent models. There are a lack of choices the lower you go. Other than the LF-1, Lexus needs to build a RWD crossover based on the IS platform and there should be a *sigh* FWD sedan that is based on the NX. Therefore, it gives Lexus customers more offerings and it shows that Lexus cars have a great bandwidth of models. I know sedans are not popular right now. But where it sits at, towards the bottom of the lineup, it just confuses me.

It should go like this:

Unique crossover - UX (single model like I explained above)
Subcompact - NX/sedan based on NX
Compact: IS/crossover based on IS/RC
Midsize: RX/ES
Higher midsize: GS/GX
Flagship: LX/LC/LS/LF-1

I believe markets like the GLC, Macan, X3 are dominating the market and there needs to be an entry from Lexus. As for subcompact sedans, the A-Class/CLA-Class/A3/2-Series are playing a huge role in the market. There needs to be another entry here.

Just my two cents. I am really proud on how Lexus is moving, but these two omissions always gets me.
F1 Silver Arrows
ssun30
Good call. The engine between the V35A-FTS and A25A-FKS looks like an inline engine (consistent with the smaller models). So A25A-FTS it is then.

Bad news: no 3.0 V6TT for the ES/NX/RX.

Good news: the AWD ES/RX will be a damn powerful beast with V35A-FTS.
Yeah! I share the same views as you. But I knew deep down that the 3.0L would never happen (at least not this time). So now that we have most of the engines confirmed. Assuming we know that there will be a turbo V8, I assume it would look like this. I will be leaving some blanks for us to make speculations. Some of these are what I wish to happen, but I still have issues with their lineup. I will explain after.

UX:
UX200 - Brand new 2.0L 4-cylinder engine
UX250 - 2.5L NA?
UX250h - 2.5L hybrid

IS:
IS300 - 2.0L turbo
IS350/400 - 3.5L TTV6
IS F - 4.0L TTV8

RC:
RC300 - 2.0L turbo
RC350/400 - 3.5L TTV6
RC F - 4.0L TTV8

NX:
NX300 - 2.0L turbo
NX300h - 2.5L hybrid
NX350/400 - 3.5L TTV6

ES:
ES300 - 2.0L turbo
ES300h - 2.5L hybrid
ES350/400 - 3.5L TTV6

RX:
RX350h -3.5L TTV6 hybrid
RX350/400 - 3.5L TTV6
RX F - 4.0 L TTV8

GX:
GX500 - 3.5L TTV6
GX550 - 4.0L TTV8
GX F - 4.0L TTV8

GS:
GS300 - 2.0L turbo
GS350/400 - 3.5L TTV6
GS350h - 3.5L TTV6 hybrid
GS F - 4.0L TTV8

This is what I think will end up for the LC......

LC:
LC500 - 3.5L TTV6
LC550 - 4.0L TTV8
LC500h - 3.5L TTV6 hybrid
LC F - 4.0 L TTV8

LS:
LS500 - 3.5L TTV6
LS550 - 4.0L TTV8
LS500h - 3.5L TTV6 hybrid
LS F - 4.0L TTV8

LX:
LX500 - 3.5L TTV6
LX550 - 4.0L TTV8
LX F - 4.0L TTV8

LF-1:
??? 500 -3.5L TTV6
??? 550 -4.0L TTV8
??? h - 3.5L TTV6 hybrid
??? F - 4.0L TTV8

Phew! Now that's done, I still have one major issue that pops out to me.

Why isn't the NX on the IS platform? This confuses me to no end. It shows that the bottom lineup has no lineage. My problem with Lexus is that they need to have a linear lineup. A SUV, sedan and a coupe for each tier. I will exclude UX because UX is a special global model to push for fuel efficient vehicles. I was so tempted to put an F model on the NX but it simply won't work because it will ruin the balance of the car. My problem is that it isn't RWD.

I am not sure here but I strongly believe that Lexus needs to take notes from Mercedes-Benz's playbook. They have a SUV, sedan and a coupe for each tier. The NX and IS do not share anything with any other car and serve as independent models. There are a lack of choices the lower you go. Other than the LF-1, Lexus needs to build a RWD crossover based on the IS platform and there should be a *sigh* FWD sedan that is based on the NX. Therefore, it gives Lexus customers more offerings and it shows that Lexus cars have a great bandwidth of models. I know sedans are not popular right now. But where it sits at, towards the bottom of the lineup, it just confuses me.

It should go like this:

Unique crossover - UX (single model like I explained above)
Subcompact - NX/sedan based on NX
Compact: IS/crossover based on IS/RC
Midsize: RX/ES
Higher midsize: GS/GX
Flagship: LX/LC/LS/LF-1

I believe markets like the GLC, Macan, X3 are dominating the market and there needs to be an entry from Lexus. As for subcompact sedans, the A-Class/CLA-Class/A3/2-Series are playing a huge role in the market. There needs to be another entry here.

Just my two cents. I am really proud on how Lexus is moving, but these two omissions always gets me.
F1 Silver Arrows
ssun30
Good call. The engine between the V35A-FTS and A25A-FKS looks like an inline engine (consistent with the smaller models). So A25A-FTS it is then.

Bad news: no 3.0 V6TT for the ES/NX/RX.

Good news: the AWD ES/RX will be a damn powerful beast with V35A-FTS.
Yeah! I share the same views as you. But I knew deep down that the 3.0L would never happen (at least not this time). So now that we have most of the engines confirmed. Assuming we know that there will be a turbo V8, I assume it would look like this. I will be leaving some blanks for us to make speculations. Some of these are what I wish to happen, but I still have issues with their lineup. I will explain after.

UX:
UX200 - Brand new 2.0L 4-cylinder engine
UX250 - 2.5L NA?
UX250h - 2.5L hybrid

IS:
IS300 - 2.0L turbo
IS350/400 - 3.5L TTV6
IS F - 4.0L TTV8

RC:
RC300 - 2.0L turbo
RC350/400 - 3.5L TTV6
RC F - 4.0L TTV8

NX:
NX300 - 2.0L turbo
NX300h - 2.5L hybrid
NX350/400 - 3.5L TTV6

ES:
ES300 - 2.0L turbo
ES300h - 2.5L hybrid
ES350/400 - 3.5L TTV6

RX:
RX350h -3.5L TTV6 hybrid
RX350/400 - 3.5L TTV6
RX F - 4.0 L TTV8

GX:
GX500 - 3.5L TTV6
GX550 - 4.0L TTV8
GX F - 4.0L TTV8

GS:
GS300 - 2.0L turbo
GS350/400 - 3.5L TTV6
GS350h - 3.5L TTV6 hybrid
GS F - 4.0L TTV8

This is what I think will end up for the LC......

LC:
LC500 - 3.5L TTV6
LC550 - 4.0L TTV8
LC500h - 3.5L TTV6 hybrid
LC F - 4.0 L TTV8

LS:
LS500 - 3.5L TTV6
LS550 - 4.0L TTV8
LS500h - 3.5L TTV6 hybrid
LS F - 4.0L TTV8

LX:
LX500 - 3.5L TTV6
LX550 - 4.0L TTV8
LX F - 4.0L TTV8

LF-1:
??? 500 -3.5L TTV6
??? 550 -4.0L TTV8
??? h - 3.5L TTV6 hybrid
??? F - 4.0L TTV8

Phew! Now that's done, I still have one major issue that pops out to me.

Why isn't the NX on the IS platform? This confuses me to no end. It shows that the bottom lineup has no lineage. My problem with Lexus is that they need to have a linear lineup. A SUV, sedan and a coupe for each tier. I will exclude UX because UX is a special global model to push for fuel efficient vehicles. I was so tempted to put an F model on the NX but it simply won't work because it will ruin the balance of the car. My problem is that it isn't RWD.

I am not sure here but I strongly believe that Lexus needs to take notes from Mercedes-Benz's playbook. They have a SUV, sedan and a coupe for each tier. The NX and IS do not share anything with any other car and serve as independent models. There are a lack of choices the lower you go. Other than the LF-1, Lexus needs to build a RWD crossover based on the IS platform and there should be a *sigh* FWD sedan that is based on the NX. Therefore, it gives Lexus customers more offerings and it shows that Lexus cars have a great bandwidth of models. I know sedans are not popular right now. But where it sits at, towards the bottom of the lineup, it just confuses me.

It should go like this:

Unique crossover - UX (single model like I explained above)
Subcompact - NX/sedan based on NX
Compact: IS/crossover based on IS/RC
Midsize: RX/ES
Higher midsize: GS/GX
Flagship: LX/LC/LS/LF-1

I believe markets like the GLC, Macan, X3 are dominating the market and there needs to be an entry from Lexus. As for subcompact sedans, the A-Class/CLA-Class/A3/2-Series are playing a huge role in the market. There needs to be another entry here.

Just my two cents. I am really proud on how Lexus is moving, but these two omissions always gets me.
S
ssun30
I'm leaning towards A for inline engine and V for V-engine. Type of aspiration is encoded in the suffix F'T'S.

I completely missed that part. The KR and NR updates are indeed somewhat new. But this could also mean their Dynamic Force update could come very late (2020-2021).
A senior engineer at TMEC said that they were not very happy with the 8NR-FTS design since it does not deliver the power density and fuel efficiency desired. It was just an interim solution for turbo-loving markets like EU and China. The problem is its very small displacement, or rather displacement per cylinder. 300cc is very little space to work with so they couldn't extract a lot of efficiency out of it. The general rule is you want as high displacement per cylinder as possible until you start losing reliability due to stroke length and vibrations. Each engine layout has a different 'sweet spot'. For I4 this is between 350 and 600 cc/cylinder. I3 rules in the sub-1.5L segment. At 330-430 cc/cylinder (1.0-1.3L), the efficiency is unbeatable by I4 but at 1.5L (the 500cc/cylinder 'magic number'), containing vibration becomes more challenging and some engineers may choose I4 for better NVH and scalability.
So I think TMC wants to try following the winning recipe and replace the 8NR-FTS with a 1.2 or 1.3T Inline-3. GM is using its new 1.3T unit to replace a lot of I4 (turbocharged included) engines.


The Aqua/Yaris Hybrid already makes 75kW, so 90kW is not a significant bump considering the drivetrain could also be used on slightly bigger vehicles like Auris and Corolla.
- I dont think KR and NR will get "Dynamic Force" engines anytime soon... not with them updating it this spring (KR) and all new 1.5l ESTEC NR last year.
- As to the 4cly vs 3cly, unfortunately those were designed to satisfy old NEDC emissions/fuel consumption... in real tests by European mags, those 3cly turbos have poor efficiency. For instance Autobild tested BMW's new turbo 3cly and they got worse efficiency than their old engines.
- 8NR-FTS is also very new engine... maybe update with new transmissions and in new platforms will add 7-8% better efficiency as well as some internal changes or turbo changes. I read from owners posts that they are pretty happy with 1.2t's fuel consumption in C-HRs, numbers are pretty low and much better than what people used to get with small 1.8l Rav4's.
- So what are those two smaller engines? I have no idea. Maybe new small turbo for Auris? Since they did not put 1.0 KR update there or new 1.5l NR I have no idea. Are they going to do 1.5l turbo for Europe for C-HR? Kind of makes no sense if they claim 2.0l has better efficiency and power curve.

As to the hybrid, why would it get a power bump? This is their mass produced powertrain sold in their best selling vehicles. It has to be cost effective if it is to compete with 1.5l engine, price differential cant be too big. They need more power from lower point of the range, they need more battery output and much better nvh... of course they also need more efficiency. But cost is primary factory, just like with Prius 1.8l engine.
S
ssun30
I'm leaning towards A for inline engine and V for V-engine. Type of aspiration is encoded in the suffix F'T'S.

I completely missed that part. The KR and NR updates are indeed somewhat new. But this could also mean their Dynamic Force update could come very late (2020-2021).
A senior engineer at TMEC said that they were not very happy with the 8NR-FTS design since it does not deliver the power density and fuel efficiency desired. It was just an interim solution for turbo-loving markets like EU and China. The problem is its very small displacement, or rather displacement per cylinder. 300cc is very little space to work with so they couldn't extract a lot of efficiency out of it. The general rule is you want as high displacement per cylinder as possible until you start losing reliability due to stroke length and vibrations. Each engine layout has a different 'sweet spot'. For I4 this is between 350 and 600 cc/cylinder. I3 rules in the sub-1.5L segment. At 330-430 cc/cylinder (1.0-1.3L), the efficiency is unbeatable by I4 but at 1.5L (the 500cc/cylinder 'magic number'), containing vibration becomes more challenging and some engineers may choose I4 for better NVH and scalability.
So I think TMC wants to try following the winning recipe and replace the 8NR-FTS with a 1.2 or 1.3T Inline-3. GM is using its new 1.3T unit to replace a lot of I4 (turbocharged included) engines.


The Aqua/Yaris Hybrid already makes 75kW, so 90kW is not a significant bump considering the drivetrain could also be used on slightly bigger vehicles like Auris and Corolla.
- I dont think KR and NR will get "Dynamic Force" engines anytime soon... not with them updating it this spring (KR) and all new 1.5l ESTEC NR last year.
- As to the 4cly vs 3cly, unfortunately those were designed to satisfy old NEDC emissions/fuel consumption... in real tests by European mags, those 3cly turbos have poor efficiency. For instance Autobild tested BMW's new turbo 3cly and they got worse efficiency than their old engines.
- 8NR-FTS is also very new engine... maybe update with new transmissions and in new platforms will add 7-8% better efficiency as well as some internal changes or turbo changes. I read from owners posts that they are pretty happy with 1.2t's fuel consumption in C-HRs, numbers are pretty low and much better than what people used to get with small 1.8l Rav4's.
- So what are those two smaller engines? I have no idea. Maybe new small turbo for Auris? Since they did not put 1.0 KR update there or new 1.5l NR I have no idea. Are they going to do 1.5l turbo for Europe for C-HR? Kind of makes no sense if they claim 2.0l has better efficiency and power curve.

As to the hybrid, why would it get a power bump? This is their mass produced powertrain sold in their best selling vehicles. It has to be cost effective if it is to compete with 1.5l engine, price differential cant be too big. They need more power from lower point of the range, they need more battery output and much better nvh... of course they also need more efficiency. But cost is primary factory, just like with Prius 1.8l engine.
S
ssun30
I'm leaning towards A for inline engine and V for V-engine. Type of aspiration is encoded in the suffix F'T'S.

I completely missed that part. The KR and NR updates are indeed somewhat new. But this could also mean their Dynamic Force update could come very late (2020-2021).
A senior engineer at TMEC said that they were not very happy with the 8NR-FTS design since it does not deliver the power density and fuel efficiency desired. It was just an interim solution for turbo-loving markets like EU and China. The problem is its very small displacement, or rather displacement per cylinder. 300cc is very little space to work with so they couldn't extract a lot of efficiency out of it. The general rule is you want as high displacement per cylinder as possible until you start losing reliability due to stroke length and vibrations. Each engine layout has a different 'sweet spot'. For I4 this is between 350 and 600 cc/cylinder. I3 rules in the sub-1.5L segment. At 330-430 cc/cylinder (1.0-1.3L), the efficiency is unbeatable by I4 but at 1.5L (the 500cc/cylinder 'magic number'), containing vibration becomes more challenging and some engineers may choose I4 for better NVH and scalability.
So I think TMC wants to try following the winning recipe and replace the 8NR-FTS with a 1.2 or 1.3T Inline-3. GM is using its new 1.3T unit to replace a lot of I4 (turbocharged included) engines.


The Aqua/Yaris Hybrid already makes 75kW, so 90kW is not a significant bump considering the drivetrain could also be used on slightly bigger vehicles like Auris and Corolla.
- I dont think KR and NR will get "Dynamic Force" engines anytime soon... not with them updating it this spring (KR) and all new 1.5l ESTEC NR last year.
- As to the 4cly vs 3cly, unfortunately those were designed to satisfy old NEDC emissions/fuel consumption... in real tests by European mags, those 3cly turbos have poor efficiency. For instance Autobild tested BMW's new turbo 3cly and they got worse efficiency than their old engines.
- 8NR-FTS is also very new engine... maybe update with new transmissions and in new platforms will add 7-8% better efficiency as well as some internal changes or turbo changes. I read from owners posts that they are pretty happy with 1.2t's fuel consumption in C-HRs, numbers are pretty low and much better than what people used to get with small 1.8l Rav4's.
- So what are those two smaller engines? I have no idea. Maybe new small turbo for Auris? Since they did not put 1.0 KR update there or new 1.5l NR I have no idea. Are they going to do 1.5l turbo for Europe for C-HR? Kind of makes no sense if they claim 2.0l has better efficiency and power curve.

As to the hybrid, why would it get a power bump? This is their mass produced powertrain sold in their best selling vehicles. It has to be cost effective if it is to compete with 1.5l engine, price differential cant be too big. They need more power from lower point of the range, they need more battery output and much better nvh... of course they also need more efficiency. But cost is primary factory, just like with Prius 1.8l engine.
S
[​IMG]


If we look at this chart again we are missing
- 2 smaller engines under 2.0l... we have no clue what they are. It seems they want to introduce new 2.0l as replacement for old 1.8l ZR engine that was probably their most sold engine in the world. They also just recently introduced updated 1.0l and 1.5l engines.
- Engine bwteen 2.5l and 2.0l? This has to be a turbo engine, maybe 1.5l turbo? But then why would UX get 2.0l in some markets? Maybe less expensive than 1.5l turbo while 2.5l might be overall superior? So who would get 1.5l turbo? Markets with fuel efficiency taxes, upgraded powertrain for small cars?
- 3.5l GR replacement it seems - between 2.5l and 3.5ltt. Will it have a turbo? If it has a turbo it might be a 3.0l. If not, it will be all new 3.5l NA engine. Why NA? Because it has to be cost effective. This will be a base engine for many Lexus vehicles. They cant have a very expensive twin turbo engine as base and most of Lexus buyers do not want 4cly turbo engine as we know by now.
- Larger than 3.5tt is obviously V8 engines for new Tundra and for new LC-F.
- Larger than 300h hybrid engine? Might it be based on 2.0t? I am not sure what can be less than latest 3.5l "500h" but more than 300h if it is not a 2.0l with turbo.
S
[​IMG]


If we look at this chart again we are missing
- 2 smaller engines under 2.0l... we have no clue what they are. It seems they want to introduce new 2.0l as replacement for old 1.8l ZR engine that was probably their most sold engine in the world. They also just recently introduced updated 1.0l and 1.5l engines.
- Engine bwteen 2.5l and 2.0l? This has to be a turbo engine, maybe 1.5l turbo? But then why would UX get 2.0l in some markets? Maybe less expensive than 1.5l turbo while 2.5l might be overall superior? So who would get 1.5l turbo? Markets with fuel efficiency taxes, upgraded powertrain for small cars?
- 3.5l GR replacement it seems - between 2.5l and 3.5ltt. Will it have a turbo? If it has a turbo it might be a 3.0l. If not, it will be all new 3.5l NA engine. Why NA? Because it has to be cost effective. This will be a base engine for many Lexus vehicles. They cant have a very expensive twin turbo engine as base and most of Lexus buyers do not want 4cly turbo engine as we know by now.
- Larger than 3.5tt is obviously V8 engines for new Tundra and for new LC-F.
- Larger than 300h hybrid engine? Might it be based on 2.0t? I am not sure what can be less than latest 3.5l "500h" but more than 300h if it is not a 2.0l with turbo.
S
[​IMG]


If we look at this chart again we are missing
- 2 smaller engines under 2.0l... we have no clue what they are. It seems they want to introduce new 2.0l as replacement for old 1.8l ZR engine that was probably their most sold engine in the world. They also just recently introduced updated 1.0l and 1.5l engines.
- Engine bwteen 2.5l and 2.0l? This has to be a turbo engine, maybe 1.5l turbo? But then why would UX get 2.0l in some markets? Maybe less expensive than 1.5l turbo while 2.5l might be overall superior? So who would get 1.5l turbo? Markets with fuel efficiency taxes, upgraded powertrain for small cars?
- 3.5l GR replacement it seems - between 2.5l and 3.5ltt. Will it have a turbo? If it has a turbo it might be a 3.0l. If not, it will be all new 3.5l NA engine. Why NA? Because it has to be cost effective. This will be a base engine for many Lexus vehicles. They cant have a very expensive twin turbo engine as base and most of Lexus buyers do not want 4cly turbo engine as we know by now.
- Larger than 3.5tt is obviously V8 engines for new Tundra and for new LC-F.
- Larger than 300h hybrid engine? Might it be based on 2.0t? I am not sure what can be less than latest 3.5l "500h" but more than 300h if it is not a 2.0l with turbo.
L
One thing you are missing is the a powerful diesel engine (V6 or V8). No way Toyota will sell any new Land Cruiser without diesel in the rest of the world, unless they have a Land Cruiser Hybrid.



ssun30
This sounds hilarious, but the possibility of Lexus restarting a horsepower war is non-zero. They are the ones who started it since the original GS400. The horsepower war is only getting worse with electrification. In China we get 542hp hybrid family SUVs starting from $40,000 before incentives. And of course everyone gets the bull/stallion-slaying Model S.
Yes, Volvo with T8 version, +400 Ps and BYD Tang PHEV with 505PS, 0-100km/h in 4.5 sec, among the many Chinese cars.

L
One thing you are missing is the a powerful diesel engine (V6 or V8). No way Toyota will sell any new Land Cruiser without diesel in the rest of the world, unless they have a Land Cruiser Hybrid.



ssun30
This sounds hilarious, but the possibility of Lexus restarting a horsepower war is non-zero. They are the ones who started it since the original GS400. The horsepower war is only getting worse with electrification. In China we get 542hp hybrid family SUVs starting from $40,000 before incentives. And of course everyone gets the bull/stallion-slaying Model S.
Yes, Volvo with T8 version, +400 Ps and BYD Tang PHEV with 505PS, 0-100km/h in 4.5 sec, among the many Chinese cars.

L
One thing you are missing is the a powerful diesel engine (V6 or V8). No way Toyota will sell any new Land Cruiser without diesel in the rest of the world, unless they have a Land Cruiser Hybrid.



ssun30
This sounds hilarious, but the possibility of Lexus restarting a horsepower war is non-zero. They are the ones who started it since the original GS400. The horsepower war is only getting worse with electrification. In China we get 542hp hybrid family SUVs starting from $40,000 before incentives. And of course everyone gets the bull/stallion-slaying Model S.
Yes, Volvo with T8 version, +400 Ps and BYD Tang PHEV with 505PS, 0-100km/h in 4.5 sec, among the many Chinese cars.

S
spwolf
- As to the 4cly vs 3cly, unfortunately those were designed to satisfy old NEDC emissions/fuel consumption... in real tests by European mags, those 3cly turbos have poor efficiency. For instance Autobild tested BMW's new turbo 3cly and they got worse efficiency than their old engines.
- 8NR-FTS is also very new engine... maybe update with new transmissions and in new platforms will add 7-8% better efficiency as well as some internal changes or turbo changes. I read from owners posts that they are pretty happy with 1.2t's fuel consumption in C-HRs, numbers are pretty low and much better than what people used to get with small 1.8l Rav4's.
The 4 vs. 3 cylinder comparison was mirroring a TMEC engineer's comment. MPG does not equate efficiency nor is it the other way around. But in their internal evaluation, they determined a 3 cylinder would better suit the sub-1.5L segment. The Dynamic Force concept would be hard to apply (or not optimally) to only 300 cc/cylinder. How BMW B38 equipped Minis failed to match the MPG of the Prince 1.6 is a mystery, but it could be a very complicated matter.
I didn't say users are unhappy with the 1.2T; they are more annoyed by the two gearboxes it comes with. It was the engineer themselves who weren't too impressed by the 8NR-FTS. They hoped to work on a 1.4T unit because 350cc/cylinder is easier to optimize. That project got shelved for unknown reasons.

spwolf
As to the hybrid, why would it get a power bump?
For use on a bigger vehicle, like Asia-spec Corolla/Vios.

Levi
One thing you are missing is the a powerful diesel engine (V6 or V8). No way Toyota will sell any new Land Cruiser without diesel in the rest of the world, unless they have a Land Cruiser Hybrid.
A new diesel engine is the least of their concern. I don't think TMC is going to develop a diesel engine from scratch, ever. They are investing an enormous amount of resources on engineering TNGA 1.0 and R&D on TNGA 2.0 and EV. Plus all these rumors about diesel bans. The chance of an entirely new diesel is infinitesimal.
Not updating its current diesel engines means better serviceability and part availability which is the prime concern in those regions that use diesel utility vehicles extensively. They do not need more power, there is plenty already. They want the engine to operate into eternity and nothing else.
Oh, and this lineup is for TMC's 'major' markets only, i.e. NA, Japan, EU, and China. They will keep a separate plan for the developing world.
S
spwolf
- As to the 4cly vs 3cly, unfortunately those were designed to satisfy old NEDC emissions/fuel consumption... in real tests by European mags, those 3cly turbos have poor efficiency. For instance Autobild tested BMW's new turbo 3cly and they got worse efficiency than their old engines.
- 8NR-FTS is also very new engine... maybe update with new transmissions and in new platforms will add 7-8% better efficiency as well as some internal changes or turbo changes. I read from owners posts that they are pretty happy with 1.2t's fuel consumption in C-HRs, numbers are pretty low and much better than what people used to get with small 1.8l Rav4's.
The 4 vs. 3 cylinder comparison was mirroring a TMEC engineer's comment. MPG does not equate efficiency nor is it the other way around. But in their internal evaluation, they determined a 3 cylinder would better suit the sub-1.5L segment. The Dynamic Force concept would be hard to apply (or not optimally) to only 300 cc/cylinder. How BMW B38 equipped Minis failed to match the MPG of the Prince 1.6 is a mystery, but it could be a very complicated matter.
I didn't say users are unhappy with the 1.2T; they are more annoyed by the two gearboxes it comes with. It was the engineer themselves who weren't too impressed by the 8NR-FTS. They hoped to work on a 1.4T unit because 350cc/cylinder is easier to optimize. That project got shelved for unknown reasons.

spwolf
As to the hybrid, why would it get a power bump?
For use on a bigger vehicle, like Asia-spec Corolla/Vios.

Levi
One thing you are missing is the a powerful diesel engine (V6 or V8). No way Toyota will sell any new Land Cruiser without diesel in the rest of the world, unless they have a Land Cruiser Hybrid.
A new diesel engine is the least of their concern. I don't think TMC is going to develop a diesel engine from scratch, ever. They are investing an enormous amount of resources on engineering TNGA 1.0 and R&D on TNGA 2.0 and EV. Plus all these rumors about diesel bans. The chance of an entirely new diesel is infinitesimal.
Not updating its current diesel engines means better serviceability and part availability which is the prime concern in those regions that use diesel utility vehicles extensively. They do not need more power, there is plenty already. They want the engine to operate into eternity and nothing else.
Oh, and this lineup is for TMC's 'major' markets only, i.e. NA, Japan, EU, and China. They will keep a separate plan for the developing world.
S
spwolf
- As to the 4cly vs 3cly, unfortunately those were designed to satisfy old NEDC emissions/fuel consumption... in real tests by European mags, those 3cly turbos have poor efficiency. For instance Autobild tested BMW's new turbo 3cly and they got worse efficiency than their old engines.
- 8NR-FTS is also very new engine... maybe update with new transmissions and in new platforms will add 7-8% better efficiency as well as some internal changes or turbo changes. I read from owners posts that they are pretty happy with 1.2t's fuel consumption in C-HRs, numbers are pretty low and much better than what people used to get with small 1.8l Rav4's.
The 4 vs. 3 cylinder comparison was mirroring a TMEC engineer's comment. MPG does not equate efficiency nor is it the other way around. But in their internal evaluation, they determined a 3 cylinder would better suit the sub-1.5L segment. The Dynamic Force concept would be hard to apply (or not optimally) to only 300 cc/cylinder. How BMW B38 equipped Minis failed to match the MPG of the Prince 1.6 is a mystery, but it could be a very complicated matter.
I didn't say users are unhappy with the 1.2T; they are more annoyed by the two gearboxes it comes with. It was the engineer themselves who weren't too impressed by the 8NR-FTS. They hoped to work on a 1.4T unit because 350cc/cylinder is easier to optimize. That project got shelved for unknown reasons.

spwolf
As to the hybrid, why would it get a power bump?
For use on a bigger vehicle, like Asia-spec Corolla/Vios.

Levi
One thing you are missing is the a powerful diesel engine (V6 or V8). No way Toyota will sell any new Land Cruiser without diesel in the rest of the world, unless they have a Land Cruiser Hybrid.
A new diesel engine is the least of their concern. I don't think TMC is going to develop a diesel engine from scratch, ever. They are investing an enormous amount of resources on engineering TNGA 1.0 and R&D on TNGA 2.0 and EV. Plus all these rumors about diesel bans. The chance of an entirely new diesel is infinitesimal.
Not updating its current diesel engines means better serviceability and part availability which is the prime concern in those regions that use diesel utility vehicles extensively. They do not need more power, there is plenty already. They want the engine to operate into eternity and nothing else.
Oh, and this lineup is for TMC's 'major' markets only, i.e. NA, Japan, EU, and China. They will keep a separate plan for the developing world.
S
ssun30
The 4 vs. 3 cylinder comparison was mirroring a TMEC engineer's comment. MPG does not equate efficiency nor is it the other way around. But in their internal evaluation, they determined a 3 cylinder would better suit the sub-1.5L segment. The Dynamic Force concept would be hard to apply (or not optimally) to only 300 cc/cylinder. How BMW B38 equipped Minis failed to match the MPG of the Prince 1.6 is a mystery, but it could be a very complicated matter.
I didn't say users are unhappy with the 1.2T; they are more annoyed by the two gearboxes it comes with. It was the engineer themselves who weren't too impressed by the 8NR-FTS. They hoped to work on a 1.4T unit because 350cc/cylinder is easier to optimize. That project got shelved for unknown reasons.


For use on a bigger vehicle, like Asia-spec Corolla/Vios.
Asia spec Vios gets old 1.5l which even older hybrid will be better than performance wise... dont expect major spec bump, just overall better package, exactly like 1.8l and 2.5l hybrid upgrades. In fact, expect one simpler hybrid powertrain that might go into those cheaper vehicles, not more complicated one... price is a big factor in that segment.

As to the 3cly vs 4cly, I think TMC made a choice already with both 1.2t and 1.5l Estec engine.

It is not just BMW, across the industry 3cly turbos are not proving as good efficiency wise. Maybe they have to be on boost too much since without it they are too anemic? So turbo is always working? FCA's 2cly turbo is even worse.
S
ssun30
The 4 vs. 3 cylinder comparison was mirroring a TMEC engineer's comment. MPG does not equate efficiency nor is it the other way around. But in their internal evaluation, they determined a 3 cylinder would better suit the sub-1.5L segment. The Dynamic Force concept would be hard to apply (or not optimally) to only 300 cc/cylinder. How BMW B38 equipped Minis failed to match the MPG of the Prince 1.6 is a mystery, but it could be a very complicated matter.
I didn't say users are unhappy with the 1.2T; they are more annoyed by the two gearboxes it comes with. It was the engineer themselves who weren't too impressed by the 8NR-FTS. They hoped to work on a 1.4T unit because 350cc/cylinder is easier to optimize. That project got shelved for unknown reasons.


For use on a bigger vehicle, like Asia-spec Corolla/Vios.
Asia spec Vios gets old 1.5l which even older hybrid will be better than performance wise... dont expect major spec bump, just overall better package, exactly like 1.8l and 2.5l hybrid upgrades. In fact, expect one simpler hybrid powertrain that might go into those cheaper vehicles, not more complicated one... price is a big factor in that segment.

As to the 3cly vs 4cly, I think TMC made a choice already with both 1.2t and 1.5l Estec engine.

It is not just BMW, across the industry 3cly turbos are not proving as good efficiency wise. Maybe they have to be on boost too much since without it they are too anemic? So turbo is always working? FCA's 2cly turbo is even worse.
S
ssun30
The 4 vs. 3 cylinder comparison was mirroring a TMEC engineer's comment. MPG does not equate efficiency nor is it the other way around. But in their internal evaluation, they determined a 3 cylinder would better suit the sub-1.5L segment. The Dynamic Force concept would be hard to apply (or not optimally) to only 300 cc/cylinder. How BMW B38 equipped Minis failed to match the MPG of the Prince 1.6 is a mystery, but it could be a very complicated matter.
I didn't say users are unhappy with the 1.2T; they are more annoyed by the two gearboxes it comes with. It was the engineer themselves who weren't too impressed by the 8NR-FTS. They hoped to work on a 1.4T unit because 350cc/cylinder is easier to optimize. That project got shelved for unknown reasons.


For use on a bigger vehicle, like Asia-spec Corolla/Vios.
Asia spec Vios gets old 1.5l which even older hybrid will be better than performance wise... dont expect major spec bump, just overall better package, exactly like 1.8l and 2.5l hybrid upgrades. In fact, expect one simpler hybrid powertrain that might go into those cheaper vehicles, not more complicated one... price is a big factor in that segment.

As to the 3cly vs 4cly, I think TMC made a choice already with both 1.2t and 1.5l Estec engine.

It is not just BMW, across the industry 3cly turbos are not proving as good efficiency wise. Maybe they have to be on boost too much since without it they are too anemic? So turbo is always working? FCA's 2cly turbo is even worse.
S
Levi
One thing you are missing is the a powerful diesel engine (V6 or V8). No way Toyota will sell any new Land Cruiser without diesel in the rest of the world, unless they have a Land Cruiser Hybrid.
This chart was for last 18 months, ending with 2018 year if I remember correctly... so it is until indefinite period, it is for engines and tech revealed until end of 2018.

So diesels for Land Cruiser 200 are not going to be there. Even though they sell it only in few countries in the world, I wonder if there will be big diesel for Land Cruiser 200 coming ever, they might just get a BMW diesel for it since markets where LC 200 sells is not markets where diesel is big.

S