Driving the All-New 2019 Lexus ES 350 & ES 300h


Lexus Enthusiast editor Kevin Watts traveled to Nashville, Tennessee last month to test drive the all-new 2019 Lexus ES 350 & ES 300h hybrid. This is his personal impressions of the car, a full technical overview was posted last week.

For one moment, forget about the new Lexus ES sedan. Instead, think about every ES previous, and how you would describe it. It would likely be with words like Comfortable or Predictable, perhaps Conservative or even Dull if you were being less charitable.

For six generations, the ES has epitomized the old-school approach to luxury vehicles by being plush and dependable, never pushing the envelope or stepping outside of the lines. As a formula, the success is undeniable — Lexus has sold 2.12 million ES sedans since 1989, with over 1 million in the USA alone.

But that was then, and this is now. Sedan sales used to be able to support the IS sports sedan, the GS mid-size sedan, and the ES that straddled the two in price and size, respectively. Now, the entire automotive market thinks only of crossovers & SUVS, and Lexus has to be selective when updating its sedan lineup.

Enter the seventh-generation ES, a sedan that moves the needle closer to mid-size luxury in class and quality, while maintaining its price position as an entry-level luxury car. The times have changed, and the formula must change with it.


In the past, there’s been a hard limit in terms of the ES design. Despite the similarities in character to the LS flagship, Lexus has been mindful to maintain a respectful distance between the two models. This is no longer the case with the new model, as the ES now borrows from the LS sedan extensively. Even so, it’s only in the broad strokes — the seventh-generation ES is a much simpler design, free from the trappings of being a flagship.

My mixed feelings on the waterfall grille of the standard model have subsided somewhat, though I much prefer the styling of the ES F SPORT on the whole. There are certain configurations of color and angle where the car looks more expensive and upscale than necessary.

(As for the new colors: Sunlit Green is surprisingly intense with a wide spectrum depending on lighting. Moonbeam Beige Metallic is not my thing.)


Inside, the cabin is dominated by the 12.3-inch multimedia display, to the point where the rest of the interior practically fades away. It’s well enough that the biggest upgrade happens behind that screen, with the introduction of Apple CarPlay and the integration of the Amazon Alexa voice service.

Lexus ES Interior

There will be the usual complaints about the Remote Touch controller, which appears as a touchpad in the ES, but the new openness of the Lexus infotainment software makes manual input feel archaic. Voice control is fluid, working well regardless of the preferred service.

After so many years without support, having Apple CarPlay should be the turning point in discussing Lexus infotainment. Lack of Google integration is a valid complaint, but anyone in the Apple or Amazon ecosystem will be very happy.

(Unfortunate that the in-car Alexa must be launched every time the car is turned on, but there’s surely a contingent of buyers that are happy for that additional layer of privacy.)

For the rest of the cabin, some point-form from my notes:

  • The “wave” leather pattern available with some packages is subtle in appearance but bold in design. Lexus took a real chance adding texture to the trim, but it ends up elevating the interior.
  • A full black interior does the cabin no favors, as it hides the details and highlights the plastics. On the flip side, the Circuit Red interior is brilliant, perfectly in line with F SPORT while keeping a semblance of maturity expected with the ES.
  • There just isn’t enough wood trim in the cabin, though it does allow for a nice upgrade in the mid-cycle refresh down the line.

While I made sure to drive the standard ES 350 and the hybrid ES 300h, I was unable to escape the siren call of the Ultra White ES 350 F SPORT and its Circuit Red interior. There will be those that deride the very existence of a front-wheel-drive ES performance package, but the benefits are real and pronounced.

As expected, the upgrades all center on the driver — the steering wheel is leather-wrapped and thicker, the seats have extended side bolsters, there’s aluminum pedals and a G-Force gauge in the instrument panel. An Adaptive Variable Suspension is standard.

Lexus ES Driving

The thing that sold me was the steering, where the ES F SPORT is a significant upgrade over the standard model. There’s more weight to the wheel, providing better feedback and increasing the luxury factor of the driving experience. Again, the ES emulates a more expensive car in a very positive way.

(It should be noted that steering feel becomes much heavier in Sport mode for both Luxury and F Sport models.)


There’s a point during the day when I’m out in an ES 300h, driving around the Tennessee countryside, looking for somewhere to take photos and maybe shoot a video. My expectation of a quick turnaround quickly subsides, and I find myself driving aimlessly, pulling into small driveways, backing out onto busy roads, trying to find a patch of privacy with a good view.

Here’s the kicker — I never end up finding a spot. 40 minutes in the southern wilderness, and not a photo opportunity anywhere. But in the process, I do learn a couple things about the ES, the hybrid in particular.

Lexus ES Driving

Where the ES F SPORT feels like a distant relative to the previous generation, the ES hybrid is more evolutionary in its handling — light to the touch, but still grounded on the road.

The ES 300h is whisper quiet at moderate load, but even with the additional hybrid frequency-specific sound dampening, I’m not a fan of the engine & electric interplay. During heightened acceleration, the whine is audible and mechanical, like a washing machine spinning too fast.

But the driving experience is almost besides the point, because the ES 300h delivers a combined 44 mpg for city & highway driving. Outside of a plug-in, there is no more fuel-efficient luxury car available in the USA. I’m convinced my IQ went up a few points in my time behind the wheel.


In a lucky turn of events, the standard ES 350 is the last car I drive — it’s an amalgamation of the other two cars, with the F SPORT’s V6 and its eight-speed transmission with the lighter driving touch of the ES 300h.

If you have any familiarity with the ES sedan over the years, and perhaps are looking to capture that classic experience, the ES 350 is the car for you. The core experience remains the same — the cabin is still comfortably isolating, and the driving remains suitably effortless. The drive back to the hotel is a breeze, just as you would hope for after a long day.


Lexus ES Final

So what words would I use to describe this new ES? Comfortable most certainly, but I would add Confident and even Compelling as new qualities. Lexus may want to position this car against the Mercedes C-Class & Audi A4, but its true competitors are a class above and $10,000 more expensive. There is a lot of car for the money here.

This leads to wondering about how the front-wheel drive of the ES will compete against the rear-wheel drive performance of the E-Class or the all-wheel drive of the A6, but this is only one part of the formula. The better question is, how can Mercedes and Audi afford to compete with this car?

FeaturesLexus ES: Sixth Generation
Comments
As to the AWD, while all the rumors say it is coming, lets keep in mind that AWD take rate is something like 8% in the USA and much less in Europe.
S
spwolf
As to the AWD, while all the rumors say it is coming, lets keep in mind that AWD take rate is something like 8% in the USA and much less in Europe.
+1 Good info to know. While I never really thought about it, its true. The USA AWD take-rate is pretty low.
S
spwolf
As to the AWD, while all the rumors say it is coming, lets keep in mind that AWD take rate is something like 8% in the USA and much less in Europe.
+1 Good info to know. While I never really thought about it, its true. The USA AWD take-rate is pretty low.
S
spwolf
As to the AWD, while all the rumors say it is coming, lets keep in mind that AWD take rate is something like 8% in the USA and much less in Europe.
+1 Good info to know. While I never really thought about it, its true. The USA AWD take-rate is pretty low.
Krew, I want to thank you for your very thorough review. All my questions have been answered.
Krew, I want to thank you for your very thorough review. All my questions have been answered.
Krew, I want to thank you for your very thorough review. All my questions have been answered.
I don't want to incline you towards a new ES300h review from a Polish guy. His name is Pertyn Ględzi. I will tell you only that I like how he gives the sensation of acceleration from a camera being fitted at the driver's side windscreen pointing towards the cabin. Of course video has English subs.
I don't want to incline you towards a new ES300h review from a Polish guy. His name is Pertyn Ględzi. I will tell you only that I like how he gives the sensation of acceleration from a camera being fitted at the driver's side windscreen pointing towards the cabin. Of course video has English subs.
I don't want to incline you towards a new ES300h review from a Polish guy. His name is Pertyn Ględzi. I will tell you only that I like how he gives the sensation of acceleration from a camera being fitted at the driver's side windscreen pointing towards the cabin. Of course video has English subs.
Sakura
+1 Good info to know. While I never really thought about it, its true. The USA AWD take-rate is pretty low.
Now i'm no expert in sales and marketing...but I would think that AWD uptake would increase if they cull the GS. I know GS sales are not through the roof. But there will be IS owners wanting bigger cars but not necessarily looking at the SUV offerings being left without any viable options. They are not going to step down into a FWD. I mean yes, in the real world, FWD and RWD makes almost no difference to the driving experience. But luxury cars are not just about practicality right?

I also believe that the hump there is not just aesthetic. The GA-K platform does support AWD. As seen in the Toyota CH-R and upcoming RAV4 lexus UX and future Toyota/lexus SUVs like the next generation RX and NX. There was also rumours of a hotted up camry a while back (https://www.caradvice.com.au/603430/hotted-up-toyota-camry-chief-engineer-loves-the-idea/ ...i'm Australian...). And yes there are a lot of differences but at the end of the day, the drivetrains are pretty much the same. So there is still hope right?

Boy wouldn't it be awesome to have a more powerful ES...roughly 250kw AWD...10 speed...i'm not asking for too much right? Also gimme rear seet warmers and double wishbone front suspension...it seems such a waste to have such a beautiful car hindered by FWD...Australians get it even worse. Just two grades, no F-sport and no V6. such a shame.
Sakura
+1 Good info to know. While I never really thought about it, its true. The USA AWD take-rate is pretty low.
Now i'm no expert in sales and marketing...but I would think that AWD uptake would increase if they cull the GS. I know GS sales are not through the roof. But there will be IS owners wanting bigger cars but not necessarily looking at the SUV offerings being left without any viable options. They are not going to step down into a FWD. I mean yes, in the real world, FWD and RWD makes almost no difference to the driving experience. But luxury cars are not just about practicality right?

I also believe that the hump there is not just aesthetic. The GA-K platform does support AWD. As seen in the Toyota CH-R and upcoming RAV4 lexus UX and future Toyota/lexus SUVs like the next generation RX and NX. There was also rumours of a hotted up camry a while back (https://www.caradvice.com.au/603430/hotted-up-toyota-camry-chief-engineer-loves-the-idea/ ...i'm Australian...). And yes there are a lot of differences but at the end of the day, the drivetrains are pretty much the same. So there is still hope right?

Boy wouldn't it be awesome to have a more powerful ES...roughly 250kw AWD...10 speed...i'm not asking for too much right? Also gimme rear seet warmers and double wishbone front suspension...it seems such a waste to have such a beautiful car hindered by FWD...Australians get it even worse. Just two grades, no F-sport and no V6. such a shame.
Sakura
+1 Good info to know. While I never really thought about it, its true. The USA AWD take-rate is pretty low.
Now i'm no expert in sales and marketing...but I would think that AWD uptake would increase if they cull the GS. I know GS sales are not through the roof. But there will be IS owners wanting bigger cars but not necessarily looking at the SUV offerings being left without any viable options. They are not going to step down into a FWD. I mean yes, in the real world, FWD and RWD makes almost no difference to the driving experience. But luxury cars are not just about practicality right?

I also believe that the hump there is not just aesthetic. The GA-K platform does support AWD. As seen in the Toyota CH-R and upcoming RAV4 lexus UX and future Toyota/lexus SUVs like the next generation RX and NX. There was also rumours of a hotted up camry a while back (https://www.caradvice.com.au/603430/hotted-up-toyota-camry-chief-engineer-loves-the-idea/ ...i'm Australian...). And yes there are a lot of differences but at the end of the day, the drivetrains are pretty much the same. So there is still hope right?

Boy wouldn't it be awesome to have a more powerful ES...roughly 250kw AWD...10 speed...i'm not asking for too much right? Also gimme rear seet warmers and double wishbone front suspension...it seems such a waste to have such a beautiful car hindered by FWD...Australians get it even worse. Just two grades, no F-sport and no V6. such a shame.
S
thtupid
Now i'm no expert in sales and marketing...but I would think that AWD uptake would increase if they cull the GS. I know GS sales are not through the roof. But there will be IS owners wanting bigger cars but not necessarily looking at the SUV offerings being left without any viable options. They are not going to step down into a FWD. I mean yes, in the real world, FWD and RWD makes almost no difference to the driving experience. But luxury cars are not just about practicality right?

I also believe that the hump there is not just aesthetic. The GA-K platform does support AWD. As seen in the Toyota CH-R and upcoming RAV4 lexus UX and future Toyota/lexus SUVs like the next generation RX and NX. There was also rumours of a hotted up camry a while back (https://www.caradvice.com.au/603430/hotted-up-toyota-camry-chief-engineer-loves-the-idea/ ...i'm Australian...). And yes there are a lot of differences but at the end of the day, the drivetrains are pretty much the same. So there is still hope right?

Boy wouldn't it be awesome to have a more powerful ES...roughly 250kw AWD...10 speed...i'm not asking for too much right? Also gimme rear seet warmers and double wishbone front suspension...it seems such a waste to have such a beautiful car hindered by FWD...Australians get it even worse. Just two grades, no F-sport and no V6. such a shame.
Not necessarily. The Lexus ES's core demographic is a male of 50 years of age or older. Its also - these likely owners are current Lexus ES owners or Camry/Avalon owners looking for a change. This shows evidence that the Lexus ES is in no demand of a AWD because sales of the previous were insanely good without AWD. With no complaints or demands for it from core consumers. The only reason why anyone is saying "AWD ES" is because of the rumors of the GS going away and these are from minority of people or enthusiasts.

The problem is: GS owners or potential GS buyers will not "drop a tier" to go buy an AWD ES. Its more likely GS owners will bail on the Lexus brand and go German. A lot of CL (ClubLexus) GS owners are saying this. And it make sense. A RWD owner wouldn't substitute having RWD for AWD.

Similarity, to the Lexus IS. Majority of IS owners are younger and want something entry-level + sporty + RWD. The Lexus IS loaded will be cheaper by at least by a couple thousand compared to a AWD ES.

Sure - maybe a little bit of the IS/GS owners will be in the minority and go to the ES. But the question is: how much money will Lexus make from an AWD ES? Will it be worth for the little bit extra of sales? You likely won't get enough GS and IS owners to buy the ES to make developing an AWD worth it. Especially since the USA market is on a SUV craze and the sedan is already facing tough competition. An AWD SUV will make more sense too because it has more clearance.

The hump, of course, is not purely aesthetics. The GA-K platform does support AWD. But Toyota is pretty much catching up in this department. Many FWD cars had humps for the exhaust pipes since the early 2000s. The Acura TSX had a hump and was never offered AWD.

Of course - it would be awesome. As car enthusiasts, we would love to see it. As a car enthusiasts, I would love to see an ES AWD with a Turbo engine. As a Toyota shareholder, an AWD Turbo ES would be bad business. An AWD will not generate enough return to create enough profits. It'll be a waste of development cash. A Turbo ES will damage the core image of the ES - will deter sales from mass consumers in favor of enthusiasts, which isn't the driving force of profits.
S
thtupid
Now i'm no expert in sales and marketing...but I would think that AWD uptake would increase if they cull the GS. I know GS sales are not through the roof. But there will be IS owners wanting bigger cars but not necessarily looking at the SUV offerings being left without any viable options. They are not going to step down into a FWD. I mean yes, in the real world, FWD and RWD makes almost no difference to the driving experience. But luxury cars are not just about practicality right?

I also believe that the hump there is not just aesthetic. The GA-K platform does support AWD. As seen in the Toyota CH-R and upcoming RAV4 lexus UX and future Toyota/lexus SUVs like the next generation RX and NX. There was also rumours of a hotted up camry a while back (https://www.caradvice.com.au/603430/hotted-up-toyota-camry-chief-engineer-loves-the-idea/ ...i'm Australian...). And yes there are a lot of differences but at the end of the day, the drivetrains are pretty much the same. So there is still hope right?

Boy wouldn't it be awesome to have a more powerful ES...roughly 250kw AWD...10 speed...i'm not asking for too much right? Also gimme rear seet warmers and double wishbone front suspension...it seems such a waste to have such a beautiful car hindered by FWD...Australians get it even worse. Just two grades, no F-sport and no V6. such a shame.
Not necessarily. The Lexus ES's core demographic is a male of 50 years of age or older. Its also - these likely owners are current Lexus ES owners or Camry/Avalon owners looking for a change. This shows evidence that the Lexus ES is in no demand of a AWD because sales of the previous were insanely good without AWD. With no complaints or demands for it from core consumers. The only reason why anyone is saying "AWD ES" is because of the rumors of the GS going away and these are from minority of people or enthusiasts.

The problem is: GS owners or potential GS buyers will not "drop a tier" to go buy an AWD ES. Its more likely GS owners will bail on the Lexus brand and go German. A lot of CL (ClubLexus) GS owners are saying this. And it make sense. A RWD owner wouldn't substitute having RWD for AWD.

Similarity, to the Lexus IS. Majority of IS owners are younger and want something entry-level + sporty + RWD. The Lexus IS loaded will be cheaper by at least by a couple thousand compared to a AWD ES.

Sure - maybe a little bit of the IS/GS owners will be in the minority and go to the ES. But the question is: how much money will Lexus make from an AWD ES? Will it be worth for the little bit extra of sales? You likely won't get enough GS and IS owners to buy the ES to make developing an AWD worth it. Especially since the USA market is on a SUV craze and the sedan is already facing tough competition. An AWD SUV will make more sense too because it has more clearance.

The hump, of course, is not purely aesthetics. The GA-K platform does support AWD. But Toyota is pretty much catching up in this department. Many FWD cars had humps for the exhaust pipes since the early 2000s. The Acura TSX had a hump and was never offered AWD.

Of course - it would be awesome. As car enthusiasts, we would love to see it. As a car enthusiasts, I would love to see an ES AWD with a Turbo engine. As a Toyota shareholder, an AWD Turbo ES would be bad business. An AWD will not generate enough return to create enough profits. It'll be a waste of development cash. A Turbo ES will damage the core image of the ES - will deter sales from mass consumers in favor of enthusiasts, which isn't the driving force of profits.
S
thtupid
Now i'm no expert in sales and marketing...but I would think that AWD uptake would increase if they cull the GS. I know GS sales are not through the roof. But there will be IS owners wanting bigger cars but not necessarily looking at the SUV offerings being left without any viable options. They are not going to step down into a FWD. I mean yes, in the real world, FWD and RWD makes almost no difference to the driving experience. But luxury cars are not just about practicality right?

I also believe that the hump there is not just aesthetic. The GA-K platform does support AWD. As seen in the Toyota CH-R and upcoming RAV4 lexus UX and future Toyota/lexus SUVs like the next generation RX and NX. There was also rumours of a hotted up camry a while back (https://www.caradvice.com.au/603430/hotted-up-toyota-camry-chief-engineer-loves-the-idea/ ...i'm Australian...). And yes there are a lot of differences but at the end of the day, the drivetrains are pretty much the same. So there is still hope right?

Boy wouldn't it be awesome to have a more powerful ES...roughly 250kw AWD...10 speed...i'm not asking for too much right? Also gimme rear seet warmers and double wishbone front suspension...it seems such a waste to have such a beautiful car hindered by FWD...Australians get it even worse. Just two grades, no F-sport and no V6. such a shame.
Not necessarily. The Lexus ES's core demographic is a male of 50 years of age or older. Its also - these likely owners are current Lexus ES owners or Camry/Avalon owners looking for a change. This shows evidence that the Lexus ES is in no demand of a AWD because sales of the previous were insanely good without AWD. With no complaints or demands for it from core consumers. The only reason why anyone is saying "AWD ES" is because of the rumors of the GS going away and these are from minority of people or enthusiasts.

The problem is: GS owners or potential GS buyers will not "drop a tier" to go buy an AWD ES. Its more likely GS owners will bail on the Lexus brand and go German. A lot of CL (ClubLexus) GS owners are saying this. And it make sense. A RWD owner wouldn't substitute having RWD for AWD.

Similarity, to the Lexus IS. Majority of IS owners are younger and want something entry-level + sporty + RWD. The Lexus IS loaded will be cheaper by at least by a couple thousand compared to a AWD ES.

Sure - maybe a little bit of the IS/GS owners will be in the minority and go to the ES. But the question is: how much money will Lexus make from an AWD ES? Will it be worth for the little bit extra of sales? You likely won't get enough GS and IS owners to buy the ES to make developing an AWD worth it. Especially since the USA market is on a SUV craze and the sedan is already facing tough competition. An AWD SUV will make more sense too because it has more clearance.

The hump, of course, is not purely aesthetics. The GA-K platform does support AWD. But Toyota is pretty much catching up in this department. Many FWD cars had humps for the exhaust pipes since the early 2000s. The Acura TSX had a hump and was never offered AWD.

Of course - it would be awesome. As car enthusiasts, we would love to see it. As a car enthusiasts, I would love to see an ES AWD with a Turbo engine. As a Toyota shareholder, an AWD Turbo ES would be bad business. An AWD will not generate enough return to create enough profits. It'll be a waste of development cash. A Turbo ES will damage the core image of the ES - will deter sales from mass consumers in favor of enthusiasts, which isn't the driving force of profits.
Sakura
The hump, of course, is not purely aesthetics. The GA-K platform does support AWD. But Toyota is pretty much catching up in this department. Many FWD cars had humps for the exhaust pipes since the early 2000s. The Acura TSX had a hump and was never offered AWD.

Of course - it would be awesome. As car enthusiasts, we would love to see it. As a car enthusiasts, I would love to see an ES AWD with a Turbo engine. As a Toyota shareholder, an AWD Turbo ES would be bad business. An AWD will not generate enough return to create enough profits. It'll be a waste of development cash. A Turbo ES will damage the core image of the ES - will deter sales from mass consumers in favor of enthusiasts, which isn't the driving force of profits.
1) First point is false. The hump is much more pronounced than a regular exhaust hump. The height is what you'd expect from a RWD or AWD car. If they didn't prepare it for the axle then they are just wasting valuable leg room in the rear.

2) Nobody is saying they are making an AWD Turbo ES, just an AWD ES in general. 8% take rate is just a statistic without context. In what segment? In which area? On what type of vehicle? Which category of consumers buy AWD? Is there a year-to-year trend that suggests it is staying that way? I would like to hear about the details. There are areas in North America where AWD is a must. What you are saying is they should stop selling the ES sedan in these areas because there aren't any ES buyers or potential ES buyers there, which makes between 1% and 50% sense. Going by that logic, the IS and LS shouldn't be offered AWD either because they are selling at a much lower volume than the ES, and thus the absolute number of AWD sales is even lower, and as a result spending resources on AWD models is an even bigger waste.

I'm not fully denying your point here. Sometimes it's okay to abandon a certain demographics to achieve better overall results, sometimes it's not. But the thing is, we can't really tell on this issue without the data analysis capability of the accounting department of a mega corporation.

Oh also on the matter of turbo, they will replace the 3.5 V6 with a turbo at some point if only to reduce fuel consumption. It has nothing to do with the core image of the car, or trying to favor the enthusiasts for that matter (seriously, what kind of enthusiast would choose a turbo 4 vs. a naturally aspirated V6?). In fact replacing V6s with turbo 4s is all it took Toyota and Lexus to drastically increase sales in regions that favor turbo engines like China. Not having a turbo 4 on the ES is restricting how high they can reach in China; they are confined to the lower end of the premium segment with the 2.5 and 2.5 hybrid.

By the way they have already made the R&D investment in multiple AWD systems and integration of AWD with GA-K. I would call engineering a LC-F or LS-F a bigger waste of development cash because these two programs are almost guaranteed to lose money. If we take the argument even further, to optimize their business results, all the company really need to invest in are crossovers. The fact that even the most optimized automaker in the world does not run an seemingly optimized strategy means those earning six-figures are analyzing things with much more depth than we could.

To bring an end to this AWD discussion (seriously, it has been brought up way too many times in this forum that it needs to end), I would say let's just wait and see. The ES lineup is surely not complete at this point but honestly I don't care. The ES300h is really the sweet spot.
Sakura
The hump, of course, is not purely aesthetics. The GA-K platform does support AWD. But Toyota is pretty much catching up in this department. Many FWD cars had humps for the exhaust pipes since the early 2000s. The Acura TSX had a hump and was never offered AWD.

Of course - it would be awesome. As car enthusiasts, we would love to see it. As a car enthusiasts, I would love to see an ES AWD with a Turbo engine. As a Toyota shareholder, an AWD Turbo ES would be bad business. An AWD will not generate enough return to create enough profits. It'll be a waste of development cash. A Turbo ES will damage the core image of the ES - will deter sales from mass consumers in favor of enthusiasts, which isn't the driving force of profits.
1) First point is false. The hump is much more pronounced than a regular exhaust hump. The height is what you'd expect from a RWD or AWD car. If they didn't prepare it for the axle then they are just wasting valuable leg room in the rear.

2) Nobody is saying they are making an AWD Turbo ES, just an AWD ES in general. 8% take rate is just a statistic without context. In what segment? In which area? On what type of vehicle? Which category of consumers buy AWD? Is there a year-to-year trend that suggests it is staying that way? I would like to hear about the details. There are areas in North America where AWD is a must. What you are saying is they should stop selling the ES sedan in these areas because there aren't any ES buyers or potential ES buyers there, which makes between 1% and 50% sense. Going by that logic, the IS and LS shouldn't be offered AWD either because they are selling at a much lower volume than the ES, and thus the absolute number of AWD sales is even lower, and as a result spending resources on AWD models is an even bigger waste.

I'm not fully denying your point here. Sometimes it's okay to abandon a certain demographics to achieve better overall results, sometimes it's not. But the thing is, we can't really tell on this issue without the data analysis capability of the accounting department of a mega corporation.

Oh also on the matter of turbo, they will replace the 3.5 V6 with a turbo at some point if only to reduce fuel consumption. It has nothing to do with the core image of the car, or trying to favor the enthusiasts for that matter (seriously, what kind of enthusiast would choose a turbo 4 vs. a naturally aspirated V6?). In fact replacing V6s with turbo 4s is all it took Toyota and Lexus to drastically increase sales in regions that favor turbo engines like China. Not having a turbo 4 on the ES is restricting how high they can reach in China; they are confined to the lower end of the premium segment with the 2.5 and 2.5 hybrid.

By the way they have already made the R&D investment in multiple AWD systems and integration of AWD with GA-K. I would call engineering a LC-F or LS-F a bigger waste of development cash because these two programs are almost guaranteed to lose money. If we take the argument even further, to optimize their business results, all the company really need to invest in are crossovers. The fact that even the most optimized automaker in the world does not run an seemingly optimized strategy means those earning six-figures are analyzing things with much more depth than we could.

To bring an end to this AWD discussion (seriously, it has been brought up way too many times in this forum that it needs to end), I would say let's just wait and see. The ES lineup is surely not complete at this point but honestly I don't care. The ES300h is really the sweet spot.
Sakura
The hump, of course, is not purely aesthetics. The GA-K platform does support AWD. But Toyota is pretty much catching up in this department. Many FWD cars had humps for the exhaust pipes since the early 2000s. The Acura TSX had a hump and was never offered AWD.

Of course - it would be awesome. As car enthusiasts, we would love to see it. As a car enthusiasts, I would love to see an ES AWD with a Turbo engine. As a Toyota shareholder, an AWD Turbo ES would be bad business. An AWD will not generate enough return to create enough profits. It'll be a waste of development cash. A Turbo ES will damage the core image of the ES - will deter sales from mass consumers in favor of enthusiasts, which isn't the driving force of profits.
1) First point is false. The hump is much more pronounced than a regular exhaust hump. The height is what you'd expect from a RWD or AWD car. If they didn't prepare it for the axle then they are just wasting valuable leg room in the rear.

2) Nobody is saying they are making an AWD Turbo ES, just an AWD ES in general. 8% take rate is just a statistic without context. In what segment? In which area? On what type of vehicle? Which category of consumers buy AWD? Is there a year-to-year trend that suggests it is staying that way? I would like to hear about the details. There are areas in North America where AWD is a must. What you are saying is they should stop selling the ES sedan in these areas because there aren't any ES buyers or potential ES buyers there, which makes between 1% and 50% sense. Going by that logic, the IS and LS shouldn't be offered AWD either because they are selling at a much lower volume than the ES, and thus the absolute number of AWD sales is even lower, and as a result spending resources on AWD models is an even bigger waste.

I'm not fully denying your point here. Sometimes it's okay to abandon a certain demographics to achieve better overall results, sometimes it's not. But the thing is, we can't really tell on this issue without the data analysis capability of the accounting department of a mega corporation.

Oh also on the matter of turbo, they will replace the 3.5 V6 with a turbo at some point if only to reduce fuel consumption. It has nothing to do with the core image of the car, or trying to favor the enthusiasts for that matter (seriously, what kind of enthusiast would choose a turbo 4 vs. a naturally aspirated V6?). In fact replacing V6s with turbo 4s is all it took Toyota and Lexus to drastically increase sales in regions that favor turbo engines like China. Not having a turbo 4 on the ES is restricting how high they can reach in China; they are confined to the lower end of the premium segment with the 2.5 and 2.5 hybrid.

By the way they have already made the R&D investment in multiple AWD systems and integration of AWD with GA-K. I would call engineering a LC-F or LS-F a bigger waste of development cash because these two programs are almost guaranteed to lose money. If we take the argument even further, to optimize their business results, all the company really need to invest in are crossovers. The fact that even the most optimized automaker in the world does not run an seemingly optimized strategy means those earning six-figures are analyzing things with much more depth than we could.

To bring an end to this AWD discussion (seriously, it has been brought up way too many times in this forum that it needs to end), I would say let's just wait and see. The ES lineup is surely not complete at this point but honestly I don't care. The ES300h is really the sweet spot.
Well, AWD is rumored to come... I was just pointing how all these people who want AWD on the internet, in the end very few will buy AWD version.

But with worldwide models, AWD is more important now for ES. Not just snowy areas of USA but also Japanese love their AWDs.

edit: I would also guess it might be interesting for Russia, one of the best Lexus markets in the world... but i dont expect crazy numbers there.
Well, AWD is rumored to come... I was just pointing how all these people who want AWD on the internet, in the end very few will buy AWD version.

But with worldwide models, AWD is more important now for ES. Not just snowy areas of USA but also Japanese love their AWDs.

edit: I would also guess it might be interesting for Russia, one of the best Lexus markets in the world... but i dont expect crazy numbers there.
Well, AWD is rumored to come... I was just pointing how all these people who want AWD on the internet, in the end very few will buy AWD version.

But with worldwide models, AWD is more important now for ES. Not just snowy areas of USA but also Japanese love their AWDs.

edit: I would also guess it might be interesting for Russia, one of the best Lexus markets in the world... but i dont expect crazy numbers there.
Sakura
A RWD owner wouldn't substitute having RWD for AWD.

An AWD SUV will make more sense too because it has more clearance.
There is a difference between F4-T (FWD-based AWD) and F4-L (RWD-based AWD), where the buyer of the later won't substitute for the former. And no buyer complains about the new E AMG or new M5 being AWD only. It is likely, should there be a hypothetical GS-F with turbo V8, it will not sell because of the lack of AWD. If cars sell thanks to Marketing, RWD is so yesterday. Anyone not interested in AWD, will not care if it is FWD. Proof by case is the BMW X1, that never sold as well.

As for SUVs, unfortunately they do not have significantly more clearance.
Sakura
A RWD owner wouldn't substitute having RWD for AWD.

An AWD SUV will make more sense too because it has more clearance.
There is a difference between F4-T (FWD-based AWD) and F4-L (RWD-based AWD), where the buyer of the later won't substitute for the former. And no buyer complains about the new E AMG or new M5 being AWD only. It is likely, should there be a hypothetical GS-F with turbo V8, it will not sell because of the lack of AWD. If cars sell thanks to Marketing, RWD is so yesterday. Anyone not interested in AWD, will not care if it is FWD. Proof by case is the BMW X1, that never sold as well.

As for SUVs, unfortunately they do not have significantly more clearance.
Sakura
A RWD owner wouldn't substitute having RWD for AWD.

An AWD SUV will make more sense too because it has more clearance.
There is a difference between F4-T (FWD-based AWD) and F4-L (RWD-based AWD), where the buyer of the later won't substitute for the former. And no buyer complains about the new E AMG or new M5 being AWD only. It is likely, should there be a hypothetical GS-F with turbo V8, it will not sell because of the lack of AWD. If cars sell thanks to Marketing, RWD is so yesterday. Anyone not interested in AWD, will not care if it is FWD. Proof by case is the BMW X1, that never sold as well.

As for SUVs, unfortunately they do not have significantly more clearance.
L
Krew just out of curiosity does Lexus ever make feedback driven changes between the time the media drives the vehicles and production? Im talking most about the downshifting delay on the 8 speed transmission which every single reviewer to date has pointed out as a major buzzkill. I understand no major transmission changes would probably be made but one or two reviewers said this could be corrected with a software update. Any thoughts?
L
Krew just out of curiosity does Lexus ever make feedback driven changes between the time the media drives the vehicles and production? Im talking most about the downshifting delay on the 8 speed transmission which every single reviewer to date has pointed out as a major buzzkill. I understand no major transmission changes would probably be made but one or two reviewers said this could be corrected with a software update. Any thoughts?

L