Toyota Is More Profitable Than Tesla For First Time Since 2021

[LS500-18]

The shake-up comes from a combination of factors; Tesla cut vehicle prices several times this year in order to boost the volume of vehicles sold, but at the expense of profit margins. When it initially claimed the profit’s crown in 2021, the company made some of its profits on strategies such as selling regulatory credits and investing in Bitcoin, rather than selling cars. Toyota, meanwhile, made its bundle of cash on selling more cars than anyone expected — 2.3 million vehicles for $74 billion over an expected $69 billion. That’s double the company’s previous quarter’s profits, according to Reuters. A benefit of the 2021's chip shortage finally abating.

Toyota also hit 10.6 percent operating profit margin, up from 6.8 percent a year ago. Tesla managed a respectable 9.6 percent operating profit margin in its most recent quarter. Barron’s gives a good breakdown of what is going on between these two companies:

Toyota Is More Profitable Than Tesla For First Time Since 2021

The famously EV-shy automaker and the all-electric titan battle it out for profit supremacy.

jalopnik.com

We'll see what the future holds but all of Tesla's products are stagnant and out-dated now and Toyota has a real long term vision whereas I don't think Elon Musk thinks much beyond right now and this quarter.

 

[DFGeneer]

English is not my native language, but my understanding of "profitable" is returning more profit in total. And Toyota has been achieving that every single quarter with the single exception of Q3 of 2022.
In my opinion what Jalopnik meant is "Toyota has higher profit margin per vehicle sold than Tesla for first time since 2021".

 

[ssun30]

Being stingy really helps.

 

[mikeavelli]

Just a couple weeks ago the stock was at a 12 month high. Investors are confident in Toyota.

 

[CRSKTN]

To get as big as Toyota, your margins reflect a broad blend of markets and vehicles, as Tesla grows they will go through the same challenges and compressed margins. With toyota now getting serious about manufacturing and EV innovation, Tesla needs to up its game.

 

[mikeavelli]

To get as big as Toyota, your margins reflect a broad blend of markets and vehicles, as Tesla grows they will go through the same challenges and compressed margins. With toyota now getting serious about manufacturing and EV innovation, Tesla needs to up its game.

Yup.. seems EV sales have been flat this year.. Musk has dropped pricing to fight off all the competition hurting margins. China their biggest market has a weaning economy. They do have the cyber truck otw which amazingly people want. Will be interesting….

 

[mikeavelli]

Have y’all been paying attention to the stock price? Toyota is on a roll!!!

 

[Tragic Bronson]

I just noticed this recently, Tesla outsold Toyota for the first time this past summer. I would think it comes down to the solid infrastructure and ease of purchase not to mention the price discounts...OTOH, many Toyota customers have had to face markups at many Toyota dealerships and/or wait for an allocation at MSRP on hybrids/PHEVs

Tesla now outsells Toyota in California

Tesla has the two bestselling cars in California by a ridiculous margin – and we are not just talking about...

electrek.co

 

[CRSKTN]

I just noticed this recently, Tesla outsold Toyota for the first time this past summer. I would think it comes down to the solid infrastructure and ease of purchase not to mention the price discounts...OTOH, many Toyota customers have had to face markups at many Toyota dealerships and/or wait for an allocation at MSRP on hybrids/PHEVs

Tesla now outsells Toyota in California

Tesla has the two bestselling cars in California by a ridiculous margin – and we are not just talking about...

electrek.co

Tesla was the bestselling brand in California with just north of 69,000 units compared to Toyota’s 67,000 units:

2,000 units in your home turf where you get thousands in rebates is apparently "a ridiculous margin".
How many Tesla's do they sell in Japan?

Tesla again cuts prices in its drive to meet year-end sales goals - Autoblog

Tesla has cut pricing on the Model 3 and Model Y in an effort to boost demand ahead of a pivotal fourth quarter.

www.autoblog.com

Oh, look at that.


EDIT:

I just want to highlight how biased and pathetic a lot of these (especially western) media outlets are:


Imagine presenting this as a positive.
The story starts out, high-margin, high-growth, high-capital efficiencies.
Today: NOBODY CUTS THEIR PRICES LIKE TESLA DOES! WHERE IS THE COMPETITION?

The competition is making cars for adults, that will last a reasonably long time and sell to reasonable people, and they want to do it at margins that make sense.

The fact Tesla only accounts for 61% of all EV sales ever in the US is actually quite embarassing.

They're asking where the competition while presenting a chart showing Tesla's share of total EV sales is below its peak and dropping since stalling.

 

[mikeavelli]

2,000 units in your home turf where you get thousands in rebates is apparently "a ridiculous margin".
How many Tesla's do they sell in Japan?

Tesla again cuts prices in its drive to meet year-end sales goals - Autoblog

Tesla has cut pricing on the Model 3 and Model Y in an effort to boost demand ahead of a pivotal fourth quarter.

www.autoblog.com

Oh, look at that.


EDIT:

I just want to highlight how biased and pathetic a lot of these (especially western) media outlets are:
View attachment 8100

Imagine presenting this as a positive.
The story starts out, high-margin, high-growth, high-capital efficiencies.
Today: NOBODY CUTS THEIR PRICES LIKE TESLA DOES! WHERE IS THE COMPETITION?

The competition is making cars for adults, that will last a reasonably long time and sell to reasonable people, and they want to do it at margins that make sense.

The fact Tesla only accounts for 61% of all EV sales ever in the US is actually quite embarassing.

They're asking where the competition while presenting a chart showing Tesla's share of total EV sales is below its peak and dropping since stalling.

Exactly…also all those stock price shouters are quiet.

 

[CRSKTN]

Underwater trade-ins are costing new car buyers almost $6,000 - Autoblog

Buyers are facing explosive negative equity as their cars depreciate faster than their payments can keep up.

www.autoblog.com

Those price cuts are no joke. They're seriously damaging their existing customers to drive growth.

 

[Sulu]

Underwater trade-ins are costing new car buyers almost $6,000 - Autoblog

Buyers are facing explosive negative equity as their cars depreciate faster than their payments can keep up.

www.autoblog.com

Those price cuts are no joke. They're seriously damaging their existing customers to drive growth.

Volume growth at all costs! Some sacrifices need to be made in order to achieve that.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

Underwater trade-ins are costing new car buyers almost $6,000 - Autoblog

Buyers are facing explosive negative equity as their cars depreciate faster than their payments can keep up.

www.autoblog.com

Those price cuts are no joke. They're seriously damaging their existing customers to drive growth.

Not to mention their "leader", whom many have vowed not to buy his cars; but for Californians, cheap EVs offset his despicability.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

Tesla Prices Now Rival Average US Cars After Billions in Cuts

Elon Musk’s latest round of price reductions brings EVs to a new level of price parity — and they’re also driving a wedge between investors.

www.bloomberg.com

“Sadly Tesla continues to have to cut prices to sell cars. Piss off core demo and kill margins to unload inventory,” Ross Gerber, co-founder and CEO of wealth management firm Gerber Kawasaki Inc., reportedly said. “The master plan!”

 

[Tragic Bronson]

Tesla EV Market Share Continues To Drop In US

Just a decade ago Tesla was the only major player in the EV game, but the competition is heating up

jalopnik.com

 

[CRSKTN]

Tesla's net income slumped 44% in Q3 as its price cuts ate into profits - Autoblog

Tesla's net income slumped in the third quarter versus a year earlier, as price cuts helped drive strong sales growth but also ate into profit margins

www.autoblog.com

Elon Musk says 'we dug our own grave' with the Cybertruck as he warns Tesla faces enormous production challenges - Autoblog

Tesla CEO Elon Musk said Wednesday that the Cybertruck's unique design means the company faces immense challenges in scaling production.

www.autoblog.com

 

[mikeavelli]

Apparently the conference call was wild. Even the Elon fan website was like wtf

Tesla (TSLA) tumbles after disastrous Elon Musk conference call

Tesla’s stock (TSLA) is down by as much as 10% today following the release of the company’s earnings and the...

electrek.co

 

[ssun30]

I have relatives who invest heavily in TSLA and praises Musk like he's a god when it's going up and curses him like a murderer when it's going down. I estimate 90% of so-called Tesla fans like the brand because of TSLA stocks not for some noble cause.

People are just like that.

 

[Tragic Bronson]

Elon Musk 'Almost In Tears,' 'Like A Little Baby' On 'Disaster' Earnings Call

Sales at Tesla are down, and investors are concerned that Musk would rather whine than come up with solutions

jalopnik.com

 

[mikeavelli]

Tesla stock $164 and Toyota $234