The Lexus RZ 450e Megathread

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CRSKTN

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mikeavelli said:
Oh for sure. GA just snuck a law in to charge any public charger road tax starting in 2025. No one has talked about it yet lol. Homes will remain exempt.
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Exactly. Ultimately what's the difference between an EV "gas station" with a bunch of added retail for people hanging around to spend money on, and a mall with EV chargers?

Or will we even have malls because AI will put us all out of a job.
 
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ssun30

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CRSKTN said:
It's free for now.

Watch.
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The whole modern car-based society is built on the foundation that petrol taxes pay for road maintenance. If charging remained free the whole infrastructure collapses or every single piece of road becomes toll road. The main reason I dislike EVs today is that their owners are free riders AND they get the privilege to travel on road lanes they don't pay for.
 
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mediumhot

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ssun30 said:
The whole modern car-based society is built on the foundation that petrol taxes pay for road maintenance. If charging remained free the whole infrastructure collapses or every single piece of road becomes toll road. The main reason I dislike EVs today is that their owners are free riders AND they get the privilege to travel on road lanes they don't pay for.
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It's just a form of subsidy for a new trend that is projected to be the new standard. I'm pretty sure at the very first boom of gasoline car there were some benefits like that. I'm not into automotive history but I'm confident gasoline cars had some government push over steam-powered cars.
 
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mediumhot said:
It's just a form of subsidy for a new trend that is projected to be the new standard. I'm pretty sure at the very first boom of gasoline car there were some benefits like that. I'm not into automotive history but I'm confident gasoline cars had some government push over steam-powered cars.
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They didn't need a subsidy push. Steam cars were difficult and sometimes dangerous to start up (as Jay Leno has demonstrated twice now), spewed steam on bystanders, and needed both gas and water added as consumables. Similarly, the BEVs of the time using early lead-acid batteries didn't work because the range was low and many buildings and most homes weren't on the grid yet. Once ICE cars had electric start there was no comparison in terms of what was easiest to live with.
 
mikeavelli

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Yeah I believe there was no push needed since most were still walking or using horse and carriages.

The push came from the government and private when they created the national highway system decades later.
 
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@mikeavelli besides the Taycan, future electric 718, or Macan, would you consider anything besides the RZ? I still think Toyota BEV batteries will last the longest in the industry, just from how the BEVs are muted in terms of driving range, motor output and charging speeds. None of those matter to me when I'm used to >200 HP vehicles and the RZ has 300+ ponies.

I think I'm okay picking up a used one down the road if the price is right for my wife lol. Then buy another BEV sedan/hatch for myself.
 
mikeavelli

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internalaudit said:
@mikeavelli besides the Taycan, future electric 718, or Macan, would you consider anything besides the RZ? I still think Toyota BEV batteries will last the longest in the industry, just from how the BEVs are muted in terms of driving range, motor output and charging speeds. None of those matter to me when I'm used to >200 HP vehicles and the RZ has 300+ ponies.

I think I'm okay picking up a used one down the road if the price is right for my wife lol. Then buy another BEV sedan/hatch for myself.
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Hasn’t been a full week yet but I get the EV thing a bit but also don’t get it still. RZ as a daily just isn’t at all emotional or that exciting but is logical as a daily. Maybe I would like the luxury grade more so I’ll try to get one next. Needs mods. Not sure would I lower it then it would be damn near sedan height. It has potential to me. It’s built very well. it’s a Lexus. That goes for a lot. So far absolutely no issues with range for my driving habits around town.

Emotionally the Taycan sedan and Sporturismo has me.. a GTS is fine heck maybe a 4S… doesn’t need to be a turbo…Im not opposed to Tesla especially with the new prices. Always loved how the Model S/Plaid looked and we know it performs. It being a large hatchback also adds logic with space for stuff.

Then you have the Audi GT which to me also looks good (just get black or wrap the front).

(lawd the idea of a Lexus GS to compete with the above makes me all hot and bothered)

A dark horse is the Ford Mustang Mach-E. I like how it looks and specs are solid. Interior is another miss. Hatchback utility being a crossover.

I have zero want for any German crossover EV. The Benz EQ’s look like rejected Prius’s. Nissan Ariya = nope. Don’t want the GM/Acura Honda things tho the pics of the EV Blazer look superb.

Now that I wrote it out, I think Lexus has a solid first step here with the RZ and I’m confident they are learning fast. Definitely will provide feedback.
 
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ssun30

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mikeavelli said:
Related… Benz just offered over the air updates for more power but you gotta pay monthly or a one time fee

www.autoblog.com

Mercedes-Benz EQE and EQS eligible for over-the-air horsepower bump - Autoblog

Mercedes-Benz released an over-the-air software update that adds 60 horsepower to the EQE 350 and 80 horsepower to the EQS 450.
www.autoblog.com www.autoblog.com

Funny but they both now do 0-60 arounf the 5 seconds the RZ already gets.
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So they are charging people money for their batteries to die faster. And because the mechanical design isn't changed, the continuous output of the system remains the same. So they are just going into limp mode faster. :ROFLMAO:

I may criticize the RZ a lot, but the EQB and EQC are by far the worst engineered BEVs from BBAL.

The RZ has very aggressive gears on its motors (13.786:1), that's like driving an ICEV constantly with 1st gear. But for some odd reason the RX500h has a longer gear ratio (10.755:1) despite using the same motor. IMO that should be the other way around. The RX needs shorter gear for better off-the-line acceleration while RZ needs longer gear for better efficiency.

The RZ also has a very high 30-minute continuous output of 134kW/180hp out of 230kW/308hp peak. These are some really overengineered motors (there aren't many ICEVs that can operate at 60% for 30 minutes). By comparison the Q4 e-tron has a meager 77kW/104hp out of 220kW/295hp. If you had the time it would be interesting to test out how quickly (if ever) the RZ goes into limp mode in repeated drag runs.
 
mikeavelli

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ssun30 said:
So they are charging people money for their batteries to die faster. And because the mechanical design isn't changed, the continuous output of the system remains the same. So they are just going into limp mode faster. :ROFLMAO:

I may criticize the RZ a lot, but the EQB and EQC are by far the worst engineered BEVs from BBAL.

The RZ has very aggressive gears on its motors (13.786:1), that's like driving an ICEV constantly with 1st gear. But for some odd reason the RX500h has a longer gear ratio (10.755:1) despite using the same motor. IMO that should be the other way around. The RX needs shorter gear for better off-the-line acceleration while RZ needs longer gear for better efficiency.

The RZ also has a very high 30-minute continuous output of 134kW/180hp out of 230kW/308hp peak. These are some really overengineered motors (there aren't many ICEVs that can operate at 60% for 30 minutes). By comparison the Q4 e-tron has a meager 77kW/104hp out of 220kW/295hp. If you had the time it would be interesting to test out how quickly (if ever) the RZ goes into limp mode in repeated drag runs.
Click to expand...

So Edmunds got a 0-60 run in 4.8 seconds. To put that in perspective that’s faster than any Acura ever made not the second gen NSX. It’s significantly quicker than the IS 350. I believe it’s rated for only 308hp but I think Lexus was conservative here.

Good points on the transmission. The RX 500h 6 speed simply needs more gears. A really puzzling choice to me. Gears are short. The RZ pulls HARD.

I will take the RZ up the same mountain roads to compare. I find the RX Direct 4 more fun and more of a hoot to drive. The RZ feels so well planted it feels more capable but less fun because it’s so damn direct.
 
bogglo

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mikeavelli said:
So Edmunds got a 0-60 run in 4.8 seconds. To put that in perspective that’s faster than any Acura ever made not the second gen NSX. It’s significantly quicker than the IS 350. I believe it’s rated for only 308hp but I think Lexus was conservative here.

Good points on the transmission. The RX 500h 6 speed simply needs more gears. A really puzzling choice to me. Gears are short. The RZ pulls HARD.

I will take the RZ up the same mountain roads to compare. I find the RX Direct 4 more fun and more of a hoot to drive. The RZ feels so well planted it feels more capable but less fun because it’s so damn direct.
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Lol Mike and Acura. looking for ward to future Lexus EV. I did not know the RZ could be in the 4 sec range that's good and promising for future EVs.
 
mikeavelli

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Drove the LC and LX the last couple of days and the RZ is back fully charged from
the house. Took like 24 hours but the car hasn’t moved so didn’t matter to me.

So to reiterate for someone like me the lower range and slower charging doesn’t mean as much. That is not to say Lexus can’t do better and it won’t get better.
 
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spwolf

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mikeavelli said:
Hasn’t been a full week yet but I get the EV thing a bit but also don’t get it still. RZ as a daily just isn’t at all emotional or that exciting but is logical as a daily. Maybe I would like the luxury grade more so I’ll try to get one next. Needs mods. Not sure would I lower it then it would be damn near sedan height. It has potential to me. It’s built very well. it’s a Lexus. That goes for a lot. So far absolutely no issues with range for my driving habits around town.

Emotionally the Taycan sedan and Sporturismo has me.. a GTS is fine heck maybe a 4S… doesn’t need to be a turbo…Im not opposed to Tesla especially with the new prices. Always loved how the Model S/Plaid looked and we know it performs. It being a large hatchback also adds logic with space for stuff.

Then you have the Audi GT which to me also looks good (just get black or wrap the front).

(lawd the idea of a Lexus GS to compete with the above makes me all hot and bothered)

A dark horse is the Ford Mustang Mach-E. I like how it looks and specs are solid. Interior is another miss. Hatchback utility being a crossover.

I have zero want for any German crossover EV. The Benz EQ’s look like rejected Prius’s. Nissan Ariya = nope. Don’t want the GM/Acura Honda things tho the pics of the EV Blazer look superb.

Now that I wrote it out, I think Lexus has a solid first step here with the RZ and I’m confident they are learning fast. Definitely will provide feedback.
Click to expand...

problem with RZ comes with its inefficiency and poor usable battery size, as well as gen 1 software when everyone is few gens ahead.

IE 63kw usable, 120 miles in 75 mph C&D run, and very slow charging (slowest on the market for new product), is a huge reality check.

If you really dont compare it to anything else, and you dont really care about EVs or want to drive EVs, in its own bubble it is ok... but it is not in its own bubble and I would never recommend anyone use their own money to get RZ or BZX.

So RZ450e check list goes like this:
- Huge Lexus fan
- Can charge at home at 208v
- Can lease it at good price
- Hate Tesla and everything it stands for.
- Never ever plan to take it for trips over 100 miles.

If all is checked, it is fine.

But otherwise, it is most uncompetitive product in Lexus lineup, including GX, including UX and everything in between.
 
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