Toyota Land Cruiser Prado/250 Series Discussion

Gecko

Gecko

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A few things about this Land Cruiser that I think may help shape people's expectations for what will be delivered shortly...

There is no doubt that the global "deal" that was made between certain regions and Japan to bring GA-F to market had an impact on what we are seeing with GX, Land Cruiser and soon, 4Runner. TMNA had to give up their V8 dreams and also lost the Land Cruiser 300.

This happened at a time when hype around the Bronco was at an all-time high and SUV sales were continuing to skyrocket, so it's logical to assume TMNA asked, "What can we do to compete with this Bronco?" "Bronco" is one of Ford's most iconic nameplates like Land Cruiser is for Toyota, so the connection for a "Bronco fighting Land Cruiser" becomes sort of obvious even if the products will look very different. This is also where it's important to separate (employee and corporate marketing) hype from the likely business case, because even Toyota has a tendency to overhype certain products.

My assumption is that Japan probably thinks GA-F is as good as or better of a starting point than what Ford has done with the Bronco and said, "Sure, TMNA, if you want a Land Cruiser, your budget is $X," and that number probably left very few options for some sort of ground-up Bronco and Wrangler fighter. Prado/GX is a natural starting point since it is the global workhorse Land Cruiser, as well as allowing them to drop the price point by $25k, and voila -- here we are today: Prado with retro headlights, bumper, grill... LAND CRUISER! Removable doors, lift off top, etc. all require extra engineering and reinforcement, and I have a feeling that just wasn't feasible despite what TMNA wanted.

The recent (American) Land Cruiser heritage, at least since the J80, has always been a vehicle that is capable and durable, but also well built, comfortable and semi-luxurious. With that legacy, once again, basing the Land Cruiser off the new Prado makes sense. History has been similar with the 4Runner which has always been more civil, quieter, more comfortable and easier to live with than the Wrangler and also now the Bronco, so this is where the relationship between the 4Runner and the new Land Cruiser becomes a bit muddy to me.

So, despite the dreams of a 4-door FJ Cruiser ready to battle the Bronco and Wrangler, what will be delivered is quite true to recent Land Cruiser heritage and in that way, will be a perfect Land Cruiser for this era: Toyota's latest and greatest off-road technology and hardware at a lower price point that more people can afford. Through factory lifts, trims and accessory kits, I assume the Land Cruiser can be built into something with a similar level of capability as the Bronco... and Toyota probably already knows the buyers who really want that will do it, and they're building a great "base" platform for enthusiasts and normal buyers alike to enjoy. Land Cruiser TRD PRO...?

Where I begin to scratch my head is why -- and where -- this is going to be necessary between a new 4Runner and GX, but my assumption is that TMNA was more worried about cashing in on the Land Cruiser name in a hot market than filling that Bronco-ish niche. It's logical to assume the 4Runner will be based on the Prado too, with the 2.4T I4 standard and the 2.4T hybrid as an option just like the Tacoma. TRD Offroad and TRD PRO models of the 4Runner will no doubt be very capable, and the 4R overall is going to be similar to the Land Cruiser in size and stature. There will be differences in styling (modern vs. retro), equipment, luxury trimmings and powertrains that will make the 4Runner more affordable than the Land Cruiser, but the GX sits above the 4Runner obviously, creating a very narrow patch of real estate for the Land Cruiser to live on.

I don't want to say too much, but a few notes...
  • 4Runner will have 4x2 model standard as well as base trims like SR5, so it will be priced lower than the Land Cruiser
  • 2.4T as standard with 2.4T hybrid as optional also lowers the cost of entry on the 4Runner
  • Land Cruiser will be hybrid-only with the 2.4T hybrid as the core powertrain, positioning it above 4Runner
  • GX will have one key thing Land Cruiser won't to keep some distance (and value) between them
This is some very narrow product positioning with a lot of overlap, but I think the pieces will make sense now through the end of the year as products roll out.

In summary, if Toyota had built a 4 door vehicle with removable top, removable doors, and that prioritized off-road ability over quality and comfort, would that have maybe been the better vehicle for this market right now? Probably. But would it have been true to the Land Cruiser name and recent heritage? Not really. Land Cruiser is gonna Land Cruiser, Ford is gonna Ford, and Jeep is gonna Jeep.
 
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UZJ100GXR

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They are closer to each other than they ever have been without a doubt, and mechanically this will easily be the best GX/Prado to date.
Obviously some things will be in favor of the 300 series because it is the flagship after all but that is expected.

It will be interesting to see the price/overlap in markets where they will sell both.

I know for a fact the Middle East/Rest of the world, will not be getting a V6 250 LC Prado as we have seen from the confirmed model codes on the Tech site.
Has the v6 been confirmed on the US LC?
 
TexasFunRunner

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Gecko said:
This is some very narrow product positioning with a lot of overlap, but I think the pieces will make sense now through the end of the year as products roll out.
Click to expand...
Are you saying we will see the 4Runner reveal before the end of the year?
 
Carmaker1

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TexasFunRunner said:
That is a non-US leak so it may or may not apply to the US models. @Carmaker1 insider contacts say an alleged TTV6 is possible for the US.
Click to expand...
Thanks, but it wasn't my insiders. It was this guy back in January, who one of my insiders "blindly" chastised ironically and chooses to be vague concerning V35A himself... (dismissed the December 2022 event for both US+CAN dealers as non-existent, definitely did happen as both 920B TRD PRO and US/CAN LC were shown together per other reliable sources.)

I don't really like commenting on the 2024 Land Cruiser J250 (or J240?) engines, because it is too inconsistent. With GX and 4Runner I have confidently commented, not Land Cruiser. I've heard way too much, so I'm not going to confirm anything as fact if there's no consistency. T24A and T24A iFM I've heard about for many months in relation to US/CAN LC, until I saw that Tundras.com post and became skeptical of I4-only.

I'm not saying anything nor asking those questions anymore, if I can just find out at reveal. A lot of these Toyota insiders clam up from too many invasive questions, so I'll be leaving 'em alone and not pissing off any.

We'll see overall, as that's all I have to say about this matter publicly going forward and anything else TNGA-F.:sneaky:
 
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Levi

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If the US Landcruiser is revealed, so should the European one? In Europe it is not called Prado since the LC200 stopped selling.
 
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Motor

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Gecko

Gecko

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So maybe Land Cruiser is just a direct copy of the Prado? That front end lines up with the Land Cruiser teasers so far.
 
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