The 2019 Lexus ES in Two New Colors: Moonbeam Beige Metallic & Sunlit Green

ssun30

Toyota said three 4WD systems and 10 variants. I think it's pretty obvious the three systems are DTV-AWD, E-Four, and next-gen truck 4WD. The non-fancy version AWD used on some trims of the new RAV4 is considered an older generation system.

That means longitudinal RWD-based AWD system will be a variant of DTV-AWD.

I dont think anything is obvious though, because for LS500 AWD they use traditional full time awd and it is not included there on the list. Just like that, traditional truck system will not be included on that list either.

So included is only something all new, I doubt it will be for RWD vehicles since ultimately what they have now with full time awd is the best system you can have.

All these new systems are for lowering costs and increasing mpg, which is great for Rav4 but not for FT-1.

So not sure whats the 3rd version really. Unless it is going to be some full time awd version that is going to be applicable to both trucks and lexus rwd vehicles.

ssun30

Toyota said three 4WD systems and 10 variants. I think it's pretty obvious the three systems are DTV-AWD, E-Four, and next-gen truck 4WD. The non-fancy version AWD used on some trims of the new RAV4 is considered an older generation system.

That means longitudinal RWD-based AWD system will be a variant of DTV-AWD.

I dont think anything is obvious though, because for LS500 AWD they use traditional full time awd and it is not included there on the list. Just like that, traditional truck system will not be included on that list either.

So included is only something all new, I doubt it will be for RWD vehicles since ultimately what they have now with full time awd is the best system you can have.

All these new systems are for lowering costs and increasing mpg, which is great for Rav4 but not for FT-1.

So not sure whats the 3rd version really. Unless it is going to be some full time awd version that is going to be applicable to both trucks and lexus rwd vehicles.

ssun30

Toyota said three 4WD systems and 10 variants. I think it's pretty obvious the three systems are DTV-AWD, E-Four, and next-gen truck 4WD. The non-fancy version AWD used on some trims of the new RAV4 is considered an older generation system.

That means longitudinal RWD-based AWD system will be a variant of DTV-AWD.

I dont think anything is obvious though, because for LS500 AWD they use traditional full time awd and it is not included there on the list. Just like that, traditional truck system will not be included on that list either.

So included is only something all new, I doubt it will be for RWD vehicles since ultimately what they have now with full time awd is the best system you can have.

All these new systems are for lowering costs and increasing mpg, which is great for Rav4 but not for FT-1.

So not sure whats the 3rd version really. Unless it is going to be some full time awd version that is going to be applicable to both trucks and lexus rwd vehicles.

Does LS500 AWD have front/rear and rear right/left torque vectoring?

Also does LS have AWD with AWS? Does the ES have AWS? Renault Talisman has.

Does LS500 AWD have front/rear and rear right/left torque vectoring?

Also does LS have AWD with AWS? Does the ES have AWS? Renault Talisman has.

Does LS500 AWD have front/rear and rear right/left torque vectoring?

Also does LS have AWD with AWS? Does the ES have AWS? Renault Talisman has.

Levi

Does LS500 AWD have front/rear and rear right/left torque vectoring?

Also does LS have AWD with AWS? Does the ES have AWS? Renault Talisman has.

Whats aws?

Levi

Does LS500 AWD have front/rear and rear right/left torque vectoring?

Also does LS have AWD with AWS? Does the ES have AWS? Renault Talisman has.

Whats aws?

Levi

Does LS500 AWD have front/rear and rear right/left torque vectoring?

Also does LS have AWD with AWS? Does the ES have AWS? Renault Talisman has.

Whats aws?

spwolf

Whats aws?

All-wheel steering. Lexus offers it on certain RWD platform F-Sport and F models.

spwolf

Whats aws?

All-wheel steering. Lexus offers it on certain RWD platform F-Sport and F models.

spwolf

Whats aws?

All-wheel steering. Lexus offers it on certain RWD platform F-Sport and F models.

Joaquin Ruhi

All-wheel steering. Lexus offers it on certain RWD platform F-Sport and F models.

Yeah, I got it... I guess it should have 20 best features from all the competition and nicer interior than E class, faster than BMW better quattro than Audi and all for the price of Dacia :)

Coincidentally I am just sitting across Talisman

edit: posting pic did not work from the phone :). It is nice car, but it is Passat competitor, nowhere close to Lexus.

Joaquin Ruhi

All-wheel steering. Lexus offers it on certain RWD platform F-Sport and F models.

Yeah, I got it... I guess it should have 20 best features from all the competition and nicer interior than E class, faster than BMW better quattro than Audi and all for the price of Dacia :)

Coincidentally I am just sitting across Talisman

edit: posting pic did not work from the phone :). It is nice car, but it is Passat competitor, nowhere close to Lexus.

Joaquin Ruhi

All-wheel steering. Lexus offers it on certain RWD platform F-Sport and F models.

Yeah, I got it... I guess it should have 20 best features from all the competition and nicer interior than E class, faster than BMW better quattro than Audi and all for the price of Dacia :)

Coincidentally I am just sitting across Talisman

edit: posting pic did not work from the phone :). It is nice car, but it is Passat competitor, nowhere close to Lexus.

As a commenter on CL noted, all-wheel steering is something carmakers keep pushing and customers keep omitting as not enough of an improvement to justify the extra complexity/maintenance.

As a commenter on CL noted, all-wheel steering is something carmakers keep pushing and customers keep omitting as not enough of an improvement to justify the extra complexity/maintenance.

As a commenter on CL noted, all-wheel steering is something carmakers keep pushing and customers keep omitting as not enough of an improvement to justify the extra complexity/maintenance.

Ian Schmidt

As a commenter on CL noted, all-wheel steering is something carmakers keep pushing and customers keep omitting as not enough of an improvement to justify the extra complexity/maintenance.

I agree that carmakers are pushing AWS, but is does provide improvements (see Porsche, Lamborghini, Ferrari). Now if you complain about carmakers pushing features on customers that we could live without, I agree. But then let them strip all the other features, like electric heating ventilating seats, steering wheel, armrest, huge rims with rubber bands, displays, gimmick lighting, all features sold for "safety" reasons,... the list is almost endless.

Ian Schmidt

As a commenter on CL noted, all-wheel steering is something carmakers keep pushing and customers keep omitting as not enough of an improvement to justify the extra complexity/maintenance.

I agree that carmakers are pushing AWS, but is does provide improvements (see Porsche, Lamborghini, Ferrari). Now if you complain about carmakers pushing features on customers that we could live without, I agree. But then let them strip all the other features, like electric heating ventilating seats, steering wheel, armrest, huge rims with rubber bands, displays, gimmick lighting, all features sold for "safety" reasons,... the list is almost endless.

Ian Schmidt

As a commenter on CL noted, all-wheel steering is something carmakers keep pushing and customers keep omitting as not enough of an improvement to justify the extra complexity/maintenance.

I agree that carmakers are pushing AWS, but is does provide improvements (see Porsche, Lamborghini, Ferrari). Now if you complain about carmakers pushing features on customers that we could live without, I agree. But then let them strip all the other features, like electric heating ventilating seats, steering wheel, armrest, huge rims with rubber bands, displays, gimmick lighting, all features sold for "safety" reasons,... the list is almost endless.

Levi

I agree that carmakers are pushing AWS, but is does provide improvements (see Porsche, Lamborghini, Ferrari). Now if you complain about carmakers pushing features on customers that we could live without, I agree. But then let them strip all the other features, like electric heating ventilating seats, steering wheel, armrest, huge rims with rubber bands, displays, gimmick lighting, all features sold for "safety" reasons,... the list is almost endless.

i trust you are in europe since you are mentioning Talisman? I mean it is not a luxury car. I dont think anyone cares that it has AWS at all.
Audi's or BMWs or MBs in this class dont have AWS, so I dont think how that equates to heated seats.


it is particular luxurious vehicle... and it is selling pretty poorly. Attached is the one my friend has.

Levi

I agree that carmakers are pushing AWS, but is does provide improvements (see Porsche, Lamborghini, Ferrari). Now if you complain about carmakers pushing features on customers that we could live without, I agree. But then let them strip all the other features, like electric heating ventilating seats, steering wheel, armrest, huge rims with rubber bands, displays, gimmick lighting, all features sold for "safety" reasons,... the list is almost endless.

i trust you are in europe since you are mentioning Talisman? I mean it is not a luxury car. I dont think anyone cares that it has AWS at all.
Audi's or BMWs or MBs in this class dont have AWS, so I dont think how that equates to heated seats.


it is particular luxurious vehicle... and it is selling pretty poorly. Attached is the one my friend has.

Levi

I agree that carmakers are pushing AWS, but is does provide improvements (see Porsche, Lamborghini, Ferrari). Now if you complain about carmakers pushing features on customers that we could live without, I agree. But then let them strip all the other features, like electric heating ventilating seats, steering wheel, armrest, huge rims with rubber bands, displays, gimmick lighting, all features sold for "safety" reasons,... the list is almost endless.

i trust you are in europe since you are mentioning Talisman? I mean it is not a luxury car. I dont think anyone cares that it has AWS at all.
Audi's or BMWs or MBs in this class dont have AWS, so I dont think how that equates to heated seats.


it is particular luxurious vehicle... and it is selling pretty poorly. Attached is the one my friend has.

Levi

I agree that carmakers are pushing AWS, but is does provide improvements (see Porsche, Lamborghini, Ferrari). Now if you complain about carmakers pushing features on customers that we could live without, I agree. But then let them strip all the other features, like electric heating ventilating seats, steering wheel, armrest, huge rims with rubber bands, displays, gimmick lighting, all features sold for "safety" reasons,... the list is almost endless.

Well, you just listed the reason why AWS is not a priority feature. Manufacturers know well which feature are more desirable for the money, and they prioritize those that people are willing to pay extra money for.

AWS will happen at some point, we just need to be patient.

Levi

I agree that carmakers are pushing AWS, but is does provide improvements (see Porsche, Lamborghini, Ferrari). Now if you complain about carmakers pushing features on customers that we could live without, I agree. But then let them strip all the other features, like electric heating ventilating seats, steering wheel, armrest, huge rims with rubber bands, displays, gimmick lighting, all features sold for "safety" reasons,... the list is almost endless.

Well, you just listed the reason why AWS is not a priority feature. Manufacturers know well which feature are more desirable for the money, and they prioritize those that people are willing to pay extra money for.

AWS will happen at some point, we just need to be patient.

Levi

I agree that carmakers are pushing AWS, but is does provide improvements (see Porsche, Lamborghini, Ferrari). Now if you complain about carmakers pushing features on customers that we could live without, I agree. But then let them strip all the other features, like electric heating ventilating seats, steering wheel, armrest, huge rims with rubber bands, displays, gimmick lighting, all features sold for "safety" reasons,... the list is almost endless.

Well, you just listed the reason why AWS is not a priority feature. Manufacturers know well which feature are more desirable for the money, and they prioritize those that people are willing to pay extra money for.

AWS will happen at some point, we just need to be patient.

spwolf

i trust you are in europe since you are mentioning Talisman? I mean it is not a luxury car. I dont think anyone cares that it has AWS at all.
Audi's or BMWs or MBs in this class dont have AWS, so I dont think how that equates to heated seats.


it is particular luxurious vehicle... and it is selling pretty poorly. Attached is the one my friend has.

ssun30

Well, you just listed the reason why AWS is not a priority feature. Manufacturers know well which feature are more desirable for the money, and they prioritize those that people are willing to pay extra money for.

AWS will happen at some point, we just need to be patient.

Yes I am in Europe.

I will not die without AWS, but the same way I will not die without AWD. That does not mean AWD cannot be beneficial, nor that AWS is not beneficial. Subaru made AWD cars long before any other car makers, and made it their USP. Customers (not enthusiast) are not always informed about new technology/features, but were recently 'sold' AWD as the latest German thing (Quattro/xDrive/4Matic) that will make you drive like Alonso in any condition (not true). I have always liked the possibilities given by AWS (passive/active mechanical/electric rear wheel-steering), and the Japanese, especially Honda made it on many cars. AWS is not crucial, but better than many other features for me, so would come top on the list of not necessary features. The problem I have, it the Germans will sell AWS as the next best thing, and they were 'first'. VAG has AWS on all its expensive cars and it will trickle down on the next A4. I also expect the next 3 Series to get AWS optionally, it will no more be related to the FWD 1 Series, but the RWD 5 Series. Normal customer will never know that Talisman also has AWS (or had it before). Normal customer will not know that even the Megane in RS guise, has AWS. Nothing can beat German marketing, I and dislike it, because it is deceptive. I also dislike feature 'brands', like 4Control, Renault's rear-wheel-steering. Which customer can understand what it means? And without repeating it like the Germans, a customer will not remember. Every generic customer that has once shopped for a new car, and considered AWD, has heard of Quattro. Porsche for example is also guilty of dumbing down customers, with all their abbreviations, when all the customer cares about is the Porsche badge. Only those interested/working in the field know what something stands for and what it really does.

Why I mention AWS with regards to the ES, is because according to Lexus, whether it replaces the GS' customers or not, the goal is to bring a younger customer. I expect the ES to be not only comfortable, but also sportier and better handling. AWS, with would help. AWD more helps with grip, not handling (unless torque vectoring).

PS: I am not bashing German engineering. They are very good, world class at machinery, components, automation, whatever a lot of high tech, but cars are not what they do well/better than others. Their carmakers are specially good at marketing. Their 'deceptive' marketing (and other dirty tricks, hint: media) blows everything out of the water.

spwolf

i trust you are in europe since you are mentioning Talisman? I mean it is not a luxury car. I dont think anyone cares that it has AWS at all.
Audi's or BMWs or MBs in this class dont have AWS, so I dont think how that equates to heated seats.


it is particular luxurious vehicle... and it is selling pretty poorly. Attached is the one my friend has.

ssun30

Well, you just listed the reason why AWS is not a priority feature. Manufacturers know well which feature are more desirable for the money, and they prioritize those that people are willing to pay extra money for.

AWS will happen at some point, we just need to be patient.

Yes I am in Europe.

I will not die without AWS, but the same way I will not die without AWD. That does not mean AWD cannot be beneficial, nor that AWS is not beneficial. Subaru made AWD cars long before any other car makers, and made it their USP. Customers (not enthusiast) are not always informed about new technology/features, but were recently 'sold' AWD as the latest German thing (Quattro/xDrive/4Matic) that will make you drive like Alonso in any condition (not true). I have always liked the possibilities given by AWS (passive/active mechanical/electric rear wheel-steering), and the Japanese, especially Honda made it on many cars. AWS is not crucial, but better than many other features for me, so would come top on the list of not necessary features. The problem I have, it the Germans will sell AWS as the next best thing, and they were 'first'. VAG has AWS on all its expensive cars and it will trickle down on the next A4. I also expect the next 3 Series to get AWS optionally, it will no more be related to the FWD 1 Series, but the RWD 5 Series. Normal customer will never know that Talisman also has AWS (or had it before). Normal customer will not know that even the Megane in RS guise, has AWS. Nothing can beat German marketing, I and dislike it, because it is deceptive. I also dislike feature 'brands', like 4Control, Renault's rear-wheel-steering. Which customer can understand what it means? And without repeating it like the Germans, a customer will not remember. Every generic customer that has once shopped for a new car, and considered AWD, has heard of Quattro. Porsche for example is also guilty of dumbing down customers, with all their abbreviations, when all the customer cares about is the Porsche badge. Only those interested/working in the field know what something stands for and what it really does.

Why I mention AWS with regards to the ES, is because according to Lexus, whether it replaces the GS' customers or not, the goal is to bring a younger customer. I expect the ES to be not only comfortable, but also sportier and better handling. AWS, with would help. AWD more helps with grip, not handling (unless torque vectoring).

PS: I am not bashing German engineering. They are very good, world class at machinery, components, automation, whatever a lot of high tech, but cars are not what they do well/better than others. Their carmakers are specially good at marketing. Their 'deceptive' marketing (and other dirty tricks, hint: media) blows everything out of the water.

spwolf

i trust you are in europe since you are mentioning Talisman? I mean it is not a luxury car. I dont think anyone cares that it has AWS at all.
Audi's or BMWs or MBs in this class dont have AWS, so I dont think how that equates to heated seats.


it is particular luxurious vehicle... and it is selling pretty poorly. Attached is the one my friend has.

ssun30

Well, you just listed the reason why AWS is not a priority feature. Manufacturers know well which feature are more desirable for the money, and they prioritize those that people are willing to pay extra money for.

AWS will happen at some point, we just need to be patient.

Yes I am in Europe.

I will not die without AWS, but the same way I will not die without AWD. That does not mean AWD cannot be beneficial, nor that AWS is not beneficial. Subaru made AWD cars long before any other car makers, and made it their USP. Customers (not enthusiast) are not always informed about new technology/features, but were recently 'sold' AWD as the latest German thing (Quattro/xDrive/4Matic) that will make you drive like Alonso in any condition (not true). I have always liked the possibilities given by AWS (passive/active mechanical/electric rear wheel-steering), and the Japanese, especially Honda made it on many cars. AWS is not crucial, but better than many other features for me, so would come top on the list of not necessary features. The problem I have, it the Germans will sell AWS as the next best thing, and they were 'first'. VAG has AWS on all its expensive cars and it will trickle down on the next A4. I also expect the next 3 Series to get AWS optionally, it will no more be related to the FWD 1 Series, but the RWD 5 Series. Normal customer will never know that Talisman also has AWS (or had it before). Normal customer will not know that even the Megane in RS guise, has AWS. Nothing can beat German marketing, I and dislike it, because it is deceptive. I also dislike feature 'brands', like 4Control, Renault's rear-wheel-steering. Which customer can understand what it means? And without repeating it like the Germans, a customer will not remember. Every generic customer that has once shopped for a new car, and considered AWD, has heard of Quattro. Porsche for example is also guilty of dumbing down customers, with all their abbreviations, when all the customer cares about is the Porsche badge. Only those interested/working in the field know what something stands for and what it really does.

Why I mention AWS with regards to the ES, is because according to Lexus, whether it replaces the GS' customers or not, the goal is to bring a younger customer. I expect the ES to be not only comfortable, but also sportier and better handling. AWS, with would help. AWD more helps with grip, not handling (unless torque vectoring).

PS: I am not bashing German engineering. They are very good, world class at machinery, components, automation, whatever a lot of high tech, but cars are not what they do well/better than others. Their carmakers are specially good at marketing. Their 'deceptive' marketing (and other dirty tricks, hint: media) blows everything out of the water.