Production Lexus LF-1 Limitless Crossover Could Get Three Row Option

Posted by Kevin on February 8th, 2018

The production model of the Lexus LF-1 Limitless concept could have a three-row option, according to a WardsAuto interview with Lexus USA general manager Jeff Bracken:

In a hot CUV market, “we absolutely need this vehicle,” Bracken says of the LF-1.

“Utility vehicles were 65% of the U.S. market for the year and 72% in December, so they are going higher.”

The concept vehicle holds two rows and four seats. No decision has been made whether the automaker would fit a potential production version with three rows.

“We’d strongly evaluate those kinds of matters should we go down that path of production,” Bracken says.

Compared to the current LX 570, the LF-1 concept is 2.6 inches shorter, but with an extra 4.9 inches of wheelbase. There’s certainly enough room for a third row. In fact, Lexus is employing a new strategy with both the RX & LX by offering both a two-row and a three-row version.

(That said, I feel strongly that the production LF-1 deserves a similar setup to the concept, with four seats and plenty of room. It would be disappointing to see a bench backseat.)

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Comments
S
  • S
    senar
  • January 16, 2018
If true, it looks like the production headlights and grill will be similar to current spindle grill designs. The hood crease also looks less aggressive (more sloped) and I'm guessing the black two tone line will be gone. Overall, I like the exterior design and hopes it reaches production quickly as a 2020 or 2021 model. I'm certainly ready to buy.

Things on my wish list are side view and rear view cameras. It would be nice if they kept the side view cameras/screens in addition to traditional mirrors for regulatory purposes. After trying out Honda's LaneWatch camera system, I much prefer the wide angle view (encompassing blind spot) that a camera can provide versus a traditional side mirror. Having a combo rear-view mirror/camera like Cadillac is also something I desperately wish Lexus would copy, especially in a big SUV with reduced rear visibility.

On the powertrain side, a hybrid with solid state batteries (if ready) and somewhere along the lines of 40+ mpg combined would be my wish. I would actually prefer a PHEV or BEV, but I doubt Lexus will have something ready within the next few years. The multi-stage hybrid system in the LS/LC sounds like an advancement in driving dynamics, but mpg in the 20s is still a bit low for my tastes.
Gecko
renyeo
Lexus needs to catch up with or surpass Mercedes-Benz in cabin quality - it’s a pity the Japanese luxury brand is ill-afford to introduce more expensive trimmings onto its cars.
Curious how you qualify this? I will give you that C, GLC and E are nicer inside than IS, NX and GS, but RX is nicer than GLE and the LX is worlds above the GLS. LC is incredible and has been universally lauded, and I don't know if Mercedes has a model to match it. I haven't been inside the LS 500 yet, but it looks to be just as nice as the S Class if not a bit nicer (I do not like the design of the S Class cockpit, but have found the materials to be very nice). Mercedes lineup is overall newer than Lexus' but I think Lexus' recent efforts are on-par or better than Mercedes.
Gecko
renyeo
Lexus needs to catch up with or surpass Mercedes-Benz in cabin quality - it’s a pity the Japanese luxury brand is ill-afford to introduce more expensive trimmings onto its cars.
Curious how you qualify this? I will give you that C, GLC and E are nicer inside than IS, NX and GS, but RX is nicer than GLE and the LX is worlds above the GLS. LC is incredible and has been universally lauded, and I don't know if Mercedes has a model to match it. I haven't been inside the LS 500 yet, but it looks to be just as nice as the S Class if not a bit nicer (I do not like the design of the S Class cockpit, but have found the materials to be very nice). Mercedes lineup is overall newer than Lexus' but I think Lexus' recent efforts are on-par or better than Mercedes.
T
I know this is a lexus lover's website, and I too love lexus...but that thing is horrendous. I thought i'd save my first post to when I finally get my hands on a IS 300 f sport...but that thing burns my eyes...the interior is nice though.
T
I know this is a lexus lover's website, and I too love lexus...but that thing is horrendous. I thought i'd save my first post to when I finally get my hands on a IS 300 f sport...but that thing burns my eyes...the interior is nice though.
mikeavelli
Posting a rendering of a modified one shortly with VIP Auto Salon... I wasn't head over heels but with some touches what a gorgous design....

I have more issues with the Avalon grill than this one. I assume being a concept they really went overboard with it.....What I do like is they are sticking with the spindle grill which is a fantastic trademark front end for Lexus. Even if one hates it, the vehicles are recognizable as a Lexus.
mikeavelli
Posting a rendering of a modified one shortly with VIP Auto Salon... I wasn't head over heels but with some touches what a gorgous design....

I have more issues with the Avalon grill than this one. I assume being a concept they really went overboard with it.....What I do like is they are sticking with the spindle grill which is a fantastic trademark front end for Lexus. Even if one hates it, the vehicles are recognizable as a Lexus.
L
mikeavelli
Posting a rendering of a modified one shortly with VIP Auto Salon... I wasn't head over heels but with some touches what a gorgous design....

I have more issues with the Avalon grill than this one. I assume being a concept they really went overboard with it.....What I do like is they are sticking with the spindle grill which is a fantastic trademark front end for Lexus. Even if one hates it, the vehicles are recognizable as a Lexus.
I think I am starting to miss the understated luxury apsect of previous Lexus. Now every car has a recognizable front, all have the same gaping hole, be it Audi, Mercedes, Hyundai, or whatever I can think of, be it a luxury brand or mainstream brand. Even BMW is now getting a huge kidney grill.

#smallgrill
L
mikeavelli
Posting a rendering of a modified one shortly with VIP Auto Salon... I wasn't head over heels but with some touches what a gorgous design....

I have more issues with the Avalon grill than this one. I assume being a concept they really went overboard with it.....What I do like is they are sticking with the spindle grill which is a fantastic trademark front end for Lexus. Even if one hates it, the vehicles are recognizable as a Lexus.
I think I am starting to miss the understated luxury apsect of previous Lexus. Now every car has a recognizable front, all have the same gaping hole, be it Audi, Mercedes, Hyundai, or whatever I can think of, be it a luxury brand or mainstream brand. Even BMW is now getting a huge kidney grill.

#smallgrill
S
  • S
    senar
  • January 17, 2018
mikeavelli
Posting a rendering of a modified one shortly with VIP Auto Salon... I wasn't head over heels but with some touches what a gorgous design....

I have more issues with the Avalon grill than this one. I assume being a concept they really went overboard with it.....What I do like is they are sticking with the spindle grill which is a fantastic trademark front end for Lexus. Even if one hates it, the vehicles are recognizable as a Lexus.
I hope the production model retains the more classic LS/LC grill. The concept grill reminds me a bit of the LF-SA grill, which I don't care for as much. I agree, the Avalon grill looks totally out of place on that car though.
S
  • S
    senar
  • January 17, 2018
mikeavelli
Posting a rendering of a modified one shortly with VIP Auto Salon... I wasn't head over heels but with some touches what a gorgous design....

I have more issues with the Avalon grill than this one. I assume being a concept they really went overboard with it.....What I do like is they are sticking with the spindle grill which is a fantastic trademark front end for Lexus. Even if one hates it, the vehicles are recognizable as a Lexus.
I hope the production model retains the more classic LS/LC grill. The concept grill reminds me a bit of the LF-SA grill, which I don't care for as much. I agree, the Avalon grill looks totally out of place on that car though.
mikeavelli
Levi
I think I am starting to miss the understated luxury apsect of previous Lexus. Now every car has a recognizable front, all have the same gaping hole, be it Audi, Mercedes, Hyundai, or whatever I can think of, be it a luxury brand or mainstream brand. Even BMW is now getting a huge kidney grill.

#smallgrill
Recently what opened my eyes was having my son and influencing him into cars. He is 3 years old. In the past few months he has stunned me naming vehicles I never taught him. The other day a basic BMW X5 in silver drives by and he says "its a BMW". The only X5 I might have ever showed him was a X5 M briefly. It showed me the power of design cues. The badge is too small to see at this point so even at 3, he has figured out what brand is what brand just by seeing similar design cues. This will last most of his life. Ironically we can relate this to most adults because most of the buying public cannot tell cars apart and if they can tell them apart they don't know the brand without seeing a badge.

The 2001 or so MMC was a great update to the ES..sadly though I remember how the #1 thing detractors would say is "looks just like a Camry". And not to instigate but this was happening at the time...



Now obviously the new Camry has a big grill like a Lexus but its less confusing and the two don't look nearly as similar.
mikeavelli
Levi
I think I am starting to miss the understated luxury apsect of previous Lexus. Now every car has a recognizable front, all have the same gaping hole, be it Audi, Mercedes, Hyundai, or whatever I can think of, be it a luxury brand or mainstream brand. Even BMW is now getting a huge kidney grill.

#smallgrill
Recently what opened my eyes was having my son and influencing him into cars. He is 3 years old. In the past few months he has stunned me naming vehicles I never taught him. The other day a basic BMW X5 in silver drives by and he says "its a BMW". The only X5 I might have ever showed him was a X5 M briefly. It showed me the power of design cues. The badge is too small to see at this point so even at 3, he has figured out what brand is what brand just by seeing similar design cues. This will last most of his life. Ironically we can relate this to most adults because most of the buying public cannot tell cars apart and if they can tell them apart they don't know the brand without seeing a badge.

The 2001 or so MMC was a great update to the ES..sadly though I remember how the #1 thing detractors would say is "looks just like a Camry". And not to instigate but this was happening at the time...



Now obviously the new Camry has a big grill like a Lexus but its less confusing and the two don't look nearly as similar.
krew
Even more than the way the LF-1 looks, I feel that the concept is perfectly Lexus.

I know that the timing is off -- the LF-1 should probably already be in the lineup as a production model. And yet, this is exactly how the NX played out. Remember how long we waited to even see the LF-NX concept? I was writing about Lexus making a RAV4 subcompact crossover ten years ago.
krew
Even more than the way the LF-1 looks, I feel that the concept is perfectly Lexus.

I know that the timing is off -- the LF-1 should probably already be in the lineup as a production model. And yet, this is exactly how the NX played out. Remember how long we waited to even see the LF-NX concept? I was writing about Lexus making a RAV4 subcompact crossover ten years ago.
mikeavelli
krew
Even more than the way the LF-1 looks, I feel that the concept is perfectly Lexus.

I know that the timing is off -- the LF-1 should probably already be in the lineup as a production model. And yet, this is exactly how the NX played out. Remember how long we waited to even see the LF-NX concept? I was writing about Lexus making a RAV4 subcompact crossover ten years ago.
Crazy to think now the X1 and X2 slot below the X3 now. So much has changed in ten years!

I do think this LF-1 is a bit ahead for a change. There really isn't a true flagship coupe SUV. I assume the Q8 will beat this out to production. The other Germans are mid class based. The Cayenne wouldn't be a true competitor as its roomier.
mikeavelli
krew
Even more than the way the LF-1 looks, I feel that the concept is perfectly Lexus.

I know that the timing is off -- the LF-1 should probably already be in the lineup as a production model. And yet, this is exactly how the NX played out. Remember how long we waited to even see the LF-NX concept? I was writing about Lexus making a RAV4 subcompact crossover ten years ago.
Crazy to think now the X1 and X2 slot below the X3 now. So much has changed in ten years!

I do think this LF-1 is a bit ahead for a change. There really isn't a true flagship coupe SUV. I assume the Q8 will beat this out to production. The other Germans are mid class based. The Cayenne wouldn't be a true competitor as its roomier.
S
  • S
    senar
  • January 17, 2018
krew
Even more than the way the LF-1 looks, I feel that the concept is perfectly Lexus.

I know that the timing is off -- the LF-1 should probably already be in the lineup as a production model. And yet, this is exactly how the NX played out. Remember how long we waited to even see the LF-NX concept? I was writing about Lexus making a RAV4 subcompact crossover ten years ago.
It seems the LF-NX concept was unveiled in September 2013 and went into production August 2014 so there's still a glimmer of hope the LF-1 will be released next year as a 2020 model. The demand will certainly be there like the NX.

mikeavelli
Crazy to think now the X1 and X2 slot below the X3 now. So much has changed in ten years!

I do think this LF-1 is a bit ahead for a change. There really isn't a true flagship coupe SUV. I assume the Q8 will beat this out to production. The other Germans are mid class based. The Cayenne wouldn't be a true competitor as its roomier.
I'm also glad they decided not to give the LF-1 a sloping coupe SUV roofline like the GLE or X6.

Do you mean the Cayenne is roomier or the LF-1? I see the 2018 Cayenne dimensions as 191.1" L x 78.7" W x 67.4" H + 114" wheelbase while the LF-1 is 197.4" L x 78.2" W x 63.2" H + 117.1" wheelbase. The LF-1 is longer, but not as tall so interior room may be close.
S
  • S
    senar
  • January 17, 2018
krew
Even more than the way the LF-1 looks, I feel that the concept is perfectly Lexus.

I know that the timing is off -- the LF-1 should probably already be in the lineup as a production model. And yet, this is exactly how the NX played out. Remember how long we waited to even see the LF-NX concept? I was writing about Lexus making a RAV4 subcompact crossover ten years ago.
It seems the LF-NX concept was unveiled in September 2013 and went into production August 2014 so there's still a glimmer of hope the LF-1 will be released next year as a 2020 model. The demand will certainly be there like the NX.

mikeavelli
Crazy to think now the X1 and X2 slot below the X3 now. So much has changed in ten years!

I do think this LF-1 is a bit ahead for a change. There really isn't a true flagship coupe SUV. I assume the Q8 will beat this out to production. The other Germans are mid class based. The Cayenne wouldn't be a true competitor as its roomier.
I'm also glad they decided not to give the LF-1 a sloping coupe SUV roofline like the GLE or X6.

Do you mean the Cayenne is roomier or the LF-1? I see the 2018 Cayenne dimensions as 191.1" L x 78.7" W x 67.4" H + 114" wheelbase while the LF-1 is 197.4" L x 78.2" W x 63.2" H + 117.1" wheelbase. The LF-1 is longer, but not as tall so interior room may be close.
mikeavelli
senar
It seems the LF-NX concept was unveiled in September 2013 and went into production August 2014 so there's still a glimmer of hope the LF-1 will be released next year as a 2020 model. The demand will certainly be there like the NX.



I'm also glad they decided not to give the LF-1 a sloping coupe SUV roofline like the GLE or X6.

Do you mean the Cayenne is roomier or the LF-1? I see the 2018 Cayenne dimensions as 191.1" L x 78.7" W x 67.4" H + 114" wheelbase while the LF-1 is 197.4" L x 78.2" W x 63.2" H + 117.1" wheelbase. The LF-1 is longer, but not as tall so interior room may be close.
Looking at interior packaging (mind you it is a concept) the LF-1 seems to be more coupe like whereas the Cayenne is more of a traditional upright SUV.

Thanks for listing the dimension comparison.
mikeavelli
senar
It seems the LF-NX concept was unveiled in September 2013 and went into production August 2014 so there's still a glimmer of hope the LF-1 will be released next year as a 2020 model. The demand will certainly be there like the NX.



I'm also glad they decided not to give the LF-1 a sloping coupe SUV roofline like the GLE or X6.

Do you mean the Cayenne is roomier or the LF-1? I see the 2018 Cayenne dimensions as 191.1" L x 78.7" W x 67.4" H + 114" wheelbase while the LF-1 is 197.4" L x 78.2" W x 63.2" H + 117.1" wheelbase. The LF-1 is longer, but not as tall so interior room may be close.
Looking at interior packaging (mind you it is a concept) the LF-1 seems to be more coupe like whereas the Cayenne is more of a traditional upright SUV.

Thanks for listing the dimension comparison.
M
Hi Guys,

Wild theory, not sure if speculated on before, but I think this car will be the next generation LX.

The new LS and LC are grounds up pure Lexus cars, while the current LX is a redone Toyota Land Cruiser. The LF-1 if it becomes the next gen LX will then be the pure flagship Lexus crossover.

As for the utilitarian/hauling/dune bashing aspect and capabilities of the current LX, well, not many other CUV's do that right now either as a full time responsibility. So losing those capabilities in the new LX might not be something that disappoints the current and future owners that much.
M
Hi Guys,

Wild theory, not sure if speculated on before, but I think this car will be the next generation LX.

The new LS and LC are grounds up pure Lexus cars, while the current LX is a redone Toyota Land Cruiser. The LF-1 if it becomes the next gen LX will then be the pure flagship Lexus crossover.

As for the utilitarian/hauling/dune bashing aspect and capabilities of the current LX, well, not many other CUV's do that right now either as a full time responsibility. So losing those capabilities in the new LX might not be something that disappoints the current and future owners that much.
S
  • S
    senar
  • January 18, 2018
momers
Hi Guys,

Wild theory, not sure if speculated on before, but I think this car will be the next generation LX.

The new LS and LC are grounds up pure Lexus cars, while the current LX is a redone Toyota Land Cruiser. The LF-1 if it becomes the next gen LX will then be the pure flagship Lexus crossover.

As for the utilitarian/hauling/dune bashing aspect and capabilities of the current LX, well, not many other CUV's do that right now either as a full time responsibility. So losing those capabilities in the new LX might not be something that disappoints the current and future owners that much.
They should just call the new model the SX as it sure looks sexy ;) I imagine they will want to choose a new name and continue selling the LX, as it's still quite popular in parts of the world.

By the way, a good size/price comparison for the LF-1 may actually be the Maserati Levante. The dimensions are close (197″ L x 77.5″ W x 66.1″ H + 118.1 wheelbase) to the LF-1 (197.4" L x 78.2" W x 63.2" H + 117.1" wheelbase), both are RWD with long hoods, and I can imagine the MSRP will be similar to its $74K.
S
  • S
    senar
  • January 18, 2018
momers
Hi Guys,

Wild theory, not sure if speculated on before, but I think this car will be the next generation LX.

The new LS and LC are grounds up pure Lexus cars, while the current LX is a redone Toyota Land Cruiser. The LF-1 if it becomes the next gen LX will then be the pure flagship Lexus crossover.

As for the utilitarian/hauling/dune bashing aspect and capabilities of the current LX, well, not many other CUV's do that right now either as a full time responsibility. So losing those capabilities in the new LX might not be something that disappoints the current and future owners that much.
They should just call the new model the SX as it sure looks sexy ;) I imagine they will want to choose a new name and continue selling the LX, as it's still quite popular in parts of the world.

By the way, a good size/price comparison for the LF-1 may actually be the Maserati Levante. The dimensions are close (197″ L x 77.5″ W x 66.1″ H + 118.1 wheelbase) to the LF-1 (197.4" L x 78.2" W x 63.2" H + 117.1" wheelbase), both are RWD with long hoods, and I can imagine the MSRP will be similar to its $74K.
Joaquin Ruhi
momers
Hi Guys,

Wild theory, not sure if speculated on before, but I think this car will be the next generation LX.

The new LS and LC are grounds up pure Lexus cars, while the current LX is a redone Toyota Land Cruiser. The LF-1 if it becomes the next gen LX will then be the pure flagship Lexus crossover.

As for the utilitarian/hauling/dune bashing aspect and capabilities of the current LX, well, not many other CUV's do that right now either as a full time responsibility. So losing those capabilities in the new LX might not be something that disappoints the current and future owners that much.
As a purist, thinking of what the Lexus lineup should be, I'd agree with you. In practice, though, the Toyota bean counter/accountant types would disagree. Taken individually, each Lexus LX is surely even more profitable than the already money-making Toyota Land Cruiser. Yet, the pricier LX handily outsells its Toyota-badged sibling in the U.S. I guess more people than not figure the longer factory warranty and the added prestige of the "Circle L" badge are worth the extra $$$. On top of that, the upcoming less-expensive 2-Row LX is bound to further cut into Land Cruiser sales.

Bottom line: I see Lexus taking a dual-prong LX body-on-frame SUV / L? (production LF-1 Limitless) crossover strategy akin to the way Mercedes has both G-Class and GLS atop its SUV offerings.
Joaquin Ruhi
momers
Hi Guys,

Wild theory, not sure if speculated on before, but I think this car will be the next generation LX.

The new LS and LC are grounds up pure Lexus cars, while the current LX is a redone Toyota Land Cruiser. The LF-1 if it becomes the next gen LX will then be the pure flagship Lexus crossover.

As for the utilitarian/hauling/dune bashing aspect and capabilities of the current LX, well, not many other CUV's do that right now either as a full time responsibility. So losing those capabilities in the new LX might not be something that disappoints the current and future owners that much.
As a purist, thinking of what the Lexus lineup should be, I'd agree with you. In practice, though, the Toyota bean counter/accountant types would disagree. Taken individually, each Lexus LX is surely even more profitable than the already money-making Toyota Land Cruiser. Yet, the pricier LX handily outsells its Toyota-badged sibling in the U.S. I guess more people than not figure the longer factory warranty and the added prestige of the "Circle L" badge are worth the extra $$$. On top of that, the upcoming less-expensive 2-Row LX is bound to further cut into Land Cruiser sales.

Bottom line: I see Lexus taking a dual-prong LX body-on-frame SUV / L? (production LF-1 Limitless) crossover strategy akin to the way Mercedes has both G-Class and GLS atop its SUV offerings.
Ian Schmidt
senar
By the way, a good size/price comparison for the LF-1 may actually be the Maserati Levante. The dimensions are close (197″ L x 77.5″ W x 66.1″ H + 118.1 wheelbase) to the LF-1 (197.4" L x 78.2" W x 63.2" H + 117.1" wheelbase), both are RWD with long hoods, and I can imagine the MSRP will be similar to its $74K.
The new LS has often been compared to the Quattroporte, so using the Levante as a point of reference for LF-1 seems exactly right.
Ian Schmidt
senar
By the way, a good size/price comparison for the LF-1 may actually be the Maserati Levante. The dimensions are close (197″ L x 77.5″ W x 66.1″ H + 118.1 wheelbase) to the LF-1 (197.4" L x 78.2" W x 63.2" H + 117.1" wheelbase), both are RWD with long hoods, and I can imagine the MSRP will be similar to its $74K.
The new LS has often been compared to the Quattroporte, so using the Levante as a point of reference for LF-1 seems exactly right.
L
Joaquin Ruhi
Bottom line: I see Lexus taking a dual-prong LX body-on-frame SUV / L? (production LF-1 Limitless) crossover strategy akin to the way Mercedes has both G-Class and GLS atop its SUV offerings.
G Class is closer to LC70 than LC200.

L