Interview with Lexus LS Interior Designer Junko Itou

spwolf

Mike, did you see it in real life? How does it look?

Yes :) These are all my personal pictures. I will debut a Flickr Folder soon and another video. The first is below.



I'll start with that I don't like which is the rear 3/4 quarter. Not that its ugly but I am not in love with it. I love the size, its obvious this is a big car, you cannot confuse this with what people are currently saying "it looks like____". Especially the front. It is mind blowing how sculpted and curvaceous it is leading into the rest of the design. When I walked back to my LS F-Sport, it suddenly looked like a box. I'm driving a new BMW 740iL now and it also seems like a box in comparison. This is one super stylish car. I am completely positive it will be grand slam based on design alone.

Oh that reminds me, we have some comparison shots of the 2018 LS with a 2017 LS. Lexus Enthusiast ftw :)

spwolf

Mike, did you see it in real life? How does it look?

Yes :) These are all my personal pictures. I will debut a Flickr Folder soon and another video. The first is below.



I'll start with that I don't like which is the rear 3/4 quarter. Not that its ugly but I am not in love with it. I love the size, its obvious this is a big car, you cannot confuse this with what people are currently saying "it looks like____". Especially the front. It is mind blowing how sculpted and curvaceous it is leading into the rest of the design. When I walked back to my LS F-Sport, it suddenly looked like a box. I'm driving a new BMW 740iL now and it also seems like a box in comparison. This is one super stylish car. I am completely positive it will be grand slam based on design alone.

Oh that reminds me, we have some comparison shots of the 2018 LS with a 2017 LS. Lexus Enthusiast ftw :)

mikeavelli

When I walked back to my LS F-Sport, it suddenly looked like a box.

I like "box", especially clean well proportioned like the first LS and the LS which is to be replaced.




Another point, made about the rear seats: those are three seats, not 2 individual seats that are optional in many cars. Previous/Current LS also has 3 and optional 2 individual seats. Maybe they will yet show the individual seats in the LS500h. It would be nice for next Land Cruiser/LX to also get 2 individual rear seats.


I would also like to remind, that good cars in this class lack folding rear seats. Thanks to a rear "firewall", the cabin is completely isolated, while also reinforcing the whole structure of the unibody. The result is uncompromising comfort. Tesla S can get a way with that (and frameless windows) thanks to BEV silence. But imagine BEV in an LS? That is what I wish the GS would be.

mikeavelli

When I walked back to my LS F-Sport, it suddenly looked like a box.

I like "box", especially clean well proportioned like the first LS and the LS which is to be replaced.




Another point, made about the rear seats: those are three seats, not 2 individual seats that are optional in many cars. Previous/Current LS also has 3 and optional 2 individual seats. Maybe they will yet show the individual seats in the LS500h. It would be nice for next Land Cruiser/LX to also get 2 individual rear seats.


I would also like to remind, that good cars in this class lack folding rear seats. Thanks to a rear "firewall", the cabin is completely isolated, while also reinforcing the whole structure of the unibody. The result is uncompromising comfort. Tesla S can get a way with that (and frameless windows) thanks to BEV silence. But imagine BEV in an LS? That is what I wish the GS would be.

Levi

I like "box", especially clean well proportioned like the first LS and the LS which is to be replaced.




Another point, made about the rear seats: those are three seats, not 2 individual seats that are optional in many cars. Previous/Current LS also has 3 and optional 2 individual seats. Maybe they will yet show the individual seats in the LS500h. It would be nice for next Land Cruiser/LX to also get 2 individual rear seats.


I would also like to remind, that good cars in this class lack folding rear seats. Thanks to a rear "firewall", the cabin is completely isolated, while also reinforcing the whole structure of the unibody. The result is uncompromising comfort. Tesla S can get a way with that (and frameless windows) thanks to BEV silence. But imagine BEV in an LS? That is what I wish the GS would be.

Yeah, when i saw the third seat belt, i was thinking that they might have more to show later ?

Levi

I like "box", especially clean well proportioned like the first LS and the LS which is to be replaced.




Another point, made about the rear seats: those are three seats, not 2 individual seats that are optional in many cars. Previous/Current LS also has 3 and optional 2 individual seats. Maybe they will yet show the individual seats in the LS500h. It would be nice for next Land Cruiser/LX to also get 2 individual rear seats.


I would also like to remind, that good cars in this class lack folding rear seats. Thanks to a rear "firewall", the cabin is completely isolated, while also reinforcing the whole structure of the unibody. The result is uncompromising comfort. Tesla S can get a way with that (and frameless windows) thanks to BEV silence. But imagine BEV in an LS? That is what I wish the GS would be.

Yeah, when i saw the third seat belt, i was thinking that they might have more to show later ?

David Undercoffler is Automotive News' West Coast Bureau reporter, and among his duties for years was covering rumors and goings-on for Torrance, California-based Toyota and Lexus' U.S. operations (with the upcoming move to Texas, those duties now fall to Dallas Bureau reporter Laurence Iliff). Undercoffler is among the more irreverent writers in the normally strait-laced trade publication, and here are his comments on the new Lexus LS:


HIT: Front of Lexus LS

Any schlub with a clay modeler and a spatula can smash together a cover-worthy concept car. The hard part is getting that shape past safety regulators, the bean counters and geriatric board members and into customers' hands. So a tip o' the cap to Lexus for introducing the new production LS with a face mighty close to the gob-stopping LF-FC concept that stole the Tokyo Motor Show in 2015. The spindle grille may still be polarizing, but to me, it has started to look at home on the LC and now this LS.


MISS: Back of Lexus LS:

It's a pity Lexus put the LS on a rotating display that let us see this sedan's caboose; next show I'm just going to jam a quarter into the stand so we can stare at the face. The problem with the rear end is it doesn't live up to the promise made by the front of the car or its interior design or the striking lines on the LF-FC concept. As President-elect Donald Trump would say, Weak! Sad! Total failure! I haven't seen a letdown this big since I saw Titanic and the boat sinks at the end.

Source: http://www.autonews.com/article/20170116/OEM03/301169983/hits-and-misses-of-the-detroit-show

David Undercoffler is Automotive News' West Coast Bureau reporter, and among his duties for years was covering rumors and goings-on for Torrance, California-based Toyota and Lexus' U.S. operations (with the upcoming move to Texas, those duties now fall to Dallas Bureau reporter Laurence Iliff). Undercoffler is among the more irreverent writers in the normally strait-laced trade publication, and here are his comments on the new Lexus LS:


HIT: Front of Lexus LS

Any schlub with a clay modeler and a spatula can smash together a cover-worthy concept car. The hard part is getting that shape past safety regulators, the bean counters and geriatric board members and into customers' hands. So a tip o' the cap to Lexus for introducing the new production LS with a face mighty close to the gob-stopping LF-FC concept that stole the Tokyo Motor Show in 2015. The spindle grille may still be polarizing, but to me, it has started to look at home on the LC and now this LS.


MISS: Back of Lexus LS:

It's a pity Lexus put the LS on a rotating display that let us see this sedan's caboose; next show I'm just going to jam a quarter into the stand so we can stare at the face. The problem with the rear end is it doesn't live up to the promise made by the front of the car or its interior design or the striking lines on the LF-FC concept. As President-elect Donald Trump would say, Weak! Sad! Total failure! I haven't seen a letdown this big since I saw Titanic and the boat sinks at the end.

Source: http://www.autonews.com/article/20170116/OEM03/301169983/hits-and-misses-of-the-detroit-show

mikeavelli

Yes I know how it all drives and works. And obviously I was right about the car but if people want to disagree, thats fine :D

Anywhoo, lets all move this back to the 2018 LS......

I wasn't referring to any specific agreements or disagreements on the RL/RLX, but, I agree....back to the LS. I hope to see the new LS at the D.C. show next week, at least up on the turntable if not floor-acccessable or unlocked, but I'm not holding my breath. Typically, Detroit (or sometimes L.A.) gets first-displays on almost all-new vehicles for the next-model year (in this case, of course, 2018)...and we may or may not get them in D.C. I'll probably do a full-MM review when it's available here at dealerships. Lexus typically introduces new vehicles at dealerships in November or December, at the start of the holiday season...so that's a while yet.

mikeavelli

Yes I know how it all drives and works. And obviously I was right about the car but if people want to disagree, thats fine :D

Anywhoo, lets all move this back to the 2018 LS......

I wasn't referring to any specific agreements or disagreements on the RL/RLX, but, I agree....back to the LS. I hope to see the new LS at the D.C. show next week, at least up on the turntable if not floor-acccessable or unlocked, but I'm not holding my breath. Typically, Detroit (or sometimes L.A.) gets first-displays on almost all-new vehicles for the next-model year (in this case, of course, 2018)...and we may or may not get them in D.C. I'll probably do a full-MM review when it's available here at dealerships. Lexus typically introduces new vehicles at dealerships in November or December, at the start of the holiday season...so that's a while yet.

The LF FC Concept was way more attractive for me. This LS - hmmm, I don't know ... It's growing on me - but I still prefer the concept car - MUCH BETTER!

The LF FC Concept was way more attractive for me. This LS - hmmm, I don't know ... It's growing on me - but I still prefer the concept car - MUCH BETTER!

In regards to a lot of commentary about the concept vs production these are my thoughts...

1. Lexus usually shows an actual "concept" which previews some of the intended design but not the actual vehicle. Usually things are either very exaggerated or sometimes the concept previews design thoughts and not a particular vehicle.
2. I think most are talking about the biggest change which was going away from the traditional doorline of the LS to one that adds the rear 3/4 window and D-Pillar.




Looking above, like the LC, I find the production model even better looking and way more detailed than the concept.
3. DO NOT expect every Lexus to look like the LC in regards to production from concept. The LC was not intended for production. Only after the RAVE RAVE reviews of the design and it winning every award in design did Lexus decide to build the exact same car. Contrarily the LF FC was a concept to showcase what was already coming in the LS. Carmaker 1 I hope can come in and bring his thoughts. So the LS and LC initial concepts are from a totally different mind frame.

In regards to a lot of commentary about the concept vs production these are my thoughts...

1. Lexus usually shows an actual "concept" which previews some of the intended design but not the actual vehicle. Usually things are either very exaggerated or sometimes the concept previews design thoughts and not a particular vehicle.
2. I think most are talking about the biggest change which was going away from the traditional doorline of the LS to one that adds the rear 3/4 window and D-Pillar.




Looking above, like the LC, I find the production model even better looking and way more detailed than the concept.
3. DO NOT expect every Lexus to look like the LC in regards to production from concept. The LC was not intended for production. Only after the RAVE RAVE reviews of the design and it winning every award in design did Lexus decide to build the exact same car. Contrarily the LF FC was a concept to showcase what was already coming in the LS. Carmaker 1 I hope can come in and bring his thoughts. So the LS and LC initial concepts are from a totally different mind frame.

mikeavelli

1. Lexus usually shows an actual "concept" which previews some of the intended design but not the actual vehicle. Usually things are either very exaggerated or sometimes the concept previews design thoughts and not a particular vehicle.

I'll go a step further and say that Lexus will design the feasible, realistic production vehicle first, with all of the constraints imposed by stuff like platform/architecture hard points, providing enough interior space (especially headroom and legroom), crumple zones, etc. Then, the designers will go back and come up with the idealized concept that reflects how they wish the car had really looked like were it not for those constraints.

CT was the first time Lexus insiders admitted to me that this was sometimes their modus operandi. In other words, the production CT was designed first, then came the LF-Ch Concept which is probably the way they really wished CT could've looked. Or perhaps the design process led to LF-Ch, then reality intervened with the constraints I listed above, plus European pedestrian safety rules, adequate suspension travel, and so on, leading to the production CT. Still, LF-Ch was unveiled 6 months ahead of CT 200h, even though it was put together after the production CT design was finalized.

I don't know if Krew or anyone else on here has heard one way or the other, but I strongly suspect the same thing happened with 5LS vs the LF-FC concept.

mikeavelli

2. I think most are talking about the biggest change which was going away from the traditional doorline of the LS to one that adds the rear 3/4 window and D-Pillar.

Indeed, I strongly suspect this is the case. And seeing the LF-FC and 5LS pictures together in the post above shows what the main proportional differences are. The production greenhouse is taller and more ovoid, with more "ragged" and segmented elliptical shapes, versus the cleaner strokes of the concept. On the other hand, it's obvious that headroom would suffer big-time had the 5LS greenhouse hewed closely to LF-LC's. And Lexus does deserve mad props for the way it handled the side window/pillar transitions in such a flush and nearly seamless manner.

mikeavelli

3. DO NOT expect every Lexus to look like the LC in regards to production from concept. The LC was not intended for production. Only after the RAVE RAVE reviews of the design and it winning every award in design did Lexus decide to build the exact same car. Contrarily the LF FC was a concept to showcase what was already coming in the LS... So the LS and LC initial concepts are from a totally different mind frame.

This cannot be emphasized enough. The LF-LC to production LC transition was unique in that regard. LF-Ch vs CT, and LF-FC to 5LS are more typical of Lexus' processes.

mikeavelli

1. Lexus usually shows an actual "concept" which previews some of the intended design but not the actual vehicle. Usually things are either very exaggerated or sometimes the concept previews design thoughts and not a particular vehicle.

I'll go a step further and say that Lexus will design the feasible, realistic production vehicle first, with all of the constraints imposed by stuff like platform/architecture hard points, providing enough interior space (especially headroom and legroom), crumple zones, etc. Then, the designers will go back and come up with the idealized concept that reflects how they wish the car had really looked like were it not for those constraints.

CT was the first time Lexus insiders admitted to me that this was sometimes their modus operandi. In other words, the production CT was designed first, then came the LF-Ch Concept which is probably the way they really wished CT could've looked. Or perhaps the design process led to LF-Ch, then reality intervened with the constraints I listed above, plus European pedestrian safety rules, adequate suspension travel, and so on, leading to the production CT. Still, LF-Ch was unveiled 6 months ahead of CT 200h, even though it was put together after the production CT design was finalized.

I don't know if Krew or anyone else on here has heard one way or the other, but I strongly suspect the same thing happened with 5LS vs the LF-FC concept.

mikeavelli

2. I think most are talking about the biggest change which was going away from the traditional doorline of the LS to one that adds the rear 3/4 window and D-Pillar.

Indeed, I strongly suspect this is the case. And seeing the LF-FC and 5LS pictures together in the post above shows what the main proportional differences are. The production greenhouse is taller and more ovoid, with more "ragged" and segmented elliptical shapes, versus the cleaner strokes of the concept. On the other hand, it's obvious that headroom would suffer big-time had the 5LS greenhouse hewed closely to LF-LC's. And Lexus does deserve mad props for the way it handled the side window/pillar transitions in such a flush and nearly seamless manner.

mikeavelli

3. DO NOT expect every Lexus to look like the LC in regards to production from concept. The LC was not intended for production. Only after the RAVE RAVE reviews of the design and it winning every award in design did Lexus decide to build the exact same car. Contrarily the LF FC was a concept to showcase what was already coming in the LS... So the LS and LC initial concepts are from a totally different mind frame.

This cannot be emphasized enough. The LF-LC to production LC transition was unique in that regard. LF-Ch vs CT, and LF-FC to 5LS are more typical of Lexus' processes.

Joaquin Ruhi

This cannot be emphasized enough. The LF-LC to production LC transition was unique in that regard. LF-Ch vs CT, and LF-FC to 5LS are more typical of Lexus' processes.

True, the 5LS is more typical of Lexus' typical concept-to-production process. Even though the 5LS comes after the LC, it's my guess that the LS was just too far in development to change into the LC's process of full integration of design and engineering development. I think that in the future, we will see Lexus adopting the LC's fully-integrated design & engineering process into their other cars. We might see this in the UX, the upcoming 4IS and 5GS if it's not cancelled.

Joaquin Ruhi

This cannot be emphasized enough. The LF-LC to production LC transition was unique in that regard. LF-Ch vs CT, and LF-FC to 5LS are more typical of Lexus' processes.

True, the 5LS is more typical of Lexus' typical concept-to-production process. Even though the 5LS comes after the LC, it's my guess that the LS was just too far in development to change into the LC's process of full integration of design and engineering development. I think that in the future, we will see Lexus adopting the LC's fully-integrated design & engineering process into their other cars. We might see this in the UX, the upcoming 4IS and 5GS if it's not cancelled.

krew

An EV button reveals the surprise that is no surprise.

View the original article post

krew

An EV button reveals the surprise that is no surprise.

View the original article post

Lexus would be wise to introduce a fully electric and/or fuel cell version of this car. At least in the market where I work, it constantly gets compared with the Tesla Model S (since there's a Tesla store literally across the street). To summarize my thoughts: 1) Exterior: blandly elegant in the grand tradition of Lexus sedans, 2) interior: gorgeous and very reminiscent of an S-class, but burdened with a stale infotainment system out of the box, 3) powertrain: uninspired but competitive. All in all, a strong effort, but not enough to retake leadership in this class let alone reinvent it like the original did.

Lexus would be wise to introduce a fully electric and/or fuel cell version of this car. At least in the market where I work, it constantly gets compared with the Tesla Model S (since there's a Tesla store literally across the street). To summarize my thoughts: 1) Exterior: blandly elegant in the grand tradition of Lexus sedans, 2) interior: gorgeous and very reminiscent of an S-class, but burdened with a stale infotainment system out of the box, 3) powertrain: uninspired but competitive. All in all, a strong effort, but not enough to retake leadership in this class let alone reinvent it like the original did.

automovista

Lexus would be wise to introduce a fully electric and/or fuel cell version of this car.

I agree, especially since Tesla recently abandoned any pretense at luxury by deleting the ventilated seats.

automovista

Lexus would be wise to introduce a fully electric and/or fuel cell version of this car.

I agree, especially since Tesla recently abandoned any pretense at luxury by deleting the ventilated seats.

It would be cool if the electric motor of the hybrid was fuel cell rather than a traditional battery so they are using stuff from the LF-FC Concept but they are not ready for a fully electric Fuel Cell Vehicle, so they just use the motor in a hybrid for now. Still, using Fuel Cell technology for hybrid vehicles, let alone fully electric vehicles by Toyota is foolish when it is lacking infrastructure and its not as efficient as regular electric vehicle batteries.

It would be cool if the electric motor of the hybrid was fuel cell rather than a traditional battery so they are using stuff from the LF-FC Concept but they are not ready for a fully electric Fuel Cell Vehicle, so they just use the motor in a hybrid for now. Still, using Fuel Cell technology for hybrid vehicles, let alone fully electric vehicles by Toyota is foolish when it is lacking infrastructure and its not as efficient as regular electric vehicle batteries.

meth.ix

It would be cool if the electric motor of the hybrid was fuel cell rather than a traditional battery so they are using stuff from the LF-FC Concept but they are not ready for a fully electric Fuel Cell Vehicle, so they just use the motor in a hybrid for now.

Right, if they switched their hybrids to a series hybrid system then it becomes much easier to chuck the ICE and drop in either a fuel cell or batteries. The actual drivetrain stays the same in all 3 cases, it's just where the power comes from that's different. But for whatever reason they seem married to their mechanically-more-complex parallel HSD/LHD system.

meth.ix

It would be cool if the electric motor of the hybrid was fuel cell rather than a traditional battery so they are using stuff from the LF-FC Concept but they are not ready for a fully electric Fuel Cell Vehicle, so they just use the motor in a hybrid for now.

Right, if they switched their hybrids to a series hybrid system then it becomes much easier to chuck the ICE and drop in either a fuel cell or batteries. The actual drivetrain stays the same in all 3 cases, it's just where the power comes from that's different. But for whatever reason they seem married to their mechanically-more-complex parallel HSD/LHD system.

meth.ix

It would be cool if the electric motor of the hybrid was fuel cell rather than a traditional battery so they are using stuff from the LF-FC Concept but they are not ready for a fully electric Fuel Cell Vehicle, so they just use the motor in a hybrid for now. Still, using Fuel Cell technology for hybrid vehicles, let alone fully electric vehicles by Toyota is foolish when it is lacking infrastructure and its not as efficient as regular electric vehicle batteries.

That would be a cool, unexpected twist. Not sure if it's possible at all, but would be neat.

What do you guys think about the interior of the LS? In this comparison:

I feel it holds up well against the S-class, which looks way too boisterous in a luxurious way. The LS on the other hand is very subtle and mature.

In this comparison between the LS500 and 7-series, I feel like it blows away the 7.

meth.ix

It would be cool if the electric motor of the hybrid was fuel cell rather than a traditional battery so they are using stuff from the LF-FC Concept but they are not ready for a fully electric Fuel Cell Vehicle, so they just use the motor in a hybrid for now. Still, using Fuel Cell technology for hybrid vehicles, let alone fully electric vehicles by Toyota is foolish when it is lacking infrastructure and its not as efficient as regular electric vehicle batteries.

That would be a cool, unexpected twist. Not sure if it's possible at all, but would be neat.

What do you guys think about the interior of the LS? In this comparison:

I feel it holds up well against the S-class, which looks way too boisterous in a luxurious way. The LS on the other hand is very subtle and mature.

In this comparison between the LS500 and 7-series, I feel like it blows away the 7.