Video & Photo Gallery: 2018 Lexus LS 500 in Autumn Shimmer

Posted by Kevin on September 22nd, 2017

Next week, the floodgates will open with reviews of the new 2018 Lexus LS flagship all over the Internet — before that happens, let’s start looking at some of the official photos & video that will get buried in all of the coverage.

This is the 2018 Lexus LS 500 AWD in Autumn Shimmer with a Parchement interior:

Video move too fast for you? Here’s a full gallery in high resolution:

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Comments
S
Rhambler
Actually almost all modern German V8 tts are "hot Vs."

BMW 4.4 V8 tt is a hot V
Mercedes 4.0 V8 tt is a hot V
Porsche 4.0 V8 tt is a hot V
Likewise for Audi

The point I was making is that Lexus CANNOT easily make single turbo V8 or V6 (as someone mentioned) because Lexus places the turbos in traditional locations, on the periphery of the engine. It just won't work. You can do this in a hot V.

I know there is no V in a straight six. German V6s are hots Vs too, at least those that make Vs
Yes my post was meant to reinforce your point that Lexus won't build a single turbo V6 because it's unnecessarily complex. I wasn't mentioning V8s though, just six cylinder engines. I've not seen a Mercedes with a hot V6 because the current model is 60 degree, and uses a traditional bi-turbo configuration. Maybe point me to some resources?

Rhambler
The LS 500 is just missing a decent engine. One that pushes out 450-500 HP in a non-F guise
The engine line-up for 5LS is completely baffling to me. I live in China and a friend of mine who works at a Lexus dealership said he was deeply disappointed by the poor engine choices. It's almost like Lexus has given up on the biggest market for premium and luxury vehicles.

In China we have this ridiculous "displacement tax" that has led to Lexus' downfall in this market, simply because their workhorse 2GR is a 3.5L engine. Under the latest version of the legislation:
The tax rate is 8% for a car with a 2.0L-2.5L engine;
12% for 2.5L-3.0L;
25% for 3.0L-4.0L;
40% for 4.0L+.

All the German competitors are in the 12% bracket, allowing them to undercut Lexus in price by a wide margin. Lexus basically had to axe its two cash cows: the ES350 and the RX350. IS350 and GS350 are gone as well. 2GR is completely replaced by 8AR, which is poorly received since it's a half-assed effort. No V6 no sales, it's just as simple as that.

The engine TMC needs RIGHT NOW is a proper 2GR replacement: a simple and efficient 3.0L bi-turbo V6. The best selling executive sedan in China all use this same recipe: S400L, 740Li, A8L 50TFSI, and Jaguar XF 3.0. The new LS350 is underpowered and in a higher tax bracket than all these competitors. It's basically DOA. And don't forget it's not just about Lexus. The Highlander needs it, the Alphard needs it, the Prado needs it, the Crown needs it. Unless TMC is content with selling just Corollas in China it needs to develop this engine ASAP.

And the LS500 uses the non-sense 3.5L V6 which will be a major disappointment for returning customers who used to have the wonderful 4.6L V8. Why give up V8 when the new "downsized" V6 is actually in the same exact tax bracket which nullifies the benefit of downsizing? Again the LS500 will be underpowered competing against Germans with V8s.
S
Rhambler
Actually almost all modern German V8 tts are "hot Vs."

BMW 4.4 V8 tt is a hot V
Mercedes 4.0 V8 tt is a hot V
Porsche 4.0 V8 tt is a hot V
Likewise for Audi

The point I was making is that Lexus CANNOT easily make single turbo V8 or V6 (as someone mentioned) because Lexus places the turbos in traditional locations, on the periphery of the engine. It just won't work. You can do this in a hot V.

I know there is no V in a straight six. German V6s are hots Vs too, at least those that make Vs
Yes my post was meant to reinforce your point that Lexus won't build a single turbo V6 because it's unnecessarily complex. I wasn't mentioning V8s though, just six cylinder engines. I've not seen a Mercedes with a hot V6 because the current model is 60 degree, and uses a traditional bi-turbo configuration. Maybe point me to some resources?

Rhambler
The LS 500 is just missing a decent engine. One that pushes out 450-500 HP in a non-F guise
The engine line-up for 5LS is completely baffling to me. I live in China and a friend of mine who works at a Lexus dealership said he was deeply disappointed by the poor engine choices. It's almost like Lexus has given up on the biggest market for premium and luxury vehicles.

In China we have this ridiculous "displacement tax" that has led to Lexus' downfall in this market, simply because their workhorse 2GR is a 3.5L engine. Under the latest version of the legislation:
The tax rate is 8% for a car with a 2.0L-2.5L engine;
12% for 2.5L-3.0L;
25% for 3.0L-4.0L;
40% for 4.0L+.

All the German competitors are in the 12% bracket, allowing them to undercut Lexus in price by a wide margin. Lexus basically had to axe its two cash cows: the ES350 and the RX350. IS350 and GS350 are gone as well. 2GR is completely replaced by 8AR, which is poorly received since it's a half-assed effort. No V6 no sales, it's just as simple as that.

The engine TMC needs RIGHT NOW is a proper 2GR replacement: a simple and efficient 3.0L bi-turbo V6. The best selling executive sedan in China all use this same recipe: S400L, 740Li, A8L 50TFSI, and Jaguar XF 3.0. The new LS350 is underpowered and in a higher tax bracket than all these competitors. It's basically DOA. And don't forget it's not just about Lexus. The Highlander needs it, the Alphard needs it, the Prado needs it, the Crown needs it. Unless TMC is content with selling just Corollas in China it needs to develop this engine ASAP.

And the LS500 uses the non-sense 3.5L V6 which will be a major disappointment for returning customers who used to have the wonderful 4.6L V8. Why give up V8 when the new "downsized" V6 is actually in the same exact tax bracket which nullifies the benefit of downsizing? Again the LS500 will be underpowered competing against Germans with V8s.
R
That's why I think this car will be a sales flop. There's not many people that buy this class of car to begin with and when you're spending this much, why compromise?

This is going to be underpowered and overpriced.

The only way this thing moves off of lots is if Lexus undercuts the G90 price wise. Kind of sad I even have to say that, but that's a hard truth because it doesn't offer anything worthy of its reported price tag.

If I'm spending this much (Lexus will probably price this like the A8 V8 or 750i), I want it all. Not some puddly V6.
R
That's why I think this car will be a sales flop. There's not many people that buy this class of car to begin with and when you're spending this much, why compromise?

This is going to be underpowered and overpriced.

The only way this thing moves off of lots is if Lexus undercuts the G90 price wise. Kind of sad I even have to say that, but that's a hard truth because it doesn't offer anything worthy of its reported price tag.

If I'm spending this much (Lexus will probably price this like the A8 V8 or 750i), I want it all. Not some puddly V6.
R
That's why I think this car will be a sales flop. There's not many people that buy this class of car to begin with and when you're spending this much, why compromise?

This is going to be underpowered and overpriced.

The only way this thing moves off of lots is if Lexus undercuts the G90 price wise. Kind of sad I even have to say that, but that's a hard truth because it doesn't offer anything worthy of its reported price tag.

If I'm spending this much (Lexus will probably price this like the A8 V8 or 750i), I want it all. Not some puddly V6.
R
That's why I think this car will be a sales flop. There's not many people that buy this class of car to begin with and when you're spending this much, why compromise?

This is going to be underpowered and overpriced.

The only way this thing moves off of lots is if Lexus undercuts the G90 price wise. Kind of sad I even have to say that, but that's a hard truth because it doesn't offer anything worthy of its reported price tag.

If I'm spending this much (Lexus will probably price this like the A8 V8 or 750i), I want it all. Not some puddly V6.
Gecko
Rhambler
Well Lexus is already on record stating this engine will propel this car to 60 in 4.5 seconds.

That's why I linked that Carbuzz article as real world testers always seem to get less than what Toyota says versus other automakers. Like the current LS 460. Toyota says 5.4 seconds. Hogwash. 6 seconds.

I bet we'll see legitimate values above 5 seconds for the new LS.
Almost every model with the GR V6 has been understated by Toyota - Camry has done 0-60 in less than 6 seconds. Highlander is very quick, as is the Avalon. Tundra 5.7L 0-60 has been timed at 6 seconds flat. Lexus actually revised the 2nd gen IS 350's acceleration number because they overstated it (5.6 originally) and the car was doing 5.2-5.3 seconds (I believe Lexus revised it to 5.4). The list goes on.

I see your point about the LS but I don't think Toyota "always seems to get less" by any stretch.
Gecko
Rhambler
Well Lexus is already on record stating this engine will propel this car to 60 in 4.5 seconds.

That's why I linked that Carbuzz article as real world testers always seem to get less than what Toyota says versus other automakers. Like the current LS 460. Toyota says 5.4 seconds. Hogwash. 6 seconds.

I bet we'll see legitimate values above 5 seconds for the new LS.
Almost every model with the GR V6 has been understated by Toyota - Camry has done 0-60 in less than 6 seconds. Highlander is very quick, as is the Avalon. Tundra 5.7L 0-60 has been timed at 6 seconds flat. Lexus actually revised the 2nd gen IS 350's acceleration number because they overstated it (5.6 originally) and the car was doing 5.2-5.3 seconds (I believe Lexus revised it to 5.4). The list goes on.

I see your point about the LS but I don't think Toyota "always seems to get less" by any stretch.
Gecko
Rhambler
Well Lexus is already on record stating this engine will propel this car to 60 in 4.5 seconds.

That's why I linked that Carbuzz article as real world testers always seem to get less than what Toyota says versus other automakers. Like the current LS 460. Toyota says 5.4 seconds. Hogwash. 6 seconds.

I bet we'll see legitimate values above 5 seconds for the new LS.
Almost every model with the GR V6 has been understated by Toyota - Camry has done 0-60 in less than 6 seconds. Highlander is very quick, as is the Avalon. Tundra 5.7L 0-60 has been timed at 6 seconds flat. Lexus actually revised the 2nd gen IS 350's acceleration number because they overstated it (5.6 originally) and the car was doing 5.2-5.3 seconds (I believe Lexus revised it to 5.4). The list goes on.

I see your point about the LS but I don't think Toyota "always seems to get less" by any stretch.
Gecko
Rhambler
Well Lexus is already on record stating this engine will propel this car to 60 in 4.5 seconds.

That's why I linked that Carbuzz article as real world testers always seem to get less than what Toyota says versus other automakers. Like the current LS 460. Toyota says 5.4 seconds. Hogwash. 6 seconds.

I bet we'll see legitimate values above 5 seconds for the new LS.
Almost every model with the GR V6 has been understated by Toyota - Camry has done 0-60 in less than 6 seconds. Highlander is very quick, as is the Avalon. Tundra 5.7L 0-60 has been timed at 6 seconds flat. Lexus actually revised the 2nd gen IS 350's acceleration number because they overstated it (5.6 originally) and the car was doing 5.2-5.3 seconds (I believe Lexus revised it to 5.4). The list goes on.

I see your point about the LS but I don't think Toyota "always seems to get less" by any stretch.
R
I base it on manufacturer's claimed times versus what third parties can actually achieve. Third parties such as established car journalists etc.

The Germans tend to understate and Toyota tends to overstate. In fact they seem to be the most egregious imo in claimed versus real across the board.

Yes I say this anecdotally, but just look at what C&D pulled on the recent Camry: 7.8 seconds. Yeah, it's a hybrid, but still that's minivan speed.

Edit: now in curious what Toyota will claim lol.
R
I base it on manufacturer's claimed times versus what third parties can actually achieve. Third parties such as established car journalists etc.

The Germans tend to understate and Toyota tends to overstate. In fact they seem to be the most egregious imo in claimed versus real across the board.

Yes I say this anecdotally, but just look at what C&D pulled on the recent Camry: 7.8 seconds. Yeah, it's a hybrid, but still that's minivan speed.

Edit: now in curious what Toyota will claim lol.
R
I base it on manufacturer's claimed times versus what third parties can actually achieve. Third parties such as established car journalists etc.

The Germans tend to understate and Toyota tends to overstate. In fact they seem to be the most egregious imo in claimed versus real across the board.

Yes I say this anecdotally, but just look at what C&D pulled on the recent Camry: 7.8 seconds. Yeah, it's a hybrid, but still that's minivan speed.

Edit: now in curious what Toyota will claim lol.
R
I base it on manufacturer's claimed times versus what third parties can actually achieve. Third parties such as established car journalists etc.

The Germans tend to understate and Toyota tends to overstate. In fact they seem to be the most egregious imo in claimed versus real across the board.

Yes I say this anecdotally, but just look at what C&D pulled on the recent Camry: 7.8 seconds. Yeah, it's a hybrid, but still that's minivan speed.

Edit: now in curious what Toyota will claim lol.
Gecko
ssun30
And the LS500 uses the non-sense 3.5L V6 which will be a major disappointment for returning customers who used to have the wonderful 4.6L V8. Why give up V8 when the new "downsized" V6 is actually in the same exact tax bracket which nullifies the benefit of downsizing? Again the LS500 will be underpowered competing against Germans with V8s.
I agree with many of your other points, but when is the last time you drove an LS 460? Torque is what makes a car feel fast and the 1UR-FSE lacks it - period. The UR V8 is smooth for sure, but I don't think anyone is going to get into an LS 500 from an LS 460 and be disappointed. If anything, the LS 500 will feel significantly faster around town because of the torque advantage.

If you compare power to weight ratios, the S560, 750i and LS 500 are within a half a pound per HP of each other. I believe these cars will all be very competitive with each other, with the "winner" probably coming down to things like transmission, throttle response and driver.
Gecko
ssun30
And the LS500 uses the non-sense 3.5L V6 which will be a major disappointment for returning customers who used to have the wonderful 4.6L V8. Why give up V8 when the new "downsized" V6 is actually in the same exact tax bracket which nullifies the benefit of downsizing? Again the LS500 will be underpowered competing against Germans with V8s.
I agree with many of your other points, but when is the last time you drove an LS 460? Torque is what makes a car feel fast and the 1UR-FSE lacks it - period. The UR V8 is smooth for sure, but I don't think anyone is going to get into an LS 500 from an LS 460 and be disappointed. If anything, the LS 500 will feel significantly faster around town because of the torque advantage.

If you compare power to weight ratios, the S560, 750i and LS 500 are within a half a pound per HP of each other. I believe these cars will all be very competitive with each other, with the "winner" probably coming down to things like transmission, throttle response and driver.
Gecko
ssun30
And the LS500 uses the non-sense 3.5L V6 which will be a major disappointment for returning customers who used to have the wonderful 4.6L V8. Why give up V8 when the new "downsized" V6 is actually in the same exact tax bracket which nullifies the benefit of downsizing? Again the LS500 will be underpowered competing against Germans with V8s.
I agree with many of your other points, but when is the last time you drove an LS 460? Torque is what makes a car feel fast and the 1UR-FSE lacks it - period. The UR V8 is smooth for sure, but I don't think anyone is going to get into an LS 500 from an LS 460 and be disappointed. If anything, the LS 500 will feel significantly faster around town because of the torque advantage.

If you compare power to weight ratios, the S560, 750i and LS 500 are within a half a pound per HP of each other. I believe these cars will all be very competitive with each other, with the "winner" probably coming down to things like transmission, throttle response and driver.
Gecko
ssun30
And the LS500 uses the non-sense 3.5L V6 which will be a major disappointment for returning customers who used to have the wonderful 4.6L V8. Why give up V8 when the new "downsized" V6 is actually in the same exact tax bracket which nullifies the benefit of downsizing? Again the LS500 will be underpowered competing against Germans with V8s.
I agree with many of your other points, but when is the last time you drove an LS 460? Torque is what makes a car feel fast and the 1UR-FSE lacks it - period. The UR V8 is smooth for sure, but I don't think anyone is going to get into an LS 500 from an LS 460 and be disappointed. If anything, the LS 500 will feel significantly faster around town because of the torque advantage.

If you compare power to weight ratios, the S560, 750i and LS 500 are within a half a pound per HP of each other. I believe these cars will all be very competitive with each other, with the "winner" probably coming down to things like transmission, throttle response and driver.
Gecko
Rhambler
I base it on manufacturer's claimed times versus what third parties can actually achieve. Third parties such as established car journalists etc.

The Germans tend to understate and Toyota tends to overstate. In fact they seem to be the most egregious imo in claimed versus real across the board.

Yes I say this anecdotally, but just look at what C&D pulled on the recent Camry: 7.8 seconds. Yeah, it's a hybrid, but still that's minivan speed.

Edit: now in curious what Toyota will claim lol.
Anyone can cherry pick good and bad stats to tell their own story. I don't disagree with you that the LS is more of a 6 second car, but I don't think it's accurate to say that Toyota has a tendency to overrate their cars in general because that is simply not true.
Gecko
Rhambler
I base it on manufacturer's claimed times versus what third parties can actually achieve. Third parties such as established car journalists etc.

The Germans tend to understate and Toyota tends to overstate. In fact they seem to be the most egregious imo in claimed versus real across the board.

Yes I say this anecdotally, but just look at what C&D pulled on the recent Camry: 7.8 seconds. Yeah, it's a hybrid, but still that's minivan speed.

Edit: now in curious what Toyota will claim lol.
Anyone can cherry pick good and bad stats to tell their own story. I don't disagree with you that the LS is more of a 6 second car, but I don't think it's accurate to say that Toyota has a tendency to overrate their cars in general because that is simply not true.
Gecko
Rhambler
I base it on manufacturer's claimed times versus what third parties can actually achieve. Third parties such as established car journalists etc.

The Germans tend to understate and Toyota tends to overstate. In fact they seem to be the most egregious imo in claimed versus real across the board.

Yes I say this anecdotally, but just look at what C&D pulled on the recent Camry: 7.8 seconds. Yeah, it's a hybrid, but still that's minivan speed.

Edit: now in curious what Toyota will claim lol.
Anyone can cherry pick good and bad stats to tell their own story. I don't disagree with you that the LS is more of a 6 second car, but I don't think it's accurate to say that Toyota has a tendency to overrate their cars in general because that is simply not true.
Gecko
Rhambler
I base it on manufacturer's claimed times versus what third parties can actually achieve. Third parties such as established car journalists etc.

The Germans tend to understate and Toyota tends to overstate. In fact they seem to be the most egregious imo in claimed versus real across the board.

Yes I say this anecdotally, but just look at what C&D pulled on the recent Camry: 7.8 seconds. Yeah, it's a hybrid, but still that's minivan speed.

Edit: now in curious what Toyota will claim lol.
Anyone can cherry pick good and bad stats to tell their own story. I don't disagree with you that the LS is more of a 6 second car, but I don't think it's accurate to say that Toyota has a tendency to overrate their cars in general because that is simply not true.
Gecko
Rhambler
The only way this thing moves off of lots is if Lexus undercuts the G90 price wise. Kind of sad I even have to say that, but that's a hard truth because it doesn't offer anything worthy of its reported price tag.
Gecko
Rhambler
The only way this thing moves off of lots is if Lexus undercuts the G90 price wise. Kind of sad I even have to say that, but that's a hard truth because it doesn't offer anything worthy of its reported price tag.
Gecko
Rhambler
The only way this thing moves off of lots is if Lexus undercuts the G90 price wise. Kind of sad I even have to say that, but that's a hard truth because it doesn't offer anything worthy of its reported price tag.
Gecko
Rhambler
The only way this thing moves off of lots is if Lexus undercuts the G90 price wise. Kind of sad I even have to say that, but that's a hard truth because it doesn't offer anything worthy of its reported price tag.
bogglo
ssun30
Yes my post was meant to reinforce your point that Lexus won't build a single turbo V6 because it's unnecessarily complex. I wasn't mentioning V8s though, just six cylinder engines. I've not seen a Mercedes with a hot V6 because the current model is 60 degree, and uses a traditional bi-turbo configuration. Maybe point me to some resources?



The engine line-up for 5LS is completely baffling to me. I live in China and a friend of mine who works at a Lexus dealership said he was deeply disappointed by the poor engine choices. It's almost like Lexus has given up on the biggest market for premium and luxury vehicles.

In China we have this ridiculous "displacement tax" that has led to Lexus' downfall in this market, simply because their workhorse 2GR is a 3.5L engine. Under the latest version of the legislation:
The tax rate is 8% for a car with a 2.0L-2.5L engine;
12% for 2.5L-3.0L;
25% for 3.0L-4.0L;
40% for 4.0L+.

All the German competitors are in the 12% bracket, allowing them to undercut Lexus in price by a wide margin. Lexus basically had to axe its two cash cows: the ES350 and the RX350. IS350 and GS350 are gone as well. 2GR is completely replaced by 8AR, which is poorly received since it's a half-assed effort. No V6 no sales, it's just as simple as that.

The engine TMC needs RIGHT NOW is a proper 2GR replacement: a simple and efficient 3.0L bi-turbo V6. The best selling executive sedan in China all use this same recipe: S400L, 740Li, A8L 50TFSI, and Jaguar XF 3.0. The new LS350 is underpowered and in a higher tax bracket than all these competitors. It's basically DOA. And don't forget it's not just about Lexus. The Highlander needs it, the Alphard needs it, the Prado needs it, the Crown needs it. Unless TMC is content with selling just Corollas in China it needs to develop this engine ASAP.

And the LS500 uses the non-sense 3.5L V6 which will be a major disappointment for returning customers who used to have the wonderful 4.6L V8. Why give up V8 when the new "downsized" V6 is actually in the same exact tax bracket which nullifies the benefit of downsizing? Again the LS500 will be underpowered competing against Germans with V8s.
All great point. But IMO , I won't conclude that Lexus is done with the LS as far as engine choice is concerned(a good example was the lunch of the LS350. I did not see that coming.). Also when you talk about tax bracket are you saying both the 3.5L NA engine and the 3.5LTT engine are in the same tax bracket(TMC is not a novice in this business and am sure they are familiar with the Tax Bracket Issue. I can see history repeating itself remember 2006 GS300 AND 2007 GS350)? Also we know how secretive TMC can get when they choose to.(For example does anyone have a concrete information of what the FT-1 mule running around would be called, or what engine it would have. does anyone know what engine would replace the IS350, RC350 and the GS350 engine.)
bogglo
ssun30
Yes my post was meant to reinforce your point that Lexus won't build a single turbo V6 because it's unnecessarily complex. I wasn't mentioning V8s though, just six cylinder engines. I've not seen a Mercedes with a hot V6 because the current model is 60 degree, and uses a traditional bi-turbo configuration. Maybe point me to some resources?



The engine line-up for 5LS is completely baffling to me. I live in China and a friend of mine who works at a Lexus dealership said he was deeply disappointed by the poor engine choices. It's almost like Lexus has given up on the biggest market for premium and luxury vehicles.

In China we have this ridiculous "displacement tax" that has led to Lexus' downfall in this market, simply because their workhorse 2GR is a 3.5L engine. Under the latest version of the legislation:
The tax rate is 8% for a car with a 2.0L-2.5L engine;
12% for 2.5L-3.0L;
25% for 3.0L-4.0L;
40% for 4.0L+.

All the German competitors are in the 12% bracket, allowing them to undercut Lexus in price by a wide margin. Lexus basically had to axe its two cash cows: the ES350 and the RX350. IS350 and GS350 are gone as well. 2GR is completely replaced by 8AR, which is poorly received since it's a half-assed effort. No V6 no sales, it's just as simple as that.

The engine TMC needs RIGHT NOW is a proper 2GR replacement: a simple and efficient 3.0L bi-turbo V6. The best selling executive sedan in China all use this same recipe: S400L, 740Li, A8L 50TFSI, and Jaguar XF 3.0. The new LS350 is underpowered and in a higher tax bracket than all these competitors. It's basically DOA. And don't forget it's not just about Lexus. The Highlander needs it, the Alphard needs it, the Prado needs it, the Crown needs it. Unless TMC is content with selling just Corollas in China it needs to develop this engine ASAP.

And the LS500 uses the non-sense 3.5L V6 which will be a major disappointment for returning customers who used to have the wonderful 4.6L V8. Why give up V8 when the new "downsized" V6 is actually in the same exact tax bracket which nullifies the benefit of downsizing? Again the LS500 will be underpowered competing against Germans with V8s.
All great point. But IMO , I won't conclude that Lexus is done with the LS as far as engine choice is concerned(a good example was the lunch of the LS350. I did not see that coming.). Also when you talk about tax bracket are you saying both the 3.5L NA engine and the 3.5LTT engine are in the same tax bracket(TMC is not a novice in this business and am sure they are familiar with the Tax Bracket Issue. I can see history repeating itself remember 2006 GS300 AND 2007 GS350)? Also we know how secretive TMC can get when they choose to.(For example does anyone have a concrete information of what the FT-1 mule running around would be called, or what engine it would have. does anyone know what engine would replace the IS350, RC350 and the GS350 engine.)
bogglo
ssun30
Yes my post was meant to reinforce your point that Lexus won't build a single turbo V6 because it's unnecessarily complex. I wasn't mentioning V8s though, just six cylinder engines. I've not seen a Mercedes with a hot V6 because the current model is 60 degree, and uses a traditional bi-turbo configuration. Maybe point me to some resources?



The engine line-up for 5LS is completely baffling to me. I live in China and a friend of mine who works at a Lexus dealership said he was deeply disappointed by the poor engine choices. It's almost like Lexus has given up on the biggest market for premium and luxury vehicles.

In China we have this ridiculous "displacement tax" that has led to Lexus' downfall in this market, simply because their workhorse 2GR is a 3.5L engine. Under the latest version of the legislation:
The tax rate is 8% for a car with a 2.0L-2.5L engine;
12% for 2.5L-3.0L;
25% for 3.0L-4.0L;
40% for 4.0L+.

All the German competitors are in the 12% bracket, allowing them to undercut Lexus in price by a wide margin. Lexus basically had to axe its two cash cows: the ES350 and the RX350. IS350 and GS350 are gone as well. 2GR is completely replaced by 8AR, which is poorly received since it's a half-assed effort. No V6 no sales, it's just as simple as that.

The engine TMC needs RIGHT NOW is a proper 2GR replacement: a simple and efficient 3.0L bi-turbo V6. The best selling executive sedan in China all use this same recipe: S400L, 740Li, A8L 50TFSI, and Jaguar XF 3.0. The new LS350 is underpowered and in a higher tax bracket than all these competitors. It's basically DOA. And don't forget it's not just about Lexus. The Highlander needs it, the Alphard needs it, the Prado needs it, the Crown needs it. Unless TMC is content with selling just Corollas in China it needs to develop this engine ASAP.

And the LS500 uses the non-sense 3.5L V6 which will be a major disappointment for returning customers who used to have the wonderful 4.6L V8. Why give up V8 when the new "downsized" V6 is actually in the same exact tax bracket which nullifies the benefit of downsizing? Again the LS500 will be underpowered competing against Germans with V8s.
All great point. But IMO , I won't conclude that Lexus is done with the LS as far as engine choice is concerned(a good example was the lunch of the LS350. I did not see that coming.). Also when you talk about tax bracket are you saying both the 3.5L NA engine and the 3.5LTT engine are in the same tax bracket(TMC is not a novice in this business and am sure they are familiar with the Tax Bracket Issue. I can see history repeating itself remember 2006 GS300 AND 2007 GS350)? Also we know how secretive TMC can get when they choose to.(For example does anyone have a concrete information of what the FT-1 mule running around would be called, or what engine it would have. does anyone know what engine would replace the IS350, RC350 and the GS350 engine.)
bogglo
ssun30
Yes my post was meant to reinforce your point that Lexus won't build a single turbo V6 because it's unnecessarily complex. I wasn't mentioning V8s though, just six cylinder engines. I've not seen a Mercedes with a hot V6 because the current model is 60 degree, and uses a traditional bi-turbo configuration. Maybe point me to some resources?



The engine line-up for 5LS is completely baffling to me. I live in China and a friend of mine who works at a Lexus dealership said he was deeply disappointed by the poor engine choices. It's almost like Lexus has given up on the biggest market for premium and luxury vehicles.

In China we have this ridiculous "displacement tax" that has led to Lexus' downfall in this market, simply because their workhorse 2GR is a 3.5L engine. Under the latest version of the legislation:
The tax rate is 8% for a car with a 2.0L-2.5L engine;
12% for 2.5L-3.0L;
25% for 3.0L-4.0L;
40% for 4.0L+.

All the German competitors are in the 12% bracket, allowing them to undercut Lexus in price by a wide margin. Lexus basically had to axe its two cash cows: the ES350 and the RX350. IS350 and GS350 are gone as well. 2GR is completely replaced by 8AR, which is poorly received since it's a half-assed effort. No V6 no sales, it's just as simple as that.

The engine TMC needs RIGHT NOW is a proper 2GR replacement: a simple and efficient 3.0L bi-turbo V6. The best selling executive sedan in China all use this same recipe: S400L, 740Li, A8L 50TFSI, and Jaguar XF 3.0. The new LS350 is underpowered and in a higher tax bracket than all these competitors. It's basically DOA. And don't forget it's not just about Lexus. The Highlander needs it, the Alphard needs it, the Prado needs it, the Crown needs it. Unless TMC is content with selling just Corollas in China it needs to develop this engine ASAP.

And the LS500 uses the non-sense 3.5L V6 which will be a major disappointment for returning customers who used to have the wonderful 4.6L V8. Why give up V8 when the new "downsized" V6 is actually in the same exact tax bracket which nullifies the benefit of downsizing? Again the LS500 will be underpowered competing against Germans with V8s.
All great point. But IMO , I won't conclude that Lexus is done with the LS as far as engine choice is concerned(a good example was the lunch of the LS350. I did not see that coming.). Also when you talk about tax bracket are you saying both the 3.5L NA engine and the 3.5LTT engine are in the same tax bracket(TMC is not a novice in this business and am sure they are familiar with the Tax Bracket Issue. I can see history repeating itself remember 2006 GS300 AND 2007 GS350)? Also we know how secretive TMC can get when they choose to.(For example does anyone have a concrete information of what the FT-1 mule running around would be called, or what engine it would have. does anyone know what engine would replace the IS350, RC350 and the GS350 engine.)

B