Will Genesis hurt Lexus?

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Lexus won't be hurt
It will just changes its category
BMW and Mercedes hurt Lexus more than Genesis could at this point (A lot of Lexus lessees went German for their next lease), but I agree with InternalAudit, the company did more damage to themselves. I would've bought a new Toyota back in 2016 or 17 IF the company put Carplay and Android Auto in their cars like the rest of the industry. That didn't happen and instead I put off a new car and saved up for a home instead.

Hyundai and Genesis were on the forefront of this, and I'll applaud them for that because their systems were very intuitive and tactile with enough buttons unlike other manufacturers (cough Honda) that also adopted CP/AA early on.
 

ssun30

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A large family crossover with an I6 diesel and 4WD somehow suddenly turning into a Land Cruiser is one of the most ridiculous statements I've heard. By that logic, give a Boeing 737 a pair of GE90 engines and somehow it can serve as a B-52 bomber?
 

spwolf

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Interesting strategy. Genesis and even the Japanese brands used to really showcase value. For example a V-6tt starting at 48k as the base engine. Instead you get less for less. In the past it was more for less, ala say the G90 where you get a V-8 for V-6 money.

Now mind you it will sell, any SUV sells and from what I've seen on FB groups and forums there are a ton of people that want this vehicle and the main vehicle I see it compared to is actually the MDX.

Genesis is aimed at Germans, hence the pricing.

Since brand awareness and number of dealers is small, maybe that is better way for them to grow. Their un-willingless to build brand and dealers is interesting, they cant be happy with 1500 sales per month for 3 vehicles.
 

maiaramdan

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Sooner or later Genesis will return to its Korean FF roots or becoming more FF American

And then we will have another Acura/Infiniti

Lexus product simply won't die, you can have all the 3 cat. of Lexus FR but by the Toyota name, for me that may even be a clue for adding another FR cat. internationally aka "Century*

Small = Mark returns with Mazda i6
Med / Executive = Crown
Large / Full = either went to Toyota with the same name LS or be given the original name Celsior
Then the Century

And for Lexus brand itself maybe they will make it electric, maybe they will turn it Porsche/A.Martin/Ferrari performance brand

We can say that they simply realized there own mistake of giving the newly born Lexus all the R&D and left the mother Toyota with a lot of issues especially fit and finish and bad building quality all that glorified with the end of the previous decade and the need to recall over 15 million vehicle world wide

I can say that Toyota is somehow safe and Lexus won't be washed up with the likes of ES / CT / HS and the likes of UX / NX / RX

Leaving them to Toyota from the beginning maybe the most accurate decision if they take it before and in time but they are late and they know it
 

mikeavelli

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Genesis is aimed at Germans, hence the pricing.

Since brand awareness and number of dealers is small, maybe that is better way for them to grow. Their un-willingless to build brand and dealers is interesting, they cant be happy with 1500 sales per month for 3 vehicles.

I know Genesis internally. Thanks tho.
 

bogglo

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For now it they are. But also remember they are competing with old lexus platforms and they are barely outperforming them. So what happens when Lexus starts releasing their all new models??
 

spwolf

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For now it they are. But also remember they are competing with old lexus platforms and they are barely outperforming them. So what happens when Lexus starts releasing their all new models??

who is outperforming what? Lexus sells more vehicles in a month than Genesis in a year.
 

bogglo

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hahahaha. I'm talking about the actual car performance not sale performance
 

super51fan

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The Stinger just got an updated 4 cylinder engine for 2021, so I don't think the Koreans will keep putting older engines in this segment against the Germans.

Not to mention the G70 outperforms the IS, G80 outperforms the outgoing GS, and the G90 outperforms (in terms of number of cylinders which is important in this demographic) the LS.

It is laughable to think Lexus outperforms Genesis in literal anything besides long term reliability which is unknown at this point for Genesis.
 

ssun30

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What's also laughable is stating the G90 is superior to the LS based on one criterion alone. The 5LS is a considerably more luxurious vehicle. You just need to sit in both for one minute and you will tell.

The G70 is superior to IS, yes. The G80 is superior to the GS, yes. But G90 vs. LS? I wouldn't give Genesis too much praise there. That is a weak point to make. And having a V8 at bargain prices certainly isn't helping Genesis as much as people think.
 

maiaramdan

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Honestly I will still pick a GS-F or RC-F over the G80 & G70 respectively
Dare I say that I will pick the newly refreshed IS over the newly refreshed G70!
 

super51fan

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What's also laughable is stating the G90 is superior to the LS based on one criterion alone. The 5LS is a considerably more luxurious vehicle. You just need to sit in both for one minute and you will tell.

The G70 is superior to IS, yes. The G80 is superior to the GS, yes. But G90 vs. LS? I wouldn't give Genesis too much praise there. That is a weak point to make. And having a V8 at bargain prices certainly isn't helping Genesis as much as people think.

Id be inclined to agree if the 5LS were selling well.

As for interior, I would say that is a weak point for the LS, but not in material quality. I believe it is too visually stimulating, although it is beautiful, it does not have the simplistic luxury of the G90 or the LS of old.
 
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What's also laughable is stating the G90 is superior to the LS based on one criterion alone. The 5LS is a considerably more luxurious vehicle. You just need to sit in both for one minute and you will tell.

The G70 is superior to IS, yes. The G80 is superior to the GS, yes. But G90 vs. LS? I wouldn't give Genesis too much praise there. That is a weak point to make. And having a V8 at bargain prices certainly isn't helping Genesis as much as people think.
Sorry, but I don't agree with this at all. The LS has some enormous weaknesses compared to the G90, that are inexcusable for the segment of vehicle that it's in, and no doubt some big reasons why it's selling so poorly. The LS has a much smaller and cramped cabin, a harsher ride, and as others have mentioned- no V8. I'm not even going to touch on the infotainment front because that has never been Lexus's strong suit.

What the LS does better is having sportier driving dynamics, slightly better fuel economy (albeit not much faster than the G90 in either of its engine trims), and of course a far more flashy design in-and-out. Unfortunately, none of these are characteristics that appeal to the traditional LS buyer, and certainly aren't class-leading in the LS compared to the Germans. It no longer even has the value proposition over the Germans as it once did. So the LS is now stuck in no-man's land.

Genesis isn't sitting around twiddling its thumbs waiting for Lexus either, they have a brand new G90 in the horizon. And it still has a V8.


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Gecko

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In some ways, Hyundai "out-LS'ed" the LS with the G90: It's more traditional, comfortable, has a smooth V8, is relatively no thrills and serves old school luxury.

This happened just as Lexus changed their core strategy with the 5LS: coupe-like fastback shape, one (large) wheelbase, a more intimate cockpit with less interior room, sportier chassis, turbo V6 and a different attitude.

Kind of funny how Lexus vacated the "traditional luxury flagship" space almost seamlessly as Genesis entered it.
 

maiaramdan

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Honestly those whom keep saying that the ditched V8 is the LS weakness, what they will say about the new generation S class as they are ditching the V8 also except in the Maybach and AMG top trim !