Lexus Has Cancelled the GS Sedan

[Gecko]

Now that we have seen the new LS, I'm not sure how Lexus can discontinue the GS.

The new LS is so highly elevated over what we had before - one car, even longer and larger than the last LS - that the hole between an ES and LS would be absolutely ridiculous.

In addition, there are going to be a number of former LS SWB buyers who will be somewhat displaced by the new car, and they may not be keen on stepping back into an ES.

GS, I feel, has to stick around to occupy the ground under this new LS.

 

[meth.ix]

Yes, the GS now has more room to get much bigger, and also more luxurious. Soon, I hope it will take the crown of its segment like I know the LS will.

 

[James]

I took in my NX today and asked the service guy if they are excited for the LS? He mentioned that it looks great and they can't wait for the new LS to come. I said I know sedan sales have been down but it will be welcome to see this new LS. He said yeah sales have been down and at one point they were considered taking out the GS from the lineup but he made it sound like that has changed and the GS will be coming back to fit under this new long LS. Let's be honest with how long the LS is they need a GS now more than ever. Hopefully they bring it back...

 

[White Bear]

Now that we have seen the new LS, I'm not sure how Lexus can discontinue the GS.

The new LS is so highly elevated over what we had before - one car, even longer and larger than the last LS - that the hole between an ES and LS would be absolutely ridiculous.

In addition, there are going to be a number of former LS SWB buyers who will be somewhat displaced by the new car, and they may not be keen on stepping back into an ES.

GS, I feel, has to stick around to occupy the ground under this new LS.

I agree. But I wonder if they would ever consider a SWB LS if they ditched the GS? I don't think that's a good idea but I'm throwing it out there.

Or, as someone else suggested, a 4-door coupe version like an A7--an "LSC"? (Does Lincoln own that name?)

 

[Gecko]

I agree. But I wonder if they would ever consider a SWB LS if they ditched the GS? I don't think that's a good idea but I'm throwing it out there.

Or, as someone else suggested, a 4-door coupe version like an A7--an "LSC"? (Does Lincoln own that name?)

It would almost make more sense to me to just keep the GS and allow the LS to be at the top of the pecking order as the undisputed flagship (no smaller models offered). With GA-L, I have to think that the engineering of different models on the same platform is much easier. If a smaller LS is the GS, and a smaller GS is the IS, then why not just keep all three?! Haha.

 

[Carmaker1]

My problem isn't so much that they truly might discontinue it, but moreover that they have no choice but to delay it if they haven't committed to many crucial stages for development.

For a vehicle due in 2018, it is required to be signed-off by now. If this was a redesigned Yaris, they could get away with having cold feet this late. A RWD luxury mid-size product with sporting pretensions, would need to be in the prototyping stage at this point. If the new Camry design was a done deal in mid-2015 and the basic design was finished a few months before the 2015MY facelift appeared at 2014 NYIAS, a GS would take just as long, if not longer.

I would hate for this being delayed, to result in the GS not getting redesigned until late 2019/early 2020 and then by extension, a new IS not arriving until 2021, which is 4 years from now.

The LS at this point is not really going to be on the roads of this earth, as a customer-owned car in 2017. The Superbowl ad highlighted "Early 2018" in the disclaimer, while LC said May 2017. What is really going on, as Mag-X supposed report may not be fully accurate, based on their tidbit regarding cancellation of the S-FR. That is already going to be revealed in the coming months.

Let's see what happens.

 

[White Beach]

Here it is, the page from Mag-X:

View attachment 2029

Any translation would be appreciated -- I can also post it up at a higher resolution if necessary.

EDIT: I now realize the full page spread was unnecessary. Here is just the GS page:

View attachment 2030

Sorry for being late but here is the (mostly) direct translation of the Mag-X on the “development freeze” of the next gen GS. ( ) is my addition.

“In the summer of 2015, Toyota decided to suspend the development of the S-FR which had been in development as a cheaper version of the 86. Although the concept model of the S-FR was displayed at the Tokyo Motor Show (in October) because the exhibition of which was decided well before the development discontinuance, it must have been tough for the Toyota engineers to see the vehicle on stage whose development had actually been stopped. But the project of the S-FR was rearranged and now TMC plans to restart the development of the S-FR targeting the launch in around 2020, once they successfully enter the WRC (World Rally Championship) with the S-FR.

And this time again we have the news about the development freeze of the vehicle of TMC. Our scoop department found out that TMC decided to suspend the development of the next generation Lexus GS.

Lexus will soon be launching the new generation common rear wheel drive platform (GA-L) to the market with the LC, and considering that this new platform will be shared with other forthcoming rear wheel drive vehicles, which TMC hopes will save the R&D cost of future products, canceling the introduction of the GS rear wheel drive sedan is not a good idea for TMC because it will slow the pace of depreciation (of the development cost of GA-L?). But after the close consideration/examination of its image and positioning in the lineup, TMC came to a conclusion that the GS doesn’t/won’t play a desired role in the lineup.

In fact, it is the next generation LS that caused TMC to make this decision. As we have reported, next gen LS has its engine down-sized; the V8 engine to the V6 engine. This means that both the LS and the GS have V6 engine, which causes product overlap in the Lexus’ own lineup. So TMC decided to kick the GS out of the lineup and to fulfill the demand of the customer looking for a large sedan with the LS alone.

When turning to the whole Lexus lineup, all new UX crossover is waiting its debut, so it is possible that they are now sorting out its lineup (in order to concentrate its resources on the new model). We also hear the rumor that TMS is trying to figure out whether it is possible to produce another all new model in exchange for the GS, so there is some chance that they will bring the new vehicle which has a completely new approach/concept.

The next generation GS were planned to debut in 2018, so at least Lexus won’t drop the existing model until 2018. It’s possible that Lexus will extend its model cycle, but it is now unlikely that we will see the next generation GS.”

 

[White Beach]

And my thoughts on this article.

The LS and the GS overlap with each other????? just because they both have the V6?????

If TMC really thinks so, I have to say it is TOTALLY stupid. The LS and the GS each has its own distinctive character, price range is HUGELY different, and their customer base is also very different IMAO.

 

[James]

I have to agree with White Beach. I mean the A6 A8 and 5 and 7 series live next to each other just fine. I mean rt now we have an IS at 50k max really and then the new LS which will start at what 80k maybe even more? I know car sales are eh rt now but that's a large gap. If they do the IS needs to grow a good amount.

 

[krew]

Sorry for being late but here is the (mostly) direct translation of the Mag-X on the “development freeze” of the next gen GS. ( ) is my addition.

Thank you so much for the translation! I've been reluctant to post this story without detail, and now I have all I need. Much appreciated.

The LS and the GS overlap with each other????? just because they both have the V6?????

If TMC really thinks so, I have to say it is TOTALLY stupid. The LS and the GS each has its own distinctive character, price range is HUGELY different, and their customer base is also very different IMAO.

Cancelling the GS would be an incredibly bad move. Can't even believe Lexus would contemplate this again.

 

[meth.ix]

And my thoughts on this article.

The LS and the GS overlap with each other????? just because they both have the V6?????

If TMC really thinks so, I have to say it is TOTALLY stupid. The LS and the GS each has its own distinctive character, price range is HUGELY different, and their customer base is also very different IMAO.

Exactly, people are not going to cross-shop the LS and GS just because they both have V6s. They are still totally different cars in totally different segments.

 

[Dean Denlay]

Hi all, looking for some additional info regarding the rumored redesign for the GS. I currently own a 2015 GS 350 F Sport and love it. End this year I plan to upgrade to the latest and greatest.

In addition im tossing around the idea of the new BMW M550i. I really want to stay with Lexus but am looking for some information - thanks in advance to all for any info you may have!

 

[krew]

Hi all, looking for some additional info regarding the rumored redesign for the GS. I currently own a 2015 GS 350 F Sport and love it. End this year I plan to upgrade to the latest and greatest.

In addition im tossing around the idea of the new BMW M550i. I really want to stay with Lexus but am looking for some information - thanks in advance to all for any info you may have!

I wouldn't expect a new GS this year, regardless of this rumor of its cancellation. This year is all LS/LC.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news!

 

[James]

Hi all, looking for some additional info regarding the rumored redesign for the GS. I currently own a 2015 GS 350 F Sport and love it. End this year I plan to upgrade to the latest and greatest.

In addition im tossing around the idea of the new BMW M550i. I really want to stay with Lexus but am looking for some information - thanks in advance to all for any info you may have!

If I were you (and could afford it) pony up for the new LS! You'd be one of the first people to have it and it's quicker than get and looks great! Just my 2 cents!

 

[Dean Denlay]

I wouldn't expect a new GS this year, regardless of this rumor of its cancellation. This year is all LS/LC.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news!

Thanks for the update, may look into the GSF or the new LS

 

[Dean Denlay]

If I were you (and could afford it) pony up for the new LS! You'd be one of the first people to have it and it's quicker than get and looks great! Just my 2 cents!

Not a bad idea... they're gonna be pricey I expect?

 

[James]

Not a bad idea... they're gonna be pricey I expect?

That's a great question. Maybe some of our higher up Lexus people on this site have a better idea but 80-85k base? Six figures fully loaded for sure.

 

[Dean Denlay]

Dang, that's a bit outside of my price range

 

[James]

New GSF fully loaded is 85k you could prolly get a used one a year old for 70ish that's a hell of a car!

 

[Carmaker1]

Sorry for being late but here is the (mostly) direct translation of the Mag-X on the “development freeze” of the next gen GS. ( ) is my addition.

“In the summer of 2015, Toyota decided to suspend the development of the S-FR which had been in development as a cheaper version of the 86. Although the concept model of the S-FR was displayed at the Tokyo Motor Show (in October) because the exhibition of which was decided well before the development discontinuance, it must have been tough for the Toyota engineers to see the vehicle on stage whose development had actually been stopped. But the project of the S-FR was rearranged and now TMC plans to restart the development of the S-FR targeting the launch in around 2020, once they successfully enter the WRC (World Rally Championship) with the S-FR.

And this time again we have the news about the development freeze of the vehicle of TMC. Our scoop department found out that TMC decided to suspend the development of the next generation Lexus GS.

Lexus will soon be launching the new generation common rear wheel drive platform (GA-L) to the market with the LC, and considering that this new platform will be shared with other forthcoming rear wheel drive vehicles, which TMC hopes will save the R&D cost of future products, canceling the introduction of the GS rear wheel drive sedan is not a good idea for TMC because it will slow the pace of depreciation (of the development cost of GA-L?). But after the close consideration/examination of its image and positioning in the lineup, TMC came to a conclusion that the GS doesn’t/won’t play a desired role in the lineup.

In fact, it is the next generation LS that caused TMC to make this decision. As we have reported, next gen LS has its engine down-sized; the V8 engine to the V6 engine. This means that both the LS and the GS have V6 engine, which causes product overlap in the Lexus’ own lineup. So TMC decided to kick the GS out of the lineup and to fulfill the demand of the customer looking for a large sedan with the LS alone.

When turning to the whole Lexus lineup, all new UX crossover is waiting its debut, so it is possible that they are now sorting out its lineup (in order to concentrate its resources on the new model). We also hear the rumor that TMS is trying to figure out whether it is possible to produce another all new model in exchange for the GS, so there is some chance that they will bring the new vehicle which has a completely new approach/concept.

The next generation GS were planned to debut in 2018, so at least Lexus won’t drop the existing model until 2018. It’s possible that Lexus will extend its model cycle, but it is now unlikely that we will see the next generation GS.”

Thank you for fully translating that, as it proved to be too much work for me. It's very clear to me now, that the source has good credibility, but I am still wary of projected release date for the S-FR. The resurrected Supra is coming out in the first half of 2018, but as I knew it for a long time, would appear at Tokyo.

The design for that car was reported by Toyota personnel to have been frozen about 2 years ago, after the production styling was approved about 8 months after the NAIAS 2014 FT-1 showing. Too many Toyota products are taking way too long to arrive to market, but usually Toyota has these kinds of extended development eras.

Anyway, nothing is truly official unless Toyota says so. I would like to see what Toyota can deliver for the upper-middle class and not just bailout on it so easily. GS sales are only suffering in relation to outdated power trains, likely not motivating to upgrade their cars, unfavourable leasing rates, a sliver of styling repulsed consumers, and backstabbing sales personnel that prod customers in the direction of the ES.

Too many of those sales personnel fail to highlight the advantages of the GS over the ES and only care about an easy sale. If Lexus USA and Canada do not zero in on this sales problem, then redesigning this product may not be worthwhile, unless they want to market its replacement as an A7 or CLS competitor.

I believe that GA-L was primarily developed for the LS from the beginning, but due to the reuse of the 2UR-GSE powertrain and being pushed forward for aspirational reasons, the LC launched ahead of the new LS. If the LC500 was launched with the TTV6, then it wouldn't arrive until well into the 2018 model year. The 5LS would've been a 2017 model, if not for the turbo V6. GA-L only withheld it until late 2016, but the V6 pushed it back even further.