Rumor: Is Lexus Planning to Cancel the GS Sedan?

Discussion in 'Lexus Lounge' started by Carmaker1, May 1, 2016.

  1. Carmaker1
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    I found this from a Japanese source while on my trip the other day. It regards the next generation GS, which I suspect is undergoing final design completion at technical centres.

    Since it is moving to GA-L, I expect Toyota doesn't want to waste any time, so a late 2018 SOP date and showroom launch no later than early 2019.

    Will Lexus keep the tradition of letting the GS set new design language for the brand or will LC and LS take over that role?


    レクサス新型 GS F FR用TNGA技術を採用 3.0リッターV6ターボ搭載し2018年フルモデルチェンジ


    次期レクサスGSシリーズにFRプラットフォームベースのTNGA技術が採用され2018年にフルモデルチェンジ。「GS F」は2015年11月デビューの5.0リッターV型8気筒エンジンから、次期2018年型には新開発の3.0リッターV型6気筒ツインターボエンジン(最高出力400ps以上)の搭載が予定されている。
    2018-gs-002.jpg
    Full model change in 2018 FR platform-based TNGA technology is adopted in the next Lexus GS series.From &GS F& 2015 of November debut 5.0-liter V-8-cylinder engine, the 2018 model year next are scheduled to be equipped with the newly developed 3.0-liter V-type 6-cylinder twin-turbo engine (more than the maximum output 400ps) there.

    低重心で軽量化及び高剛性のプラットフォームを採用することで、更に運動性の良いスポーツ・カーに仕上がる。
    2018-gs-003.jpg
    By adopting a lightweight and highly rigid platform with a low center of gravity, finished a further exercise of good sports car.

    新型FR用プラットフォームはレクサスLC(ラグジュアリークーペ)から採用されGSにも使われる。
    2018-gs-005.jpg
    The new FR platform is also used in the GS is adopted from the Lexus LC (luxury coupe).

    GS F 搭載予定の新しいエンジンは開発呼称943F。3.0リッターV型6気筒ながら最高出力は400ps以上、最大トルクは45.0kgf.m前後と予想されている。V8エンジンに代わるダウンサイジングエンジンは来年発売される次期LSシリーズにも採用予定。
    L20 TTV6 Specs.jpg
    The new engine development designation 943F of the GS F equipped scheduled.3.0 liter V-6 with maximum output of 400ps above, the maximum torque is expected to longitudinal 45.0kgf.m.

    Down-sizing engine that replaces the V8 engine is adopted will also be available on the next LS series to be released next year.



    As you can see, they keep referring to a new LS in 2017. They know more than anyone else. I do however, doubt that the GS-F 2UR-GSE V8 will replaced by an engine putting out only 400 PS.

    That only matches the new E43 AMG at 396 PS.

    Maybe this is strictly the 2GR-FSE replacement TTV6. To be honest they renderings may not be accurate, but at least it is something.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2016
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  2. mikeavelli
    mikeavelli Staff Member Moderator
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    That front end looks amazing to me...hopefully finally with the power to match the super aggressive looks. Thank you for this info!
     
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  3. Gecko
    Gecko Staff Member Administrator
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    Agree with mike. That front end is insane... and I absolutely love it. 395hp TT V6 sounds about right too, and I assume it might be mated to the new 10AT?

    Next gen F V8 is supposed to be twin turbo and 600+ hp, so I assume that the engine above would be a mid grade option.

    Very promising.
     
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  4. CIF
    CIF Premium Member
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    Thank you for the scoop, information like this is getting very hard to come by these days, so much appreciated Carmaker1!

    Not really feeling the front end personally, I both like it and hate it at the same time. Even for a GS F, I don't think it fits. I think all the black cladding looks very out of place and tacky. That rendering just looks too overdone in my opinion.

    I also doubt that engine will be used for the GS F.

    Also what's truly incredible is we have more details now on the next-gen GS technically, than we do on the next LS, even though the LS is coming sooner. Bizarre.
     
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  5. Carmaker1
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    Likely with the 10 speed, but only if it is ready to be mated to the 10 speed automatic like the 2UR-GSE. This engine sounds like it is the GS300 and GS350 replacement.

    The TTV8 is likely being saved for last. What will replace for 2UR-GSE for the 2019-2020 model year in the LC and LS is my question. Still a downsized, but single turbo 4.0L V8 putting out 480-500?

    Then maybe the F variants get a twin turbo V8 w/600?

    I have to wonder why that particular rendering was made though? Someone internally leaking hints already, but maybe too early to be concrete.

    Anything is something right now.

    You're welcome! It is quite early to even be talking about a next generation GS-F, but not really a GS300t F-Sport.

    I do feel that design is too overly aggressive at the front, with an uninspired side profile (well it's a rendering). The same issue the current model has. At this point some items might be leaking out, based on internal design proposals.

    This could be an overdone version of a losing proposal, that the chosen one might even be different and tame.

    I agree about how shocking it is one is hearing about the 2019 GS already, yet not much about the LS. Reading Tokuo Fukuichi's and Akio Toyoda's body language during each of their LF-FC presentations they were unusually stern and business as usual.

    Toyoda's mood greatly changed at NAIAS, once he changed subject to the LC500. You can see how particular they are about silence regarding it.

    There is LS news out there, but you really have to be really good with Japanese search engines to come across tidbits. I don't post some things, as there is no visual illustration and too muddled.
     
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  6. Gecko
    Gecko Staff Member Administrator
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    I think you are right...

    I was told a while ago that going forward, Lexus will favor a comprehensive rollout at a new model change/introduction - meaning that all model options will at least be revealed within a few months of each other. This is unlike the 2IS where we got IS F two years after the 250/350, and 4GS when we got GS F three years after 350/450h. What we should expect is something more like RC where RC 300h, RC 350 and RC F were all revealed much more closely together (albeit 200t came a year later).

    If that is so, I think we could see...

    2018 LC 500/LC 500h
    2019 LC F

    2018 LS 500/LS 500h/ LS 300t (maybe)
    2019 LS F

    2019 GS 200t/GS 300t/ GS hybrid
    2020 GS F

    That seems like a lot of product launching at the same time based on hypothetical model years, but as you always note, production model years and "on sale" dates rarely align, so Lexus could stagger any of those over nearly 24 months.

    I do indeed hope that a timeline this this happens, instead of waiting 2-3 years for F models.
     
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  7. meth.ix
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    400hp is good for a GS F Sport, but definitely not GS F. By GS F sport, I mean an E43 competitor.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2016
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  8. krew
    krew Administrator
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  9. LexusTechSA
    LexusTechSA Founding Member
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    WOW .
     
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  10. Adrian de Leon
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    This would be good as a GS 350 replacement and a good engine for the F-Sport. But that face! It looks menacing, I love it!
     
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  11. isanatori
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    The 2UR-GSE V8 while shockingly passed all the emission regulations, that all other automakers simply could not, was criticised by the journalists as old tech and gas guzzler. Maybe now, Toyota will give journalists what they want. But new engines will comply with higher emission standards, therefore will lose 20 percent of max hp power. Considering GS200t weight on par with GS350 I bet that weight will remain the same in this case too and maybe even Lexus will add more luxury equipment(more sound deadening material etc. Maybe Next -F will have slower pace performance than current -F, which would be ok as a result, considering the new environmental chalenges.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2016
  12. meth.ix
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    GS F cannot afford to be slower with all the competition having sub 4 second 0-60 times.
     
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  13. DDas
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    I may be one of the few that does not care for that front end...the shape of the grille looks good, the side vents look good, but those headlights and those blue things in the grille do not work for me. If the blue was blacked out in the grille, it would look good. If the headlights weren't so skinny with an overbearing checkmark DRL, then it would be perfect.
     
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  14. Travis
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    Looks insane
     
  15. Tinhinnh
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    I dont care what anybody says, that face is wicked wicked :)
     
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  16. krew
    krew Administrator
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    Oh I completely agree with you -- it's way overdone. But squinting at it, trying to picture a version that would actually reach production, and I would be very impressed.
     
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  17. isanatori
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    Motortrend questioned Yukihiko Yaguchi san, when he gave life to his second -F child.
    What car did you benchmark?

    Yaguchi: No benchmark. I don’t care about the competitors. I want to create what I want, which is a really high-performance car offering driving pleasure to anybody, even regular drivers.

    If this article/rumour is to be believed, then
    1. All true -F lovers with sadness realise that Lexus will have to ditch a core element of -F cars (the NA V8 engine with its -F sound note) in favour of Non-NA V6 with their comical-tragedy engine sound notes.
    2. But what makes them happy by looking that next -F engine will also output 20 % less power, is that Lexus take this direction, not because Yaguchi san changed his mind about -F cars, but because Lexus could not surpass emission standards.

    Now do you understand why your comment logic is absolutely irritating, frustrating and under certain circumstances a trolling behaviour for the true fans of the -F cars? Your thinking shows that, you are totally ignoring the creator's words about the -F cars. But I also think that most people here tend to ignore Yaguchi san words too, which is really dissapointing. A sign of disrespect. I don't want to blame people who think that way, since I want to believe that you are falling into the usual journalists trap. Therefore automakers invest on buyers snobbism and arrogance, who don't really care about obtaining that high level of track performance driving enjoyment advertised by the journalists, but rather for social reasons ( e.g talking about their cars at cafe's while reading on the magazines how fast is their car 0-60, or think they can find a sex partner by advertising their gun on wheels, when otherwise an impossible task).

    Thankfully Lexus way of thinking on its F cars, allows owners to challenge their limits and make them better drivers on daily public road conditions by providing very easy drivability even on rainy or icy roads, without scaring drivers and staying always in a safety net. An approach far away from the usual marketing/cheating business and such kind of people.
     
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  18. meth.ix
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    I honestly would have thought that was a rendering of the LC F
     
  19. mikeavelli
    mikeavelli Staff Member Moderator
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    Wanted to bump this to keep it relevant with the new engines coming and the new LS coming...the next GS will have a bigger role to fill next generation..
     
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  20. meth.ix
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    quite literally...