The LS is hard to move because it wasnt the home run it needed to be, and then Lexus released an ES which looks very close to the LS and has more rear leg room (I think the LS refresh tries to address this).The real question would be if the 5th gen would have launched would it sell in generous numbers over its current gen. The ES is pretty stout, while the LS is pretty hard to move.
I feel like they actually turned a low-volume Lexus into a low-volume Toyota, with apologies to @krew. And they should've at least made it available as a Lexus, a GS-FC or whatever. They've had no problem with the self-driving LS being identified as the best and brightest of Toyota, so why be different with the Mirai?The real question would be if the 5th gen would have launched would it sell in generous numbers over its current gen. The ES is pretty stout, while the LS is pretty hard to move.
Yes. My fear is that if Toyota internalized that message it would mutate into "all Lexus vehicles need to be reworked as rebadges". One thing that's currently positive is that we haven't seen Lexus go rebadge crazy; if the LX is indeed replaced with the LF-1 that will actually eliminate one rebadge. (I count the NX and UX as more or less replacing the HS and CT, so the rebadge count stays constant with them).Toyota needs to stop viewing Lexus as a standalone thing. The idea that you don't want to meaningfully subsidize or fund development of your core image defining luxury lifestyle brand with your gargantuan mass market offerings is crazy, like, what're you even doing?
I haven't had any of that experience with my local dealers. Both have the same services at the same level they've always had, loaners haven't been a problem, and as I've mentioned before they converted a new RX off the sales lot into a loaner for me when I came in without an appointment. I do feel that Lexus US needs to put more pressure on dealers to make the experience consistent and awesome though, because I know all dealers aren't as good as mine.And to be honest, and this may come off sounding a bit elitist so I'll apologize, but nowadays when I deal with the dealership, I am stuck in the middle of an ocean of UX/NX/base model owners (no offense to you, they are great options for buyers in that market). I have also noticed that the local dealers have cut back on services at the same time. The extras either aren't there, or they don't have anyone staffing them (e.g. look at the fancy massage center. Oh whoops noone is there. Oh nice a coffee bar. Oh let me sit here for 15 minutes before realizing I would need to go to the concierge to ask for someone to make one for me. Sorry, the golf simulator broke in 2018 and we haven't bothered to fix or remove it.)
Getting loaners has also gotten more difficult, and finding sales reps that are knowledgeable and excited has become way harder as everyone seems focused on conning young people and families into crazy financing schemes to get them into entry level vehicles.
I've read similar stories of M-B salespeople tired of dealing with GLA customers and BMW salespeople jaded about the X1, so I do think there's something to the idea that auto loan debt and longer term financing are driving the march downward for luxury brands.The guys I used to buy from have all moved on to sell other brands. I literally had floor salesmen so jaded that they would straight up tell me "f*** the [insert Lexus model here], go check out XYZ", and bam within a few months they had left for elsewhere. I have never in my life see a BMW or Benz salesperson make that sort of comment. They always had something in the lineup that excited somebody about the brand, even if they only ended up buying a lesser or different class of vehicle from the same brand.
I have to wonder if this is a side effect if growing inequality combined with auto loan debt and longer terms of new car financings.
That unverified information was from Jonny Lieberman in the post about the cancellation of the Land Cruiser. While it seems that many from Toyota moved from California to Texas, how many in the Lexus division stayed behind and perhaps went to other companies like the Koreans? Toyota VP and Lexus alum Brian Smith retired from the company, and is now COO at Hyundai.The reason I brought up the sales numbers, was I remember reading that Lexus as a whole has not turned a profit in many years (again this was not direct from Lexus Corp but rather unverified information). So if the path to profitability or long term sustainability is of utmost concern, decisions to cancel lines and make decision through the numbers will end up with various model lines being lost.
GS, GX seem the beasts to take that first cut.
Lexus you better bring that above rendering as next gen Lexus GS. Stop killing your brand and losing your customers to the competitors.I hope my emoji doesn't hurt your post, but this explains my frustration with product planners at Lexus and likely executive management. Anything not an easy to develop FWD vehicle or Akio's sports car vision, is backburnered or cancelled. Hell, where are the all wheel drive GA-K sedans? They definitely have to be coming as I don't see what would prevent them.
He couldn't cancel the LS because it is the flagship and starter of the brand. I don't see how this benefits them with the lower volume Mirai, using a Lexus. All of a sudden, this March 2016 rendering makes sense. This was the final design for the next gen GS and possibly an early look at future Lexus models. I wonder if the LS+ used this design because the GS would no longer have it? Argh!!
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What gets me, is that this rendering was done in the early months of 2016 when no one had a lick of an idea what was going on, except those with likely Lexus leaking out details of the Next Generation design.
It was so easy for anyone else to write off this rendering as nothing, but my information came from the same source as the Camry rendering, which was very accurate (outside of T-shaped upper grille). The same artist responsible for this Kodansha rendering in December 2015, saw Camry clay buck itself or CAD drawing for sure. Meaning the GS-F rendering was accurate and we just will never see it.
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Actual XV70 Camry
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They have spent the last 36 months reworking this car into the Mirai. I am so disappointed in this brand for the first time ever, not just annoyed, because their failure to execute the GS facelift properly is what resulted in abysmal 2016 sales.
The decision in the fall of 2016 to indefinitely halt the GS program, after they had already settled on a final design, judging by the date of launch targeted and some supplier information (JDM) was definitely influenced a large degree by active sales performance.
By October 2016, the 240/241B 2019 ES design was frozen and already being shown to Lexus personnel. The idea was to elevate the ES but I don't think it was ever engineered to replace the GS. Anything development wise post late 2016 for the ES, only marginally could have countered Lexus 300B cancellation.
I want a Lexus BEV Will. I'm too frugal to pay for premium gasoline here in Toronto, Canada , and it's likely even cheaper here than in Portugal (where I think you live).I’m looking for a Toyota/Lexus as well but... Craming my family in a RC F (5.0V8) doesn’t sound bad at all