New 2020 Prius PHEV/Prius Prime

flexus

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2020_Toyota_Prius_PRIME_Whats_New_B7EFA2F4DC28E4784D226974194D1C8203B09978.jpg PLANO, Texas (May 2, 2019) – Toyota Prius Prime gets many upgrades for 2020 and remains the most efficient Toyota hybrid and one of the best options to protect drivers from price hikes at the gas pump. Available this summer, the Manufacturer’s Suggested Retail Price (MSRP) for the LE grade will be $27,600, the MSRP for XLE grade will be $29,500 and the MSRP for Limited grade will be $33,500.
New upgrades for 2020 include:
  • New 5th seat for even more room
  • Standard Apple CarPlay®, SiriusXM® and Amazon Alexa compatibility
  • Two additional 2.1A USB ports for the rear passengers
  • Black interior accents to replace previous white accents for a more premium feel
  • A new sun visor extender
  • A relocation of seat heater buttons for front seat passengers for easier usability
  • New grade strategy that offers LE, XLE and Limited Grades
https://pressroom.toyota.com/releases/2020+toyota+prius+prime+solution+rising+gas+prices.htm
 

ssun30

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So they didn't bother updating the battery pack after all.

A new round of reviews of the ChDM Corolla/Levin PHV came in. Most reviewers get 55-60km compared to 55km official declared range, and 4.2-4.6L/100km fuel economy (compared to 4.3L/100km). The bump from 8.8 kWh (6.5 kWh avaialble) to 10.5 kWh (8.0 kWh available) is really needed for USDM, where most of the complains around the Prime is the lack of range (besides having only four seats).
 

Will1991

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I agree with you @ssun30, everything they add makes sense but for a facelift... It’s very little...

An upgraded battery pack would be the best thing, but it’s the first facelift from Toyota without any bumper renewal.
 

flexus

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Japanese PHEVs are getting a significant increase in range. Ministry of land and transportation is mandating better electric "fuel economy". Too low range won't be counted as one PHEV/EV when calculating share by fuel. Also, Japan is getting stricter CO2 hurdles than the EU.
 

Will1991

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@flexus, do you know how much range does it need? What's the specification type Japan is looking for?
 

flexus

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@flexus, do you know how much range does it need? What's the specification type Japan is looking for?
For 2020 target is 3.9l/100km as industrial average which translates to 91g of CO2/km. Note that this is in WLTC not NEDC. Japan achieved emission target for 2020 in 2016 so this could become tighter. PHEV and EV are measured by Well to Wheel system but its not public yet. I think it is connected with motor efficiency and how much does PHEV use petrol engine in real life. FCVs are outside of any regulations.
 

Will1991

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Sad but true... It does seems Toyota loosed all the steam...

Specially when you see there were a second-get PHEV prototype that never got to the market, and even by the 3rd gen they made something only later in the model life...

Only now, by the 4th-gen Prius they sell a proper PHEV, and it's only one PHEV!

Also, the more you think about it, Toyota did made a RAV4 EV, and they latter in life had a Toyota iQ BEV which can't be all that bad considering they sold the project to a chinese company this year...

(I meant this RAV4, not the one from Tesla):


But somehow, hydrogen still is the future... It was the future in 1992 when they started to work on FCEV's...

According to Toyota hydrogen was the future in 1996:


It was the future in 2001:


It was the future in 2003:


It was the future in 2010:


It was the future in 2011:


It was the future in 2013:


And, somehow, it still is the future today (Besides California and Norway, where are the hydrogen filling stations?)! I really love Toyota but c'mon, it can be really stubborn!!!

Meanwhile, mainstream BEV's technology wen't from 24kWh to 60kWh without any enormous price difference (see Nissan Leaf) more than tripling driving range in less than 10 years! Not to mention Tesla's technology which is clearly ahead of everything...

Toyota leapfrogged everyone with Hybrid technology and Tesla is doing the same to BEV technology.... I do agree, FCEV's will improve, but BEV's will not stay still...

And worst of all, Toyota's executives until very recently keep saying they just doesn't have a BEV because they don't see the market (But they clearly see it for FCEV's....) as they have publicly said having all the know-how to build one... It's really frustrating...
 

ssun30

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Meanwhile, mainstream BEV's technology wen't from 24kWh to 60kWh without any enormous price difference (see Nissan Leaf) more than tripling driving range in less than 10 years! Not to mention Tesla's technology which is clearly ahead of everything...

Toyota leapfrogged everyone with Hybrid technology and Tesla is doing the same to BEV technology.... I do agree, FCEV's will improve, but BEV's will not stay still...

And worst of all, Toyota's executives until very recently keep saying they just doesn't have a BEV because they don't see the market (But they clearly see it for FCEV's....) as they have publicly said having all the know-how to build one... It's really frustrating...
These are all outdated information I think I've pointed this out multiple times that they've moved away from a FCV-only strategy to both routes in 2017. And they have clearly adjusted their strategy to switch FCs to commercial vehicles, which is the right thing to do. The last time they said they don't want BEV because of demand was 2017. And lots of things could happen in two years.

please read some news

The reason they don't have a BEV today is very simple: it's unprofitable and risky. They want to start from the ground up to have a secure supply chain and stable technology before wasting resources on a hype project and run into a production hell. All it takes is a REE embargo by China to destroy half of the world's BEV market.

To understand why they want FCV you have to think about Japan's energy policy. I don't know where you come from but I hope you realize that different countries are different. Not every nation has an infinite source of electric energy like Norway or USA. Both Japan and Korea poured huge amounts of resources into hydrogen economy because of methane clathrate in the Sea of Japan. And if you are reading the news you know nuclear power is not an option in these two countries; and nuclear is the key to a BEV economy in the short term (forget renewables, they are still long way from being competitive and are not as clean as nuclear). Even China, which has by far the largest BEV market in the world, is jumping into the hydrogen economy bandwagon because of clathrates. All these three East Asian nations want self-sufficiency in energy supply and I won't go into further geopolitics here.

"The Fall of the Prius" is just a simple result of the proliferation of hybrid technology. There is zero reason to buy a Prius when a cheaper Corolla hybrid is better in every way except one MPG or two.

I agree that I will be very disappointed if the next-gen Prius was still a traditional hybrid. The PHV should be the base version with an optional BEV version.
 
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flexus

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And, somehow, it still is the future today (Besides California and Norway, where are the hydrogen filling stations?)! I really love Toyota but c'mon, it can be really stubborn!!!
In Japan, Korea and China, basically where metanhydrate is available at sea bottom. Also in Denmark, UK, The Netherlands and etc where people think of environment.
 

Will1991

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Nicely done! Maybe Toyota will do a bigger push with this facelift to increase plug-in share, trying to push this one over the regular Prius.

Here in Europe (specially in Portugal), it's even shocking how much they're unwilling to sell it...
 

spwolf

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Nicely done! Maybe Toyota will do a bigger push with this facelift to increase plug-in share, trying to push this one over the regular Prius.

Here in Europe (specially in Portugal), it's even shocking how much they're unwilling to sell it...
They dont have to for CO2, so they chose not to lose money on it. In the USA, they have to due to the credit system, so they lose money on PHEV - quite often it can be gotten for similar price as regular Prius.
 

Will1991

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They certainly doesn't need to sell a plug-in for the time being, but in my opinion, they would profit a lot in the long term for maintaining an image of engineer prowess regarding efficiency and reliability.

I mean, it's one of the most efficient drivetrains ever created, how even after 3 years being launched, this drivetrain isn't under the bonnet of the Lexus CT? Or worse, 4th-gen Prius was launched 4 years ago and still hasn't managed to get to Lexus... We can still buy a Lexus with an hybrid powertrain lauched in 2009 (and they still sell very well around here, just imagine if it were an updated version).
 

Will1991

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I don't agree with Toyota's choice of only one PHEV (despite having one of the most efficient powertrain on the market) or all of the past reluctance regarding BEV's, but Forbes was too harsh on the Prius...

First, it was actually the Prius who started an eco-conscious mobility
Second, it still is more fuel efficient than most of the competition
Third, it's available for a wider number of potential buyers regarding their price range
 
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I don't agree with Toyota's choice of only one PHEV (despite having one of the most efficient powertrain on the market) or all of the past reluctance regarding BEV's, but Forbes was too harsh on the Prius...

First, it was actually the Prius who started an eco-conscious mobility
Second, it still is more fuel efficient than most of the competition
Third, it's available for a wider number of potential buyers regarding their price range
The only inference that I get from the article is that the Model 3 is the new poster child for green vehicles; the Prius was the first and forerunner of the movement, but nowadays its efficiency doesn't make it stand out anymore than a Chevy Bolt and that the image that the car had in the mid 2000s is largely gone in the public eye, though it still is viable eco vehicle.
 
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