Lexus – premium brand or just an expensive Toyota?

Sulu

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I thought that this was a good essay on the differentiation between Toyota and Lexus.


Lexus design isn’t just differentiated from Toyota, but of late, its premium peers from Germany. Compared to the equivalent Mercedes-Benz, BMW or Audi, Lexus models are typically sharper and/or more sculptured, a contrast to the safer approach taken by the Europeans.

2021 Lexus LS facelift Thailand launch-13

Lexus UX lifestyle 33

The bold approach also extends to cabin design and choice of materials. Examples of the latter range from the UX 200’s Japanese washi paper-inspired dash top surface to the LS’ Kiriko cut glass door trim and origami hand-folded pleats on the door cards. It feels almost wrong to merely call the latter door cards. The perceived quality and attention to detail of Lexus interiors vis-à-vis other premium brands is easier seen and felt than explained.

In terms of design, Lexus has been going on its own very Japanese path – sure, doing that means you won’t please everyone, but distinct identity and boldness has to be celebrated. Have you wondered why BMW is doing what they have been doing to those kidney grilles?

The differences go beyond the top hat. Lexus has its own versions of platforms shared with Toyota, with specific tuning and hardware to suit premium applications. This is where detractors might harp on, but platform sharing has been part of the car industry for some time now, and is here to stay. Economies of scale is a desirable thing, and the Volkswagen Group – which has Audi and Porsche in its stable of brands – are masters of the sharing game.
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The same principles apply to powertrains. It’s not cheap to come up with something new, so when you do it, maximise its use – that’s the idea behind it. We have no problems with that, provided that the final product is par for the course the car is competing in.

A case in point is the Lexus ES – while its FWD underpinnings is also found in the XV70 Camry, the Lexus is larger, more luxurious and looks like a junior LS. Nice as the Camry is, the Lexus feels more special.

Most Lexus models are engineered to be true premium cars from the ground up...

The premium car experience is more than just the car itself, and among premium brands, it’s perhaps Lexus that understands this the best. From the way the showrooms look and feel, to the attention from personnel, Lexus has been known to provide a feel good factor that’s second to none in the premium segment. Just ask their customers, especially those who have also owned a Continental peer.

In terms of product and branding, it’s obvious why Lexus wants to distance itself from its mass market parent, but if you ask me, there’s one Toyota element they should wear with pride – reliability. IMHO, that’s a strong and unique selling point for the brand, in its segment, against its main rivals.
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Levi

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No question, Lexus is premium in everything but power (straight line acceleration).
 

maiaramdan

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I have a very different view
Everyone talks about Lexus and Toyota relation as if Toyota is / was a disease

Before Lexus Toyota had
LandCruiser
4Runner
Century
Crown (Royal/Athlete/Majesta)
Mark-2/Chaser/Caresta/Cressida
Supra
Sourer
Celica

Honestly Lexus didn't add to Toyota but the opposite is true, and without this relation Lexus won't ever live for 40 days, not 40 years

ES from Camry
LX was LandCruiser Cygnus
LS was from Celsior which was made of Majesta
GS was from Aristo which was made of Royal
IS was from Altezza the FR of the legendary Corona after turning the Corona to FF with the CoronaE

The current status of rivalry is the best for the 2
In early 20th Toyota got the cheapest material to make Lexus shine

That was a real bad model
Right now is nearly rivalry
 

ssun30

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Lexus in the 90s was actually 'watered down JDM Toyota' for the rest of the world 🤣 Lexus became the premium brand because Toyota downgraded itself to an appliance maker after the Bubble burst. Lexus would have had much better prestige today it they were indeed just 'expensive Toyota' since the beginning. They could have had IS-F and GS-F with 1JZ/2JZ and embarrass the Ms and AMGs of the time and V12 LS/SC rivalling the comfort level of Rolls Royce and Bentley.
 

maiaramdan

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Lexus in the 90s was actually 'watered down JDM Toyota' for the rest of the world 🤣 Lexus became the premium brand because Toyota downgraded itself to an appliance maker after the Bubble burst. Lexus would have had much better prestige today it they were indeed just 'expensive Toyota' since the beginning. They could have had IS-F and GS-F with 1JZ/2JZ and embarrass the Ms and AMGs of the time and V12 LS/SC rivalling the comfort level of Rolls Royce and Bentley.

Infinite agrees on this
The main problem happen from the beginning of 20th with the introduction of the RX and IS, suddenly Lexus felt itself as a tier-1 luxury automaker and suddenly Toyota build quality tends to zero with a lot of hard plastic interior

But honestly that's all started to be shifted with the coming of Akio in the reign of TMC and then the brake pedal accelerated it and the new era began with LFA , everyone thought it's the continuation of Lexus as tier-1 luxury but thanks God 🙏 I was right and Toyota started to get better and better by generation, add to that the Korean which are still making a great pressure on all the Japanese to ramp up
 

mikeavelli

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Lexus in the 90s was actually 'watered down JDM Toyota' for the rest of the world 🤣 Lexus became the premium brand because Toyota downgraded itself to an appliance maker after the Bubble burst. Lexus would have had much better prestige today it they were indeed just 'expensive Toyota' since the beginning. They could have had IS-F and GS-F with 1JZ/2JZ and embarrass the Ms and AMGs of the time and V12 LS/SC rivalling the comfort level of Rolls Royce and Bentley.

That’s not true. Lexus was made to be Lexus and rebadged in Japan since they had no dealer network.
 

mikeavelli

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I always thought it was because of this as well.

Yup. Not up for argument. The entire point of Lexus was to be Lexus. The original LS was entirely new and built to be a Lexus LS. It was a Toyota Celsior as they didn’t have a dealer network in Japan.

Yes the ES 250 was a rebadge but it was just a filler until the ES. The ES was built to be a Lexus and happened to share Toyota parts. The GS was built to be a GS and rebadged Aristo.

Even if we look at the original IS. It had its own platform and 3 different engines for each market. A 2.5 I think I-6 for Europe and a high revving I-4 for Japan where it was the Altezza. When it was time for America, US dealers said an I-4 was unacceptable so we got the 2JZ. Funny how today now I-4 is normal.

People confuse Lexus not having a dealer network in Japan with being rebadged for the world and that’s not remotely true.
 

maiaramdan

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That’s not true. Lexus was made to be Lexus and rebadged in Japan since they had no dealer network.

Honestly you are true with those CT, HS, UX, LC, RC, IS & NX

But not with those Celsior, Aristo, Harrier, LC-Cygnus, Prado, Vellfire/Alphard

All those are pure Toyota whom killed as Celsior, Aristo & Cygnus to be Lexus or stayed but with different audiences as the Harrier, or still premium as the Vellfire/Alphard
 

mikeavelli

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Honestly you are true with those CT, HS, UX, LC, RC, IS & NX

But not with those Celsior, Aristo, Harrier, LC-Cygnus, Prado, Vellfire/Alphard

All those are pure Toyota whom killed as Celsior, Aristo & Cygnus to be Lexus or stayed but with different audiences as the Harrier, or still premium as the Vellfire/Alphard

No that is completely incorrect; like it’s not up for debate. You are going against history.

Toyota didn’t make a Toyota Celsior then decide to sell it as a Lexus. It would have failed. Lexus was all new from the ground up and over 1 billion dollars in 1980s money was used to develop and all new car. It was sold and debuted as a Lexus in the USA and Europe. Obviously at the time the USA was the main target market.

IT WAS REBADGED SINCE JAPAN HAD NO DEALER NETWORK.

Period. End of discussion. :)
 

ssun30

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That’s not true. Lexus was made to be Lexus and rebadged in Japan since they had no dealer network.
I was not referring to the distribution model. It was about the fact early international Lexus models were actually inferior to JDM Toyotas of the time. Ironically the 'rebadged Lexus' Toyotas like the Aristo and Altezza are superior to the Lexus they are based on.

As an example the Crown Majesta had satellite navigation, onboard TV, four-wheel steering, adaptive suspension, HUD and electronic dashboard in 1991. The Celsior had rear massage seats and rear seat entertainment system. The LS got this much tech and feature almost a decade later. The original LS was the best luxury sedan of its time, yet it was not its ultiate form.