ES-F ?

Gecko

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@LexusTechSA it would be helpful if you could provide some of the article copy or images, going forward :)

Also, I believe this is the upcoming Acura TLX replacement, not the ES. Word on the street is it will be debuting with Acura's new turbo V6 and SHAWD, thus the higher performance aero and exhaust bits.
 

Joaquin Ruhi

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I just read the whole Spanish-language article, and it's so full of gyrations, author Daniel Murias talking out of his butt and just flat-out B.S. that it's just ridiculous. I don't know where to start, but I'll try.

The author was in Vilafranca del Penedés (a town in Spain's Barcelona province) when he spotted this camoed prototype and gave chase. He was unable to photograph the front but he said it was more covered up than the lightly camoed rear. He starts out by concluding that this is an ES F powered by a hybrid V8 powertrain (!) Then he states that the powertrain could be anything, from a naturally aspirated V8 (dreaming doesn't cost anything....) to a V6 turbo hybrid. Then he concludes that while the ES F is highly likely to at least be a hybrid, it won't use the glorious V8 developed with Yamaha's help. :dizzy::confused:

He did get one thing right: "Just because it's tested in Spain doesn't necessarily mean that it'll arrive in the European market".

As Gecko and Mikeavelli correctly noted, all we're seeing is the current Acura TLX with quad instead of dual exhaust outlets. Since the TLX has never been sold in Europe, it looked unfamiliar to this so-called journalist.
 

flexus

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I just read the whole Spanish-language article, and it's so full of gyrations, author Daniel Murias talking out of his butt and just flat-out B.S. that it's just ridiculous. I don't know where to start, but I'll try.

The author was in Vilafranca del Penedés (a town in Spain's Barcelona province) when he spotted this camoed prototype and gave chase. He was unable to photograph the front but he said it was more covered up than the lightly camoed rear. He starts out by concluding that this is an ES F powered by a hybrid V8 powertrain (!) Then he states that the powertrain could be anything, from a naturally aspirated V8 (dreaming doesn't cost anything....) to a V6 turbo hybrid. Then he concludes that while the ES F is highly likely to at least be a hybrid, it won't use the glorious V8 developed with Yamaha's help. :dizzy::confused:

He did get one thing right: "Just because it's tested in Spain doesn't necessarily mean that it'll arrive in the European market".

As Gecko and Mikeavelli correctly noted, all we're seeing is the current Acura TLX with quad instead of dual exhaust outlets. Since the TLX has never been sold in Europe, it looked unfamiliar to this so-called journalist.
As the journalist speculated wild things, I will also. Honda sales have decreased over years and brand image is taken a hit from discontinuing Accord. Current gen Civic sales are no match to Auris or Corolla. It is too american and sales have declined. New CRV hybrid and Honda E won't help enough Honda to regain it's position.
Here is my wild guess: Honda is bringing Accord back. Old one was based on TSX so new one could be TLX. Maybe Honda is seeing an oppurtunity to rival with familycars between peoplemovers and premium like Opel Grand Insignia, Peugeot 508, Mazda 6 and new to market Camry.
As Honda is electrifying it's whole line-up, in my wet dreams Accord would have Clarity's PHEV system. I think Clarity's sales alone can cover dev and production costs. Certainly hybrid would be offered.
Only time can tell us why the TLX was in Spain. Maybe hiding for its target market USA's car media? Testing new drivetrain? Bringing Accord back? Only way to confirm my silly Accord theory is if someone spots TLX estate :)
 

Carmaker1

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I really get tired of poor reporting, as the occasional contributions I even bother making to Wikipedia (influence copy-pasted info), are badly affected by silly bureaucracy. Journalists are awfully lackadaisical at times. The reality is, why are even mistaking a Honda product for a Toyota product in Lexus? Second, Honda is testing the next generation MDX and TLX in both Europe and North America, yet it took one casual Youtube to spot it while driving around.

What are these so-called spy photographers doing? They've gotten really complacent. It took many weeks for the 3IS to be caught testing back in 2012, because of their inability to notice anything. Funny enough, TFL even does a better job at times than they do Brendy Priddy has clearly gotten comfortable or maybe retired, at my mother's age. Still, there should be others following in her footsteps and staying on the ball.
 

Carmaker1

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@LexusTechSA it would be helpful if you could provide some of the article copy or images, going forward :)

Also, I believe this is the upcoming Acura TLX replacement, not the ES. Word on the street is it will be debuting with Acura's new turbo V6 and SHAWD, thus the higher performance aero and exhaust bits.
Yep! AWD, with a 368 hp TTV6. A lot of folks called it a 2020 model, but based on a stage they were at with choosing final designs 18 months ago, I figured it was very up in the air. Japanese can be very great about being lean, but in this decade they have changed that and are slower like in the post-Bubble 90s. Where a Camry took 3 years from final concept to hitting the streets. The LS 400 bested them, by manpower and resources to get to market quickly enough. 😉

This is it right here! Coming November 2020.


 

Gecko

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368hp seems a tad low, coming from a TTV6, no, @Carmaker1?

I read some stuff on TOV saying it would be single turbo. Have you heard contrary?
 

Carmaker1

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368hp seems a tad low, coming from a TTV6, no, @Carmaker1?

I read some stuff on TOV saying it would be single turbo. Have you heard contrary?
It does, but Honda will be Honda. I haven't paid much attention actually, but it's surprising how much one knows more than media at that point.
 

mikeavelli

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368hp seems a tad low, coming from a TTV6, no, @Carmaker1?

I read some stuff on TOV saying it would be single turbo. Have you heard contrary?
The G80 has 383 or so right? Infinit has 400hp already.... I'm sure they will market it as "most powerful Acura sedan ever" or something lol...

As for the ES F...Lexus is losing a lot of interest with loyal owners with some weird spacing...

No IS F
ES sportier but still FWD and some people just don't want that nameplate
ES AWD and F rumored. I highly doubt the latter
GS likely going away as RWD but the model the enthusiasts want
GS F likely going away
LS with no V-8 option and if the LS F comes its likely a 130k car

That leaves a bunch of hardcore Lexus guys that buy new and used with nothing up their alley specifically. The GS and GS F filled that gap as the V-8 LS....
 

Gecko

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^Most of the Lexus people I know who were fans of GS/IS F/old school (V8) LSs have jumped ship for Genesis or Audi these days.

If Lexus had launched ES with AWD and an upmarket engine option, I think most people would have been like, "Ok, losing GS is no biggie. They consolidated and we didn't really lose anything." Clearly that is not what we got.

$65-70k AWD ES F with V35A-FTS would be in a class of one, but also kinda cool in a way.
 

mikeavelli

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^Most of the Lexus people I know who were fans of GS/IS F/old school (V8) LSs have jumped ship for Genesis or Audi these days.

If Lexus had launched ES with AWD and an upmarket engine option, I think most people would have been like, "Ok, losing GS is no biggie. They consolidated and we didn't really lose anything." Clearly that is not what we got.

$65-70k AWD ES F with V35A-FTS would be in a class of one, but also kinda cool in a way.
If we are to believe in the ES going upmarket where the GS is gone and it battles cars like the 5 series etc that would mean an ES F needs to make 600hp to stay relevant.

Think about that for a second then go grab the Vodka.....
 
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