Did Lexus cheap out on the ES?

Discussion in 'Lexus Sedans' started by phoenixss, May 8, 2019.

  1. phoenixss
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    Seems like Lexus went on the cheaper side with the ES.

    Some of the traditional finishing touches inside are missing, headliner material is not as soft to the touch and no folding mirrors ????? How much did lexus save on each car? 50$

    Lexus needs to be careful and stay the line with signature feature. I've notice on the UX the steering wheel is not electrically adjustable... what a fiasco.

    Lexus needs to smarten up if they want to retain their prestigious cachet.
     
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  2. RAL
    RAL Staff Member Moderator
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    Even our NX has retractable mirrors ... it seems Lexus saves some goodies for the refresh.
     
  3. phoenixss
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    Heard a theory that Lexus will put folding mirrors on SUV and only on high end LS. unconfirmed
     
  4. mmcartalk
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    With one exception (a mid-generation interior facelift for the 2010 model year to improve the trim a little, from customer complaints), Lexus has been steadily cheapening the ES since the superb 4th-generation model, which IMO was the best ES ever done, ended production in 2006.
     
  5. RAL
    RAL Staff Member Moderator
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    While I have to admit there are more hard plastics in the 7ES interior, I have to respectfully disagree with you. A friend at Lexus Southern recently confided the trend across the entire industry is toward an expansion of interior hard plastics. That said, I find the 7ES interior and moreover the entire car a vast improvement over previous generations. I find the 7ES to be the quietest best driving ES yet.
     
  6. mmcartalk
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    Likewise, I respect your view....you have made some good posts over the years. I did do a test-drive, though, of the latest 7Gen ES with the 45-series tires, and found it had substantially more road noise and a firmer ride than the 4Gen, and, to some extent, even more so than the 5Gen and 6Gen it just replaced. However, an Avalon XLE that I also test-drove, with the 55-series tires, was noticeably better on the road than the 45s. And, yes, the same 55s come standard on the base ES model, so the base ES can be expected to be a little more refined. Still, even so, I have not impressed with the the interiors of any of the ES models since the 4Gen.
     
  7. RAL
    RAL Staff Member Moderator
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    I've had quite a bit of experience with multiple generations of the ES; and as far as I am concerned there is no comparison. Opinions are relative, but I admire your tenacity.
     
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  8. mmcartalk
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    Thanks, but I wouldn't call it tenacity. I just go by what my own eyes, ears, and seat-of-the-pants tell me.
     
  9. Greg1967
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    The new 2019 ES 350 F Sport is my third Lexus. I owned a 1st Gen ES 300 in 1995 and the GS 300 AWD in 2007. Of all my Lexus automobiles, I think the new ES 350 F Sport is the best. The ML audio system is pretty impressive and I have been having a blast driving country roads in TN using the F Sport mode and paddle shifters. The AWD GS was super solid navigating New England winters but this new ES is extremely fun to drive while still maintaining the smooth ride and reliability Lexus is known for. I have only had this new Lexus for a couple of months so I will report back if I think the quality standard doesn't meet expectations.
     
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  10. Ian Schmidt
    Ian Schmidt Staff Member Moderator
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    @Greg1967: Likewise, my LS500 really comes to life on back country roads (in MD in my case). I can understand why people in cities don't like it as much, but the fun factor for me is off the scale. I'm hoping to get a new ES as my loaner next time I'm in for service so I can slide right on into that debate above :p
     
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  11. rigarba
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    No folding mirrors in USA? Here at Spain, and I'm prety sure that is the same in all western europe, all ES have folding mirrors. And mine will come complete with anti-fog and electro chromatic mirrors.
    About interior quality, I think it's superb. May be some hard plastic somewhere (a few ones really), but I see similar ones in the new BMW serie 5 and Mercedes clase E (in the same price level a lot more), and those brands are more expensives to buy and to maintain. And with the new regulations those can't drive in the downtowns a lot of days by year.
     
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  12. F1 Silver Arrows
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    At the end of the day, you got a LS. Definitely the best sedan Lexus makes. :D

    I hope Lexus stops cheaping out a little on the small features. While without a shadow of a doubt it is the best ES made, it's no GS.
     
  13. zeusus
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    I think you mean Lexus needs to smarten up if they want to satisfy your personal needs? Because the new ES is selling like hotcakes in every market it lands in. There must be some disconnect between your niche "enthusiast" expectations and the rest of the consumer market.

    Other than the subjective nature of the complaint, do you have any objective evidence of "missing finishing touches" and headliner not being as soft? Soft as opposed to what? Did you compare the two directly? or strictly going off memory or what somebody else said?

    Did the ES previously come with power folding mirrors?

    Which market are you making this complaint in?

    Did you measure any gains in value in other areas of the car?
     
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  14. mmcartalk
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    I have to agree with phoenixss....either you're going to do an upscale product or you aren't.
     
  15. RAL
    RAL Staff Member Moderator
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    Upscaled or not? ... Moto-Man has 200k subscribers on Youtube. His review goes beyond subjective opinion and is quite revealing regarding the 'upscaling' of the 2019 ES 350. His comments at 2:50 are particularly telling as he decribes how the 7ES is not just a re-badged Avalon. His comments at 5:34 draw stark comparison to previous ES generations. Indeed, I encourage watching the entire video because he details how the 7ES is vastly improved! He nails it at 10:22!

     
    Last edited: May 23, 2019 at 8:50 AM
  16. SAND619
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    During the launch of the new ES we were told that Lexus is aware that customers/dealers are asking for folding mirrors and that it's likely the ES will offer it down the road.

    Also, not sure if you're comparing apples to apples but I have to disagree with you that Lexus cheaped out on the new ES. I would argue that it's a vast improvement over its predecessor and the best value in Lexus's lineup (as well as its competition).
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2019 at 3:27 PM
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