Gecko

Administrator
Messages
4,000
Reactions
9,169
I'm going to bet all my chips on TX replacing the RX-L, as I mentioned above. But if that's the case, there's something here that bothers me and that will likely apply to the next gen RX as well: The "350" trademark.

TX 350 indicates to me that this vehicle will either be coming with the next gen 2.4L turbo 4 cyl, or a carryover GR V6 -- and if true, neither is enough. We're assuming ~300hp for that motor, and it'll probably weigh ~4,850lbs, and could have 4-5 people + their gear at any given time. A 300hp turbo 4 is not enough engine, especially when you consider the GLE 450, X5 4.0, and even the MDX coming with a 350hp turbo V6. A GR V6 is going to make roughly the same horsepower and a little less torque, so I have the same argument there again... it's not going to be enough.

TX 500h with ~350 hp will be in the sweet spot, but I really wish Lexus would call that the new "450h" because we all know it's not a true substitute for a 5.0L V8 as the naming would suggest. 350hp hybrid V6 is about what this vehicle should have, and I'm happy to see the trademark.

My theory on this is that Lexus is about to push heavy on hybridizing everything going forward, and TX 350 and RX 350 will be fairly entry level models, while things like Ultra Luxury packages and upper spec F Sport kit will probably be only available on 500h. The RX/TX 500h will likely become the core model with more options and features, and "350" will be limited to lower trims.

I do still wish there was some sort of RX 400 or 450/TX 400 or 450 trademark because I believe they need a ~375hp+ option based on the competition, likely weight and customer expectations... but I'm also expecting Lexus to lean into hybrids even harder as a differentiator, and there's nothing rumored to fill the open space between the 2.4L turbo and the V35A-FTS for gas powered cars. I think they see the 354hp "500h" as that gap filler.
 

ssun30

Expert
Messages
2,564
Reactions
5,968
The TX350 won't be that underpowered. Lexus already sells an actually underpowered RX300 with no problem. I think TX350 will have similar performance to the current GX460. The 2.4T will have very similar power and torque to the 4.6 V8, but the GX will be ~100kg heavier. Therefore the TX350 will be a perfectly fine entry level model. Many 3-row crossovers in this segment actually have lower power-to-weight ratio in entry-level models. Think the 2.0T Audi Q7.
As for the 500h. I think Lexus rates the 'ICE equivalent' in terms of real world scenarios instead of outright drag performance. As an example the multistage 500h gets beaten by both V35 and 2UR on a long straight, but can keep up at launch and during overtaking. 'De-rating' it to 450h has the same problem as rating it 500h: it would suggest the system is similar to a 4.5/4.6 V8. But I don't blame Lexus for this, as this arbitrary rating problem exists in every brand. We still have no idea why Audi rates a 345hp V6 as a 55 while BMW's 50 has 50% more power.
 

James

Founding Member
Messages
647
Reactions
1,168
I'm going to bet all my chips on TX replacing the RX-L, as I mentioned above. But if that's the case, there's something here that bothers me and that will likely apply to the next gen RX as well: The "350" trademark.

TX 350 indicates to me that this vehicle will either be coming with the next gen 2.4L turbo 4 cyl, or a carryover GR V6 -- and if true, neither is enough. We're assuming ~300hp for that motor, and it'll probably weigh ~4,850lbs, and could have 4-5 people + their gear at any given time. A 300hp turbo 4 is not enough engine, especially when you consider the GLE 450, X5 4.0, and even the MDX coming with a 350hp turbo V6. A GR V6 is going to make roughly the same horsepower and a little less torque, so I have the same argument there again... it's not going to be enough.

TX 500h with ~350 hp will be in the sweet spot, but I really wish Lexus would call that the new "450h" because we all know it's not a true substitute for a 5.0L V8 as the naming would suggest. 350hp hybrid V6 is about what this vehicle should have, and I'm happy to see the trademark.

My theory on this is that Lexus is about to push heavy on hybridizing everything going forward, and TX 350 and RX 350 will be fairly entry level models, while things like Ultra Luxury packages and upper spec F Sport kit will probably be only available on 500h. The RX/TX 500h will likely become the core model with more options and features, and "350" will be limited to lower trims.

I do still wish there was some sort of RX 400 or 450/TX 400 or 450 trademark because I believe they need a ~375hp+ option based on the competition, likely weight and customer expectations... but I'm also expecting Lexus to lean into hybrids even harder as a differentiator, and there's nothing rumored to fill the open space between the 2.4L turbo and the V35A-FTS for gas powered cars. I think they see the 354hp "500h" as that gap filler.
Wait what Gecko? Lexus not having enough power in one of their cars...you don’t say! That never happens...
 

maiaramdan

Expert
Messages
1,668
Reactions
1,300
Lexus version of Sienna?

Lexus will always have only 1 minivan and that's the LM

let's see what will happen in the next couple years
but Toyota have 3 sizes the longest Sequoia the Shortest 4Runner / Prado / Fortuner and the middle between them the LC200
so the TX for me either
1) RX-L and as the rumors declaring the next RX is FR so the TX will also FR if the RX didn't switch the TX will be FF
or
2) Next generation Sequoia twin
or
3) Next generation Prado twin
or
4) Next generation LC300 twin
 

ssun30

Expert
Messages
2,564
Reactions
5,968
A sad news from Toyota but potentially exciting news for Lexus:

The S220 Crown sedan will be discontinued in 2022 and redesigned as a SUV, and will be sold internationally (at least in China and USA). Could this mean the TX can be a 'rebadged' Crown SUV based on GA-N? Never mind that idea the Crown SUV will be based on GA-K.

So what could happen is the new RX is a two-row GA-K and its Toyota counterpart is the Crown SUV, while the TX is a three-row based on Highlander.
 
Last edited:

Gecko

Administrator
Messages
4,000
Reactions
9,169
Seeing that Toyota trademarked "Grand Highlander" which is broadly expected to be a longer/larger Highlander just a few weeks after Lexus trademarked TX, I have a feeling TX and Grand Highlander will be on the same version of TNGA-K which will likely be a bit longer than the Highlander, with more 3rd row room and storage capacity. Sienna has 120" wheelbase... I wonder if that version could work for SUVs too? 120" wheelbase is similar to others in the class, like the Explorer.

I could be wrong, but we will see. Very interested to see how both of these products come together.

@b.ba I see that you posted this but deleted it. I think you're right!
 

b.ba

Fan
Messages
72
Reactions
220
@Gecko thanks for the mention! I didn't see that other members (@Motor and @Sulu) had already mentioned that in another thread (oops). Sulu brought up similar points to what I was thinking.

In terms of styling differences (between Highlander/Grand Highlander and potentially the RX/TX), is one expected to be a bigger version of the other but with the same styling (like the Honda Passport/Pilot)? Or will they have unique fascia + different interiors?
 

Gecko

Administrator
Messages
4,000
Reactions
9,169
@Gecko thanks for the mention! I didn't see that other members (@Motor and @Sulu) had already mentioned that in another thread (oops). Sulu brought up similar points to what I was thinking.

In terms of styling differences (between Highlander/Grand Highlander and potentially the RX/TX), is one expected to be a bigger version of the other but with the same styling (like the Honda Passport/Pilot)? Or will they have unique fascia + different interiors?

Not sure on that, but I think it will be interesting to see. Personally, I am expecting the Grand Highlander to be mostly a larger Highlander, but I bet the TX will be positioned as a unique model apart from the RX.
 

Gecko

Administrator
Messages
4,000
Reactions
9,169
tmmi_004-1024x668.png


Toyota just announced an $803 Million investment at Toyota Motor Manufacturing Indiana (TMMI) that will bring 1,400 more jobs to the Princeton, Indiana plant. As Lexus enthusiasts, here is the most interesting section of the release:

"Today, Toyota announced an $803 million investment and 1,400 new jobs at the Princeton, Ind., auto-manufacturing plant in preparation to introduce two all-new, three-row SUVs designed with the active Gen Y American Family in mind. What’s more, only one will bear the Toyota name. The other will officially introduce the Lexus line to Toyota Indiana."

So, what might that be? If you ask us, the answer is pretty simple: The three-row Lexus TX and Toyota Grand Highlander will be brought online at the plant that currently builds the Highlander, Sequoia and Sienna. This notion is further reinforced in the press release here:

"Speaking of happy, these new additions will have customers bursting at the seams when they get a glimpse of the cutting-edge technology featured in both vehicles. When on sale, customers can expect a semi-automated driving system—which will allow for hands-free driving in certain conditions—a remote parking system allowing the driver to park and unpark from outside the vehicle using a smartphone, and a digital key that turns a user’s smartphone into their key and allows them to share it digitally. Both the Lexus and Toyota versions will offer seating for up to eight passengers."

When Lexus trademarked "RX 500h" with "TX 350" and "TX 500h"</a>, we assumed that it would mean the two would be closely related and with the lackluster packaging of the RX L model, it was logical to assume the TX would succeed the RX L as an all-new, dedicated three row model.

No spy shots of the TX have been seen yet, nor are many details known about the new model other than trademarks.
 

mordecai

Follower
Messages
145
Reactions
393
Lexus’ SUV lineup would really be quite full with the upcoming slate of models:

FWD
  • UX
  • NX
  • RX
  • TX

BOF
  • GX
  • LX

RWD

  • LQ (LF-1 model)
I hope they eventually switch over their FWD CUVs to RWD, but that’s probably never going to happen.
 

Gecko

Administrator
Messages
4,000
Reactions
9,169
From what I know, GX's future has been cagey but given the strong sales in the last few years, it has been greenlit for a second generation.

Between RX, TX, GX and LX, I think the decision was made that there was no room for the LF-1. Just my .02 from a few things I heard very recently.
 

mikeavelli

Moderator
Messages
5,645
Reactions
12,212
This new SUV made here makes perfect sense as we will be it’s biggest market and I’m sure every single trick in the book will be thrown at it. I’m not a CUV guy but this is a perfect addition and much needed one from a dealer perspective.
Great to see additional investment in the USA.
 

maiaramdan

Expert
Messages
1,668
Reactions
1,300
From what I know, GX's future has been cagey but given the strong sales in the last few years, it has been greenlit for a second generation.

Between RX, TX, GX and LX, I think the decision was made that there was no room for the LF-1. Just my .02 from a few things I heard very recently.
From what it cleared and been rumored , the next Crown will approximately made on the LF-1 limitless and based with a potential sibling from Lexus as well

Maybe it will be the next RX as the rumors about the RX turning to FR, and maybe even it will be the next generation GX