2021 Nissan Fairlady 400Z/Z Proto discussion

Joaquin Ruhi

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I see mentions in the text above of both 304ps and 405ps. Could that mean that both states of tune of Nissan's VR30DDTT 3-liter twin turbo V6 (300hp and 400hp Red Sport) will be offered in the new Z? And will badging morph from engine size to horsepower (thus giving us both a 300Z and a 400Z)?
 

supra93

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Discussion on the J29 vs Z35 below. Which one would you guys go for and why?

 

carguy420

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The new Z won't be as impressive as you might think, mainly because of the platform that it's using is such an outdated design, too heavy for what it is and not to mention it is not a purpose built sports car platform unlike the MX-5, 124 spider, Supra and Z4. Since the platform is going to be a carryover from the 370Z, the current 370Z with a manual transmission already weighs about as much as the new Supra despite having a really basic interior, very little NVH insulation, regular passive dampers, no active differential/eLSD and most likely a less rigid chassis when compared to the Supra.

The primary focus of the new Z seems to revolve around the engine, that it will most likely offer a manual transmission unlike the new Supra and be a more affordable alternative to the Supra, but honestly I can't see the base price of the new Z starting at less than 40k USD when you take into consideration the cost of this twin turbo DI V6, upgrades throughout the whole car to handle that power and Nissan pushing the new Z more upmarket.
 

super51fan

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The new Z won't be as impressive as you might think, mainly because of the platform that it's using is such an outdated design, too heavy for what it is and not to mention it is not a purpose built sports car platform unlike the MX-5, 124 spider, Supra and Z4. Since the platform is going to be a carryover from the 370Z, the current 370Z with a manual transmission already weighs about as much as the new Supra despite having a really basic interior, very little NVH insulation, regular passive dampers, no active differential/eLSD and most likely a less rigid chassis when compared to the Supra.

The primary focus of the new Z seems to revolve around the engine, that it will most likely offer a manual transmission unlike the new Supra and be a more affordable alternative to the Supra, but honestly I can't see the base price of the new Z starting at less than 40k USD when you take into consideration the cost of this twin turbo DI V6, upgrades throughout the whole car to handle that power and Nissan pushing the new Z more upmarket.
It doesn’t have to perform well to be an engaging driver’s car and sell relatively well. Yeah the Supra will probably win on paper but most buyers in that demographic don’t take their car to the track enough (or at all) to see these benefits.
 
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Although I haven't elaborated too much, I know a hell of a lot about this program dating back to 2018 approval the cost of roughly $240 million and...touch on it later.
Yeah $240 million is literally nothing compared to what Toyota and BMW spent for the Supra and the Z4 project. This just confirms that the new Z will definitely undercut the Supra in price.
 

Levi

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However much the Supra might be "better" does not make the Z a bad car. I am glad it is coming, and not killed like some other car at Lexus. The new Z can't be any worse than the new IS.

What influence did Ghosn have on the new Z?
 

Gecko

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If the Z comes with a 400hp TT V6 option and 6MT, you're going to conquest some Supra shoppers just for that alone. A lower price will make it even more competitive, and don't forget that the base Supra has 255hp(I4) while the base Z may have 300hp (turbo V6).

Do I think most people are OK with the BMW chassis/motor/transmission/electronics/everything? Yeah.

Are there still some people looking for a truly Japanese sports coupe with a Japanese chassis/motor/transmission? Yes.

Doesn't mean the Supra is a bad car - it turned out pretty damn good. But the German bones are a turnoff for some people, myself included.

I don't think Lexus fans are in much of a position to trash talk extended refreshes 😉
 

super51fan

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THIS! I don't know about everyone else, but rumored cheaper base 6cyl Z sounds a lot more attractive than a 4 banger Zupra. And a manual for the Z would be icing on the cake.
Since the 300hp and 400hp versions are practically the same motor with different tunes, I'd say the 300hp Z is a better buy than the 6 cylinder Supra if youre planning on tuning.

The embarrassing part for Toyota is that they can't even increase power to match the Z without asking daddy bmw
 

supra93

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Since the 300hp and 400hp versions are practically the same motor with different tunes, I'd say the 300hp Z is a better buy than the 6 cylinder Supra if youre planning on tuning.

The embarrassing part for Toyota is that they can't even increase power to match the Z without asking daddy bmw
I was thinking the same thing. Makes you wonder if a 400hp version will come with better brakes/tires, suspension upgrades ect?

Lol, or at least drop the starting price point. Even the pro 2.0 people on the MKV forum feel that $43k is way too expensive for what you getting. This has been shared by a few people that think it was a mistake for Toyota to offer the 4 banger in the US. Toyota should have kept the 335hp version as the base model and taken out some of the goodies for a lower MSRP. If the rumors about the Z are true I predict the 4 banger Zupra is DOA.
 

super51fan

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I was thinking the same thing. Makes you wonder if a 400hp version will come with better brakes/tires, suspension upgrades ect?

Lol, or at least drop the starting price point. Even the pro 2.0 people on the MKV forum feel that $43k is way too expensive for what you getting. This has been shared by a few people that think it was a mistake for Toyota to offer the 4 banger in the US. Toyota should have kept the 335hp version as the base model and taken out some of the goodies for a lower MSRP. If the rumors about the Z are true I predict the 4 banger Zupra is DOA.
I think you can get the bigger brakes on the 300hp Q60 in the sport package so you can probably option it on the 300hp Z and the 400hp Z will probably get them standard. Knowing Nissan, they will probably be using the same akebono kit since the 370z which can be found cheap as take offs. As for suspension, it probably won’t be much different than 370z suspension which has plenty of aftermarket options. I know stock vs aftermarket is a dumb conversation point when comparing cars but I think it’s important to mention that a modded 300hp Z could be less than the 4 cyl Supra with 6 cyl Supra performance.

The 4 cyl Supra is a joke. It’s just another one of their questionable decisions about this car. It’s sad because it could have been a home run even with the bmw partnership with a few minor development changes.
 
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The embarrassing part for Toyota is that they can't even increase power to match the Z without asking daddy bmw
That's false lmao. Toyota literally pulled off a gentleman's agreement with BMW by underrating their engine by quoting their horsepower numbers at the wheels and not the crank. BMW underrated their engine too but looking at the dyno it was closer to their claimed horsepower number than Toyota were closer to theirs. It's the same case for the 2021 GR Supra too.

Toyota's Supra GRMN will happen whether "daddy BMW" will like it or not. They will also add incremental updates to the engine regardless of BMW thinks. It has been said a few times that the Supra will get power bumps throughout its life cycle.
 
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