2021 Acura TLX Type S Will Pack a Powerful 3.0L Turbo V-6

Gecko

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But the TLX will still be FWD?
Yes, but surely with SH-AWD. I'm also hearing 365hp on this motor... time will tell if it's as underrated as their 2.0T. If so, ~400hp midsize sedan with SH-AWD for ~$45-50k really doesn't sound bad at all.

Hey, @Lexus, this is kinda what we were hoping for with a TNGA ES. Maybe you could get off the bench and step up to the plate...?
 

mikeavelli

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Kia Stinger will get a bump to 380hp. BMW already makes it. Infiniti has 400hp... only Honda fans are making this a big deal. It’s not, just for them.

Sadly I can’t throw a Lexus in the mix currently. :(
 

Gecko

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Kia Stinger will get a bump to 380hp. BMW already makes it. Infiniti has 400hp... only Honda fans are making this a big deal. It’s not, just for them.

Sadly I can’t throw a Lexus in the mix currently. :(
Sad how irrelevant both the Q50 and Infiniti have become. G35 was once the "it" car in this segment... now, nobody cares.

I am not dismissing this TLX so fast. Acura has made a lot of stupid errors in the last decade, but there is reason to believe this new engine is going to be their first to incorporate an electronically assisted turbo, which I think is a technology adapted from their F1 efforts. As I understand it, the engine will be a single, electronically assisted turbo with electric assistance/boost available before the turbo spools and hits the powerband, creating acceleration that is linear and more akin to a twin-turbo motor.

If this is true, I'll have to give them credit. Toyota has been talking about this technology for over a decade and nothing has come of it, and all we have is a FWD ES with a 15 year old engine.

Again, I understand the hate for Acura, but... a midsize sedan with a 370hp state of the art turbo V6 and SH-AWD could be very impressive. If Lexus dropped something like this, we'd all be going wild.
 

mikeavelli

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Sad how irrelevant both the Q50 and Infiniti have become. G35 was once the "it" car in this segment... now, nobody cares.

I am not dismissing this TLX so fast. Acura has made a lot of stupid errors in the last decade, but there is reason to believe this new engine is going to be their first to incorporate an electronically assisted turbo, which I think is a technology adapted from their F1 efforts. As I understand it, the engine will be a single, electronically assisted turbo with electric assistance/boost available before the turbo spools and hits the powerband, creating acceleration that is linear and more akin to a twin-turbo motor.

If this is true, I'll have to give them credit. Toyota has been talking about this technology for over a decade and nothing has come of it, and all we have is a FWD ES with a 15 year old engine.

Again, I understand the hate for Acura, but... a midsize sedan with a 370hp state of the art turbo V6 and SH-AWD could be very impressive. If Lexus dropped something like this, we'd all be going wild.
And it will be 60k and rot at the dealer. An e- turbo will be cool no doubt. Totally agree if the IS got something with this much power it would be awesome. But again it would late and still behind the Q50/60 Redsport, which is tunable. Those cars don’t sell as they are 55-65k cars which goes to my first point to Acura. They couldn’t sell a now discontinued RLX at that price which is an entire class up. Only the MDX sells at that point and it has less to do with the MDX being a good vehicle and more with people will just buy a SUV with no questions asked. Ironically this engine in the MDX will probably do better for them.

If Acura could somehow offer it at 40-45k, they would have a compelling case with that engine. If it’s the base engine at that price it’s just more of the same.
 

mikeavelli

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I just realized the Mercedes-Benz C43 makes 385hp as well...
Audi S4 349hp with standard AWD

Mercedes-Benz also offers a 53 variant in vehicles with 429hp from a 3.0 V-6 twin turbo with E-assist (mild hybrid).

I know Audi offers mild e turbos but I can’t figure it out lol. They have a 2.9 V-6 that makes over 444hp shared with Porsche,

Geeze in retrospect the Japanese brands are way way behind with engines. These ain’t even their top power plants!
 
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ssun30

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As I understand it, the engine will be a single, electronically assisted turbo with electric assistance/boost available before the turbo spools and hits the powerband, creating acceleration that is linear and more akin to a twin-turbo motor.

If this is true, I'll have to give them credit. Toyota has been talking about this technology for over a decade and nothing has come of it, and all we have is a FWD ES with a 15 year old engine.
Sounds like a reliability nightmare to me. An extremely fast spinning motor in close proximity to a high heat source is how their F1 engines suffered for years. There are many ways to make a high specific output twin-turbo engine work just as well. Electric turbo is an extremely expensive and potentially unreliable gimmick. It sounds very very cool but doesn't work well in the real world. In motorsport? Amazing if done right. If you look at F1 engine R&D budget majority of it goes to making MGU-H reliable.

Toyota actually dismissed the electric turbo idea when they evaluated next-gen lean-burn engines because it doesn't meet their efficiency target. In real world there is not a lot of opportunity to recover enough exhaust energy to make up for the pumping loss, unlike in the case of racing cars. Instead the right way to go is an electric supercharger. Less harsh operating conditions, more efficient. They are actually testing this idea without saying it out aloud: it's in the Mirai's air compressor system. I expect it to be deployed on selected next-gen engines.
 

Levi

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I understand electrically assisted turbo for for zero lag/response only, not for efficiency, without battery/hybrid setup.
 
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Sounds like a reliability nightmare to me. An extremely fast spinning motor in close proximity to a high heat source is how their F1 engines suffered for years. There are many ways to make a high specific output twin-turbo engine work just as well. Electric turbo is an extremely expensive and potentially unreliable gimmick. It sounds very very cool but doesn't work well in the real world. In motorsport? Amazing if done right. If you look at F1 engine R&D budget majority of it goes to making MGU-H reliable.

Toyota actually dismissed the electric turbo idea when they evaluated next-gen lean-burn engines because it doesn't meet their efficiency target. In real world there is not a lot of opportunity to recover enough exhaust energy to make up for the pumping loss, unlike in the case of racing cars. Instead the right way to go is an electric supercharger. Less harsh operating conditions, more efficient. They are actually testing this idea without saying it out aloud: it's in the Mirai's air compressor system. I expect it to be deployed on selected next-gen engines.
I just wanted to vouch for his answer as well. The reason why Honda was f*cking garbage in F1 was exactly because of what @ssun30 mentioned. They only started started to get their act together ~5 years after they joined F1, and they still have the worst power unit out of the 4 engine suppliers. Mind you, Ferrari and Renault had some small problems as well when the hybrid era first came to F1, but they quickly got over those issues and their engines are top notch. I don't think I need to mention Mercedes' power units heh.

However I do want to make a counterargument though. Ferrari's, Renault's, and obviously Mercedes' (their power units are absolutely monstrous beasts) power units are pretty stout so there is a lot of hope that this technology can be proven reliable over the course of time.

The fact that these guys had these turbo-hybrid power units in F1 since 2014, and they're being used in a high pressure environment like F1, where you're only legally allocated 3 power units per season (any more then you'll get penalties), and are driven hard for tens of thousands of kilometres all out on the racetrack, I think it's safe to say it will be very reliable in a road car application in numerous climates, environments and also can take a lot of abuse as well.

I've always said that hybrid power units are the future. There's too many issues with electric motors be it with the car's dynamics or the environmental impact that the mining and producing of those electric motors also create as well as them being quite tough to recycle, I don't see it as the best solution even in the long term, let alone now. With normal ICE's becoming even better than ever in terms of performance and efficiency and with small electric motors being lighter and more efficient to produce (not the crazy skateboard batteries that are in Tesla's but the small batteries that you currently see in hybrids) you're able to essentially cancel out the negative effects of each other while having the positives.
 

Will1991

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@F1 Silver Arrows , F1 can go another route for the longer run while getting a lot more sustainable.

Since for me F1 (and pretty much any Motorsport) need to have loud engines, they can make hybrid units with internal combustions engines running on H2 instead of gas).

I know it's a bit nonsense and it would require a lot of R&D, but I would watch it faster than Formula E... What a ****... Racing without race car noises isn't racing.
 

Gecko

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Type S looks cool. Interested in specs on that new V6.
 

suxeL

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Love that the leaked/"Acura officially denies this is real" from the acurazine poster about a year ago was on point.














Here is the next Gen MDX as well:


The digital dash info seems to indicate a launch on the MDX first so TLX is analog coupled with a past gen audi like enhanced center display.


 

Gecko

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New rumors indicate this engine will be over 400hp instead of 365-370hp. Their newer 2.0T I4 is ~140hp/L if you average the Accord/RDX and Civic Type R versions. 140hp/L applied to 3.0L = 415hp.

If the Type S shows up over 400hp (and SH-AWD), that will be very impressive and brings Acura into the arena with the S4, 340i and C43 AMG.

Is it going to save Acura? Probably not. But the bits we are seeing about dedicated platform, dedicated suspension, next gen SH-AWD and dedicated engine for Type S... are impressive to me.
 

suxeL

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New rumors indicate this engine will be over 400hp instead of 365-370hp. Their newer 2.0T I4 is ~140hp/L if you average the Accord/RDX and Civic Type R versions. 140hp/L applied to 3.0L = 415hp.

If the Type S shows up over 400hp (and SH-AWD), that will be very impressive and brings Acura into the arena with the S4, 340i and C43 AMG.

Is it going to save Acura? Probably not. But the bits we are seeing about dedicated platform, dedicated suspension, next gen SH-AWD and dedicated engine for Type S... is impressive to me.
That last bit has been a key talking point on every press event on the current gen RDX. Acura is going all in with the story of "we are not a higher trim level honda"
 
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