Possibility for a 3.0l turbo?

[amoschen7]

Im a long time Lexus lover. Had IS 350 when I was first in States. Got a NX 200t when I was back in China. And now I really miss the stronger engine. Right now almost all 3.5L engine model are cancelled in China because of the stiff tax rate 45% I remember from last time for engine greater than 3.0l compared with 20% for engine greater than 2.0l. And now 3.5l engine are only present in ls350( yes, seemed to be China only) and the 450h models. I just feel a 3.0T engine could give Lexus quite a lot potential market to address in the market for models like GS, LS, and a lesser F family like AMG had AMG43. It seemed to be a sweet spot when everyone are getting the 2.0T models in China from A6,A8, 728, Q5，Q7,GLC,XC60, RR Velar, Honda Avancier…just everything... There's an emerging middle class in China characterized by fond of different statement and really know about cars compared to older generation. Just hope this 3.0T could be on the market soon.

 

[amoschen7]

@ssun30 maybe you have some info on this?

 

[amoschen7]

Someone give some input? Possible or just a dream?

 

[ssun30]

There's no guarantee this engine will appear soon. We should wait for the 7ES launch to see what TMC has to offer for its workhorse engine.
You are right the 8AR is one of the less competitive engines in its segment. It's neither powerful nor efficient, and the response is terrible. However it boosted sales of every single model it is equipped on.

 

[amoschen7]

There's no guarantee this engine will appear soon. We should wait for the 7ES launch to see what TMC has to offer for its workhorse engine.
You are right the 8AR is one of the less competitive engines in its segment. It's neither powerful nor efficient, and the response is terrible. However it boosted sales of every single model it is equipped on.

I dug a bit on your comments on other post and realized a 2.5T also make a lot of sense. It leaves the 3.5T some room for the " premium " status and save quite a bit development cost. But the downside would be it's a L4 and HP will be only around 320ish?
But still if we think about China market, I suspect Lexus hold on the LS 500(3.5T has the same tax rate as the LS350) and LC500 for a reason, which can be explained by the intro of a 3.0t engine( LS450 possibly?) But yea, everything is just spectulation at this point.

 

[ssun30]

I dug a bit on your comments on other post and realized a 2.5T also make a lot of sense. It leaves the 3.5T some room for the " premium " status and save quite a bit development cost. But the downside would be it's a L4 and HP will be only around 320ish?
But still if we think about China market, I suspect Lexus hold on the LS 500(3.5T has the same tax rate as the LS350) and LC500 for a reason, which can be explained by the intro of a 3.0t engine( LS450 possibly?) But yea, everything is just spectulation at this point.

Making a 350hp 2.5 turbo 4 is trivial, in fact that level of specific power is pretty standard these days. Four cylinders on premium vehicles are also pretty standard. I can understand why Lexus will do it but I would never buy one.

Lexus didn't import the LS500 because it does not need to exist when the 500h is available. The 500 is strictly a North America thing because people aren't too concerned with MPG and prefer gas-only models in general.

The LC500 has a huge 5.0V8 which puts it into the highest taxed category so unfortunately we will have to live with the 'boring' LC500h until we get a 4.0V8TT.

 

[amoschen7]

Making a 350hp 2.5 turbo 4 is trivial, in fact that level of specific power is pretty standard these days. Four cylinders on premium vehicles are also pretty standard. I can understand why Lexus will do it but I would never buy one.

Lexus didn't import the LS500 because it does not need to exist when the 500h is available. The 500 is strictly a North America thing because people aren't too concerned with MPG and prefer gas-only models in general.

The LC500 has a huge 5.0V8 which puts it into the highest taxed category so unfortunately we will have to live with the 'boring' LC500h until we get a 4.0V8TT.

But in the arena of D-class sedan( or full-size luxury sedan is the name here in States?) having a 3.5 NA as the only option is inadequate. Look at the vast options Merceds had from s320 to s680 just for the non-amg models. And we have to admit the hybrid model just won't appeal to the majority customer at the moment. It would be really bizarre not to introduce the 3.5T model unless they are hiding a 3.0T or something.

 

[ssun30]

But in the arena of D-class sedan( or full-size luxury sedan is the name here in States?) having a 3.5 NA as the only option is inadequate. Look at the vast options Merceds had from s320 to s680 just for the non-amg models. And we have to admit the hybrid model just won't appeal to the majority customer at the moment. It would be really bizarre not to introduce the 3.5T model unless they are hiding a 3.0T or something.

The LS350, at its price point (starting at ¥888k), is very strong compared to competitors. Yes the 2GR is a very old engine, but at 315hp it comfortably outruns any competition and is still efficient enough. And it's the only naturally aspirated V6 that runs silky smooth and does not have sluggish response.
The BMW 730Li has a 258hp turbo 4. Four cylinders in a flagship sedan, seriously?
The MB S320L has a 272hp turbo 6, slower, more expensive and burns more fuel.
The A8L 50TFSI still uses the supercharged 6 from last decade, LS350's 2GR-FKS at least has some Dynamic Force elements in it.

In a different post I said the LS350 is DOA because I assumed it competes against the 740Li or S400L. I didn't expect it to be priced so aggressively. But now I consider it to be a very strong product.

The LS500h is the one that competes directly against the 740 and S400, and is extremely competitive in that regards. Lexus does not really need a 3.0T LS400 because the prices are already very competitive, but it will be nice to see the 2GR getting replaced.

If anything, they need a new LS600h "even longer wheelbase" with a real V8 to compete against the S-Class Maybach.