Lexus to Develop Full Electric Vehicle?

krew

Site Founder
Administrator
Messages
3,686
Reactions
5,670
krew
16-11-08-lexus-lf-fc-electric-car.jpg


The brand is seriously considering the possibility.
View the original article post
 

Levi

Expert
Messages
2,707
Reactions
3,134
I like the new LS, but it is "old": ICE. A BEV Lexus (or any other car for that matter) excites me a lot more.


If it is true that the GS will have no direct successor, but also that Lexus is to develop a BEV, a GS replacement as luxurious sporty electric sedan could be a perfect addition to Lexus portfolio and the best car for urban and extra-urbain driving. Of course nothing will beat a Land Cruiser as "King of the Road" with a powerful diesel, but that is not what most use. I say this because till now, no SUV/CUV has been able to combine good on-road performance with good off-road capability in one single vehicle, and sports cars are all too big and heavy, which defeats the purpose of a sports car.
 
Last edited:

Ian Schmidt

Moderator
Messages
2,330
Reactions
4,065
Messages
6
Reactions
10
I like the new LS, but it is "old": ICE. A BEV Lexus (or any other car for that matter) excites me a lot more.


If it is true that the GS will have no direct successor, but also that Lexus is to develop a BEV, a GS replacement as luxurious sporty electric sedan could be a perfect addition to Lexus portfolio and the best car for urban and extra-urbain driving. Of course nothing will beat a Land Cruiser as "King of the Road" with a powerful diesel, but that is not what most use. I say this because till now, no SUV/CUV has been able to combine good on-road performance with good off-road capability in one single vehicle, and sports cars are all too big and heavy, which defeats the purpose of a sports car.

Definitely the same for me! I was a long time Lexus driver and enthusiast but now I'm out. Waiting for an electric ... otherwise TESLA.
 

Hemi

Premium Member
Messages
71
Reactions
53
Definitely the same for me! I was a long time Lexus driver and enthusiast but now I'm out. Waiting for an electric ... otherwise TESLA.

FUEL CELL is also an interesting option.
 

Ian Schmidt

Moderator
Messages
2,330
Reactions
4,065
Fuel Cell is the wrong way. In power not comparable to EV powered cars, inefficient, no infrastructure.
Many Lexus owners moved to TESLA - they did the job right.
I am back as soon as Lexus offers a full electric vehicle.

You do know that a fuel cell EV has the same drivetrain and performance characteristics as a battery EV, right? The only difference is the fuel cell generates power (with no combustion, and water as the exhaust) instead of charging a battery.
 
Messages
6
Reactions
10
You do know that a fuel cell EV has the same drivetrain and performance characteristics as a battery EV, right? The only difference is the fuel cell generates power (with no combustion, and water as the exhaust) instead of charging a battery.

Yes, I know that, I'm an expert in that. The problem is the inefficiency of fuel cell systems. It would be much easier to build an all electric drivetrain for Lexus / Toyota than this fuel cell systems. I'm sure: Battery will survive, FC will die. Too inefficient, too much money to invest yet. All the industry moves to all electric. Toyota decided the same in these days. It was a failure to invest money in FC technology. Daimler failed years ago too.
 

Ian Schmidt

Moderator
Messages
2,330
Reactions
4,065
I still don't see it as that different. You should be able to reuse the electric motor drivetrain and associated ECU regardless of where the power's coming from, be it a series ICE hybrid, an FC-EV, or a BEV.
 

meth.ix

Admirer
Messages
925
Reactions
1,097
I found this to be quite interesting, this car uses hydrogen or gasoline to power an internal combustion engine, which means it is not any more efficient than an electric or hybrid vehicle using a Hydrogen Fuel Cell. It just uses Hydrogen as an alternative fuel for an ICE engine. Just thought I should share it even though it is barely relevant. This type of engine is called a bivalent internal combustion engine.
https://www.wikiwand.com/en/BMW_Hydrogen_7
It is quite a useless car since on Hydrogen it gets about 5 MPG and it doesn't stop or reduce CO2 emissions at all
 

Rob Grieveson

Follower
Messages
183
Reactions
160
Electric seems to be the popular choice and Tesla continues to impress actually amaze when one considers the complexities of a new start up against all comers. With twenty years of hybrid experience with the Prius the Tesla is even more impressive. I have to wonder if there are not a number of problems that Tesla are dealing with that we are unaware of - otherwise why does Toyota appear to behind the curve? - I am sure they have the experts in hand so why the delay?
 

Hemi

Premium Member
Messages
71
Reactions
53
Fuel Cell is the wrong way. In power not comparable to EV powered cars, inefficient, no infrastructure.
Many Lexus owners moved to TESLA - they did the job right.
I am back as soon as Lexus offers a full electric vehicle.
There havent been any infrastructure for electric cars few years ago either which I see the main drawback now for Fuel Cell but I would not say that it is so black and white. However I agree that the electric cars should be in a Lexus lineup for sure since It has shown that it can be really competitive.

One of the main question is, what is the difference in making electricity versus hydrogen in terms of emissions.
 

Ian Schmidt

Moderator
Messages
2,330
Reactions
4,065
I have to wonder if there are not a number of problems that Tesla are dealing with that we are unaware of - otherwise why does Toyota appear to behind the curve? - I am sure they have the experts in hand so why the delay?

Toyota is much more conservative about this stuff. Tesla's operating on a Silicon Valley-style "throw it all out there and we'll patch it if a few customers end up as hamburger on a wall" kind of ethos, whereas Toyota's already been (falsely) through the wringer on computer-related safety.
 

mmcartalk

Expert
Messages
4,155
Reactions
2,675
You do know that a fuel cell EV has the same drivetrain and performance characteristics as a battery EV, right? The only difference is the fuel cell generates power (with no combustion, and water as the exhaust) instead of charging a battery.

Anthony said:
Yes, I know that, I'm an expert in that. The problem is the inefficiency of fuel cell systems.

The main problem, more so than fuel-cell efficiency, is simply the lack of refueling stations and/or an infrastructure for fuel-cell cars. California seems to be one of the very few places where these cars can be readily re-filled...and, even then, it's not like having a regular gas or diesel-powered car. I mean, let's face it, there just aren't many places where one can pull right into and start filling the tank with hydrogen compressed to 20,000 psi. ;)
 

Ian Schmidt

Moderator
Messages
2,330
Reactions
4,065
The main problem, more so than fuel-cell efficiency, is simply the lack of refueling stations and/or an infrastructure for fuel-cell cars.

Absolutely, but 5 years ago there wasn't one for BEVs either. And to a large extent there still isn't given that Tesla's network only works with Tesla's vehicles. That's a major reason there is no true BEV market, there is only Tesla. I expect either they'll work out a standard or regulators will step in soon.
 

mmcartalk

Expert
Messages
4,155
Reactions
2,675
Absolutely, but 5 years ago there wasn't one for BEVs either.

Regular household 110-volt outlets for recharging have always been plentiful...less so for the 220-volt outlets. Recently, 400-volt outlets have been developed for quick (roughly 20-30-minute) full-charges, but, of course, not many places have them yet. Though I'm not an electrical engineer, I'd venture to say that the 400V chargers probably couldn't be used with regular household wiring, as the wiring would probably be overloaded and catch fire.
 
Messages
6
Reactions
10
I still don't see it as that different. You should be able to reuse the electric motor drivetrain and associated ECU regardless of where the power's coming from, be it a series ICE hybrid, an FC-EV, or a BEV.

You are absolutely right. Toyota / Lexus just has to switch the energy source to battery.
 

Ian Schmidt

Moderator
Messages
2,330
Reactions
4,065
Though I'm not an electrical engineer, I'd venture to say that the 400V chargers probably couldn't be used with regular household wiring, as the wiring would probably be overloaded and catch fire.

Normal households and businesses don't have 400 volt service at all; in the US and Canada households get two hots and a neutral off the pole. From hot to hot is 240V for stoves/dryers/HVAC, from either hot to neutral is 120V.

Higher voltages are brought out to factories to run gigantic motors and arc furnaces and stuff.