Next Generation Lexus IS F to use Turbocharged V6?


2013 Lexus IS F

Autoblog has gotten into the rumor game with talk that the next-generation Lexus IS F will use a twin-turbo V6:

BMW has confirmed that the next-generation M3 will drop its V8 in favor of a turbocharged inline-six, and it is just a matter of time before the C63 drops its naturally aspirated 6.2-liter V8 for the automaker’s twin-turbo 5.5-liter.

We recently asked Lexus about rumors that the next-generation IS F will follow the same path. While nobody would confirm that the range-topping successor would have a smaller turbocharged engine, the executives admitted with a sly smile that such an approach does have its advantages. They didn’t need to say more.

As Lexus doesn’t have an obvious turbocharged solution in its current lineup, what do you think will end up under the hood in 2014? And, now that Toyota and BMW have inked a new collaboration, what about the possibility of Lexus borrowing a BMW-sourced engine for its next-gen IS F?

It’s a difficult call — the massive 5.0L 2UR-GSE V8 engine defined the personality of the current IS F, and switching to turbocharged V6 would change that character considerably.

Not only that — it feels like Lexus has only scratched the surface of the 2UR-GSE engine, and that there’s still plenty of untapped potential. Besides, reducing displacement is one thing, but going from a V8 to a V6 is something else entirely.

Still, no arguing that Lexus needs to introduce some type of forced induction system. There was a solid rumor last year that the GS F SPORT might debut with an available supercharger — while this ended up being incorrect, it does suggest that Lexus is devoting engineering resources to the technology.

(As for Lexus using a BMW-sourced engine in the next IS F? A totally ridiculous concept — neither Lexus or BMW would benefit from sharing engines in such brand-important cars.)

Comments


  • http://twitter.com/VCLT The Victor

    I personally hope they stick with a V8 N/A engine, but with more power, lighter and better fuel economy. How they will do that? I have no idea, but It would definitely be something amazing.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Sebastien-Kroetsch/550680597 Sebastien Kroetsch

    Just look at the CCS-R. It’s 300kg less but the mechanical part is the same making it faster and indirectly more powerful and fuel efficient. Since the IS-F doesn’t need much dead luxury weight it could shave off a few hundred pounds and bump the power in the 2UR-GSE. Or better yet, add force induction to it. Hell yeah!!

  • Matt

    Given the reliability of the turboed BMW engines, wouldn’t want them to use one. Stick with what Lexus knows best, leave the 5L V8 as it is, combine with a small hybrid system (think KERS rather than Prius) it will give you a very nice performance jump and bump in econmy, especially if could do a cylinder deactivation as well.

  • BlackDynamiteNY

    Still want a stick shift option.  If BMW can do it…..
    BD

  • DAMN

    time to have the team that engineered the LFA to step into the next gen LFA. Have yamaha build put in some collob for this new engine just like the LFA

  • ademello

    Inclined to think not such a good idea.  New global emissions regulations are already resulting in increasing engine temperatures and pressures.   FI equals more heat and more stress on engine components, possibly expensive repairs and even premature engine failure in some cases and   long-term reliability issues.  It seems like cylinder deactivation and weight reduction might be a smarter strategy.     

  • Nataraj_D

    Personally hope they stick with a N/A setup … either that or supercharged.

  • Brnjou87

    I’m sure if Lexus is going to switch to turbo engines they are going to make sure they are relaible before putting it into production.

  • http://www.facebook.com/RDS.Alphard Yong Thian Ding

    Just don’t do any Hybrid on the pure F , either Twin Turbo or Natural Aspiration … although 3.5-liter V6 Twin Turbo sounds good .

  • Ljn71

    I agree,and let’s not forget the twin turbo inline six from the last Supra. That thing has been tuned to more than twice it’s standard hp rating with no reliability issues.

  • Travis

    no keep the V8 just add more tq and hp and make it more efficienct to kick some m3 and c63 ass

  • James

    Turbos are coming to Lexus soon. 4cyl then 6 cyl.

  • enthusiast88

    It’s more about sound and feel to me. Sure the turbo V6 Audi S4 is quicker than the V8 S4, but it has NO personality. I would take the old V8 version any day just because the sound and feel makes me smile.
    The IS-F is the same way. Sure the spec sheet of a turbo V6 IS-F might look good, but its the sound and feel of that V* engine just makes me smile (and make the hairs on my neck stand up). That’s what I’m spending my money on. A spec sheet has never made me feel that way.

  • Chris

    V8 supercarged……

  • LexusLVR

    BMW has been using forced induction for decades (turbodiesels, 2002 Turbo) and they’re considered reliable engines.

    The BMW turbo motors with reliability issues are the N54/N55 found in the 335i, 535i etc. models. From what I hear, the new N55 motor is much better, though.

  • LexusLVR

    The secret to keeping a turbocharged motor in reliable working order is to let it idle for a few minutes after starting it. The turbo works best when it’s reached it’s optimal operating temperature. Likewise, before shutting down a turbocharged motor, you’re supposed to keep the engine running for a few minutes in order to allow the turbo to “cool off” and allow the oil to flow back into its tank. The new BMW M5 features an automatic turbo-cooling-procedure when the engine is shut off. That way owners won’t have to keep the engine idling for a few minutes while counting to three/four minutes…

    I don’t think anyone buying a turbocharged car will expect anvil reliability in the first place. There comes a time when a turbo has to be replaced or serviced as it’s a crucial wear and tear item of the engine. Also, the heat an engine generates (and the cooling off period) affect the material density of a turbo and over time this causes the material to wear out.

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/WGWI3V455RIPSWLRMDXILQNT2E Walter

    Toyota have many technologies of getting power. Remember the VVTLI the “L” is for lift, at 6,000rpm the lift technology kicks in like as if it a turbo. this was the most powerful 1.8l N/A engine matching the turbo charcheged engines , this engine is a 1.8l was featured in the corolla and lotus ellise. Believe me toyota can make a N/A V6 to be as poweful as a V8 no turbo. It the trend setters which is BMW & MERC that might cause Lexus not do what they could have done, people believe BMW & MERC to be gosbel. VVTLI, DUEL VVTLI, VALVEMATIC

  • F1

    Yeah exactly the case..! They can make a NA engine better.. Look at IS350 it’s advanced 2GR-FSE engine gives very impressive performance..

    Going FI means lots of compromises and problems.. The next m3 is going to have a 325kw turbo.. The current ISF is 311Kw NA.. Not much difference!! Make the next ISF lighter, bit more power and a few improvements here and there and it should do..

    Plus it’s not all about absolute crank numbers.. Most important is weight and gear ratios and Toyota knows this very well..

  • http://bestessay4u.com/ bestessay4u.com

    Awesome car! It’s my drem!

  • Ugtc

    The LS460 is faster from 0 to about 80mph then the new 4.4L twin-turbo 7 series.. That alone explains well why FI SUKS!

    Although superchargers mitigate hat problem

    Not to mention he massive reliability & durability issue with turbo’s.. Not to mention their performance will be reduced as the turbochargers starts to wear out.. Which doesn’t take long.. Especially this class of cars

  • http://www.facebook.com/nate.vongshotivat Nate Vongshotivat

     Still prefer sound and respond from high capacity V6, V8 engine without FI :D

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/WGWI3V455RIPSWLRMDXILQNT2E Walter

    I doubt toyota will use turbo on lexus cars. They will come out with a special engine for ISF

  • LexusLVR

    Forced induction has many benefits. It does not “suck”. Most people who complain about forced induction either have no clue or have never driven a modern forced induction motor.

    And nobody out there cares if the LS460 is slightly faster than a BMW 7 series. It has no real world advantages and nobody, NOBODY, tracks these cars in the first place where such milliseconds/seconds would matter.

    It’s no secret that a turbocharger is an item that wears and tears and will need an eventual replacement. BMWs turbochargers for example have been tested to last for around 125,000 miles before needing an inspection or replacement. The main wear and tear a turbocharger experiences is from the varying temperatures inside the engine bay – hot or cold. This places enormous stress on the materials the turbocharger is made out of. 125,000 miles is a lot. If a turbo has to be replaced at this mileage, so what? If you can’t afford to pay for this then you have no business driving a luxury car.

  • yosafbridge

     Turbocharged engines still suffer from lag no matter how advanced. That’s why Lexus has persisted with Normal Aspirated engines all this while. Nothing matches the instantaneous and linear throttle response of a well engineered NA engine like most Lexus IS/GS/LS engines. That’s what Lexus has deemed most important for keen drivers.

    You only need to go to BMW 5 series forums and fully 30% of the posts there are 5 series owners complaining about the throttle delay of the turbocharged 3L engine in the 535i.

  • LexusLVR

    I’m pretty sure that the lag is inconsequential to most consumers out there. Most consumers drive in a stately and elegant manor which means the turbo lag won’t be noticeable as the engine is at speed the turbos can function more effectively. If the cars are driven hard and demandingly from a standstill then the lag might be noticeable. The few milliseconds of turbo lag at higher speed are really irrelevant to most consumers.

    I’ve not driven any newer turbo-engines (aside from rentals in Europe which strike me as very responsive) but I’ve driven a friends 335i with the N54 motor and I didn’t think the turbo lag was that bad. In fact the turbo lag was a small delay that barely lasted a second and then the car accelerated with such force.

  • Ugtc

    Yeah by 125,000 miles they’ll be dead..

    But way before that they’ll be heavily worn out which means the performance of the car will be heavily decreased…

    After driving an IS350 and a 335i you start to appreciate the benefits of the Naturally Aspirated IS350..

    No lag, no hesitation..

    Acceleration is direct and extreme with the IS350.. And that’s what we want..

  • Raptor

    yessss!!!!!!!

     

     

    I have always dreamed that Lexus would go Supercharged
    rather than Turbo…

    yessss!!!!!!!

     

     

    I have always dreamed that Lexus would go Supercharged
    rather than Turbo…

  • Raptor

    Ok sites tweakin…

    But Supercharged done right by Lexus would be brutal force.

  • Pondd

    But seriously who needs more then a IS350 for their daily drive lol?

    I mean the IS350 is pulling 4.6 seconds 0 to 60mph and low 13’s quarter-mile.. And it’s just a very good 3.5L V6.. 

  • yosafbridge

     Throttle lag of “less than a second” can still be fatal when merging with rapidly flowing traffic and is anathema form a purist driver’s perspective.

    It is a sad day when the Brand purportedly building the “Ultimate Driving Machine” (BMW) has to resort to such lame excuses like : “but-but-but the lag is less than a second!!!”.

    That clearly goes to show that BMW has really lost sight of what made their cars such an addictive drive.

    Strange world when it is now Lexus that is more purist from a driving perspective than BMW.

  • F1

    Yeah that’s true, ironically BMW back in the day used to mock other companies for using turbo..

    Whether people like it or not that turbo and forced induction in general are a compromise..

  • http://lexusenthusiast.com krew

    Such a great point — the weight of the next IS F is going to make a huge difference. Imagine we’ll finally see the giant carbon fiber loom used in another vehicle outside of the LFA.

  • http://lexusenthusiast.com krew

    Yeah, agree with this — the sound of the IS F engine is absolutely mental, and I don’t want anything affecting that.

  • LexusLVR

    If “turbo lag is fatal” when merging unto a freeway then you shouldn’t be driving. Merging unto a freeway also takes intelligent driving – no matter what car you’re driving.

    Also, I personally would still rank BMW far ahead of Lexus in terms of purist driving. Many BMWs can still be had with a manual transmission and 50/50 weight balance, unlike Lexus.

    There have been many great cars with turbochargers and there are still many great turbocharged cars out there (Lancia Delta Integrale, BMW 2002 Turbo, Porsche 911 Turbo, Mercedes CL/S600 V12 Biturbo, Nissan GT-R etc.).  I personally feel the “turbo lag” of modern turbocharged cars is greatly exaggerated.

  • piterdufflerpiterduffler

    This post is really amazing! Thanks a lot for it.

  • Terry Been

    I wrote this post while watching Avatar for the first time. I wasn’t
    sure it was going to make much sense, but I’m glad it still resonated

  • Perry

    Thanks
    a lot for sharing. You have done a brilliant job

  • Carmaker1

    ?????

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100002742151262 Jason Miller

    Pump up the 5.0 to 550-580 to slap the CTS-V around and stomp a mud hole in M3. Just get it over with. Lol. 

  • bertyfaserty

    I love to come back on a regular basis,post more on the subject.